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O.T. Conference Shuffle ( OU and Texas inquire about joining SEC)


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48 minutes ago, brianstl said:

If SLU’s big boosters want to pull an SMU you don’t do it with the Big East.  You buy your way into the Big 12.

never thought of that.   but it makes sense.   the big east is arrogant enough they would turn their head.  big 12 would take the money in a second..   plus the big 12 is in the reshuffle no matter what.   the big east without football?  maybe not.  

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A comparison of the number of NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament bids since SLU joined the Atlantic 10 for the '06-'07 season:

A10 51, average of 3.0 NCAA bids per season;  MVC 26, average of 1.5 NCAA bids per season;  Horizon 19, average of 1.056 NCAA bids per season.

If the comparison is begun at the '13-'14 season, the season after Temple, Xavier and Butler (one and done) left the A10 and Creighton left the MVC, the number of NCAA Tourney bids is as follows:  A10 25, an average of 2.8 per season;  MVC 12 bids, an average of 1.3 per season;  Horizon, 9 bids, an average of 1 bid per season.

All of the above and the following does not include the '20 season when the NCAA Tourney was not played.  The MVC has been Juan Bid 6 of the last 7 seasons, the Horizon Juan Bid for the last 13 consecutive seasons.  The A10 was Juan Bid in '23 for the first time since '05, before SLU joined the A10.  Let's hope '23 was an outlier for the A10, and not the start of a trend. Juan Bid could be an unwelcome guest due to the NCAA Power 5 +1 skewed NET and the Power 5 +1 not playing non-Power 5's on the road.

In terms of television rights, the A10 has deals with CBS for its A10 Tourney Championship Game on Selection Sunday, CBS Sports Network, NBC- now on USA Network after the NBC Sports Network folded, and the ESPN Networks for the A10 Friday Night games, which put the A10 in a national spotlight, in an only game in town scenario.  This is not a close call- A10 TV access is significantly better than the MVC and eons better than the Horizon.  A lot of MVC games are confined to ESPN+ streaming.  Whether the A10 can maintain this excellent linear TV exposure remains to be seen.

The institutional fit is no contest.  I realize the detractors don't like to be told that, but that one is also not close.

The only thing the MVC and to a lesser extent Horizon have over the A10 for SLU is geography.

As noted by another poster, if the MVC is so great, why did Loyola Chicago leave the MVC for the A10? That is a rhetorical question and yields an obvious answer.

My fellow Billikens, this one is not a close call.  While the ultimate home for SLU should be in the Big East, the A10 is significantly better than the MVC and Horizon.  

 

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18 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

A comparison of the number of NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament bids since SLU joined the Atlantic 10 for the '06-'07 season:

A10 51, average of 3.0 NCAA bids per season;  MVC 26, average of 1.5 NCAA bids per season;  Horizon 19, average of 1.056 NCAA bids per season.

If the comparison is begun at the '13-'14 season, the season after Temple, Xavier and Butler (one and done) left the A10 and Creighton left the MVC, the number of NCAA Tourney bids is as follows:  A10 25, an average of 2.8 per season;  MVC 12 bids, an average of 1.3 per season;  Horizon, 9 bids, an average of 1 bid per season.

All of the above and the following does not include the '20 season when the NCAA Tourney was not played.  The MVC has been Juan Bid 6 of the last 7 seasons, the Horizon Juan Bid for the last 13 consecutive seasons.  The A10 was Juan Bid in '23 for the first time since '05, before SLU joined the A10.  Let's hope '23 was an outlier for the A10, and not the start of a trend. Juan Bid could be an unwelcome guest due to the NCAA Power 5 +1 skewed NET and the Power 5 +1 not playing non-Power 5's on the road.

In terms of television rights, the A10 has deals with CBS for its A10 Tourney Championship Game on Selection Sunday, CBS Sports Network, NBC- now on USA Network after the NBC Sports Network folded, and the ESPN Networks for the A10 Friday Night games, which put the A10 in a national spotlight, in an only game in town scenario.  This is not a close call- A10 TV access is significantly better than the MVC and eons better than the Horizon.  A lot of MVC games are confined to ESPN+ streaming.  Whether the A10 can maintain this excellent linear TV exposure remains to be seen.

The institutional fit is no contest.  I realize the detractors don't like to be told that, but that one is also not close.

The only thing the MVC and to a lesser extent Horizon have over the A10 for SLU is geography.

