slu72 fan Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 21 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: see trollboy tilk. now that was an answer. you on the other hand are worthless. and sorry the program is important to most true fans. are you saying that I'm not a true fan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Just now, slu72 fan said: are you saying that I'm not a true fan? no slu72. your fanship has never been questioned. tilk was short for the board troll tilkowski or whatever his name is today that is defending the length of time this is taking without any reason why. you in one sentence gave a very good reason as to the reason it is dragging out. i thank you for jumping in to remind all of the fact everyone might/does have an attorney with possible different wants and points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 fan Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Thank you for the clarification. I’ll sure be glad when this is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgeldmacher Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 1 hour ago, billiken_roy said: no disrespect. you obviously are just giving us facts. but for the life of me i just dont see it. if the people involved were missing or not cooperating that might add time to gather statements. but i just cant see why in our case this has to drag out. it is stupid. make a decision I think everyone is basing their ire about the investigation not being complete on a belief that we all have a pretty good idea about the facts of the incident that occurred. If our understanding about the facts is wrong, or incomplete, or if there is a twist that we are unaware of like that the girls are claiming something happened after the camera was turned off (if there even was one), then we are basing our opinions on assumptions that may not be true. It is amazing to me that this board is so upset (actually not so unbelievable, since losing was going to bring out this frustration regardless of how properly the investigation was proceeding) based upon what we all believe the facts of this situation to be, when our understanding of those facts are completely based upon speculation and hearsay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgeldmacher Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Another note: If we had won all of our games thus far, no one would be all that concerned about the length of the investigation. Think about that for a moment. It's true. Then wonder why grown men are so upset about an investigation into rape allegations. If the answer is we are upset because we aren't having as good of a basketball season as we would have hoped, then shame on us. Further note: Would the two players who are not playing right now have made that much of a difference? That is a whole other debate, but I think that the sentiment is that we would be having very different results if they were playing. I don't know that that would be true. Slu let the dogs out? likes this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2010andBeyond Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 12 minutes ago, gravilst said: What I don't understand is the notion that the players are allowed to participate in all basketball/team/college activities, except for games. They are under investigation....but isn't banning them from games punishment before being found guilty of doing something wrong? Hypothetically if the results of the investigation yield no wrong doing, you just punished 2 players (graves wouldnt count since he has to sit anyway) for no reason.....or according to some because it would "look bad" if they were allowed to play and later found guilty of something. I don't see how it would look bad. The players are innocent until deemed otherwise by said investigation. How does it look bad that the players were not punished until the end of the investigation? So is sitting out just to keep a particular group happy? If thats the case then screw Dr. P AND the rest of the administration. This is what I have been struggling with. Very bad precedent if simply being accused of something immediately warrants punishment until your name is cleared. Isn’t this the exact opposite of innocent until proven guilty? gravilst likes this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 50 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: these players will never get any of this missed time back. to believe such is naive imo. i dont really care. if they are "guilty" in the eyes of this so called committee whatever. just make a dam decision. we want it over. I'm not saying that they get missed time back; I'm saying they lose less eligibility by not playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 16 minutes ago, gravilst said: What I don't understand is the notion that the players are allowed to participate in all basketball/team/college activities, except for games. They are under investigation....but isn't banning them from games punishment before being found guilty of doing something wrong? Hypothetically if the results of the investigation yield no wrong doing, you just punished 2 players (graves wouldnt count since he has to sit anyway) for no reason.....or according to some because it would "look bad" if they were allowed to play and later found guilty of something. I don't see how it would look bad. The players are innocent until deemed otherwise by said investigation. How does it look bad that the players were not punished until the end of the investigation? So is sitting out just to keep a particular group happy? If thats the case then screw Dr. P AND the rest of the administration. As I said in an earlier post, Is there any possibility that SLU's administration is not responsible for the players' absence? Is it possible that it stems from the players themselves and their representation? If that's the case, then all of this rancor directed at the SLU administration is misdirected. I could very well be wrong, but I suspect I'm on to something. The administration might not want to hold them out -- after all, the punishments could be actions aside from expulsion from school! -- and the athletics department and coaches might want them to play, but those who are watching out for their best long-term interests aren't willing to risk their eligibility on a favorable outcome at this time. However, none of the parties is permitted to issue a comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2010andBeyond Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 At the beginning of the season I thought the mystery absences/suspensions meant that the matter was about to resolved and if the players were cleared the small amount of missed time would be written off as a team rules violation or something. The longer this drags on, and every game that goes by, the punishment gets more severe. If the players end up being cleared this would be totally bogus. This is definitely beginning to look like a classic slu cluster f$&@. If the process was nowhere near completion at the beginning of the season then it should be business as usual until there is some sort of outcome. If at end of the investigation it is determined one or more players is guilty of what they are being accused of, then I’m all for throwing the book at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 8 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said: Another note: If we had won all of our games thus far, no one would be all that concerned about the length of the investigation. Think about that for a moment. It's true. Then wonder why grown men are so upset about an investigation into rape allegations. If the answer is we are upset because we aren't having as good of a basketball season as we would have hoped, then shame on us. Further note: Would the two players who are not playing right now have made that much of a difference? That is a whole other debate, but I think that the sentiment is that we would be having very different results if they were playing. I don't know that that would be true. I think it's been established that no one is being accused of rape. The two players most certainly would've made a difference. And I would still want them on the team even if we were 6-0 (or 5-0 depending on your thoughts on Rockhurst). