troy on 590 the fan

[brianstl]

26 minutes ago, dlarry said:

I’m with you on Slaten but I have to admit he did a good job with this interview.

I guess the interview was part of Troy’s commission for selling Slaten’s house.

[almaman]

think the prince or one of? is named Troy also. I went & watched some of his walk when he went from arena? to wherever after losing bet about making playoffs? he is a tool.

[dlarry]

6 minutes ago, willie said:

Slaten is a jerk but the man does conduct a good interview. 

He does a good job when he isn’t trying to play “gotcha” or push an agenda. Unfortunately those are few and far between. 
This one was good.
 

[dlarry]

7 minutes ago, willie said:

Slaten is a jerk but the man does conduct a good interview. 

 

[TheA_Bomb]

Finally listened to the interview.  Here's my thoughts and some speculation based on reading between the lines. 

I kid about Troy, but he has a tough job and spoke well in this interview.  Isn't there some former SLU Soccer player (or other sport) that worked in Business or Corporate law that could dedicate themselves to this full time? I know a guy but he has health issues but I think that's the profile we need running this collective.  It's too much for someone running their own business with kids at home. 

Reading between the lines.  SLU Boosters are not like SMU Pony Excess boosters.  The latter are willing to buy what they want and spend the money.  SLU Boosters are conservative and maybe tapped out right now after giving to the Champions  Center.  Also they aren't into the NIL World.

Also speculation Boosters are asking about a ROI.  I believe that's the same wording me and other posters have used for supporting a Ford coached team.  We could pay for a Marcus Smart level player with Ford and not win a NCAA Tournament game. I think there's a general lack of enthusiasm due to a lack of belief in the coach. 

So that bums me out.  If we can't raise funds because lack of belief in coach then we aren't competitive for players then we win less.  But we also can't raise buy out funds. So we're stuck.  Death rattle until end of his contract when we can start again. 

[thunderdan]

Isn't Slaten a SLU Law School grad?

[White Pelican]

58 minutes ago, thunderdan said:

Isn't Slaten a SLU Law School grad?

The web says spumac.

[thetorch]

Troy admits that the BVF's plan won't work.

They are not going to pay HS recruits.

They don't have the money to be competitive in the transfer market.

We will pay for loyalty and returning players.

Who are these returning players if we can't get transfers and don't pursue HSers?

ROI once again what Ford and the BVF should focus on are 3 star and below HS recruits that are undervalued and not getting offers from high level schools.  Then we pay to retain them.  We seem to be doing the opposite of this.  Focusing on international recruits so heavily when we don't dedicate enough resources to get those players eligible won't cut it.

You also have the views of the donors.  The AD and big time donors saved Ford's job this summer.  The next step down in donors doesn't want Ford, but they don't have enough money to buy him out and won't contribute to the BVF for him to get players.  Meanwhile the big donors who back Ford spent all their money on the Champions Center.

[stmdragons]

15 minutes ago, thetorch said:

Troy admits that the BVF's plan won't work.

They are not going to pay HS recruits.

They don't have the money to be competitive in the transfer market.

We will pay for loyalty and returning players.

Who are these returning players if we can't get transfers and don't pursue HSers?

ROI once again what Ford and the BVF should focus on are 3 star and below HS recruits that are undervalued and not getting offers from high level schools.  Then we pay to retain them.  We seem to be doing the opposite of this.  Focusing on international recruits so heavily when we don't dedicate enough resources to get those players eligible won't cut it.

You also have the views of the donors.  The AD and big time donors saved Ford's job this summer.  The next step down in donors doesn't want Ford, but they don't have enough money to buy him out and won't contribute to the BVF for him to get players.  Meanwhile the big donors who back Ford spent all their money on the Champions Center.

Which international recruits are ineligible? Did I miss something?

[willie]

1 hour ago, thetorch said:

Troy admits that the BVF's plan won't work.

They are not going to pay HS recruits.

They don't have the money to be competitive in the transfer market.

We will pay for loyalty and returning players.

Who are these returning players if we can't get transfers and don't pursue HSers?

ROI once again what Ford and the BVF should focus on are 3 star and below HS recruits that are undervalued and not getting offers from high level schools.  Then we pay to retain them.  We seem to be doing the opposite of this.  Focusing on international recruits so heavily when we don't dedicate enough resources to get those players eligible won't cut it.

You also have the views of the donors.  The AD and big time donors saved Ford's job this summer.  The next step down in donors doesn't want Ford, but they don't have enough money to buy him out and won't contribute to the BVF for him to get players.  Meanwhile the big donors who back Ford spent all their money on the Champions Center.

How did big time donors save his job? By not buying him out is not a saving event. I think if you ran a pool on this board give him one more year would win. 

[DOC]

1 hour ago, thetorch said:

Troy admits that the BVF's plan won't work.

They are not going to pay HS recruits.

They don't have the money to be competitive in the transfer market.

We will pay for loyalty and returning players.

Who are these returning players if we can't get transfers and don't pursue HSers?