As noted by another poster, if the MVC is so great, why did Loyola Chicago leave the MVC for the A10? That is a rhetorical question and yields an obvious answer.

My fellow Billikens, this one is not a close call.  While the ultimate home for SLU should be in the Big East, the A10 is significantly better than the MVC and Horizon.  

 

correct, as things stand today, the A10 is better.  Some of the discussion from above - at least from me- is conf comparison if the teams mentioned leave. At that point, *maybe* the A10 is still stronger, but by not enough to truly justify its worth staying in. 

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2 hours ago, brianstl said:

If SLU’s big boosters want to pull an SMU you don’t do it with the Big East.  You buy your way into the Big 12.

can you elaborate, I'm unfamiliar with what went down with SMU.  

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As the top four conferences gain a stranglehold on football, I wonder if lesser programs will give up on it. Schools like Charlotte, Temple, and UAB doubled down on football in the last decade. The pendulum could swing the other way. We're already seeing it a bit with UConn leaving the AAC for the Big East.

If the likes of Charlotte, Temple, Tulsa, or WKU opt out of football irrelevance, and/or Wichita St tires of playing second fiddle, there could be some solid pick-ups available for non-football conferences.

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5 minutes ago, wgstl said:

can you elaborate, I'm unfamiliar with what went down with SMU.  

SMU booster provided the school with enough money to not take any disbursement from the ACC for the duration of the ACC’s current media deal.  That will be 12 years of SMU’s money going to other conference members, but it is worth it for SMU because it raises the school’s profile and ensures them of a future at the highest level of college athletics.

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5 minutes ago, Compton said:

As the top four conferences gain a stranglehold on football, I wonder if lesser programs will give up on it. Schools like Charlotte, Temple, and UAB doubled down on football in the last decade. The pendulum could swing the other way. We're already seeing it a bit with UConn leaving the AAC the Big East.

If the likes of Charlotte, Temple, Tulsa, or WKU opt out of football irrelevance, and/or Wichita St tires of playing second fiddle, there could be some solid pick-ups available for non-football conferences.

The AAC has a secure future with their ESPN deal.  It isn’t SEC or Big 10 money, but ESPN is going to make sure a conference it is paying $100 million a year has a seat at the table.

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19 minutes ago, wgstl said:

correct, as things stand today, the A10 is better.  Some of the discussion from above - at least from me- is conf comparison if the teams mentioned leave. At that point, *maybe* the A10 is still stronger, but by not enough to truly justify its worth staying in. 

The A10 is still significanlty stronger than the MVC (and Horizon) post-Temple, Xavier and Butler (1 year) exits and post-Creighton MVC exit, as proven by the NCAA Tourney bids since, 25 to the A10, 12 to the MVC, 9 to the Horizon.

Another point, of the MVC's 26 NCAA bids since '05-'06, 13 were earned by schools that are no longer in the MVC:  Wichita State (7), Loyola Chicago (3), Creighton (3).   Turning to the Horizon, 7 of the 19 NCAA bids were earned by schools no longer in the Horizon:  Butler (5), Valparaiso (2). In the A10, NCAA bids earned by former members amount to 14:  Xavier (7), Temple (6), Butler (1).  Just subtracting those NCAA bids yields:  A10 37, MVC 13, Horizon 12. 

Five (5) of those 13 MVC bids would have been earned by someone else, other than a team that left, bringing that total up to 18.  Likewise, 5 of the 7 Horizon bids would have been won by someone else. The A10 still wins with 37 bids to 18 for the MVC, and 17 for the Horizon.  Again, there's no contest.

I can see St. Louis Area and Midwest alumni, residents and fans having an issue with the geographic disparity of the A10 vis-a-vis SLU in St. Louis.  But the A10 is better than the MVC and Horizon in Basketball, TV availability, and institutional fit categories.  

This being said, SLU's goal should be Big East membership.  If SMU can pull off a miracle and get into the ACC (just think about that), then SLU can make a concerted effort and finally get where it's belonged for 18 and 10 years, the Big East.

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23 minutes ago, Compton said:

As the top four conferences gain a stranglehold on football, I wonder if lesser programs will give up on it. Schools like Charlotte, Temple, and UAB doubled down on football in the last decade. The pendulum could swing the other way. We're already seeing it a bit with UConn leaving the AAC for the Big East.

If the likes of Charlotte, Temple, Tulsa, or WKU opt out of football irrelevance, and/or Wichita St tires of playing second fiddle, there could be some solid pick-ups available for non-football conferences.

