Does Anyone Really Think Ford Still Is A Good Coach After This Mess?

[dlarry]

3 minutes ago, wgstl said:

No one was better than Fred in conference play last year for us, so I thought we would see it carry into this year.  Okoro I can see why people would say that, its almost 1a/b.

Unfortunately there is no right answer. 
 

[Slu let the dogs out?]

27 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

We have played some elite level defensive teams this year although that doesn't totally explain Okoro's loss of touch around the rim......

Absolutely baffling. I had a holiday party Saturday afternoon that I could not get out of and had to to catch the first 10 minutes of the game on the radio. The frustration in Bob Ramsey's voice regarding Okoro's lack of finishing was palpable. At one point he sort of mumbled under his breath "just dunk the ball" or something to that effect. 

[HoosierPal]

You can take whatever set of statistics you wish to in evaluating a player. (One of my favorite books in college was "How to Lie with Statistics".)

Using Fred Thatch's career numbers (including this short 9 game set from this OOC season), he is shooting a career best 48% FG, a career best 53% 2 FG, and a career best 37% 3FG. Yes his rebound average is down 1.3 per from last season. His man defense on taller and bigger players is unparalleled on this team.  If this is regression, I'll take it.

[willie]

53 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Fred may be the biggest disappointment of all. 

I don't buy this. I think Fred has been one of our steadiest players. Always brings the D. His ball handling while not great has been ok. 

[WVBilliken]

#KeepFord

[gobillsgo]

51 minutes ago, WVBilliken said:

#KeepFord

[laker119]

1 hour ago, willie said:

I don't buy this. I think Fred has been one of our steadiest players. Always brings the D. His ball handling while not great has been ok. 

I don’t blame any ball-handling woes solely on Fred.  Blame has to be placed on Travis for basically not recruiting a backup PG and forcing Fred to play point guard and be a primary ball handler, which he probably hasn’t done since his senior year at Sikeston.

I think Fred’s importance is really felt when he is not playing.  

[Billiken Rich]

8 minutes ago, laker119 said:

I don’t blame any ball-handling woes solely on Fred.  Blame has to be placed on Travis for basically not recruiting a backup PG and forcing Fred to play point guard and be a primary ball handler, which he probably hasn’t done since his senior year at Sikeston.

I think Fred’s importance is really felt when he is not playing.  

Fred has been fine.  My favorite moments this year have come when guards/small forwards have tried go back to the basket against Fred.  Just keep banging guys Fred isn't going anywhere.  Hilarious! Outmuscle Fred.....you must be joking......

I don't recall Fred turning the ball over a bunch while playing point.  He's not going to bamboozle the defense single handedly but I thought he was solid.......

 

[AnkielBreakers]

On 12/10/2022 at 8:22 PM, gobillsgo said:

Let me preemptively strike:  Travis is the best coach ever and if you blame him at all for tonight you’re an idiot and a terrible fan! #Travis4Life

Counter-strike:

Let’s get rid of Travis Ford and if you can’t see how bad he is you are an idiot, because any coach can have a .600 average at SLU, and SLU would make any coach look good. Even though Ford is the first coach in like 60 years to average a .600 winning percentage, and even though SLU’s best recent coaches (Spoonhour and Majerus) had their greatest successes at other schools, we should assume that SLU will achieve greater heights with a different coach and winning here is easy. If you can’t see that, then you are inevitably drawn to mediocrity and are a loser. The last two games are the only lens with which to view a coaching career, and the rest of the season doesn’t matter. 

[TheA_Bomb]

@AnkielBreakers. That's not what reasonable persons are posting.  It's not 2 games It's a career of underachieving despite great recruiting.  The history of SLU BB despite the 40s didn't have the level of support we have today.   Furthermore, SLU was in more competitive conference situations.   Despite great recruiting (which Ford gets 100%credit for), lesser conference competition, better AD support (top paid coach great facilities relative to the league) he's underachieving yet again.  I have no faith it will change.  What data suggests it will?  Dude won the A10 tournament 1 time embarrassed in the NCAAs next game, embarrassed in NIT games,  losing record vs our biggest rival. These are the criterion that coaches are judged upon. 

[slufan13]

Ford is always going to keep you relevant. He is always going to have you playing meaningful basketball in early March which is nice. There is something to be said for that. It's also fair to want more. A different coach could have you playing a meaningful game in late March or could have you done playing meaningful basketball in mid February. I know some people don't think it's possible to make 1-2 Sweet 16's every 10 years at a school like SLU and they may be right but I'm not ready to give up on that yet. Nothing in Ford's 25+ years have shown he can make that next step but I see no reason to overly bash on Ford at this point. The season isn't over yet and I still think this team has the pieces to make the tournament and then see what happens. Like I've said before, if we miss the tournament this season, I think Ford has to go. Until then, I'll enjoy the ride.

 

[BC1764]

Some of you remind me of Matheny supporters. Rather look at the numbers instead of the totality of his tenure.