ROI once again what Ford and the BVF should focus on are 3 star and below HS recruits that are undervalued and not getting offers from high level schools.  Then we pay to retain them.  We seem to be doing the opposite of this.  Focusing on international recruits so heavily when we don't dedicate enough resources to get those players eligible won't cut it.

You also have the views of the donors.  The AD and big time donors saved Ford's job this summer.  The next step down in donors doesn't want Ford, but they don't have enough money to buy him out and won't contribute to the BVF for him to get players.  Meanwhile the big donors who back Ford spent all their money on the Champions Center.

Who else would you want to make the decision on the coach other than the AD and the guy paying a big chunk of his salary?

[willie]

6 minutes ago, DOC said:

Who else would you want to make the decision on the coach other than the AD and the guy paying a big chunk of his salary?

A lot of this board assumes Dr. C is paying a big part of Ford’s salary. Basis?

[Lord Elrond]

8 minutes ago, DOC said:

Who else would you want to make the decision on the coach other than the AD and the guy paying a big chunk of his salary?

No one else was going to make that decision other than the AD and the big money guys.  Other people thought their opinion mattered, but not so much as it turned out. Not really a surprise, just another example of the Golden Rule, he who has the gold makes the rules

[TheChosenOne]

Absent the contract, did folks actually think Ford was deserving of being fired? I was disappointed with last season and questioned the future of the team, but would not have supported firing Ford without some exciting candidate essentially lined up that would not be around down the line. I don’t know his contract, but think asking folks to buy him out in the spring wouldn’t get much support. Six months from now that might be a different discussion.

[wgstl]

16 minutes ago, TheChosenOne said:

Absent the contract, did folks actually think Ford was deserving of being fired? I was disappointed with last season and questioned the future of the team, but would not have supported firing Ford without some exciting candidate essentially lined up that would not be around down the line. I don’t know his contract, but think asking folks to buy him out in the spring wouldn’t get much support. Six months from now that might be a different discussion.

More importantly, did those in charge take a quick peek just to see if there was anything out there at the time? This means way more to me than anything. If they did that, and decided to stay put, than ok let’s roll. If those in charge had blinders on, and thought what they have seen over 8(!) years is good with the money and resources available, well. 
 

 

[billikenfan05]

23 minutes ago, TheChosenOne said:

Absent the contract, did folks actually think Ford was deserving of being fired? I was disappointed with last season and questioned the future of the team, but would not have supported firing Ford without some exciting candidate essentially lined up that would not be around down the line. I don’t know his contract, but think asking folks to buy him out in the spring wouldn’t get much support. Six months from now that might be a different discussion.

I would honestly say he probably should have been given one more year. Has one NCAA tournament appearance so give him two 4 year cycles. At this point, based on the farce this off-season has been, May should be shown the door no matter what and Ford should both be shown the door barring a genuine miracle.

[TheChosenOne]

25 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

I would honestly say he probably should have been given one more year. Has one NCAA tournament appearance so give him two 4 year cycles. At this point, based on the farce this off-season has been, May should be shown the door no matter what and Ford should both be shown the door barring a genuine miracle.

I think that’s close to where I am at now too unfortunately. Hopefully the team surprises us. And if not, we can discuss who our next coach should be.

[thetorch]

2 hours ago, willie said:

How did big time donors save his job? By not buying him out is not a saving event. I think if you ran a pool on this board give him one more year would win. 

If we made coaching changes by board consensus Soderberg would be entering his 22nd season as HC of the Billikens and the highlight of our non conference schedule would be a home and home series with SIUE, our games played at West Pine.

[thetorch]

2 hours ago, DOC said:

Who else would you want to make the decision on the coach other than the AD and the guy paying a big chunk of his salary?

Someone else, because they made the wrong decision.

[thetorch]

2 hours ago, TheChosenOne said:

Absent the contract, did folks actually think Ford was deserving of being fired? I was disappointed with last season and questioned the future of the team, but would not have supported firing Ford without some exciting candidate essentially lined up that would not be around down the line. I don’t know his contract, but think asking folks to buy him out in the spring wouldn’t get much support. Six months from now that might be a different discussion.

Yes, most certainly.  After the SIUE loss he should have been gone.

This past offseason was essentially the same one that got Soderberg fired.  Both teams had veteran led squads that while on their face had a nice season, 20 wins, neither met expectations.

When Soderberg was fired Biondi saw that the ceiling was reached.  He had his best team, the most talent, and still underachieved.  Biondi fired him, despite protests from the big donors &  the AD Levick who had Soderberg's next contract signed and waiting on Biondi's desk for his approval.

Ford should have been looked at the same way.  This was his best team, most talent, and they didn't sniff an NCAA tourney.  This is Ford's ceiling, this is as good as it is going to get.  Problem was he had a huge buyout that no one wanted to pay.  A huge buyout should never be a reason for not firing someone.  

Excuses were made, if this didn't happen or if this had happened we would have made the tournament.  So bring back Ford.  One of these years his luck will change.  It won't.  We've made those excuses every season.  This is what he is.

The only difference between Ford and Soderberg is Ford is making about 1.8 mil more than Soderberg.  Which should be even more of an impetus to firing him.