Football brings the much larger TV money.

UConn actually took a TV pay cut when it moved from the AAC to the (New) Big East due to the loss of AAC ESPN TV revenue, in the vicinity of $7M in the AAC to $4+M in the Big East. 

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2 hours ago, Compton said:

Missouri State:

  • Licensing & Royalties: 158,000
  • NCAA distributions: 700,000
  • Conference reimbursement: 580,000

Not really a big financial difference in terms of money coming in. Expenses would go down in the MVC over the A10, so financially we might be better off in the MVC instead of the A10

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"Institutional Fit" or "Like Minded" is the biggest myth that has been peddled to and by SLU fans in regard to the A10.

This is basketball.  No one cares if a school is Jesuit or not, or has certain majors, or higher acceptance rates like SLU's.  

None of that matters at all.  When it is brought up as a positive for the A10 I will shut it down every time.

We have a 10,500-seat arena, a 2.5 mil per year coach, opening the 20 mil champions center, the largest asst budgets, charter flights, and the list goes on.

What programs are doing this in the A10 beside us?  Dayton, maybe VCU.  What programs are even close to us in this respect?  Anyone? Bueller?  The Champions Center, basically a huge athlete lounge costs more than 3/4 of the conference's arenas.

Look how much the conference applauded Fordham for finishing in the top half of the league last year.  They play in a 100 year old arena with 1500 seats in the basketball capital of the world and they can't sell out.  1500 seats in NYC?!?!?!  Fordham is excited about this?  There are HS teams in the MCC with better facilities and bigger budgets than Fordham.

Did you see the pictures of Davidson's locker rooms?  Simply atrocious.  I could build a better locker room on a weekend with a $1000 budget and a crew I found standing outside the home depot.  A college with less than 2,000 undergrads playing in a 40 year old arena that is half full most games is not a like minded institution.

The list goes on LaSalle, St Joes, Mason, St Bona, Loyola, Duquesne, GW, these are all schools just happy to be in the A10.  They have neither the want or need to be any better than they are, low rent borderline mid major programs.  What do we share in common with them?

Then we have the public dregs, UMass and Rhode Island, flush with cash but certainly don't spend it on hoops.  UMass has a terrible football program to support, RI is happy to be second fiddle to Providence.  Nothing in common with SLU.  Terrible programs, terrible facilities that SLU dwarfs in every imaginable concern.

Even in our worst attendance year, we averaged a hair under 7k last year.  SLU still DOUBLED the attendance of NINE teams in the A10.  We TRIPLED the attendance of 4 teams.  How is that an indication of "Like Minded" schools.

Every fan on this board has at one point questioned the commitment of SLU's administration to athletics.  Imagine being a LaSalle fan, a Fordham fan, a GW fan, and on and on?  These programs aren't just worse than ours they are exponentially worse than ours. 

SLU places a high value on athletics, maybe not high enough but we are head and shoulders above everyone in this conference save for Dayton and VCU.  I may not know what conference SLU should be in, but I know it isn't the A10.  We've been in this dump second class conference for going on 19 years and it has gotten us nowhere.  The days of making excuses, "this is the best place for us" "Institutional fit" "We make $20 more dollars from ESPN+" trying to convince ourselves that we are in good shape should be over.  

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37 minutes ago, thetorch said:

"Institutional Fit" or "Like Minded" is the biggest myth that has been peddled to and by SLU fans in regard to the A10.

This is basketball.  No one cares if a school is Jesuit or not, or has certain majors, or higher acceptance rates like SLU's.  

None of that matters at all.  When it is brought up as a positive for the A10 I will shut it down every time.

We have a 10,500-seat arena, a 2.5 mil per year coach, opening the 20 mil champions center, the largest asst budgets, charter flights, and the list goes on.

What programs are doing this in the A10 beside us?  Dayton, maybe VCU.  What programs are even close to us in this respect?  Anyone? Bueller?  The Champions Center, basically a huge athlete lounge costs more than 3/4 of the conference's arenas.

Look how much the conference applauded Fordham for finishing in the top half of the league last year.  They play in a 100 year old arena with 1500 seats in the basketball capital of the world and they can't sell out.  1500 seats in NYC?!?!?!  Fordham is excited about this?  There are HS teams in the MCC with better facilities and bigger budgets than Fordham.

