WVBilliken Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 43 minutes ago, wgstl said: No, really not too many teams with 3 or more, and most of those teams are typically ranked in the 300's outside of just Michigan who is in a complete collapsing mode. There's a reason most teams have the roster ALMOST complete at this point(mostly 1 open spot). But you're trying to convince yourself its not a problem and that's fine, but not the case. By July any potential starter will likely be gone. And we need a few. Also for the 100th time, I still have not met or heard a single person who "hates" Ford. Really? I have searched the internet and can't find any source that gives open roster spots by team. So is your statement based on fact or "gut" feel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 15 minutes ago, WVBilliken said: Really? I have searched the internet and can't find any source that gives open roster spots by team. So is your statement based on fact or "gut" feel? It was on twitter somewhere this morning. I think 247 tweeted something about teams that still have a few spots open along with the named teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Elrond Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 Here’s a post from Transfer Portal for Playing Time’s twitter @TP4PT Transfer Portal for Playing Time @TP4PT CBB Division 1 programs with most available scholarships today. 8: Cal State Northridge 7: Prairie View A&M 6: Bethune Cookman 6: Mississippi Valley 5: Coppin State 5: Eastern Illinois 5: Nicholls State 4: Alabama State 4: Arkansas-Pine Bluff 4: St. Louis 4: Notre Dame 4: Jacksonville State 4: Texas 4: SC Upstate 4: Michigan 4: Chicago State 4: Buffalo 4: Manhattan 4: Howard 4: Maryland Eastern Shore 4: Louisiana 4: Texas Southern 4: New Mexico State 4: Southern Utah 4: Pacific #TP4PT #TransferPortal 9:05 AM · Jun 1, 2023· 3h Update: EIU now has 1 available, and SC Upstate has filled out their roster. ᗩᑎT ᗯᖇIGᕼT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 3 hours ago, wgstl said: yes and no. From how I understand it is yes coaching changes no longer count, that said, it helps your chances still until the NCAA completely revamps everything in the coming months. Was that I’m the January 23, 2023 update NCAA Guidance document? If so, I missed it. He would have to tie a coaching change into mental health issues is the way I read it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCoBillsFan Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 32 minutes ago, Lord Elrond said: Here’s a post from Transfer Portal for Playing Time’s twitter @TP4PT Transfer Portal for Playing Time @TP4PT CBB Division 1 programs with most available scholarships today. 8: Cal State Northridge 7: Prairie View A&M 6: Bethune Cookman 6: Mississippi Valley 5: Coppin State 5: Eastern Illinois 5: Nicholls State 4: Alabama State 4: Arkansas-Pine Bluff 4: St. Louis 4: Notre Dame 4: Jacksonville State 4: Texas 4: SC Upstate 4: Michigan 4: Chicago State 4: Buffalo 4: Manhattan 4: Howard 4: Maryland Eastern Shore 4: Louisiana 4: Texas Southern 4: New Mexico State 4: Southern Utah 4: Pacific #TP4PT #TransferPortal 9:05 AM · Jun 1, 2023· 3h Update: EIU now has 1 available, and SC Upstate has filled out their roster. ᗩᑎT ᗯᖇIGᕼT We have the same amount of open scholarships as New Mexico St, Jesus it’s worse than I thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmbilliken Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 4 hours ago, cheeseman said: Yeah and if my aunt had balls she would be my uncle Your aunt no longer needs balls to be your uncle. She can just identify as your uncle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLU_Nick Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 18 hours ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Let’s break down the current state of the program. It’s about more than Noland and you know it. We are coming off of a season where we being picked in the top 25 prior to the season and were seen as one of the top 2 teams in the A10 before the year started. We ended the year outside the top 100, no postseason, and had some of the worst losses since the Crews era (SEMO at home). As of June 1st, we are still missing an assistant coach and have three open scholarships. Due to the fact that we lost three starters and several impact players, hitting the portal hard was a must. And what have we gotten? A good big that will need a waiver that he might not get, a terrible defender from a terrible team (when the current roster already has no defense), and a completely unknown Euro big (that Ford has had 0 luck on so far). And the current roster isn’t exactly stacked either. Jimerson coming back helps, and I’m super high on Parker, but what else do we have? Our only true point guard is an undersized freshman, all of our bigs are giant question marks, and we really have nobody that can actually guard a wing effectively. And that’s just looking at the surface level! It gets worse when you add context. I’ll make a list: 1. We’ve only made the tournament once in 6 possible seasons (and that only happened because Tramaine Isabell turned into prime Allen Iverson for four games). 