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2021-2022 Season


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1 hour ago, Old guy said:

I apologize for my lack of knowledge. Does anyone know how what the average minutes per game was for Thatch last season?

Based on kenpom, the only site that broke out the splits, Fred played an average of 16.2 minutes per game. For conference, it was 18.02 minutes per game. 

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Thank you johnbj14. Let's try to figure out what happened with Thatch. We all know he had mitochondrial myositis (a rare genetic disorder causing muscle degeneration when overused). He had a really extensive medical work up and therapy. However, I always had the doubt he would be able to play a full game or close to a full game without problems. We know that during conference play we just did not do that well. This is reflected in the increased in average minutes played per game, he was needed to help out. However he could not play, or apparently could not play, a full game last season. I think we should expect him to play an equivalent amount of time during the 21-22 season. In my opinion, he could be a starter, but he will not be able to play the number of minutes French and Goodwin were playing.

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4 hours ago, Dr. Holly Hills said:

Love all the starting lineup talk!!  Got my blood pumping on this boring Tuesday.  Got to say I’m going with

1. Collins, 2. Nesbit, 3. Jimmmmerson, 4. Perkins,  5. Okora 

small lineup with a bunch of ‘short leashes’.  Hargrove added a 3 shot to his game last year, which is awesome, but big difference between being able to create offense and popping wide open corner 3s.  I don’t remember seeing him take guys off the dribble or effectively use screens to get shots.  Thatch… hey, I’m Fred’s biggest fan.  But you never know if his illness could flare up again.. I think he and the coach’s will always have his minutes in the back of their minds not to over work him.

 

No offense intended, but not sure you can use TJ not taking guys off the dribble as reason not to start him, when you’re plan on starting Jimerson instead. So far Jimerson has never been anything more offensively than a spot up shooter. A deadly spot up shooter. A sniper. But TJ is infinitely more capable of taking guys off the dribble than Jimerson is. 

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9 hours ago, willie said:

Sorry they are an idiot. This has nothing to do with politics. It’s pure science. And social responsibility. Politics has nothing to do with it . 

willie i am sorry, but i can respect folks who dont feel comfortable with taking the vaccine.   i got the shots as soon as possible, but you have to admit there is no long range statistics or testing so at this point in time the "science" is without a doubt limited and knowing for sure what will happen to those of us that took the shots is a "shot" in the dark.   so if an individual doesnt want to get the shot which obviously is effective at least short term imo it is their choice and i will respect that choice.   i dont think any politician or even a "doctor" who really doesnt have the complete statistics to say for sure can mandate anyone is required to get the shots.

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8 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

I miss my home of nearly 50 years (St. Louis), but this is where God has led me.  I'm settled.  I've found someone willing to marry me!  That's one of C-land's redeeming qualities!

They consider a 90-degree day very hot here.  But lake-effect snow makes it The Mistake by the Lake.

Go Guardians?

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1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

willie i am sorry, but i can respect folks who dont feel comfortable with taking the vaccine.   i got the shots as soon as possible, but you have to admit there is no long range statistics or testing so at this point in time the "science" is without a doubt limited and knowing for sure what will happen to those of us that took the shots is a "shot" in the dark.   so if an individual doesnt want to get the shot which obviously is effective at least short term imo it is their choice and i will respect that choice.   i dont think any politician or even a "doctor" who really doesnt have the complete statistics to say for sure can mandate anyone is required to get the shots.

This is a wildly uninformed statement. Any side effects from the vaccine would be noticed within months due to how mRNA vaccines work. Additionally, mRNA vaccines have been studied for decades. The COVID-19 vaccine was not created out of thin air.

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5 hours ago, Reinert310 said:

No offense intended, but not sure you can use TJ not taking guys off the dribble as reason not to start him, when you’re plan on starting Jimerson instead. So far Jimerson has never been anything more offensively than a spot up shooter. A deadly spot up shooter. A sniper. But TJ is infinitely more capable of taking guys off the dribble than Jimerson is. 

This is a big summer for Jimerson.  He absolutely has to become more confident in putting the ball on the deck when defenders run him off the line.  Otherwise, we've already seen his ceiling.

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10 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

This is a big summer for Jimerson.  He absolutely has to become more confident in putting the ball on the ball deck when defenders run him off the line.  Otherwise, we've already seen his ceiling.