Did you see the pictures of Davidson's locker rooms?  Simply atrocious.  I could build a better locker room on a weekend with a $1000 budget and a crew I found standing outside the home depot.  A college with less than 2,000 undergrads playing in a 40 year old arena that is half full most games is not a like minded institution.

The list goes on LaSalle, St Joes, Mason, St Bona, Loyola, Duquesne, GW, these are all schools just happy to be in the A10.  They have neither the want or need to be any better than they are, low rent borderline mid major programs.  What do we share in common with them?

Then we have the public dregs, UMass and Rhode Island, flush with cash but certainly don't spend it on hoops.  UMass has a terrible football program to support, RI is happy to be second fiddle to Providence.  Nothing in common with SLU.  Terrible programs, terrible facilities that SLU dwarfs in every imaginable concern.

Even in our worst attendance year, we averaged a hair under 7k last year.  SLU still DOUBLED the attendance of NINE teams in the A10.  We TRIPLED the attendance of 4 teams.  How is that an indication of "Like Minded" schools.

Every fan on this board has at one point questioned the commitment of SLU's administration to athletics.  Imagine being a LaSalle fan, a Fordham fan, a GW fan, and on and on?  These programs aren't just worse than ours they are exponentially worse than ours. 

SLU places a high value on athletics, maybe not high enough but we are head and shoulders above everyone in this conference save for Dayton and VCU.  I may not know what conference SLU should be in, but I know it isn't the A10.  We've been in this dump second class conference for going on 19 years and it has gotten us nowhere.  The days of making excuses, "this is the best place for us" "Institutional fit" "We make $20 more dollars from ESPN+" trying to convince ourselves that we are in good shape should be over.  

I had to read this in some sort of Dick Schaap voice from the “Sports Reporters” on ESPN because it was so well-written and spot-on. Well done. 

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3 hours ago, Lord Elrond said:

Not really a big financial difference in terms of money coming in. Expenses would go down in the MVC over the A10, so financially we might be better off in the MVC instead of the A10

I'm not so sure about that. Two considerations:

  1. Missouri State has football. So, assumedly, at least some of its $158,000 in licensing and royalties is coming from the Missouri Valley Football Conference. It's not unreasonable to think the A10's payout could be 2X the MVC's.
  2. Missouri State's NCAA distributions could be significantly padded by A10-member Loyola Chicago's final four and sweet sixteen tourney runs.
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5 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

The A10 is still significanlty stronger than the MVC (and Horizon) post-Temple, Xavier and Butler (1 year) exits and post-Creighton MVC exit, as proven by the NCAA Tourney bids since, 25 to the A10, 12 to the MVC, 9 to the Horizon.

Another point, of the MVC's 26 NCAA bids since '05-'06, 13 were earned by schools that are no longer in the MVC:  Wichita State (7), Loyola Chicago (3), Creighton (3).   Turning to the Horizon, 7 of the 19 NCAA bids were earned by schools no longer in the Horizon:  Butler (5), Valparaiso (2). In the A10, NCAA bids earned by former members amount to 14:  Xavier (7), Temple (6), Butler (1).  Just subtracting those NCAA bids yields:  A10 37, MVC 13, Horizon 12. 

Five (5) of those 13 MVC bids would have been earned by someone else, other than a team that left, bringing that total up to 18.  Likewise, 5 of the 7 Horizon bids would have been won by someone else. The A10 still wins with 37 bids to 18 for the MVC, and 17 for the Horizon.  Again, there's no contest.

I can see St. Louis Area and Midwest alumni, residents and fans having an issue with the geographic disparity of the A10 vis-a-vis SLU in St. Louis.  But the A10 is better than the MVC and Horizon in Basketball, TV availability, and institutional fit categories.  

This being said, SLU's goal should be Big East membership.  If SMU can pull off a miracle and get into the ACC (just think about that), then SLU can make a concerted effort and finally get where it's belonged for 18 and 10 years, the Big East.

I agree that it does not make much sense to switch conferences at this point but I'm also not sure I subscribe to the notion that if SLU somehow found itself in the MVC (or another conference) that it would diminish their chances of landing in the BE.  To me, if the BE wants us they want us. First, SLU has to string together some very successful seasons of college hoops (or be able to back up the Brinks truck as Brian suggests - don't see that happening) regardless of conference.  But if they got to that point (fingers crossed) I would imagine conference affiliation (along with all of the conference comparison stats provided in previous posts) would hold less weight than what what SLU would able bring to the BE table: a top 25 market, top notch facilities that rival some P4 schools, another basketball-centric Jesuit institution, the final puzzle piece to a BE West division, and the resources to compete in the BE. SLU maintains all of those things regardless of their conference affiliation.

