New Assistant Coach

[slufan13]

I need a definition of a true billiken fan. I've heard that phrase a few times this off-season 

[billiken_roy]

15 minutes ago, Billiken Bob said:

Thank you Roy, but if you reread my post you will notice that I purposely did not say that everyone would be happy.  I said that TRUE Billiken fans will be.  I am convinced that there is an element on here that do not really root for the Billikens and their postings here on this Board keep me from posting more often. There are some people here that absolutely hate Chris May and/or Travis so much that I don't think anything will please them.

thanks for correcting me Bob.   goes to show you that your mind tends to read what it wants to read sometimes.  

personally i think a lot of our hate comes from at best casual billiken fans that probably have little to no connection to the billikens.   that said, i have to admit i have been more negative this year than anytime since crews left.   however, dont count me in the may haters group.   i consider Chris May a friend and i think he has been the best across the board athletic director since i joined the billiken fandom in 1978.   as to travis ford, i have always defended his recruiting and his ability to motivate his players, but i truly feel he has practice and game coaching issues.  i should probably keep that to myself rather than express them on the board, however i am getting old and fear my chance for another level of performance might never come.   so too often frustration overrules my own common sense. 

thank you though for being a great supporter.   if we could all be Billiken Bob.     

[billikenfan05]

29 minutes ago, Billiken Bob said:

Thank you Roy, but if you reread my post you will notice that I purposely did not say that everyone would be happy.  I said that TRUE Billiken fans will be.  I am convinced that there is an element on here that do not really root for the Billikens and their postings here on this Board keep me from posting more often. There are some people here that absolutely hate Chris May and/or Travis so much that I don't think anything will please them.

No doubt Chris May has had some very important accomplishments in his time at SLU. I will never argue against that. But, I’m curious if you’ve ever had conversations with literally anyone who's ever worked in the AD or played a sport at SLU regarding Chris May? 

[billikenfan05]

1 hour ago, DOC said:

He directed his comments to a select few, people who constantly complain. 

First of all, he subtweeted, he didn't @ anyone. So it comes off as a blanket complaint towards any fans complaining. Secondly, he doesn't need to be arguing with ANY fans on twitter. Reminder that those who complain the most often are some of the most passionate. These people spend a lot of money on the Billikens. So, who he directed it at is irrelevant. 

 

The true irony of his argument was that not everything is publicized and you don't see all the good things behind the scenes. Which is pretty much the essence of Twitter. You only either get polarized positives or negatives.

[DOC]

Just now, billikenfan05 said:

That’s irrelevant. 

You make it sound like he’s going after the fan base, which is not true. He’s addressed a few people, who claim to be fans, but discredit the program at every turn. To those folks he’s saying get lost. I’m with him. 

[JMM28]

17 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

I need a definition of a true billiken fan. I've heard that phrase a few times this off-season 

It happens anytime a program is in a state of decline or close to a coaching change. There are boosters who have become close with the coach or AD. Their friendship can cloud the rational view of that persons performance. They see the message boards and/or social media and conflate legitimate gripes with personal criticism of their friend. They then conflate the program they are and have been a great supporter of AND the coach and/or AD. It’s why there are always hurt feelings and a loss of boosters when there is a change made from a longer term coach. 
 

SLU athletics is much bigger than Pestello, May, or Ford. It will be around much longer than any of them will be. I’m glad there are fans that care. I don’t see many here that are going over any sort of personal line about any of them. No one is calling any of them a wife beater, drug addict, or the such. They just want them to do better as the caretaker of the program we all support. 

[billikenfan05]

Just now, DOC said:

You make it sound like he’s going after the fan base, which is not true. He’s addressed a few people, who claim to be fans, but discredit the program at every turn. To those folks he’s saying get lost. I’m with him. 

He and you are completely off-base. As I edited my post above with actual rebuttle:
 

First of all, he subtweeted, he didn't @ anyone. So it comes off as a blanket complaint towards any fans complaining. Secondly, he doesn't need to be arguing with ANY fans on twitter. Reminder that those who complain the most often are some of the most passionate. These people spend a lot of money on the Billikens. So, who he directed it at is irrelevant. 

The true irony of his argument was that not everything is publicized and you don't see all the good things behind the scenes. Which is pretty much the essence of Twitter. You only either get polarized positives or negatives.

[DOC]

1 minute ago, billikenfan05 said:

He and you are completely off-base. As I edited my post above with actual rebuttle:
 

First of all, he subtweeted, he didn't @ anyone. So it comes off as a blanket complaint towards any fans complaining. Secondly, he doesn't need to be arguing with ANY fans on twitter. Reminder that those who complain the most often are some of the most passionate. These people spend a lot of money on the Billikens. So, who he directed it at is irrelevant. 

The true irony of his argument was that not everything is publicized and you don't see all the good things behind the scenes. Which is pretty much the essence of Twitter. You only either get polarized positives or negatives.

You edit a lot. Did Larry hurt your feelings?

[billikenfan05]

4 minutes ago, DOC said:

You edit a lot. Did Larry hurt your feelings?

