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Cards fire Schildt


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I just finished watching Mozeliak and DeWitt's press conference. I still think Cardinals fans are owed a better explanation than whatever they gave. It clearly wasn't based on how Shildt managed the team, and Mozeliak indicated that Shildt was "shocked" by the news and that the front office only began thinking about this in the past week. 

My guess (and this is wild speculation) is that Shildt was speaking poorly of some front office decisions (perhaps Albert, perhaps player choices) to people within the organization. Word got back to Mozeliak and Mo decided the dissent needed to be quelled.

Mo and Shildt haven't even met face to face since the season ended prior to the firing. Very weird way for things to go down.

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16 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

For the love of Gus Phillips...

Joe Maddon with an O.

Mike Shildt without a C.

 

Madden is 85 and hasn't coached since 1978 and he's never had a baseball job.

hahahahahaha

sorry my spelling isnt to your level of acceptance.   i said joe not john.   i would think most people would be smart enough to understand.  i spelled his last name wrong and i meant the guy who is the only living person to win a world series for the cubs and is now managing the angels.   not the crazy guy that used to coach football.   but at least you apparently are a good speller.   i am happy you got that going for you. 

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38 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

hahahahahaha

sorry my spelling isnt to your level of acceptance.   i said joe not john.   i would think most people would be smart enough to understand.  i spelled his last name wrong and i meant the guy who is the only living person to win a world series for the cubs and is now managing the angels.   not the crazy guy that used to coach football.   but at least you apparently are a good speller.   i am happy you got that going for you. 

Roy it was aimed at the entire thread mostly misspelling Shildt (including the original poster) not just you.

 

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Most managers don’t make a difference anymore because there his very little with the team they are allowed to actually manage anymore.  The majority of managers today are just guys in spot to take heat for the front office people.

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20 minutes ago, brianstl said:

Most managers don’t make a difference anymore because there his very little with the team they are allowed to actually manage anymore.  The majority of managers today are just guys in spot to take heat for the front office people.

The piss and vinegar common in yesterday's managers doesn't play well in today's society.  Baseball front offices have taken advantage of that fact to saturate the game with compliant managers.  I think the watershed moment was when Dusty Baker, John Farrell and Joe Girardi got canned in 2017, after leading their teams to the playoffs.

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1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

hahahahahaha

sorry my spelling isnt to your level of acceptance.   i said joe not john.   i would think most people would be smart enough to understand.  i spelled his last name wrong and i meant the guy who is the only living person to win a world series for the cubs and is now managing the angels.   not the crazy guy that used to coach football.   but at least you apparently are a good speller.   i am happy you got that going for you. 

Should've just used initials.

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6 hours ago, cheeseman said:

Well if this is true then I am really clueless on this topic.  My impression was that Shildt was the the protector of Alberts.

Then color yourself clueless. 😉  Alberts and his philosophy  are what MO wants-all the New School numbers.  Forget about "Hit em where they ain't." 

I am sick of the TV screen telling me about launch angles, exit velocity, wins above replacement and spin rates along with talking heads who think we know what those things are or how to calculate them or even care about those new measures.

Two of the most exciting plays in the last few weeks of this season were 1) Bader scoring from 1st on a single ; and 2) the double play where just about the entire team was involved... I didn't hear any announcer need to use any new measurement terms to describe either play.  Imagine that.

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4 hours ago, slufanskip said:

First the idea that difference was Schildt wanted to cut down k’s and put the ball in play and Mo and DeWitt said no we don’t want that is silly regardless of who said it. It may have involved Jeff A, in fact it likely involved him to some aspect. Of course Mo doesn’t want to abandon situational hitting and just swing for the fences. I’m not necessarily an J Albert fan but if you blame him for players like Carp and DeJong don’t you have to give him credit for O’Neil, Bader, Sosa, Carlson, and the resurgence of Goldie? In fact Goldie stated was one of the things that he felt helped change the year was the hitting coaches urging them to stay the course, keep doing what you’re doing. Jeff A also is responsible for the minor league approach and instruction. Gorman, Yepez, Nootbar, Walker, Wynn, Herrera, and more are just absolutely raking in the minors while many being among the youngest players in their league. 
 

