SLU Men's Basketball Head Coaching Candidates

[HoosierPal]

11 hours ago, Pistol said:

Why not?

Thanks for asking.

I tried to find my response to ABomb when he basically asked why I hadn't jumped on his bandwagon.  I can't find it, but I will paraphrase:

I don't care who the coach of the Billikens is.  I don't care how much he makes.  (Apparently some posters would have been satisfied if Ford had made $250,000.  I never understood "We aren't getting our money's worth.")

I don't care who the AD is and I don't care how much he/she makes.

I don't care who the public address announcer is, and I don't care if the band plays at the games.  I don't care what the price of beer is at Chaifetz.

Basketball is entertainment.  I want to be entertained when I watch a basketball game.  I want my adrenaline to rush.  Hopefully the Billikens win, but if the game is a good contest, I am satisfied no matter who wins.  The Fordham loss was a good example of that.  Who wasn't entertained with that game?  Basketball doesn't feed any of STL's homeless or impact the crime rate in STL.  It's entertainment.  

There are countless coaches that can/could be in front of the Billiken bench.  Some of course would do better than others.  But it is a krap shoot.  You never know the results until you have the results in hand.  And due to the NIL and portal, the way to basketball success has changed dramatically.  Ford's coaching methods didn't change over his tenure.  He didn't de-emphasize defense, as some think he did.  He didn't get the portal right.  He didn't get the players he needed.  I watch the IU Hoosiers, and Woodson missed on the portal too. He didn't bring in enough shooters. There is no formula for success with this new chaos. 

There is no sure thing on the new hire.  If the NIL money isn't there, then it REALLY doesn't matter who the coach is.  A buyout number of $7 to $10 million has been floated on this board.  Likely that doesn't include any buyouts for the rest of the staff.  So who is supplying that money, and how much will be left over for NIL?  No one knows, but to think there will be a surplus is likely naive.  I am not increasing my donation. 

I simply find it counterproductive to get emotionally tied up in the search for a new coach.  It doesn't matter what I think nor what any of the MBM's think about a new coach.  Of course, posting opinions and desires is fine.  I don't have a candidate that if not selected, will prevent me from following the Billikens.  Whatever happens will happen, and I will give the new regime time to produce, time to give me quality entertainment.

 

[TheA_Bomb]

Hardcore SLU fans are emotionally invested in their schools' coach.

College sports fans usually care about things like the band, the arena, the Baby Blues, traditions, the atmosphere all the things that make American College Sports unique in the world and different from pro sports. Remember watching the Covid season with no atmosphere?

People care about the coach's salary because program support was once used as a reason SLU couldn't win.  Now we're supported at high levels. So it can't be as excuse.

There are not countless coaches that can win at SLU. Some schools win more than others some schools have ongoing traditions of winning. Why is that? Multiple factors that aren't just random. Good decision making, support, location, facilities etc. It's not random.

Boosters spending $10mil in buyout is a significant investment. I think they would be smart enough to know that sizeable subsequent NIL funds are needed.

The AD matters more today maybe than ever before. NCAA rules are changing weekly, conferences are changing yearly and more big possibly seismic changes are coming.  That requires leadership and vision.

If the quality of basketball is all that matters then a good coach and effective AD makes quality basketball happen.

[wgstl]

22 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Thanks for asking.

I tried to find my response to ABomb when he basically asked why I hadn't jumped on his bandwagon.  I can't find it, but I will paraphrase:

I don't care who the coach of the Billikens is.  I don't care how much he makes.  (Apparently some posters would have been satisfied if Ford had made $250,000.  I never understood "We aren't getting our money's worth.")

I don't care who the AD is and I don't care how much he/she makes.

I don't care who the public address announcer is, and I don't care if the band plays at the games.  I don't care what the price of beer is at Chaifetz.

Basketball is entertainment.  I want to be entertained when I watch a basketball game.  I want my adrenaline to rush.  Hopefully the Billikens win, but if the game is a good contest, I am satisfied no matter who wins.  The Fordham loss was a good example of that.  Who wasn't entertained with that game?  Basketball doesn't feed any of STL's homeless or impact the crime rate in STL.  It's entertainment.  

There are countless coaches that can/could be in front of the Billiken bench.  Some of course would do better than others.  But it is a krap shoot.  You never know the results until you have the results in hand.  And due to the NIL and portal, the way to basketball success has changed dramatically.  Ford's coaching methods didn't change over his tenure.  He didn't de-emphasize defense, as some think he did.  He didn't get the portal right.  He didn't get the players he needed.  I watch the IU Hoosiers, and Woodson missed on the portal too. He didn't bring in enough shooters. There is no formula for success with this new chaos. 

