Billiken Victory Fund

[Bizziken]

6 hours ago, dennis_w said:

my observation is perkins has not recovered from the ankle injury, preseason top 30 was based on him making a solid returen

I don't totally buy this 'Perkins as missing link' theory. Sure, we would have been much better had he returned to form. But we returned almost everyone from a 23-12 NIT season and added Pickett, Parker, and the freshmen. Even if you take Perkins out of the equation, I would've expected a big year. 

[Soderball]

8 hours ago, dennis_w said:

it is tough to get an at large in a mid major conference and you know that, the net is stacked for the big boys, i think expectations for the season are disappointing, but likely they were not realistic

What a joke.

Why is Ford being paid 2,400,000 per year?

If I up my job I get fired. I make less than 5% of what Ford does. He deserves criticism. Your attitude is just sad.

N I T. N I T.

[Soderball]

7 years and this team has never been in at-large discussions under Ford's tenure. It's just shameful. He's the same he always was. What one win in the first round in 20 years of coaching. Booooo.

[dennis_w]

37 minutes ago, Soderball said:

What a joke.

Why is Ford being paid 2,400,000 per year?

If I up my job I get fired. I make less than 5% of what Ford does. He deserves criticism. Your attitude is just sad.

N I T. N I T.

I suppose I could attack your attitude,but I am sure you would not understand 

[BIG BILL FAN]

9 hours ago, NoCoBillsFan said:

Number of wins doesn’t really matter when you play against weak competition. I think the context that’s missing from this discussion is how much Ford gets paid. If you’re the highest paid coach in the A10, how come you’ve never finished higher than fourth in six seasons (and most likely to finish fourth in your seventh season)? Fourth place should not be celebrated in this conference. 
 

Besides Dayton, SLU has the most money invested into basketball in a weak A10. There’s no reason we can’t be like VCU or Dayton with regular top 3 finishes and in serious bubble conversations almost every season.

Trivia question for Ford haters, This is Anthony Grants 6th season at Dayton. How many NCAA appearances have they had? Now going by Ford hater standards, just answer the question, not interested in excuses. 

[dennis_w]

5 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

Trivia question for Ford haters, This is Anthony Grants 6th season at Dayton. How many NCAA appearances have they had? Now going by Ford hater standards, just answer the question, not interested in excuses. 

I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts 

[stmdragons]

17 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

Trivia question for Ford haters, This is Anthony Grants 6th season at Dayton. How many NCAA appearances have they had? Now going by Ford hater standards, just answer the question, not interested in excuses. 

Respectfully, comparing one serial underachiever to another isn’t the best way to prove your point. 

[dennis_w]

16 minutes ago, stmdragons said:

Respectfully, comparing one serial underachiever to another isn’t the best way to prove your point. 

i think his point was nocobill said we ought to be like dayton a team with fewer ncaa appearances than the billikens in recent years

[Schasz]

31 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

Trivia question for Ford haters, This is Anthony Grants 6th season at Dayton. How many NCAA appearances have they had? Now going by Ford hater standards, just answer the question, not interested in excuses. 

Why do we care about Anthony Grant like Ford he wasn't successful when he tried his hand as HC for a P-5 team. We're discussing whether Ford is the right man for the Billikens HC job. Don't care one bit about Dayton or Anthony Grant. I'm all for playing out the season and A10 Tourney and if we don't get the bid for winning the A10 Tourney the big money boys at SLU have a decision to make on Ford staying as SLU HC.

[wgstl]

39 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts 

Dennis, you’re not an idiot and a troll, so I’m asking you what do you mean by your post(as oppose to the other person). What do you mean “ I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts”? What facts? That the other coach who majority of the fan base also wants fired is in a similar boat as ford? Linking ford and grant isn’t good for the …. FoRd LoVeRs

[dlarry]

Just now, wgstl said:

Dennis, you’re not an idiot and a troll, so I’m asking you what do you mean by your post(as oppose to the other person). What do you mean “ I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts”? What facts? That the other coach who majority of the fan base also wants fired is in a similar boat as ford? Linking ford and grant isn’t good for the …. FoRd LoVeRs

AG is hearing it a lot louder from the Dayton fans than Ford is from the Billiken fans. 
 

