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I'm probably beating a dead horse, but I can't get over how much of a joke the NET rankings are. The Bradley Braves at ranked 10 points higher than the Saint Louis Billikens. I want to hear a possible logical explanation that says Bradley's resume can even be brought up in the same sentence as ours. 

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20 minutes ago, gabriel said:

I'm probably beating a dead horse, but I can't get over how much of a joke the NET rankings are. The Bradley Braves at ranked 10 points higher than the Saint Louis Billikens. I want to hear a possible logical explanation that says Bradley's resume can even be brought up in the same sentence as ours. 

As far as I am concerned, the NCAA wasted their money developing the NET ranking system. Unless, of course, their objective was to boost members of the Power conferences, in which case well done.

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1 hour ago, Lord Elrond said:

Unless, of course, their objective was to boost members of the Power conferences, in which case well done.

winner!  that's all it was ever about.   the mids figured out how to beat the rpi, so they had to do something.  the hell with letting the lowly mvc and A-10 get 4 or 5 teams in "their" tourney.

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1 hour ago, gabriel said:

I'm probably beating a dead horse, but I can't get over how much of a joke the NET rankings are. The Bradley Braves at ranked 10 points higher than the Saint Louis Billikens. I want to hear a possible logical explanation that says Bradley's resume can even be brought up in the same sentence as ours. 

The NET system automatically moves you up 10 pots if you beat SIUE.

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19 hours ago, gabriel said:

I'm probably beating a dead horse, but I can't get over how much of a joke the NET rankings are. The Bradley Braves at ranked 10 points higher than the Saint Louis Billikens. I want to hear a possible logical explanation that says Bradley's resume can even be brought up in the same sentence as ours. 

I have written about this in numerous threads since the NET was developed. It is a relatively inefficient model that was developed to assist with team selection  for March Madness. It is a full data model.  This means it can only operate correctly when it has a full set of data (in March).  In December, when it comes out, it is a joke. Two coin tosses in December that both come up tails and the NET would say 100% chance for a tails toss in March.

Even though in Dec,  it varies widely from my model (as well as others ) it finally starts to come together in March at about 80-85%.   Unfortunately , SLU is a frequent flyer in that 15-20%(10-20 teams) zone almost every year.  This is exactly what the NCAA wants. A model that is somewhat in the ballpark so the NCAA can come in and fix things ...er uh....i.e  correct the AI inefficiency with the all seeing and understanding human intelligence and touch.

I would say the NCAA is happy right now with the way things are working out.  Well, what about the December inefficiency ? ...what about making Colgate a top 10 team?  What about what the fans think?  The NCAA thinks it is all good for fan interest and that in March it will in its wisdom always make things right.

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In ‘22 an NCAA Tournament unit was estimated to be worth $338,887 (per game played). This week the NET transfers 3 NCAA at large bids to the Power 5, for a total redistribution of $1,016,661 minimum, if those 3 at large bid teams play and lose only 1 NCAA game. The NET also makes intra-Power 5 transfers, primarily to the Big XII and Big Ten, primarily from the ACC, but that is of minimal concern here, other than the ACC would have standing to object, at least this year could be a powerful ally.

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For my two cents, you can pick whatever formula you want.  The inequity is that conferences outside of the P6 need the chance to schedule more impact games with P6 opponents.  (Q1 games as an example of impact games).   SLU got 3 P6 games this season, VCU 3 and Dayton 3 also.  All 3 of SLU's and Dayton's P6 games currently are Q1. None of VCU's games are Q1. 

The margin of error is extremely slim.

Second, you have to perform, you have to win.  Today, the entire A10 is 3-24 in all Q1 games, including in conference games and non-P6 games.  That just doesn't cut it.   

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1 hour ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

In ‘22 an NCAA Tournament unit was estimated to be worth $338,887 (per game played). This week the NET transfers 3 NCAA at large bids to the Power 5, for a total redistribution of $1,016,661 minimum, if those 3 at large bid teams play and lose only 1 NCAA game. The NET also makes intra-Power 5 transfers, primarily to the Big XII and Big Ten, primarily from the ACC, but that is of minimal concern here, other than the ACC would have standing to object, at least this year could be a powerful ally.