There is no sure thing on the new hire.  If the NIL money isn't there, then it REALLY doesn't matter who the coach is.  A buyout number of $7 to $10 million has been floated on this board.  Likely that doesn't include any buyouts for the rest of the staff.  So who is supplying that money, and how much will be left over for NIL?  No one knows, but to think there will be a surplus is likely naive.  I am not increasing my donation. 

I simply find it counterproductive to get emotionally tied up in the search for a new coach.  It doesn't matter what I think nor what any of the MBM's think about a new coach.  Of course, posting opinions and desires is fine.  I don't have a candidate that if not selected, will prevent me from following the Billikens.  Whatever happens will happen, and I will give the new regime time to produce, time to give me quality entertainment.

 

So you're a basketball fan.  Not a SLU fan. 

[3star_recruit]

7 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Thanks for asking.

I tried to find my response to ABomb when he basically asked why I hadn't jumped on his bandwagon.  I can't find it, but I will paraphrase:

I don't care who the coach of the Billikens is.  I don't care how much he makes.  (Apparently some posters would have been satisfied if Ford had made $250,000.  I never understood "We aren't getting our money's worth.")

I don't care who the AD is and I don't care how much he/she makes.

I don't care who the public address announcer is, and I don't care if the band plays at the games.  I don't care what the price of beer is at Chaifetz.

Basketball is entertainment.  I want to be entertained when I watch a basketball game.  I want my adrenaline to rush.  Hopefully the Billikens win, but if the game is a good contest, I am satisfied no matter who wins.  The Fordham loss was a good example of that.  Who wasn't entertained with that game?  Basketball doesn't feed any of STL's homeless or impact the crime rate in STL.  It's entertainment.  

There are countless coaches that can/could be in front of the Billiken bench.  Some of course would do better than others.  But it is a krap shoot.  You never know the results until you have the results in hand.  And due to the NIL and portal, the way to basketball success has changed dramatically.  Ford's coaching methods didn't change over his tenure.  He didn't de-emphasize defense, as some think he did.  He didn't get the portal right.  He didn't get the players he needed.  I watch the IU Hoosiers, and Woodson missed on the portal too. He didn't bring in enough shooters. There is no formula for success with this new chaos. 

There is no sure thing on the new hire.  If the NIL money isn't there, then it REALLY doesn't matter who the coach is.  A buyout number of $7 to $10 million has been floated on this board.  Likely that doesn't include any buyouts for the rest of the staff.  So who is supplying that money, and how much will be left over for NIL?  No one knows, but to think there will be a surplus is likely naive.  I am not increasing my donation. 

I simply find it counterproductive to get emotionally tied up in the search for a new coach.  It doesn't matter what I think nor what any of the MBM's think about a new coach.  Of course, posting opinions and desires is fine.  I don't have a candidate that if not selected, will prevent me from following the Billikens.  Whatever happens will happen, and I will give the new regime time to produce, time to give me quality entertainment.

 

That's basically how we all operated when we were 10 years old and fandom was a lot more fun and carefree back then.  I certainly didn't worry about how Rich Grawer produced whatever results he produced.  I'm not even sure I knew who the coach was back then.  I certainly wasn't making mental progress reports of the athletic director, who I didn't even know existed. 

Being an adult has turned most of us into concern trolls.  We stress out endlessly over things we have no control over.  We demonize men that we barely know.  It's unfortunate.  But it happens on every sports message board.  That's the price of testosterone.

[Pistol]

2 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

That's basically how we all operated when we were 10 years old and fandom was a lot more fun and carefree back then.  I certainly didn't worry about how Rich Grawer produced whatever results he produced.  I'm not even sure I knew who the coach was back then.  I certainly wasn't making mental progress reports of the athletic director, who I didn't even know existed. 

Being an adult has turned most of us into concern trolls.  We stress out endlessly over things we have no control over.  We demonize men that we barely know.  It's unfortunate.  But it happens on every sports message board.  That's the price of testosterone.

What on earth?

[TheA_Bomb]

Just now, wgstl said:

So you're a basketball fan.  Not a SLU fan. 

But solely basketball not anything that's surrounds basketball.

Wonder if recruiting is random too in Hoosi

Just now, 3star_recruit said:

That's basically how we all operated when we were 10 years old and fandom was a lot more fun and carefree back then.  I certainly didn't worry about how Rich Grawer produced whatever results he produced.  I'm not even sure I knew who the coach was back then.  I certainly wasn't making mental progress reports of the athletic director, who I didn't even know existed. 