[dennis_w]

6 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Dennis, you’re not an idiot and a troll, so I’m asking you what do you mean by your post(as oppose to the other person). What do you mean “ I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts”? What facts? That the other coach who majority of the fan base also wants fired is in a similar boat as ford? Linking ford and grant isn’t good for the …. FoRd LoVeRs

one of the posters said he wanted slu to be like dayton, the fact is dayton has not been as good as slu when it comes to ncaa tournaments, as guess i wasnt clear on my point. i also do not think the majority of the fan base wants ford fired, i think it just a handful of mbm's 

.

 

[wgstl]

3 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

one of the posters said he wanted slu to be like dayton, the fact is dayton has not been as good as slu when it comes to ncaa tournaments, as guess i wasnt clear on my point

 

Gotcha 

[wgstl]

7 minutes ago, dlarry said:

AG is hearing it a lot louder from the Dayton fans than Ford is from the Billiken fans. 
 

Yep. But let’s be honest, ford + grant is a tallest midget race. 

[TheA_Bomb]

Interesting thought experiment regarding Ford vs Grant.

Head to Head Grant 9 wins and 3 losses (while coach at SVU)

Post Season SLU 1 NCAA, 2 NIT no wins.  SVU 3 NIT games, 1 NIT W (edge Ford)

Conference Championships Ford 1 A10 Tournament 2018-19, Grant 1 Regular Season 2019-20 (tie if you think tournament matters as much as regular season)

The argument has been made that the 1 COVID year is a mulligan or doesn't count at all in the overall ability to make it to the NCAA.  If we don't count the year then we're measuring 6 CTF seasons vs 5 CAG seasons.  But let's take a look at that season....

In 2019-20

SLU was 12-6 in conference and 23-8 overall, 49 in NET

SVU was 18-0 in conference and 29-2 overall ranked #3 in the Nation in the AP and NET'

That season, Anthony Grant was AP Coach of the Year, Naismith Coach of the Year, AP Coach of the Year, A10 Coach of the Year

This Season

SLU 18-9, 10-4 NET 109

SVU 18-9, 10-4 NET 74

If I were a UD fan, I wouldn't be satisfied either but that 2019-20 Season would give me some reason for optimism.

Both very similar in that they don't win in the NCAA tournament and are at schools with good support for basketball in a weak A10 and haven't gotten to the NCAA consistently or at all and won any games lately.

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by TheA_Bomb
fixed error on NET ratings for this year

[dlarry]

4 minutes ago, TheA_Bomb said:

Interesting thought experiment regarding Ford vs Grant.

Head to Head Grant 9 wins and 3 losses (while coach at SVU)

Post Season SLU 1 NCAA, 2 NIT no wins.  SVU 3 NIT games, 1 NIT W (edge Ford)

Conference Championships Ford 1 A10 Tournament 2018-19, Grant 1 Regular Season 2019-20 (tie if you think tournament matters as much as regular season)

The argument has been made that the 1 COVID year is a mulligan or doesn't count at all in the overall ability to make it to the NCAA.  If we don't count the year then we're measuring 6 CTF seasons vs 5 CAG seasons.  But let's take a look at that season....

In 2019-20

SLU was 12-6 in conference and 23-8 overall, 49 in NET

SVU was 18-0 in conference and 29-2 overall ranked #3 in the Nation in the AP and NET'

That season, Anthony Grant was AP Coach of the Year, Naismith Coach of the Year, AP Coach of the Year, A10 Coach of the Year

This Season

SLU 18-9, 10-4 NET 74

SVU 18-9, 10-4 NET 109

If I were a UD fan, I wouldn't be satisfied either but that 2019-20 Season would give me some reason for optimism.

Both very similar in that they don't win in the NCAA tournament and are at schools with good support for basketball in a weak A10 and haven't gotten to the NCAA consistently or at all and won any games lately.

 

Very nice but you have the NETs switched for this year.

But it a great comparison.

[drkelsey55]

Boy what a bunch of MBM. How many of you have ever coached a team to the dance. Dare I say none of you. You just want to come on here and moan and groan.

Let the man do his job and if he needs to go his boss or bosses will make that decision.

 

You all need to quit your crying.

Ps: I don't have a clue either but I am not going to tear the man down because I can't do what he does even if I tried.

