Midtown Madness: S4E36 Schertz Hits Ground Running: Visits Scheduled, Recruit Commitment, Media Appearances

[Podcast]

Season 4 of the Midtown Madness Podcast is brought to you by Two Men and a Garden! That’s right they are fueling this podcast with not only delicious pickles, but salsas and most recently Harissa sauce. They are the real deal! Their products are delicious and more importantly local to St. Louis. You can pick up their many products at any local grocery stores or online where they ship nationwide!

https://twomenandagarden.com/

https://twitter.com/2mensalsa

https://www.instagram.com/2mensalsa

On This Episode

• Josh Schertz Introductory Press Conference

• Tour de St. Louis Sports for Schertz

• St. Louis Media Tour

• Staff Positions Announced

• Flood of Recruiting and Transfer Portal News

• Gibson is BACK!

• Coaching Carousel

• Peyton Kennedy’s Last Ride

• Baseball sweeps Davidson

• Softball splits with URI via 2 Walk Offs

https://twitter.com/MidtownMadPod

https://www.instagram.com/midtownmadpod/

View the full article

[Lord Elrond]

Question- Pete mentioned on the podcast that he had noticed that the staff under CTF hadn’t done much recruiting activity recently. I would assume that’s about the time that CTF’s assistant coaches came to the conclusion that CTF was a dead man walking, and they needed to start polishing up their resumes. About what time do you think they reached that conclusion? The SIU game? Sometime around then?

[ACE]

3 hours ago, Lord Elrond said:

Question- Pete mentioned on the podcast that he had noticed that the staff under CTF hadn’t done much recruiting activity recently. I would assume that’s about the time that CTF’s assistant coaches came to the conclusion that CTF was a dead man walking, and they needed to start polishing up their resumes. About what time do you think they reached that conclusion? The SIU game? Sometime around then?

Assistants should keep recruiting, building relationships and possible recruits for their next job. I have little doubt Forte was doing it while he was here - recruiting for his next job.

[thetorch]

4 hours ago, Lord Elrond said:

Question- Pete mentioned on the podcast that he had noticed that the staff under CTF hadn’t done much recruiting activity recently. I would assume that’s about the time that CTF’s assistant coaches came to the conclusion that CTF was a dead man walking, and they needed to start polishing up their resumes. About what time do you think they reached that conclusion? The SIU game? Sometime around then?

Ford's staff quit contacting locals a couple months after Hughes and Thames came on.

[Old guy]

How can you work for someone who offers you no movement forward? Confronted with a boss in that situation, lots of people just start planning to move elsewhere. 

[Pistol]

6 hours ago, Lord Elrond said:

Question- Pete mentioned on the podcast that he had noticed that the staff under CTF hadn’t done much recruiting activity recently. I would assume that’s about the time that CTF’s assistant coaches came to the conclusion that CTF was a dead man walking, and they needed to start polishing up their resumes. About what time do you think they reached that conclusion? The SIU game? Sometime around then?

 

1 hour ago, thetorch said:

Ford's staff quit contacting locals a couple months after Hughes and Thames came on.

Yeah, there was very little recruiting activity this entire season. They basically offered a few juco players and that was it. Offered some local kids last year but then didn't maintain those relationships.

[BrettJollyComedyHour]

8 hours ago, Pistol said:

 

Yeah, there was very little recruiting activity this entire season. They basically offered a few juco players and that was it. Offered some local kids last year but then didn't maintain those relationships.

This just seems like we shouldn't have been paying the staff.

[SLUMS81]

Were they totally immersed in the portal?   Otherwise doesn’t sound like a coach and his staff trying all that hard to keep his gig.

[billiken_roy]

16 minutes ago, SLUMS81 said:

Were they totally immersed in the portal?   Otherwise doesn’t sound like a coach and his staff trying all that hard to keep his gig.

I agree completely with this.  I truly don't want a lot of attention towards the high school players.   We coach them up and then they transfer up to a P5 team.  