Being an adult has turned most of us into concern trolls.  We stress out endlessly over things we have no control over.  We demonize men that we barely know.  It's unfortunate.  But it happens on every sports message board.  That's the price of testosterone.

Nah it's not. When I was 10 I cared about the mascot, the band, the concessions available, the half time show, the cheers.

The thing is college fans do have some measure of control. College sports rely on alumni participation and donations.  Fan unhappiness effects the school.

[Soderball]

28 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Thanks for asking.

I tried to find my response to ABomb when he basically asked why I hadn't jumped on his bandwagon.  I can't find it, but I will paraphrase:

I don't care who the coach of the Billikens is.  I don't care how much he makes.  (Apparently some posters would have been satisfied if Ford had made $250,000.  I never understood "We aren't getting our money's worth.")

I don't care who the AD is and I don't care how much he/she makes.

I don't care who the public address announcer is, and I don't care if the band plays at the games.  I don't care what the price of beer is at Chaifetz.

Basketball is entertainment.  I want to be entertained when I watch a basketball game.  I want my adrenaline to rush.  Hopefully the Billikens win, but if the game is a good contest, I am satisfied no matter who wins.  The Fordham loss was a good example of that.  Who wasn't entertained with that game?  Basketball doesn't feed any of STL's homeless or impact the crime rate in STL.  It's entertainment.  

There are countless coaches that can/could be in front of the Billiken bench.  Some of course would do better than others.  But it is a krap shoot.  You never know the results until you have the results in hand.  And due to the NIL and portal, the way to basketball success has changed dramatically.  Ford's coaching methods didn't change over his tenure.  He didn't de-emphasize defense, as some think he did.  He didn't get the portal right.  He didn't get the players he needed.  I watch the IU Hoosiers, and Woodson missed on the portal too. He didn't bring in enough shooters. There is no formula for success with this new chaos. 

There is no sure thing on the new hire.  If the NIL money isn't there, then it REALLY doesn't matter who the coach is.  A buyout number of $7 to $10 million has been floated on this board.  Likely that doesn't include any buyouts for the rest of the staff.  So who is supplying that money, and how much will be left over for NIL?  No one knows, but to think there will be a surplus is likely naive.  I am not increasing my donation. 

I simply find it counterproductive to get emotionally tied up in the search for a new coach.  It doesn't matter what I think nor what any of the MBM's think about a new coach.  Of course, posting opinions and desires is fine.  I don't have a candidate that if not selected, will prevent me from following the Billikens.  Whatever happens will happen, and I will give the new regime time to produce, time to give me quality entertainment.

 

Whoever that coach is, it will not be Travis Ford.

 

Travis Ford got fired, HoosierPal. Probably Joe Biden's fault. Deal with it.

[BrettJollyComedyHour]

2 minutes ago, Pistol said:

What on earth?

So he's saying being an adult means...caring about adult things? Caring about a sports team as an adult is about recapturing that feeling of when we were kids, I think.

[Pistol]

27 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Thanks for asking.

I tried to find my response to ABomb when he basically asked why I hadn't jumped on his bandwagon.  I can't find it, but I will paraphrase:

I don't care who the coach of the Billikens is.  I don't care how much he makes.  (Apparently some posters would have been satisfied if Ford had made $250,000.  I never understood "We aren't getting our money's worth.")

I don't care who the AD is and I don't care how much he/she makes.

I don't care who the public address announcer is, and I don't care if the band plays at the games.  I don't care what the price of beer is at Chaifetz.

Basketball is entertainment.  I want to be entertained when I watch a basketball game.  I want my adrenaline to rush.  Hopefully the Billikens win, but if the game is a good contest, I am satisfied no matter who wins.  The Fordham loss was a good example of that.  Who wasn't entertained with that game?  Basketball doesn't feed any of STL's homeless or impact the crime rate in STL.  It's entertainment.  

There are countless coaches that can/could be in front of the Billiken bench.  Some of course would do better than others.  But it is a krap shoot.  You never know the results until you have the results in hand.  And due to the NIL and portal, the way to basketball success has changed dramatically.  Ford's coaching methods didn't change over his tenure.  He didn't de-emphasize defense, as some think he did.  He didn't get the portal right.  He didn't get the players he needed.  I watch the IU Hoosiers, and Woodson missed on the portal too. He didn't bring in enough shooters. There is no formula for success with this new chaos. 