Each unit is worth $2,033,322.  It is paid out over six years at $338,887 per year.

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19 minutes ago, WVBilliken said:

Interesting how 2 ranking systems can be so different.  Rankings as of today.  

SLU RPI Ranking ........ 41

SLU NET Ranking ....... 89

Can a computer geek out there explain this huge difference?  Oh, and KENPOM has SLU at 80.

not a geek, but i have long suspected the net was intentionally set up to retard the mid major and promote the power conferences.   so credit the programming to accomplish that task.   it isnt a mistake it was done intentionally.   who knew when the likes of the MVC figured out the formula and did what was needed to maximize the conference bids it would receive would lead to this "corruption" by the ncaa.  

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KenPom, roughly speaking, measures efficiency in 3 categories. offense, defense, tempo. 

Offense is points per 100 possessions vs the average.

Defense is points given up per 100 possessions vs the average. 

Tempo is defined as number of possessions per game. 

Possessions=Field Goals attempted, minus offensive rebounds. Plus turnovers. Plus free throws attempted.

Stats are based on per 100 possessions. 

Currently SLU is 47 in offensive efficiency. SLU is 147 in defensive efficiency. SLU is 103 in the above mentioned Tempo. 

Other things are measured, such as luck factor, schedule, both in and out of conference. SLU’s non-conference schedule is currently 59. SLU is 59 in luck factor.

 

 

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2 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

not a geek, but i have long suspected the net was intentionally set up to retard the mid major and promote the power conferences.   so credit the programming to accomplish that task.   it isnt a mistake it was done intentionally.   who knew when the likes of the MVC figured out the formula and did what was needed to maximize the conference bids it would receive would lead to this "corruption" by the ncaa.  

As of today, the NET transfers 2 NCAA At Large bids to the Power 5 vis-a-vis the RPI, the ratings metric formerly used by the NCAA. One of those transferred NCAA at large bids is SLU’s.

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Updated NET:  Dayton 67, VCU 81, SLU 85.

Pomeroy: Dayton 59, VCU 78, SLU 79.

RPI: SLU 39, VCU 59, George Mason 95, Fordham 100, UMass 102, Dayton 103. 

While the NET is the metric now used by the NCAA, and the NET and Pomeroy are considered advanced, what a disparity exists for SLU with those two metrics compared to the RPI, the metric formerly used by the NCAA and still used in Soccer and Baseball. 

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Dayton moves up 6 spots in the NET with their drubbing of Richmond. Dayton at 67 with 0 Q1 or 2 wins and 3 Q3 losses is laugh out loud funny. EDIT: looks like one of Dayton’s wins has moved to a Q2 win.  Now 1-5 in Q 1&2. 

 VCU’s home loss to the Bonnies drops them 11 spots. 

We need to start stepping on some necks out there if we want to move up. 

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22 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

Updated NET:  Dayton 67, VCU 81, SLU 85.

Pomeroy: Dayton 59, VCU 78, SLU 79.

RPI: SLU 39, VCU 59, George Mason 95, Fordham 100, UMass 102, Dayton 103. 

While the NET is the metric now used by the NCAA, and the NET and Pomeroy are considered advanced, what a disparity exists for SLU with those two metrics compared to the RPI, the metric formerly used by the NCAA and still used in Soccer and Baseball. 

This just tells me NET and Pomeroy are trash.

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2 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

Updated NET:  Dayton 67, VCU 81, SLU 85.

Pomeroy: Dayton 59, VCU 78, SLU 79.

RPI: SLU 39, VCU 59, George Mason 95, Fordham 100, UMass 102, Dayton 103. 

While the NET is the metric now used by the NCAA, and the NET and Pomeroy are considered advanced, what a disparity exists for SLU with those two metrics compared to the RPI, the metric formerly used by the NCAA and still used in Soccer and Baseball. 

Thanks for saving me some searches. Just keep taking care of business men! Friday should be awesome! And who’s joining me in Dayton?!?!

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