Wow. Very nice. Very intelligent. Since we’re sinking to childish jabs: Neither, Pestello, May, Ford are going to sleep with you, they don’t consider any of you their friend. Just like the Hooters waitresses aren’t your friend. They are hired to do jobs. Win sports games and separate boosters from their money. 

[HoosierPal]

For those who had Derek Kellogg in the Assistant Coaching Pool, he s NOT heading to STL.

@MLBergman_

 

4h

 

UMass assistant coach Derek Kellogg is officially headed to Creighton, per his bio. The former UMass/LIU HC joined Frank Martin's staff last August after LIU's puzzling move letting DK go after last season

[cheeseman]

It is a bit insulting when you make reasonable critiques of the program and people say you are a hater and not a real fan.  For my part, I have been financially supporting the program for pushing 50 years and as my situation improved I have increased that support to the point that it is a fair amount more than probably many on this board do who are calling me a hater and not a real fan so to be called not a real fan is absolutely BS and those who try to make themselves out to be the moral high ground is simply disgusting.  I won't even try to restate my position and those who think much the same because some of you are simply incapable of wanting to try to understand.   So, as far as I am concerned, those who are calling others haters and not real fans can go piss up a rope.  No this is not how I really feel - you don't want to know that.

[Box and Won]

42 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Just like the Hooters waitresses aren’t your friend. They are hired to do jobs. 

NOW HOLD ON JUST A MINUTE THERE PAL.

[VeniceMenace]

1 hour ago, cheeseman said:

It is a bit insulting when you make reasonable critiques of the program and people say you are a hater and not a real fan.  For my part, I have been financially supporting the program for pushing 50 years and as my situation improved I have increased that support to the point that it is a fair amount more than probably many on this board do who are calling me a hater and not a real fan so to be called not a real fan is absolutely BS and those who try to make themselves out to be the moral high ground is simply disgusting.  I won't even try to restate my position and those who think much the same because some of you are simply incapable of wanting to try to understand.   So, as far as I am concerned, those who are calling others haters and not real fans can go piss up a rope.  No this is not how I really feel - you don't want to know that.

Are those people “plants” to spew propaganda on behalf of the program? Did not notice this dynamic you speak of until last few months of the season.

[DOC]

2 hours ago, cheeseman said:

It is a bit insulting when you make reasonable critiques of the program and people say you are a hater and not a real fan.  For my part, I have been financially supporting the program for pushing 50 years and as my situation improved I have increased that support to the point that it is a fair amount more than probably many on this board do who are calling me a hater and not a real fan so to be called not a real fan is absolutely BS and those who try to make themselves out to be the moral high ground is simply disgusting.  I won't even try to restate my position and those who think much the same because some of you are simply incapable of wanting to try to understand.   So, as far as I am concerned, those who are calling others haters and not real fans can go piss up a rope.  No this is not how I really feel - you don't want to know that.

The program deserves criticism. People have every right to voice their displeasure. Calling for the coach’s head at this point is fair. There are a few people on here that will always support Ford and some who will never support him. Both schools of thought have validity in my mind. But to voice your said opinion, regardless of your side, over and over and over is the problem. If you’re one of those guys then stfu about it if you don’t want to be called a hater. That was Larry’s point. If you’re a true fan you’re not going to trash the program every chance you get. 

[willie]

“Some who will never support him”. Isn’t that Billiken Bobs point. How can that be and be a true Billiken fan. 

[slufan13]

11 minutes ago, DOC said:

The program deserves criticism. People have every right to voice their displeasure. Calling for the coach’s head at this point is fair. There are a few people on here that will always support Ford and some who will never support him. Both schools of thought have validity in my mind. But to voice your said opinion, regardless of your side, over and over and over is the problem. If you’re one of those guys then stfu about it if you don’t want to be called a hater. That was Larry’s point. If you’re a true fan you’re not going to trash the program every chance you get. 

While I don't disagree with you, that is not what Larry or Frank or Rammer said

[VeniceMenace]

3 hours ago, DOC said:

The program deserves criticism. People have every right to voice their displeasure. Calling for the coach’s head at this point is fair. There are a few people on here that will always support Ford and some who will never support him. Both schools of thought have validity in my mind. But to voice your said opinion, regardless of your side, over and over and over is the problem. If you’re one of those guys then stfu about it if you don’t want to be called a hater. That was Larry’s point. If you’re a true fan you’re not going to trash the program every chance you get. 

Being called a ford hater on this board is a badge of honor.

[DOC]

9 hours ago, VeniceMenace said:

Being called a ford hater on this board is a badge of honor.

Then don’t cry about it when it happens. 

[thatskablamo]

55 minutes ago, DOC said:

Then don’t cry about it when it happens. 

regardless of which side of the ford debate you fall on, it is very clear that both sides are exercising a great amount of concern RE: the direction of this basketball program and, quite possibly, the entire athletic department. It is very palpable. 

[SLUMedBilliken15]

2 hours ago, thatskablamo said:

regardless of which side of the ford debate you fall on, it is very clear that both sides are exercising a great amount of concern RE: the direction of this basketball program and, quite possibly, the entire athletic department. It is very palpable. 

Are you really going to complain about the direction of the ENTIRE athletic department???? I'd rethink your position here...