There is no sure thing on the new hire.  If the NIL money isn't there, then it REALLY doesn't matter who the coach is.  A buyout number of $7 to $10 million has been floated on this board.  Likely that doesn't include any buyouts for the rest of the staff.  So who is supplying that money, and how much will be left over for NIL?  No one knows, but to think there will be a surplus is likely naive.  I am not increasing my donation. 

I simply find it counterproductive to get emotionally tied up in the search for a new coach.  It doesn't matter what I think nor what any of the MBM's think about a new coach.  Of course, posting opinions and desires is fine.  I don't have a candidate that if not selected, will prevent me from following the Billikens.  Whatever happens will happen, and I will give the new regime time to produce, time to give me quality entertainment.

Thanks. I was just curious based on some recent posts. I think you have a much different approach to fandom than most people around here.

I would say that for someone with your perspective, Schertz should be an excellent hire. Offensive minded coach whose teams score a ton = high entertainment value. And he's coming from a school in Indiana.

[Soderball]

Just now, BrettJollyComedyHour said:

So he's saying being an adult means...caring about adult things? Caring about a sports team as an adult is about recapturing that feeling of when we were kids, I think.

I don't know about you guys but I want to go to the NCAA tournament with my dad again. I want to be able to yell unsportsmanlike things at Anthony Grant and our A10 rivals and other hated programs. Let's go Billikens. Bring on the era of the Dirty Schertz.

[BrettJollyComedyHour]

3 minutes ago, Soderball said:

I don't know about you guys but I want to go to the NCAA tournament with my dad again. I want to be able to yell unsportsmanlike things at Anthony Grant and our A10 rivals and other hated programs. Let's go Billikens. Bring on the era of the Dirty Schertz.

Absolutely! I want my dad to be able to work in an electric atmosphere again where we go up against ranked opponents on the regular and have a shot to beat them every time. The right coach will do that.

[TheA_Bomb]

I want Billiken Roy to see SLU make it to the Sweet 16. 

But I want to see it too.  

[3star_recruit]

14 minutes ago, BrettJollyComedyHour said:

So he's saying being an adult means...caring about adult things? Caring about a sports team as an adult is about recapturing that feeling of when we were kids, I think.

But this isn't how we operated when we were kids.  We didn't know enough about how the world worked to care about the fine details. (Well ABomb did but maybe he was precocious).  I'm not saying it's all bad, but it's certainly more stressful being an adult sports fan.  And often more mean-spirited.

[billikenfan05]

1 minute ago, 3star_recruit said:

But this isn't how we operated when we were kids.  We didn't know enough about how the world worked to care about the fine details. (Well ABomb did but maybe he was precocious).  I'm not saying it's all bad, but it's certainly more stressful being an adult sports fan.  And often more mean-spirited.

I'm not sure that's true.

[someoneelse]

1 minute ago, 3star_recruit said:

But this isn't how we operated when we were kids.  We didn't know enough about how the world worked to care about the fine details. (Well ABomb did but maybe he was precocious).  I'm not saying it's all bad, but it's certainly more stressful being an adult sports fan.  And often more mean-spirited.

I disagree with it being more stressful being an adult sports fan.  An adult understands that life is long and your team, most probably, will get another shot at a title.  If you are ten years old, your frame of reference is all off.  You are only in college four years and there are 'lasts' being that kind of fan, too.

 

An adult can remember Bonner, or Lisch, or Hughes with perspective and know that tomorrow is another day.  Hope springs eternal!

[TheA_Bomb]

10 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

But this isn't how we operated when we were kids.  We didn't know enough about how the world worked to care about the fine details. (Well ABomb did but maybe he was precocious).  I'm not saying it's all bad, but it's certainly more stressful being an adult sports fan.  And often more mean-spirited.

I'm not saying I cared about the AD as a child. Hoosier has stated he doesn't care about the aspects that I think make up the college atmosphere.  As a child I went to Auburn football games. The atmosphere surrounding the games was huge.  Seeing the Eagle fly and land on the field, my uncle telling me to go to to the cheer leaders and tell them I'm a baby tiger, hearing the band, rolling Toomer's Corner.  That's all unique to college sports. Each school has unique traditions. I and many others adult or child, care about it.

Now yes as an adult I realize that the atmosphere doesn't just happen. Winning doesn't just happen.  I have knowledge of organizational management and leadership.  I can't help but notice when it's bad.  So yeah that makes me mad if my school's athletics director is feckless.  Ignorance is bliss as they say. 