Every summer is important for the whole roster whether it's Javonte adding size/strength, Yuri getting healthy, Nesbitt and Okoro adjusting to a new team, TJ continuing to develop his shooting. There's plenty of ceiling for GJ, who was a Freshman last year. 

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At 40% Fred must've been a prolific scorer in conference games.  Oh, wait, he took ten threes and made four.  Once again proving you can substantiate anything using/manipulating statistics.  Outside of that, he was 1-of-6 from distance in OOC games.  Now, he was ill so there is that to consider but overall, Fred has to show some sort of advancement in his offensive game, much like Collins does as well.  This is their fourth and third year with the program.  Time to fish or cut bait.

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21 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

my recollection jimerson put the ball on the floor a number of times effectively. he likely should do it more often. that said ford has him out there to shoot and make the 3 ball

fixed 

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18 minutes ago, Taj79 said:

At 40% Fred must've been a prolific scorer in conference games.  Oh, wait, he took ten threes and made four.  Once again proving you can substantiate anything using/manipulating statistics.  Outside of that, he was 1-of-6 from distance in OOC games.  Now, he was ill so there is that to consider but overall, Fred has to show some sort of advancement in his offensive game, much like Collins does as well.  This is their fourth and third year with the program.  Time to fish or cut bait.

it seems to me, the problem with thatch is his fouls.  he was in foul trouble constantly.  

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4 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

it seems to me, the problem with thatch is his fouls.  he was in foul trouble constantly.  

Fred’s fouls per 40 last year was 4.9, second highest on the team (for rotation players) behind Linssen at an astonishing 8.1 per 40. Fred is always going to have a degree of foul trouble to his game, he simply plays too physically on defense, but the key will be spacing the fouls out. 

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11 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

fixed 

i didnt know someone else could edit my post. i did not insert "and make". of course jimerson should never miss a shot, that goes without saying. that is why i didnt put that in my post

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31 minutes ago, Taj79 said:

At 40% Fred must've been a prolific scorer in conference games.  Oh, wait, he took ten threes and made four.  Once again proving you can substantiate anything using/manipulating statistics.  Outside of that, he was 1-of-6 from distance in OOC games.  Now, he was ill so there is that to consider but overall, Fred has to show some sort of advancement in his offensive game, much like Collins does as well.  This is their fourth and third year with the program.  Time to fish or cut bait.

In the case of Yuri, there's no one to cut bait to.  He's the best point guard we have, and it's not even close.  And Fred has already shown the advancement that you're talking about.  He averaged 7 ppg in only 18 min a game during conference , shooting 45% from the floor and 83% from the line.  If you play him 26 min, that projects to a double figure scorer.  

And while he had a horrible case of foul-itis in the NIT game, Fred only averaged 1.7 fouls per game in conference.

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23 minutes ago, Taj79 said:

At 40% Fred must've been a prolific scorer in conference games.  Oh, wait, he took ten threes and made four.  Once again proving you can substantiate anything using/manipulating statistics.  Outside of that, he was 1-of-6 from distance in OOC games.  Now, he was ill so there is that to consider but overall, Fred has to show some sort of advancement in his offensive game, much like Collins does as well.  This is their fourth and third year with the program.  Time to fish or cut bait.

My attempted point wasn’t that Thatch was a 3 point marksman.  It was that you can’t label him as a guy who can’t shoot from the 3, either.  For Fred to be effective in the offense he doesn’t need to be Curry like.  He just needs the opposition to respect his shot enough not to leave him alone on the perimeter.

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The most interesting thing for me will be the combination of players on the court. My biggest criticism of Ford over the years has been that there always seems to be a 8-10 minute stretch in the 2nd half where he puts 5 really good defenders on the court together but the lineup is 1) limited offensively and/or 2) repetitive offensively. We only give up like 6 points in that entire stretch but only score 5 points ourselves. 

As many have said, Perkins, Collins, and Okoro seem like shoe-ins for big minutes. I think Nesbitt is knocking on that door as well.