Look at Schertz players from last year at Indiana State.   True we were compliant in attempting to pirate those players but the first 2 even skipped over us and transferred to Texas for a apparent big pay raise 

I hate what the Division one scene has become, but it isn't going back.  If we get a high school kid we better really want him and be willing to pay big.   

Considering high school recruiting at the Billiken level has always been about finding potential and hoping for developing that potential.   Now we're going to be developing it so they can go somewhere else when they finally reach the production level?    No thank you 

[slu72]

Why waste the effort and money on HS players below the top 25 line? They will likely seek new homes after 1 year; eg Medley, Curcic, Zhang, and Bussell. While I didn’t dislike these players and thought there was some potential they really didn’t add much to last season. The focus for every team has to be on the portal. Calipari learned his lesson. Five 5 star FR didn’t do much against 20-21 year old experienced players. NIL and the Portal have created a whole new ball game. I don’t like it as has turned college sports into the professional arena. But you have to play the cards you’ve been dealt, so you learn to play the game. 

[Littlebill]

1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

I agree completely with this.  I truly don't want a lot of attention towards the high school players.   We coach them up and then they transfer up to a P5 team.  

Look at Schertz players from last year at Indiana State.   True we were compliant in attempting to pirate those players but the first 2 even skipped over us and transferred to Texas for a apparent big pay raise 

I hate what the Division one scene has become, but it isn't going back.  If we get a high school kid we better really want him and be willing to pay big.   

Considering high school recruiting at the Billiken level has always been about finding potential and hoping for developing that potential.   Now we're going to be developing it so they can go somewhere else when they finally reach the production level?    No thank you 

Why are you comparing us to Indiana State? We were paying our coach more than they spent on their entire basketball program. We are not the same. 

Our soon to be all-time leading scorer is going to start his SIXTH year in a row at SLU. He isn't playing for free. We kept the nation's leader in assists on our roster for four years - he wasn't playing for free either.

 

We won't keep everyone, but no one is keeping everyone. College sports are different now, but we're a lot higher on the totem pole (and spend like it) than some people are making it seem

[Lord Elrond]

2 hours ago, SLUMS81 said:

Were they totally immersed in the portal?   Otherwise doesn’t sound like a coach and his staff trying all that hard to keep his gig.

I think the previous coaching staff realized at the start of the year that the team needed to perform or Coach Travis Ford would get fired (and his assistants). When they realized the season was going to be a disaster, the assistant coaches saw no reason to worry about future Billiken players because they (the assistants) weren’t going to be here, so they didn’t bother recruiting and instead started working on finding an off ramp.  My own guess is that it was right after the SIU game.

[billikenfan05]

1 hour ago, Littlebill said:

Why are you comparing us to Indiana State? We were paying our coach more than they spent on their entire basketball program. We are not the same. 

Our soon to be all-time leading scorer is going to start his SIXTH year in a row at SLU. He isn't playing for free. We kept the nation's leader in assists on our roster for four years - he wasn't playing for free either.

 

We won't keep everyone, but no one is keeping everyone. College sports are different now, but we're a lot higher on the totem pole (and spend like it) than some people are making it seem

Quoting this because it deserves to be posted twice. 

[Pistol]

No matter what your long-term recruiting strategy is, if you're in a major market, you can't just stop recruiting it. There are going to be HS prospects from STL with the ability to play immediately. You can't be a passive observer letting those guys all go to other schools.

[billikenbill]

1 hour ago, Lord Elrond said:

I think the previous coaching staff realized at the start of the year that the team needed to perform or Coach Travis Ford would get fired (and his assistants). When they realized the season was going to be a disaster, the assistant coaches saw no reason to worry about future Billiken players because they (the assistants) weren’t going to be here, so they didn’t bother recruiting and instead started working on finding an off ramp.  My own guess is that it was right after the SIU game.

Or for sure after the thrashing at VCU. Might have still been some hope after the first St. Joes game and the decent showing at Dayton, but with the horrid showing at VCU and Dalger's departure soon after, all hope had to be lost.

[TheA_Bomb]

Also the recruiting is making connections. If we didn't sign the player and they go elsewhere but later transfer you've already made a connection for a possible transfer. 