[Brighton]

Well, I’ll tell you what, if it’s that stressful on you, then might I suggest following McKendree, MoBap, or WashU ?

[Littlebill]

20 minutes ago, Brighton said:

Well, I’ll tell you what, if it’s that stressful on you, then might I suggest following McKendree, MoBap, or WashU ?

Can we not include the Catz with the two d3 schools? They're in the GLVC and lost in the Sweet 16 last year. Thanks in advance.

 

PS - George Suggs will be coaching in d1 eventually. Been good at McK for a couple years now and is only 30 or so

[HoosierPal]

1 hour ago, wgstl said:

So you're a basketball fan.  Not a SLU fan. 

Whatever......

[billikenfan05]

5 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Whatever......

https://www.reddit.com/r/CollegeBasketball/

[HoosierPal]

1 hour ago, Pistol said:

Thanks. I was just curious based on some recent posts. I think you have a much different approach to fandom than most people around here.

I would say that for someone with your perspective, Schertz should be an excellent hire. Offensive minded coach whose teams score a ton = high entertainment value. And he's coming from a school in Indiana.

Interesting, the point I underlined.  I find it amusing how many assumptions are made by posters.  My glass is half full.  Most posters seem to have a half empty glass. 

I remember watching Larry Bird and Magic Johnson's fabulous matchup.  Bird had a banged up hand and basically had to shoot with his off hand.  Carl Nicks was basically the only other Sycamore who helped take the heat off of Bird. That was a wonderful final game.   Fabulous entertainment.

Yes, I follow all things hoosier, (just a Billiken Roy follows all things Metro East.) and I have enjoyed ISU's success.  Would Schertz be successful in the A10, or a P6 league?  I have no idea.  High octane offense if wonderful, but tough man defense is fun to watch also.  If Schertz is the coach, great.  If he brings his players fine, if he doesn't fine also.   If it is someone else selected, great.  There are no guarantee's attached to any coach.  

[almaman]

4 hours ago, 3star_recruit said:

That's basically how we all operated when we were 10 years old and fandom was a lot more fun and carefree back then.  I certainly didn't worry about how Rich Grawer produced whatever results he produced.  I'm not even sure I knew who the coach was back then.  I certainly wasn't making mental progress reports of the athletic director, who I didn't even know existed. 

Being an adult has turned most of us into concern trolls.  We stress out endlessly over things we have no control over.  We demonize men that we barely know.  It's unfortunate.  But it happens on every sports message board.  That's the price of testosterone.

well said. fanatics r a pain, so we fans cause pain by being fanatics. not pretty, embarrassing really but this fan can't help it

[cgeldmacher]

3 hours ago, billikenfan05 said:

I'm not sure that's true.

I do.  When I was a kid and when I was a student at SLU I never got as worked up about the Billikens as I have as an adult.  I think the same is true of the other guys on this board. Maybe it's something about being older.  Maybe it has to do with the fact that message boards exist now.  I am constantly having to back myself off of getting too upset about things like which coach we might get now that Ford has been fired.

Right now, a group of adults are arguing back and forth, to the point of name calling, about a few coaches who we may or may not hire.  The reality is that we don't know how any of them will do.  Schertz could get us to an Elite 8 in a few years or be the next Soderberg.  Ahearn could make us into perennial A-10 champs and get us into the Big East or could be terrible.  The reality is that we just don't know, but guys on this board are at each other's throats acting like they absolutely, positively do know what the future would be for either of these guys.  And before anyone throws out the "that's what message boards are" understand that the question was are we more stressed and angry as older fans.  The answer is definitely yes.

[slu72]

Right now there’s a hole in the hoops staff, so is anyone studying the portal? Anyone know Harriman’s status. I hope we keep him, but likely won’t. 

[DOC]

6 hours ago, Pistol said:

Where are these figures coming from?

I would expect SLU to pay either of them close to the same amount, and it would be somewhere in between those numbers. Schertz makes $365,000. I don't know what Ahearn makes but I'm guessing it's comparable. NBA assistants generally make 6 figures, with a pretty wide range depending on role and experience.

Bottom line is neither of them would be a huge savings over the other in terms of salary.

Schertz has a proven record of success at the college level. He has 4 national championships. Ahearn hasn’t even coached a college game. 
Schertz coached the #1 offense in the country. Ahearn did not. 
Schertz is on most everyone’s short list. He is a hot commodity. Ahearn is only on a few boosters short list. 
There’s no comparison between what the 2 bring to the table. None. So why do you think Ahearn deserves Schertz money? He doesn’t.