I'm sure I am in the minority here and completely off base with this extremely simplistic take. First things first: let's win a lot of national collegiate athletic association basketball games. Starting with a 33-0 record this year.

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27 minutes ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

I agree that it does not make much sense to switch conferences at this point but I'm also not sure I subscribe to the notion that if SLU somehow found itself in the MVC (or another conference) that it would diminish their chances of landing in the BE.  To me, if the BE wants us they want us. First, SLU has to string together some very successful seasons of college hoops (or be able to back up the Brinks truck as Brian suggests - don't see that happening) regardless of conference.  But if they got to that point (fingers crossed) I would imagine conference affiliation (along with all of the conference comparison stats provided in previous posts) would hold less weight than what what SLU would able bring to the BE table: a top 25 market, top notch facilities that rival some P4 schools, another basketball-centric Jesuit institution, the final puzzle piece to a BE West division, and the resources to compete in the BE. SLU maintains all of those things regardless of their conference affiliation.

I'm sure I am in the minority here and completely off base with this extremely simplistic take. First things first: let's win a lot of national collegiate athletic association basketball games. Starting with a 33-0 record this year.

What the Big East, itself, appears to want in a prospective new member is NCAA Tournament units. The question then is which conference provides the best opportunity for SLU to accumulate those units. I can see merit in both sides in trying to answer that question. SLU checks all the other boxes. 

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12 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

What the Big East, itself, appears to want in a prospective new member is NCAA Tournament units. The question then is which conference provides the best opportunity for SLU to accumulate those units. I can see merit in both sides in trying to answer that question. SLU checks all the other boxes. 

Correct. SLU needs to start collecting successful seasons (tourney appearances) regardless of what conference they play in. Which conference provides the best opportunity for SLU to become a serious BE candidate? You would think the A10 but with 1 (autobid) appearance the last decade I’m not so sure. But winning is definitely step 1 of Mission: Big East and if SLU were to eventually check off the “recent success” box on the their checklist, my guess is that most of the other items listed would be things that SLU maintains regardless of conference affiliation. Just speculation on my part. 

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1 hour ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

What the Big East, itself, appears to want in a prospective new member is NCAA Tournament units. The question then is which conference provides the best opportunity for SLU to accumulate those units. I can see merit in both sides in trying to answer that question. SLU checks all the other boxes. 

Typically, maybe always, a team leaving a conference leaves their NCAA units behind.  The league they departed keeps those not already released.  (The Pac 12 may be an exception - let's see how that one ends up.)

If/When the Big East expand, it is all about money.  Which team/market brings in the most $$ for the league.  And the driver there is TV money.  I don't know SLU TV ratings, nor how they compare to Dayton/VCU/Davidson/Richmond, etc.  That will be a key focus for Fox.  And if SMU is the new norm, the cut of TV money for a new school wouldn't be equal to existing conference members for several years.

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17 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Typically, maybe always, a team leaving a conference leaves their NCAA units behind.  The league they departed keeps those not already released.  (The Pac 12 may be an exception - let's see how that one ends up.)

If/When the Big East expand, it is all about money.  Which team/market brings in the most $$ for the league.  And the driver there is TV money.  I don't know SLU TV ratings, nor how they compare to Dayton/VCU/Davidson/Richmond, etc.  That will be a key focus for Fox.  And if SMU is the new norm, the cut of TV money for a new school wouldn't be equal to existing conference members for several years.

-in 3, 2, 1.....

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9 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Typically, maybe always, a team leaving a conference leaves their NCAA units behind.  The league they departed keeps those not already released.  (The Pac 12 may be an exception - let's see how that one ends up.)

If/When the Big East expand, it is all about money.  Which team/market brings in the most $$ for the league.  And the driver there is TV money.  I don't know SLU TV ratings, nor how they compare to Dayton/VCU/Davidson/Richmond, etc.  That will be a key focus for Fox.  And if SMU is the new norm, the cut of TV money for a new school wouldn't be equal to existing conference members for several years.

To be more specific, it appears the Big East wants a school that is going to earn NCAA Units ($).  As such, the Big East looks to past performance in terms of earning NCAA Units as the best predictor of future results, those future results being earning NCAA Units as a Big East school.  This is not a case of a school bringing NCAA units with it. Yes, those are generally left behind. 