 

[NoCoBillsFan]

3 hours ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

Trivia question for Ford haters, This is Anthony Grants 6th season at Dayton. How many NCAA appearances have they had? Now going by Ford hater standards, just answer the question, not interested in excuses. 

Why are you disregarding context to make a point? It’s completely disingenuous to disregard the fact that Dayton was ranked 3rd in the country prior to the 2020 NCAA tournament being cancelled. Ford can’t even reach 3rd in the A10!! our only tourney appearance under Ford took a Hail Mary conference tourney win. And yes, Dayton doesn’t have an appearance under grant; but we all know they would’ve been a one seed if not for COVID while we were on track for the NIT. 
 

So in six seasons, our high point has been a lucky tourney run and fourth place in a weak A10 while Dayton’s high point has been a sure fire one seed and undefeated in the A10. And you’re trying to say we’re on par with Dayton? 

 

[NoCoBillsFan]

Also, can we stop undermining any and all criticisms of Ford by this point? If it’s directed at posters who have had nothing positive to say since they’ve joined (BC, Banghegotit, Joelabs, Bonner, etc.), then I get it. But there are a lot of us (myself included) that have been Ford defenders up until this season. Personally, my breaking point was blowing an 18 point lead against SIUE (who is 223 in the net btw) at home. How some of you find that acceptable, I will never understand.
 

When you have lifelong Billikens and unquestionable supporters like BRoy becoming apathetic, something is very wrong. It’s no longer just Ford haters looking to find something to complain about; people actually have valid criticisms. 

 

[TheA_Bomb]

49 minutes ago, drkelsey55 said:

Boy what a bunch of MBM. How many of you have ever coached a team to the dance. Dare I say none of you. You just want to come on here and moan and groan.

Let the man do his job and if he needs to go his boss or bosses will make that decision.

 

You all need to quit your crying.

Ps: I don't have a clue either but I am not going to tear the man down because I can't do what he does even if I tried.

 

2x Championship Coach aka the Steve Kerr of Kuwait just sayin'. 

[almaman]

14 hours ago, dennis_w said:

perkins injury is the "big loss" pre injury he was a differene maker

in this moron's opinion biggest loss since Ryan Grant broke his leg &  way sadder. If he was same player seems unlikely we'd not make the dance. When he has been least productive we'd likely been more if we had some one else in, a catch 22 hindsight wormhole of epic proportions

[BIG BILL FAN]

9 hours ago, wgstl said:

Dennis, you’re not an idiot and a troll, so I’m asking you what do you mean by your post(as oppose to the other person). What do you mean “ I hope you are not trying to confuse the issue with facts”? What facts? That the other coach who majority of the fan base also wants fired is in a similar boat as ford? Linking ford and grant isn’t good for the …. FoRd LoVeRs

Let me help, the system is severely rigged against the mid majors and will remain so, regardless of who the coach or program is, something Ford haters don’t understand. Their solution is just fire the coach and start over. They are unable to recognize that despite not being a perineal NCAA Tournament team that significant progress has been made towards achieving that goal with coaching stability and a strong recruiting base. Anthony Grant and Dayton are taking that approach as well. You are extremely naïve when you think bringing in a new coach is going to result in immediate success. The best you can do is point to Mizzou which is not remotely comparable to a Mid Major program. They are able to play a crap schedule and be a .500 team in conference play and get a bid, we don’t have that luxury. It’s also highly debatable that a strategy like that is sustainable. 

[dennis_w]

5 hours ago, almaman said:

in this moron's opinion biggest loss since Ryan Grant broke his leg &  way sadder. If he was same player seems unlikely we'd not make the dance. When he has been least productive we'd likely been more if we had some one else in, a catch 22 hindsight wormhole of epic proportions

ryan grant healthy might have kept grawer from being fired

 

[TheA_Bomb]

If only CTF coached a P5 program he would've dominated......... let me Google that...... he did same results.  Argument invalid.

[BC1764]

You have these great facilities, commitment from the donors, recruiting base in a big market and in the same breath say you can’t do anything in a mid major conference. Think Dayton fans, who also have Big East aspirations but are in a small market, have this attitude ? Adrian Woj tweeted something to this effect two years ago when Ford whined about officiating after the second round loss to the Bonnies. I wish he hadn’t deleted it, because he’s not alone in seeing the untapped potential of SLU Basketball.