Jimerson actually used a pump fake/pull-up jumper very successfully early in the season (and in his first year). That stopped in the back-half of the season. He's not a very good defender either. There are some rumors that he hit a wall post covid because 1) lingering effects from covid and 2) his "freshman" season was cut short with an injury and he hit a fatigue wall with this being his first full-season of D1 basketball. I think he's slightly misused when he is just asked to stand in the corner and wait for a pass. To me, he is a 20 min/game type of guy on average who can play huge minutes if he's hot from 3 and can play less if he's struggling with his shot. But shooters need to be given a chance so I hope he doesn't get buried on the bench like he did late last year. Also he needs to be on the court with other good defenders.

Thatch is a little foul-prone and I actually think at times he is an overrated defender. But I also think he's an underrated offensive player and I still have confidence in him defending the opposing team's best player. He's a good rebounder as well which is a staple for Ford's SLU teams. I think Thatch will get big minutes but a lineup of Collins, Nesbitt, Thatch, Perkins, Okoro seems a little too similar to the offensively challenged lineups of last year although I think Nesbitt will offer more offensively than Goodwin (not trying to knock JG)

Hargrove I think needs to be similar to Jimerson in the sense that he could play 8-10 minutes one game and then 30 minutes the next just depending on how the game is flowing. Maybe both average 20 mpg but they never both play 20 minutes in the same game. I do think teams will respect Hargrove's shooting ability a little more this season but I also think Hargrove will continue to develop his game and be able to respond to more of a half-court, offensive flow. I would like to see him become a better defender. He's more of a pest defender rather than one who locks you up. Not to knock anyone on here but I don't get much out of his offseason shooting %'s. I would take about 200 3's/day in high school and would shoot it at about a 65% clip. It's good practice to develop mechanics which is important but it just doesn't translate to games consistently. It's definitely encouraging though.

Strickland may still be a year away. I hope I'm wrong but he seemed pretty unpolished last year outside of dunking. I love his ceiling though.

Williams will be really interesting to me. His skillset fits in but I haven't seen enough of him to guess where he actually falls in the rotation.

Linssen obviously has a big role backing up Okoro and potentially playing some minutes together (although I'm not sure I want to see a lot of that). 

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2 hours ago, BilliesBy40 said:

This is a wildly uninformed statement. Any side effects from the vaccine would be noticed within months due to how mRNA vaccines work. Additionally, mRNA vaccines have been studied for decades. The COVID-19 vaccine was not created out of thin air.

The long and the short of it is that the vaccines are available and effective and many are too obstinate to avail themselves of them for NO COST.  I do not want a government mandate to take the vaccine but I'm chafing at having to wear a mask for the benefit of those who won't.  At this point that's a you (unvaxxed) problem, not a me problem.  I'm tired of using plastic scissors just because goofballs keep running with the sharp metal ones..... 

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20 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

The long and the short of it is that the vaccines are available and effective and many are too obstinate to avail themselves of them for NO COST.  I do not want a government mandate to take the vaccine but I'm chafing at having to wear a mask for the benefit of those who won't.  At this point that's a you (unvaxxed) problem, not a me problem.  I'm tired of using plastic scissors just because goofballs keep running with the sharp metal ones..... 

Some obstinate goofballs are taking a cautious and measured approach as to the safety and efficacy of the vaccines. some medications have unintended consequences, example thalidomide

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10 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

Some obstinate goofballs are taking a cautious and measured approach as to the safety and efficacy of the vaccines. some medications have unintended consequences, example thalidomide

The COVID-19 vaccine is not a medicine. Totally different actually. 

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37 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

The long and the short of it is that the vaccines are available and effective and many are too obstinate to avail themselves of them for NO COST.  I do not want a government mandate to take the vaccine but I'm chafing at having to wear a mask for the benefit of those who won't.  At this point that's a you (unvaxxed) problem, not a me problem.  I'm tired of using plastic scissors just because goofballs keep running with the sharp metal ones..... 

What we need is a vigilante running around in the streets giving people the vaccine against their will. Like Batman.  We can call this person: The Horseshoe Crab!

Edit: Blue font (this note is necessary for the unvaccinated!)

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39 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

Some obstinate goofballs are taking a cautious and measured approach as to the safety and efficacy of the vaccines. some medications have unintended consequences, example thalidomide

That's your choice.  I'm sitting here at my desk in a mask because the only people more frustrating than your ilk are the power-mad cowards in power forcing me to wear this pretty much useless thing.  

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