[BC1764]

59 minutes ago, TheA_Bomb said:

@AnkielBreakers. That's not what reasonable persons are posting.  It's not 2 games It's a career of underachieving despite great recruiting.  The history of SLU BB despite the 40s didn't have the level of support we have today.   Furthermore, SLU was in more competitive conference situations.   Despite great recruiting (which Ford gets 100%credit for), lesser conference competition, better AD support (top paid coach great facilities relative to the league) he's underachieving yet again.  I have no faith it will change.  What data suggests it will?  Dude won the A10 tournament 1 time embarrassed in the NCAAs next game, embarrassed in NIT games,  losing record vs our biggest rival. These are the criterion that coaches are judged upon. 

0-16 against ranked teams since being here.

[wgstl]

It’s so easy to say fire, get someone else. While I’m inching closer and closer to that, if I’m a betting man, I’m not entirely sure we get someone better. 

[HoosierPal]

1 minute ago, wgstl said:

It’s so easy to say fire, get someone else. While I’m inching closer and closer to that, if I’m a betting man, I’m not entirely sure we get someone better. 

Patrick Ewing likely will be available before the end of this season. 

[slufanskip]

20 minutes ago, BC1764 said:

Some of you remind me of Matheny supporters. Rather look at the numbers instead of the totality of his tenure.

You’ve shown up here with no other agenda than to bash Coach Ford. 

You remind me of a troll rather than an objective poster. 
 

We aren’t firing coach today or next week. This gets old. At least let the season play out. It’s going to happen whether you like it or not, so just enjoy it

[wgstl]

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Patrick Ewing likely will be available before the end of this season. 

Kenny Payne too 

[BC1764]

Quote

At least let the season play out

How many more seasons are we going to keep saying this ?

[dlarry]

1 hour ago, wgstl said:

It’s so easy to say fire, get someone else. While I’m inching closer and closer to that, if I’m a betting man, I’m not entirely sure we get someone better. 

This my big concern. You either get a hot shot assistant who works out and leaves in 5 years or a hot shot assistant who fails and you start over again.

If they don’t right the ship I’d be on board with firing him. I just don’t know what the answer is.

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Patrick Ewing likely will be available before the end of this season. 

73-90 at Georgetown. Never won more than 19 games.  I can say with confidence he isn’t the answer. 
Plus I hated him as a knick so that would be tough for me.

[WVBilliken]

So, Ford has 6 full seasons with the Bills.  He started with a horrible roster so I give him a pass for year 1 and 2.  No transfer portal so you cannot build a competitive roster quick.

Year 3 he got SLU to the Dance.  Nice, to the NCAA's in year 3.

Year 4 a 23-8 record but no bid.  No Tournament due to covid but may have made it, in the discussion.

Year 5 a 14-7 record, covid year mess.  I give Ford a pass.  NIT bid.

Year 6 a 23-12.  In the NCAA Tournament discussion but not selected.  NIT bid.

Year 7 ..... TBD.

So in my estimation Ford got SLU to the Tourney 1 out of 3 years.  Damn good.  I give him this year and next.  This board expected Parker and Perkins to be big factors for this team.  Let's see if they can live up to their "press clippings" in Conference play.  Ford just might have a chance to get his second bid if they can.  The coach bears responsibility for loses ...... but so do the players, something many on this board fail to see over and over again.

 

[Billiken Rich]

1 hour ago, BC1764 said:

How many more seasons are we going to keep saying this ?

Exactly three more.  Anything else?

[Old guy]

I am totally in favor of getting rid of Ford. However rather than have a war in our hands between supporters and antagonists, could we all agree in giving him the chance to get us to the NCAA tournament this year? If he achieves this goal I would, reluctantly, agree to have him one more season and surprise us with what a brilliant and successful coach he really is, next season. If he does not achieve this goal, it is out and thank you very much for all.

Is this a civil enough compromise to be accepted by most everyone?

 

[brianstl]

3 hours ago, wgstl said:

It’s so easy to say fire, get someone else. While I’m inching closer and closer to that, if I’m a betting man, I’m not entirely sure we get someone better. 

$2.5 million and great facilities opens up some good options.  I am not saying Ford has to go, but you don’t keep a coach because you fear the unknown.  You keep a coach because you think he is best option raise the the program.  If you don’t think you will hire a good option, you might not have faith in your Athletic Director.

[Billiken Rich]

10 minutes ago, brianstl said:

$2.5 million and great facilities opens up some good options. 

I read somewhere that none of that means anything anymore in the nil era.........however, having a great recruiter, good enough to keep your star point guard out of Schazland might help.  I'm not saying there are no better options but you better have a Rick Majerus in the building when you fire the best recruiter I've ever seen for the Bills.............

[TheChosenOne]

Not worth doing now, but I do think one could question if Ford is such an elite recruiter where is the talent the past few classes. We have never found that true combo guard to play with Yuri (like an Isabell) nor have we found a combo forward that has been an obvious hole. Instead we have a roster of 3s, one point guard, and two true bigs.