We give Ford one more year.  For what?  He lost his best players?  We have no ability to get high level transfers?  His HS recruiting has taken a dive.  His staff left in droves.  We are going to end up keeping him another year for a season that won't be a success, and then end up letting him go after this one.  Why bother keeping him this season?  

The only reason is that buyout that no one wants to pay.  If Biondi was still in charge the person that gave him that huge contract wouldn't be employed by SLU, and neither would Ford.

[BrettJollyComedyHour]

9 hours ago, billikenfan05 said:

May should be shown the door no matter what and Ford should both be shown the door barring a genuine miracle.

I'm all for this sequence of events. May has always rubbed me the wrong way for any number of reasons.

[TheChosenOne]

@thetorchthat is a reasonable response to my question (I had not really considered a comparison to that Sodie final season, but that is fair). I think I had checked out and didn’t realize just how many folks supported Ford being fired after the season. I assumed most would be more in line with 05 and driven more to that point after you layer on the off-season activity. What are we thinking the buyout looks like?

[johnbj14]

10 hours ago, TheChosenOne said:

Absent the contract, did folks actually think Ford was deserving of being fired? I was disappointed with last season and questioned the future of the team, but would not have supported firing Ford without some exciting candidate essentially lined up that would not be around down the line. I don’t know his contract, but think asking folks to buy him out in the spring wouldn’t get much support. Six months from now that might be a different discussion.

Trying not to beat a dead horse, but yes.  There were legitimate talks of top 25 last preseason, and they missed the postseason entirely. That alone isn’t enough, but combined with other seasons where expectations were fallen short of, it is a pattern. 
 

As for the exciting candidate you’re hoping for, it’s not a guarantee one will be lined up whenever SLU does pull the plug. Coaching searches at this level will always have a leap of faith element to them. I’d personally take that leap, because for all of the negatives that have been acknowledged on this board about the changing NCAA, I still feel SLU has potential that can be unlocked with a new voice at the head of the program. 

[TheChosenOne]

39 minutes ago, johnbj14 said:

Trying not to beat a dead horse, but yes.  There were legitimate talks of top 25 last preseason, and they missed the postseason entirely. That alone isn’t enough, but combined with other seasons where expectations were fallen short of, it is a pattern. 

As for the exciting candidate you’re hoping for, it’s not a guarantee one will be lined up whenever SLU does pull the plug. Coaching searches at this level will always have a leap of faith element to them. I’d personally take that leap, because for all of the negatives that have been acknowledged on this board about the changing NCAA, I still feel SLU has potential that can be unlocked with a new voice at the head of the program. 

Good point on the candidate. Seldom is a hire truly a home run without questions and some level of doubt. I am closer to you and torch with respect to my opinion of Ford, but less aggressive with wanting to fire him (and I suppose the discussion doesn't matter at this point). I would have given him this season with it being make or break. Unfortunately, the offseason did little to ease my concerns and now I am so concerned with our ability to compete in NIL under this current regime.

Nobody took the bull by the horns with respect to NIL and the interview Troy did with Slaten further supported those concerns. This isn't on Troy, but the athletic department and program in general failing to see an opportunity. Instead, Troy talks about Mizzou almost taking passive aggressive shots at them in his interview, well I see their basketball program currently has the top recruiting class for 2024 on rivals (I assume it will not finish that way, but still) and a lot of smoke around their football program. Maybe mock them less and follow their lead. If Ford goes after this season, I hope May is gone too. We need leaders that see a changing landscape and view it is an opportunity and work to position the program to take advantage of those changes. Instead, we are once again playing from behind.

[3star_recruit]

24 minutes ago, TheChosenOne said:

Good point on the candidate. Seldom is a hire truly a home run without questions and some level of doubt. I am closer to you and torch with respect to my opinion of Ford, but less aggressive with wanting to fire him (and I suppose the discussion doesn't matter at this point). I would have given him this season with it being make or break. Unfortunately, the offseason did little to ease my concerns and now I am so concerned with our ability to compete in NIL under this current regime.

Nobody took the bull by the horns with respect to NIL and the interview Troy did with Slaten further supported those concerns. This isn't on Troy, but the athletic department and program in general failing to see an opportunity. Instead, Troy talks about Mizzou almost taking passive aggressive shots at them in his interview, well I see their basketball program currently has the top recruiting class for 2024 on rivals (I assume it will not finish that way, but still) and a lot of smoke around their football program. Maybe mock them less and follow their lead. If Ford goes after this season, I hope May is gone too. We need leaders that see a changing landscape and see it is an opportunity and work to position the program to take advantage of those changes. Instead, we are once again playing from behind.

It's been my experience in St. Louis that old money runs this town, not just the SLU athletic department.  There aren't enough rich people under the age of 60 to change how business is done.  And very few of them are sports fans.

I hear the same stagnation arguments about wealthy decision makers in the St Louis metro area in general as I read every week on this message board.  I don't think that's a coincidence.  There's a lot of overlap between the two groups. 

What I hear some MBMs saying without saying it is this:  I wish there were wealthy Gen Xers with new ideas in leadership positions.  Some of you guys went to elite private schools.  Where are these people?