I just feel blaming it one wanting situational hitting and the other not is wrong and even if something of the sorts played a role it was a much broader picture than 

 


My post was primarily to relate what I was told. This being said, the Cards much improved situational hitting during the 17 game streak, and I was present for the 3 wins in New York, disappeared last week in LA, and I was present there too.

Goldschmidt’s hitting improved with each passing month, including situational hitting. Goldy warming up as the season progresses has reportedly been his history. 

More will come out. Apparently Shildt made hitting approach changes in June. He may well have helped save the season in doing so, along with Mo acquiring the 2 veteran lefty starters at the trading deadline, who at least threw strikes. 

My issue with the Shildt concerns pitching staff and in game management. 

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1 hour ago, Bay Area Billiken said:


My post was primarily to relate what I was told. This being said, the Cards much improved situational hitting during the 17 game streak, and I was present for the 3 wins in New York, disappeared last week in LA, and I was present there too.

Goldschmidt’s hitting improved with each passing month, including situational hitting. Goldy warming up as the season progresses has reportedly been his history. 

More will come out. Apparently Shildt made hitting approach changes in June. He may well have helped save the season in doing so, along with Mo acquiring the 2 veteran lefty starters at the trading deadline, who at least threw strikes. 

My issue with the Shildt concerns pitching staff and in game management. 

I knew you were just relaying what you heard. Didn't mean for it to seem otherwise if it did.

Re Goldie. Goldie stated one of the things he thought helped save the season was the hitting coaches and staff urging him and possibly others ( it wasn't clear if he was referring to just himself ) to stay the course. Keep doing what you are doing and the results will come. That doesn't sound like Shildt making adjustments to the hitting approach to me. 

From Baseball Reference. image.png.db2f76ba13da625587405cfc6f84bbb7.png

As you can see not  only did their BA go up but their OBP and slugging did also beginning in June. This tells me it was more than just a change in situational hitting but more a case of being patient and doing a better job of identifying the pitch they want and not swinging at pitches out of the zone. Goldie's stats for example show he pulled the ball at a greater % this year than any year since his rookie year and his hard hit % was his highest since 2017. I can't find those stats on a month to month basis but I'd be willing to bet they were at their highest in Aug and Sept. Take O'Neil and Bader the improvement from them also was more of a continued growth in being patient and identifying the pitch they wanted and swinging at fewer pitches out of the zone. 

I don't buy that Shildt made adjustments to the hitting approach and Goldie's statement seems to directly contradict that he did. 

 

 

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6 hours ago, brianstl said:

Most managers don’t make a difference anymore because there his very little with the team they are allowed to actually manage anymore.  The majority of managers today are just guys in spot to take heat for the front office people.

Totally agree.

Thats why they are going to hire from within and hire a guy with no managerial experience.

They want to hire someone they can control.  The new manager will get a spread sheet from the front office and told to follow the spread sheet.
Then in 3 or 4 years when the new manager has some experience and feels like he can voice his opinion he’ll be fired. 

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On 10/15/2021 at 8:52 AM, billiken_roy said:

the above list is a fail.   no world series winner there.   

The last four World Series winning managers were on their first managerial jobs and hadn't won a World Series until they did.  Dave Roberts won in his 5th full year of being a manager.  Alex Cora won in his 1st season as a manager.  Dave Martinez won in his 2nd year of managing.  A.J. Hinch was in his, basically 4th year of being a manager when he won.  The trend lately is definitely not for long tenured, experienced managers winning the World Series.  Its all been new guys.  Not sure that just saying a guy is "no world series winner" is a valid justification for hiring or not hiring.

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26 minutes ago, almaman said:

I'm rooting For Dusty to finally win a WS as manager.

But wait he has won one.  I saw him call Ortiz back to the mound to give him the game ball of game six against the Angels....oh wait so did all the Angels ahem never mind.

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