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12 hours ago, Compton said:

I'm not so sure about that. Two considerations:

  1. Missouri State has football. So, assumedly, at least some of its $158,000 in licensing and royalties is coming from the Missouri Valley Football Conference. It's not unreasonable to think the A10's payout could be 2X the MVC's.
  2. Missouri State's NCAA distributions could be significantly padded by A10-member Loyola Chicago's final four and sweet sixteen tourney runs.

The MVC shares tournament revenue equally.  In the A10 the tourney team keeps 75% and the conference only gets 25% and that 25% is spread among more programs. So payouts in MVC will be higher for that reason alone.

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50 minutes ago, brianstl said:

The MVC shares tournament revenue equally.  In the A10 the tourney team keeps 75% and the conference only gets 25% and that 25% is spread among more programs. So payouts in MVC will be higher for that reason alone.

Another missed SLU opportunity from missing the tournament so many years. 

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If we lose VCU and UMass, I think one possible move is to try to merge the A-10 and the West Coast Conference into a mega private school conference.  I would think this conference would have good bargaining power for TV rights considering its cities would include, New York, D.C. (2 teams), Philadelphia (2 teams), Pittsburgh, St. Louis, Chicago, Bay Area (2 teams), San Diego, Los Angeles (2 teams), and Portland.  Non-revenue sports could be kept on one side of the country or the other outside of championship games.  Just create Eastern Division and a Western Division.

This would have to be done amongst the schools and Athletic Departments as one of the conference offices would go away.  Can't imagine they would be invested in a situation where they have a 50/50 shot of being let go.

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22 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

A comparison of the number of NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament bids since SLU joined the Atlantic 10 for the '06-'07 season:

A10 51, average of 3.0 NCAA bids per season;  MVC 26, average of 1.5 NCAA bids per season;  Horizon 19, average of 1.056 NCAA bids per season.

If the comparison is begun at the '13-'14 season, the season after Temple, Xavier and Butler (one and done) left the A10 and Creighton left the MVC, the number of NCAA Tourney bids is as follows:  A10 25, an average of 2.8 per season;  MVC 12 bids, an average of 1.3 per season;  Horizon, 9 bids, an average of 1 bid per season.

All of the above and the following does not include the '20 season when the NCAA Tourney was not played.  The MVC has been Juan Bid 6 of the last 7 seasons, the Horizon Juan Bid for the last 13 consecutive seasons.  The A10 was Juan Bid in '23 for the first time since '05, before SLU joined the A10.  Let's hope '23 was an outlier for the A10, and not the start of a trend. Juan Bid could be an unwelcome guest due to the NCAA Power 5 +1 skewed NET and the Power 5 +1 not playing non-Power 5's on the road.

In terms of television rights, the A10 has deals with CBS for its A10 Tourney Championship Game on Selection Sunday, CBS Sports Network, NBC- now on USA Network after the NBC Sports Network folded, and the ESPN Networks for the A10 Friday Night games, which put the A10 in a national spotlight, in an only game in town scenario.  This is not a close call- A10 TV access is significantly better than the MVC and eons better than the Horizon.  A lot of MVC games are confined to ESPN+ streaming.  Whether the A10 can maintain this excellent linear TV exposure remains to be seen.

The institutional fit is no contest.  I realize the detractors don't like to be told that, but that one is also not close.

The only thing the MVC and to a lesser extent Horizon have over the A10 for SLU is geography.

As noted by another poster, if the MVC is so great, why did Loyola Chicago leave the MVC for the A10? That is a rhetorical question and yields an obvious answer.

My fellow Billikens, this one is not a close call.  While the ultimate home for SLU should be in the Big East, the A10 is significantly better than the MVC and Horizon.  

 

Great breakdown.  Sad that your argument had to be made.  Thanks for putting in the time.

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2 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

This would have to be done amongst the schools and Athletic Departments as one of the conference offices would go away.  Can't imagine they would be invested in a situation where they have a 50/50 shot of being let go.

I like the idea in an "out of the box" way. I don't think this part would necessarily be true. You still need conference officials on the ground at some level as well as enough folks to handle a lot of schools and their needs. 

I would also kick some of the no-loads out and add in some of the midwestern private schools Belmont, Drake, Bradley, etc. to create a better nationwide swath. 

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