2. We have had two de-commitments of much needed impact players and lost two assistant coaches in the last two months. 3. The A10 continues to get worse and while the Big East is likely to expand soon, we’ve completely threw away any chance of us being able to move up. 4. We haven’t made any strides in recruiting for 2024 and beyond. 5. We had a local two-time National assist leader on the roster and he never made the tournament, not exactly sending a good message to any future local recruits. 6. Our “Ace-recruiter” of a coach has a roster without a single top-150 recruit. 7. We have the highest paid coach in the conference and he has never finished higher than 4th in 7 seasons. Sit back and think about it. Are you happy about this? Does this make you hopeful for the future of the program? According to the AD and the FFC, we got our 20 wins so we should just shut up and take the mediocrity. Personally, I actually care about the program and would like to see it be better than this. This is the most thoughtful post I’ve read on here in a long time. Perfect state of the program post. One thing omitted was any mention of kellen Thames. I think Thames is a wildcard this season. In extremely limited minutes, his length and athleticism intrigued me and suggested he had all the tools to be a lockdown defender. Combined with Hughes it might be a good recipe for stopping dribble penetration. one nit pick to the above post - we lost to edwardsville at home not semo CenHudDude, NoCoBillsFan, Bizziken and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCoBillsFan Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said: This is the most thoughtful post I’ve read on here in a long time. Perfect state of the program post. One thing omitted was any mention of kellen Thames. I think Thames is a wildcard this season. In extremely limited minutes, his length and athleticism intrigued me and suggested he had all the tools to be a lockdown defender. Combined with Hughes it might be a good recipe for stopping dribble penetration. one nit pick to the above post - we lost to edwardsville at home not semo Thank you for the kind words. The Ford debate has gotten so convoluted, I felt like we needed to get back to the roots of why there is so much criticism of Ford. Anytime I hear “bUt 20 wiNs” from now on, I’m just gonna point back to this post You see how much I’ve disassociated from that game? Can’t even get the correct OVC school. Edited my post accordingly. In an ideal world, I’d love for Thames to be a lockdown defender. He would be exactly what this team is missing. But since the beginning of the Ford era, how many guys went from only getting garbage time minutes on season to eventually contributing the next? The only guy I can think of is Demarius Jacobs. Would love for it happen, but it seems like a pipe dream imo. thatskablamo likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVBilliken Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 57 minutes ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Thank you for the kind words. The Ford debate has gotten so convoluted, I felt like we needed to get back to the roots of why there is so much criticism of Ford. Anytime I hear “bUt 20 wiNs” from now on, I’m just gonna point back to this post You see how much I’ve disassociated from that game? Can’t even get the correct OVC school. Edited my post accordingly. In an ideal world, I’d love for Thames to be a lockdown defender. He would be exactly what this team is missing. But since the beginning of the Ford era, how many guys went from only getting garbage time minutes on season to eventually contributing the next? The only guy I can think of is Demarius Jacobs. Would love for it happen, but it seems like a pipe dream imo. Thames was apparently hurt the second half of the season. At the halfway point of the season he and Hughes had both played limited minutes. Who's to say without the injury Thames wouldn't of also become a bigger contributer like Hughes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JettFlight5 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 8 minutes ago, WVBilliken said: Thames was apparently hurt the second half of the season. At the halfway point of the season he and Hughes had both played limited minutes. Who's to say without the injury Thames wouldn't of also become a bigger contributer like Hughes. Didn't Thames get hit by a car? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 34 minutes ago, WVBilliken said: Thames was apparently hurt the second half of the season. At the halfway point of the season he and Hughes had both played limited minutes. Who's to say without the injury Thames wouldn't of also become a bigger contributer like Hughes. Good point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Compton Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 20 hours ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Let’s break down the current state of the program. It’s about more than Noland and you know it. We are coming off of a season where we being picked in the top 25 prior to the season and were seen as one of the top 2 teams in the A10 before the year started. We ended the year outside the top 100, no postseason, and had some of the worst losses since the Crews era (SIUE at home). As of June 1st, we are still missing an assistant coach and have three open scholarships. Due to the fact that we lost three starters and several impact players, hitting the portal hard was a must. And what have we gotten? A good big that will need a waiver that he might not get, a terrible defender from a terrible team (when the current roster already has no defense), and a completely unknown Euro big (that Ford has had 0 luck on so far). And the current roster isn’t exactly stacked either. Jimerson coming back helps, and I’m super high on Parker, but what else do we have? Our only true point guard is an undersized freshman, all of our bigs are giant question marks, and we really have nobody that can actually guard a wing effectively. And that’s just looking at the surface level! It gets worse when you add context. I’ll make a list: 1. We’ve only made the tournament once in 6 possible seasons (and that only happened because Tramaine Isabell turned into prime Allen Iverson for four games). 2. We have had two de-commitments of much needed impact players and lost two assistant coaches in the last two months. 3. The A10 continues to get worse and while the Big East is likely to expand soon, we’ve completely threw away any chance of us being able to move up. 4. We haven’t made any strides in recruiting for 2024 and beyond. 5. We had a local two-time National assist leader on the roster and he never made the tournament, not exactly sending a good message to any future local recruits. 6. Our “Ace-recruiter” of a coach has a roster without a single top-150 recruit. 7. We have the highest paid coach in the conference and he has never finished higher than 4th in 7 seasons. Sit back and think about it. Are you happy about this? Does this make you hopeful for the future of the program? According to the AD and the FFC, we got our 20 wins so we should just shut up and take the mediocrity. Personally, I actually care about the program and would like to see it be better than this. A lot of good points there. However, I don't think "we ended the year outside the top 100" is accurate. Wherever you look - NET (97), KenPom (96), ESPN BPI (89), Sagerin (84) - last season's team was top 100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbj14 Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 minutes ago, Compton said: A lot of good points there. However, I don't think "we ended the year outside the top 100" is accurate. Wherever you look - NET (97), KenPom (96), ESPN BPI (89), Sagerin (84) - last season's team was top 100. While that is true, it also doesn’t mean much being right inside it, because it’s still short of what this team was supposed to be. At the end of the day, the team was supposed to make the tournament, and fell short of even the NIT. NoCoBillsFan likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCoBillsFan Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 1 hour ago, WVBilliken said: Thames was apparently hurt the second half of the season. At the halfway point of the season he and Hughes had both played limited minutes. Who's to say without the injury Thames wouldn't have also become a bigger contributer like Hughes. You’re right, we don’t know for sure because Thames got hurt. Still a question mark regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCoBillsFan Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 33 minutes ago, Compton said: A lot of good points there. However, I don't think "we ended the year outside the top 100" is accurate. Wherever you look - NET (97), KenPom (96), ESPN BPI (89), Sagerin (84) - last season's team was top 100. Fair enough, I edited my post. But with the guys we had last year and the expectations, making the NIT would’ve still been a failure. We weren’t even on the NIT bubble!! johnbj14 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Elrond Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 14 minutes ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Fair enough, I edited my post. But with the guys we had last year and the expectations, making the NIT would’ve still been a failure. We weren’t even on the NIT bubble!! Exactly! We weren’t even on the NIT bubble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheA_Bomb Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 I agree with WV that this is the new normal the turn over the seemingly last minute roster fills due to transfer portal. I'm not panicking because of that, I was raising the alarm before all this. The trend is bad. The events whether the new normal or not are mostly bad. I'm not in the Noland didn't matter anyway camp. I think he was going to be a very good impact player for SLU due to size and skill. If you're on the all B12 newcomer team you have skills. Alas now he's gone. MusicCityBilliken and Bizziken like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgeldmacher Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 6 hours ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Thank you for the kind words. The Ford debate has gotten so convoluted, I felt like we needed to get back to the roots of why there is so much criticism of Ford. Anytime I hear “bUt 20 wiNs” from now on, I’m just gonna point back to this post You see how much I’ve disassociated from that game? Can’t even get the correct OVC school. Edited my post accordingly. In an ideal world, I’d love for Thames to be a lockdown defender. He would be exactly what this team is missing. But since the beginning of the Ford era, how many guys went from only getting garbage time minutes on season to eventually contributing the next? The only guy I can think of is Demarius Jacobs. Would love for it happen, but it seems like a pipe dream imo. The crazy thing about this argument that is happening is how insanely inaccurate both sides are in characterizing each other's opinions. As someone pointed out, no one who thinks Ford should be gone actually hates Ford. On the opposite side, it's getting very old hearing that people who think Ford should be retained (for now) are happy with 20 win seasons. We are not fine with 20 wins if that means not winning the A-10 and not making the tournament. NoCoBillsFan's post was dead on. Neither side can disagree with anything he posted. I, personally, thought Ford should get one more chance. That doesn't mean I'm happy with the state of the team. I see everything NoCoBillsFan wrote and say "yes, we need to be better than that." The team under Ford has not met the university's and fans' expectations. There have been some extenuating circumstances, but those cannot be used as excuses indefinitely. I think that most "Ford Supporters" will say its time for him to go if this season doesn't prove that we are on track with the expectations. Can't we just cheer for our team and know that we're all, nearly, in the same place about being upset with not being better right now, without the stupidity that has made this board nearly unreadable for several months? Billiken Rich, Billikenbooster, ACE and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 12 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said: The crazy thing about this argument that is happening is how insanely inaccurate both sides are in characterizing each other's opinions. As someone pointed out, no one who thinks Ford should be gone actually hates Ford. On the opposite side, it's getting very old hearing that people who think Ford should be retained (for now) are happy with 20 win seasons. We are not fine with 20 wins if that means not winning the A-10 and not making the tournament. NoCoBillsFan's post was dead on. Neither side can disagree with anything he posted. I, personally, thought Ford should get one more chance. That doesn't mean I'm happy with the state of the team. I see everything NoCoBillsFan wrote and say "yes, we need to be better than that." The team under Ford has not met the university's and fans' expectations. There have been some extenuating circumstances, but those cannot be used as excuses indefinitely. I think that most "Ford Supporters" will say its time for him to go if this season doesn't prove that we are on track with the expectations. Can't we just cheer for our team and know that we're all, nearly, in the same place about being upset with not being better right now, without the stupidity that has made this board nearly unreadable for several months? I understand your point and do not necessarily disagree with it but the problem is that people are wanting everyone to donate to the BVF so Ford can have the money to buy who he wants and they want people to continue buying their season tix and they want people to still donate to the athletic department. SLU wants that also but they want to not have to listen to those who are not satisfied by simply saying everything is fine when it really may not be. My issue is why would I give money to the BVF fund when I may not have much confidence that Ford will use it effectively, I probably will continue to buy my season tix but not because I am happy with where we are but because I don't want to lose my place in line when the team does turn around a couple of years down the road. Will I continue to give to the athletic department, well that is a tougher call because once again I am not sure I want to give money to a group who may not use it properly but then again I still want to support the overall athletic program. As you can see keeping Ford for one more year to give him one more chance does make it a bit more complicated for some us. TheA_Bomb likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgeldmacher Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 15 minutes ago, cheeseman said: I understand your point and do not necessarily disagree with it but the problem is that people are wanting everyone to donate to the BVF so Ford can have the money to buy who he wants and they want people to continue buying their season tix and they want people to still donate to the athletic department. SLU wants that also but they want to not have to listen to those who are not satisfied by simply saying