When you see a athlete hit the portal I always look at where they're from and who recruited them before.  Seems that many go back home or to a school/coach hat had previous relationship.

But I'd need to validate that assumption

[billiken_roy]

6 hours ago, Littlebill said:

Why are you comparing us to Indiana State? We were paying our coach more than they spent on their entire basketball program. We are not the same. 

Our soon to be all-time leading scorer is going to start his SIXTH year in a row at SLU. He isn't playing for free. We kept the nation's leader in assists on our roster for four years - he wasn't playing for free either.

 

We won't keep everyone, but no one is keeping everyone. College sports are different now, but we're a lot higher on the totem pole (and spend like it) than some people are making it seem

I'm talking about NOT recruiting totally inexperienced college players to be.   Imo it's a waste of time we are only going to upgrade them and likely lose them.   Jimmerson is an exception. He already has an established relationship with a big billiken booster, reportedly has a serious relationship with a SLU coed, and has a big time Billiken history that likely provides the billiken a home town discount as well as gives SLU a reason to invest more of their bank as well. I'm I guarantee he is not playing for free.

[slu72]

If SLU had a shot at landing a Love type FR, they should sign him. He’d at least give you a boost for one season. And if you can find the NIL $$’s to keep him, great, a bonus. It’s recruits like last year’s FR class that are the problem. Take Curcic for example. He always impressed me as a smart strong player with a good shot. But Ford just didn’t use him enough. No surprise he leapt into the portal. I guess Harriman’s departure didn’t help as both ended up here in Charleston. Still, I think a lot of FR like him will take their shot at the portal for a better playing opportunity or to earn some NIL $$’s. Medley’s another example. Why did he find the portal attractive? He came here for Ford. Ford goes he goes. Is Kent St gonna shower him with NIL $$’s? I doubt it. Again, a guy who improved at our expense and now taking it somewhere else. 
This is what college sports has become. Every team may see wholesale roster turnovers every year. It sucks, but it’s the new reality. 
I don’t even think Schertz could have kept the ISU 5 together if he had stayed given ISU’s lack of NIL $$’s. I think he knew this and was a big factor in his decision to jump ship. 

[Zink]

11 minutes ago, slu72 said:

If SLU had a shot at landing a Love type FR, they should sign him. He’d at least give you a boost for one season. And if you can find the NIL $$’s to keep him, great, a bonus. It’s recruits like last year’s FR class that are the problem. Take Curcic for example. He always impressed me as a smart strong player with a good shot. But Ford just didn’t use him enough. No surprise he leapt into the portal. I guess Harriman’s departure didn’t help as both ended up here in Charleston. Still, I think a lot of FR like him will take their shot at the portal for a better playing opportunity or to earn some NIL $$’s. Medley’s another example. Why did he find the portal attractive? He came here for Ford. Ford goes he goes. Is Kent St gonna shower him with NIL $$’s? I doubt it. Again, a guy who improved at our expense and now taking it somewhere else. 
This is what college sports has become. Every team may see wholesale roster turnovers every year. It sucks, but it’s the new reality. 
I don’t even think Schertz could have kept the ISU 5 together if he had stayed given ISU’s lack of NIL $$’s. I think he knew this and was a big factor in his decision to jump ship. 

Assuming Curcic is here on a student visa, he likely can’t receive NIL funds in the usual manner. Feel like solid international players are quickly going to be the “Moneyball” strategy for those whom NIL has left behind. 

[Taj79]

It's the new world order .... college mercenaries.  The idea that kid's are profiting from their Name, Image and Likeness is pure bullshite.  Kobe Brea at Dayton is in the portal.  Assets at Dayton claim he wants "MORE" money.  It's a hostage situation.  Love reportedly demanded $1 million.  Ballo from Arizona to Indiana for a reported $1.2 million.  For what?  A one-year thrill ride?  With no guarantee at the end of the rainbow for fans.  NIL was a nice idea but it was quickly highjacked into Pay-for-Play.  

I hope Caleb Love gets his $1 million somewhere because once he's done with his fifth year, it's minimum wage in the G League, if he's lucky.  By the way, when does all this five year COVID crap stop?