#1) Men's soccer has the number 1 recruiting class in the nation and recently made a run in the NCAA tournament.

#2) Women's soccer has won the A-10 and made the tournament 4 straight years and has been playing their best soccer ever.

#3) Women's basketball made their FIRST ever NCAA tournament appearance due to what seems to be a genius hire by the athletic director.

#4) Even baseball is currently in first place in the A-10.

#5) Men's basketball did not meet expectations last season, but they were by no means bad. They beat Memphis and Providence. [#5 is the only one you could even argue with]

Come on people!!!! Use your brains!

 

Edited April 22, 2023 by SLUMedBilliken15
Typos

[HoosierPal]

10 minutes ago, SLUMedBilliken15 said:

Are you really going to complain about the direction of the ENTIRE athletic department???? I'd rethink your position here...

#1) Men's soccer has the number 1 recruiting class in the nation and recently made a run in the NCAA tournament.

#2) Women's soccer has won the A-10 and made the tournament 4 straight years and has been playing their best soccer ever.

#3) Women's basketball made their FIRST ever NCAA tournament appearance due to what seems to be a genius hire by the athletic director.

#4) Even baseball is currently in first place in the A-10.

#5) Men's basketball did not meet expectations last season, but they were by no means bad. They beat Memphis and Providence. [#5 is the only one you could even argue with]

Come on people!!!! Use your brains!

 

#6) Track and Field athletes have set 16 new school records in the past year.

#7) The O'Loughlin Family Champion Center is under construction

[thatskablamo]

37 minutes ago, SLUMedBilliken15 said:

Are you really going to complain about the direction of the ENTIRE athletic department???? I'd rethink your position here...

#1) Men's soccer has the number 1 recruiting class in the nation and recently made a run in the NCAA tournament.

#2) Women's soccer has won the A-10 and made the tournament 4 straight years and has been playing their best soccer ever.

#3) Women's basketball made their FIRST ever NCAA tournament appearance due to what seems to be a genius hire by the athletic director.

#4) Even baseball is currently in first place in the A-10.

#5) Men's basketball did not meet expectations last season, but they were by no means bad. They beat Memphis and Providence. [#5 is the only one you could even argue with]

Come on people!!!! Use your brains!

 

Those are athletic teams - I’m specifically pointing out Chris May and the team that brings in 99% of its budget. I’m very aware of the on-field and in the classroom success of the teams you mentioned. 

[JettFlight5]

51 minutes ago, SLUMedBilliken15 said:

Are you really going to complain about the direction of the ENTIRE athletic department???? I'd rethink your position here...

#1) Men's soccer has the number 1 recruiting class in the nation and recently made a run in the NCAA tournament.

#2) Women's soccer has won the A-10 and made the tournament 4 straight years and has been playing their best soccer ever.

#3) Women's basketball made their FIRST ever NCAA tournament appearance due to what seems to be a genius hire by the athletic director.

#4) Even baseball is currently in first place in the A-10.

#5) Men's basketball did not meet expectations last season, but they were by no means bad. They beat Memphis and Providence. [#5 is the only one you could even argue with]

Come on people!!!! Use your brains!

 

Your first four points are spot on. I disagree with #5 (96 KenPom, #97 NET) reeks of mediocrity. The whole department is doing some awesome stuff…but when the largest revenue program is struggling it paints anything in a negative light.

[VeniceMenace]

4 hours ago, DOC said:

Then don’t cry about it when it happens. 

Such defensiveness first thing on a Saturday is amusing. 

[Crewsorlose]

1 hour ago, SLUMedBilliken15 said:

Are you really going to complain about the direction of the ENTIRE athletic department???? I'd rethink your position here...

#1) Men's soccer has the number 1 recruiting class in the nation and recently made a run in the NCAA tournament.

#2) Women's soccer has won the A-10 and made the tournament 4 straight years and has been playing their best soccer ever.

#3) Women's basketball made their FIRST ever NCAA tournament appearance due to what seems to be a genius hire by the athletic director.

#4) Even baseball is currently in first place in the A-10.

#5) Men's basketball did not meet expectations last season, but they were by no means bad. They beat Memphis and Providence. [#5 is the only one you could even argue with]

Come on people!!!! Use your brains!

 

Revenue sports drive everything. I doubt Mens' Soccer breaks even. There's one revenue sport. We're paying the coach a ton of money. The team massively underachieved, with people thinking it would be ranked in the #20-40 range and ending up around 95th.

Ford can't convince players to stay, and he can't convince the better transfers to come here. He ran off the perfect combo guard (Jacobs) for this team. This season he buried TJ, put the shortest possible leash on Parker, saw another promising big transfer out, and yelled like a maniac on the sidelines. It's fine when you're 30. Not so fine past 50. 

Chris May's responded in the most tone-deaf manner possible. Two assistants have hightailed out of town. He has a good nucleus of guards and wings. Can he find an asst. coach that can help him see the game better? Can he tone down maniac behavior? Can he develop a culture of defense and toughness? That was his brand, but after watching this team, I'm wondering how much of it was built on the unique talents of Marcus Smart and J-Good.