everything is fine when it really may not be. My issue is why would I give money to the BVF fund when I may not have much confidence that Ford will use it effectively, I probably will continue to buy my season tix but not because I am happy with where we are but because I don't want to lose my place in line when the team does turn around a couple of years down the road. Will I continue to give to the athletic department, well that is a tougher call because once again I am not sure I want to give money to a group who may not use it properly but then again I still want to support the overall athletic program. As you can see keeping Ford for one more year to give him one more chance does make it a bit more complicated for some us. I get it. My take is that I think we should all continue to support the program in whatever way we have and let the chips fall where they may. Whether that money helps Ford get us where we want to be or the next coach, it still helps the program overall. shempie, dlarry and willie like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlarry Posted June 2, 2023 Share Posted June 2, 2023 1 hour ago, cgeldmacher said: The crazy thing about this argument that is happening is how insanely inaccurate both sides are in characterizing each other's opinions. As someone pointed out, no one who thinks Ford should be gone actually hates Ford. On the opposite side, it's getting very old hearing that people who think Ford should be retained (for now) are happy with 20 win seasons. We are not fine with 20 wins if that means not winning the A-10 and not making the tournament. NoCoBillsFan's post was dead on. Neither side can disagree with anything he posted. I, personally, thought Ford should get one more chance. That doesn't mean I'm happy with the state of the team. I see everything NoCoBillsFan wrote and say "yes, we need to be better than that." The team under Ford has not met the university's and fans' expectations. There have been some extenuating circumstances, but those cannot be used as excuses indefinitely. I think that most "Ford Supporters" will say its time for him to go if this season doesn't prove that we are on track with the expectations. Can't we just cheer for our team and know that we're all, nearly, in the same place about being upset with not being better right now, without the stupidity that has made this board nearly unreadable for several months? I don’t think it’s as bad as it seems. we have had 5-6 posters total who were so extreme one way or the other than it made super frustrating. They would jump into a thread every time Ford was mentioned and either defend him to a nauseating extreme or rip him to a nauseating extreme. I think 95 percent of posters on this board are pretty level headed. Some may be happy with Ford and some may want to move on but most can understand both sides of the arguments. Personally I wish we would have moved on. I knew it wasn’t likely but that was my hope. We didn’t and I will continue to support Ford and the Billikens this year. 2010andBeyond, cgeldmacher and Bizziken like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 18 hours ago, dlarry said: I don’t think it’s as bad as it seems. we have had 5-6 posters total who were so extreme one way or the other than it made super frustrating. They would jump into a thread every time Ford was mentioned and either defend him to a nauseating extreme or rip him to a nauseating extreme. I think 95 percent of posters on this board are pretty level headed. Some may be happy with Ford and some may want to move on but most can understand both sides of the arguments. Personally I wish we would have moved on. I knew it wasn’t likely but that was my hope. We didn’t and I will continue to support Ford and the Billikens this year. My biggest problem with the anti-Ford crowd is the timing. Almost nothing could have gotten Ford fired last season, but it didn’t stop the piling on. All it did was lead to this current malaise. That felt predictable. Sometimes you can’t really win, but you can always lose! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 1 hour ago, AnkielBreakers said: My biggest problem with the anti-Ford crowd is the timing. Almost nothing could have gotten Ford fired last season, but it didn’t stop the piling on. All it did was lead to this current malaise. That felt predictable. Sometimes you can’t really win, but you can always lose! Your right it is all the people who wanted a change that has caused Ford all his problems - give me a break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLIKNS Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 On Twitter C. J. thanked 11 conferences( no schools mentioned ) for recruiting him, decision coming soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 1 hour ago, cheeseman said: Your right it is all the people who wanted a change that has caused Ford all his problems - give me a break. This is a great example of the problem. That is not what I said at all. billikenbill, cgeldmacher, Billiken Rich and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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