[Pistol]

This upcoming season is the last possible time to use a COVID bonus year.

I don't disagree that the market has gotten out of control. I still think we're going to see it cool when some of these really high dollar signings don't pan out, or at least don't turn out to be worth high-6 or low-7 figures to the fans who funded the deals.

I like the endorsement side of NIL. Every time I see a college athlete pop up in an ad, I remember there's no reason we couldn't have had that all along.

And had they allowed that all along (back before CBB and CFB became multi-billion-dollar industries), it probably would've prevented the out of control super PAC-style unregulated NIL market that we all hate- expensive to compete, devoid of transparency, and chock full of unscrupulous actors.

[willie]

3 minutes ago, Pistol said:

This upcoming season is the last possible time to use a COVID bonus year.

I don't disagree that the market has gotten out of control. I still think we're going to see it cool when some of these really high dollar signings don't pan out, or at least don't turn out to be worth high-6 or low-7 figures to the fans who funded the deals.

I like the endorsement side of NIL. Every time I see a college athlete pop up in an ad, I remember there's no reason we couldn't have had that all along.

And had they allowed that all along (back before CBB and CFB became multi-billion-dollar industries), it probably would've prevented the out of control super PAC-style unregulated NIL market that we all hate- expensive to compete, devoid of transparency, and chock full of unscrupulous actors.

I also like the endorsement side of NIL. Take a Luther Burden at Missouri . Putting his name on a potato chip can be a win win. Mention your favorite Billiken player and get $10 off at Best Steak House. Gibson Jimerson loves the smashed pizza at Press.  

[Old guy]

27 minutes ago, Taj79 said:

It's the new world order .... college mercenaries.  The idea that kid's are profiting from their Name, Image and Likeness is pure bullshite.  Kobe Brea at Dayton is in the portal.  Assets at Dayton claim he wants "MORE" money.  It's a hostage situation.  Love reportedly demanded $1 million.  Ballo from Arizona to Indiana for a reported $1.2 million.  For what?  A one-year thrill ride?  With no guarantee at the end of the rainbow for fans.  NIL was a nice idea but it was quickly highjacked into Pay-for-Play.  

I hope Caleb Love gets his $1 million somewhere because once he's done with his fifth year, it's minimum wage in the G League, if he's lucky.  By the way, when does all this five year COVID crap stop?

This is the beauty of Schertz strategy, find  them early on or in places a lot of colleges do not go to recruit, be able to  identify the good ones and take them in, and then get them together into a winning team. He can get a winning team out of places that none of the people thinking how are we going to get a Love or a Kobe? is given the simple answer let them go elsewhere. If the Kobes and Loves of this world spend time sucking wind not playing is because they wanted too much money that they did not get. Schertz is approaching the recruiting process from the correct angle. In other words, screw them and their greed.

[TRN]

Calipari brought up a good point at his Arkansas press conference - “why are there 26 year olds playing college basketball?”  

Of course the quick answer was COVID years, but he brought up the NCAA’s willingness to hand out extra eligibility years without much pushback.  And most importantly, a 23-26 year old would much rather stick around college playing basketball than having a post-grad job making less.

The extra years awarded has taken away opportunities from high school players.  I think the NCAA needs to just make a blanket ruling awarding all athletes 5 years and do away with the redshirt rules.  Schools can be held on the hook to honor scholarships for 4 years, although that won’t be much of an issue anymore with the portal. 

[slu72]

I think NIL was intended for players to be allowed to cut endorsement deals with businesses and receive royalties from sales of their jerseys and when their likeness was used. Fair enough. But soon enough it gets distorted and has become play for pay with no little or no strings attached. Yuri supposedly returned to SLU for NIL $$’s, does anyone recall if he did commercials or made appearances on behalf of any local businesses? Same for Gibby last season. The NIL largely did away with under the table arrangements. Combined with the no limitations portal college athletics has now become a version of the Professional Sports Free Agent period without the player having to enter into any legal contract. Nice work if you can get it.