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Rammer response to a Durando tweet about how SLU needs shooters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 24 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said: Another note: If we had won all of our games thus far, no one would be all that concerned about the length of the investigation. Think about that for a moment. It's true. Then wonder why grown men are so upset about an investigation into rape allegations. If the answer is we are upset because we aren't having as good of a basketball season as we would have hoped, then shame on us. Further note: Would the two players who are not playing right now have made that much of a difference? That is a whole other debate, but I think that the sentiment is that we would be having very different results if they were playing. I don't know that that would be true. good discussion points. first, again i dont think anyone with an ounce of decency wants the players to be given a free pass if they indeed did something wrong. and agreed we are basing our thoughts and frustrations on hearsay and rumors etc. THAT IS THE PROBLEM. we are being asked to be patient and quiet on the billikens success or failure for something that we just dont know what is going on. i am not an attorney i am not an ncaa guidelines expert, so forgive me for my impatience about my only passion beyond my career and my family, the billikens. but at this point i think it is past the time of patience for all concerned and all involved need to figure out how to give the fandom some reason to continue to wait and be patient and quiet. as to your further note, after last night and really in hindsight after virginia tech, it is obvious to anyone with an ounce of basketball knowledge you beat saint louis university right now by rebounding and most importantly denying the lane. make the billikens shoot. amazingly two of our missing players are reputed to be our best shooters by far. giving us the real outside threat changes completely the "how to beat the billikens". if bishop, johnson and most importantly henriquez are sitting on the wing when either bess or goodwin drive and knowing how unselfish both bess and goodwin are, how eager are opponents to double down to the lane to help defend goodwin and bess? i definitely think our only loss at this point is providence had we had our full squad and who knows if we make a few threes to change their approach even that game might have been different. to even question if we can beat detroit and western michigan with our full roster imo is crazy. that said, to be surprised in hindsight that we lost to detroit and western michigan without our full roster is crazy as well. any program that loses their a. henriquez player is going to struggle to replace them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Suppose this process takes 5 months. The players could have actually played the whole season. If the playears are cleared, they have (rightfully) lost nothing. If their acts warrant punishment, then they're either kicked out of school or sit out the beginning of next season. Instead we have the Sword of Damocles dangling over the team and the entire fanbase. This is what administrative failure looks like. brianstl likes this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 2 hours ago, billikenblue said: Totally agree Roy. Or at the very least communicate something. I was close to Rick and the handling of a similar situation with Willie etc made him very angry to the point I thought he might leave the program. Travis may be going through the same thing. Losing these buy games isn’t going to help Coach Ford land a job anywhere.. so uh, that’s a silver lining.. right... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Just now, majerus mojo said: Losing these buy games isn’t going to help Coach Ford land a job anywhere.. so uh, that’s a silver lining.. right... ? ive seen far lesser coaches than travis ford end up in cushy power conference jobs. if the likes of seth greenberg or dave leito or you can even say cuomzo martin can get big pay raise step up jobs, there is one out there for travis ford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 9 minutes ago, majerus mojo said: Losing these buy games isn’t going to help Coach Ford land a job anywhere.. so uh, that’s a silver lining.. right... ? It gives Ford a reason to leave right after he turns the program around. Why would you take a chance on putting yourself through this again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniorbill76 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Did they lose to Detroit Mercy at home too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 19 minutes ago, brianstl said: It gives Ford a reason to leave right after he turns the program around. Why would you take a chance on putting yourself through this again? Comment made 98% in jest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bay Area Billiken Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 1 hour ago, cgeldmacher said: Further note: Would the two players who are not playing right now have made that much of a difference? That is a whole other debate, but I think that the sentiment is that we would be having very different results if they were playing. I don't know that that would be true. SLU without question would have defeated Detroit Mercy. SLU more likely than not would have defeated Western Michigan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetorch Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 On the Kilcoyne show one of the hosts just said if there is no statement from the school by Friday the two lawyers representing the players will be speaking to the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseOfTheBillikens Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 Most aggravating part of this is that if there were some underprivileged youth protesting at the clock tower SLU would be much more transparent with the process. Just give people something. Excited to hear what the representation has to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 5 minutes ago, thetorch said: On the Kilcoyne show one of the hosts just said if there is no statement from the school by Friday the two lawyers representing the players will be speaking to the media. Well that could be something interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeSmetBilliken Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 5 minutes ago, thetorch said: On the Kilcoyne show one of the hosts just said if there is no statement from the school by Friday the two lawyers representing the players will be speaking to the media. I can’t see that being good for SLU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Ken Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 There has got to be a lot more to this case than what we know. Why the AD or university didn't just get out in front of this story and do the basic blocking and tackling as far as making a statement initially, again I do not understand. Everyone at the school deserves blame for this, everyone. The law school, the med school, enrollment, the clock tower accords, this situation, the lay offs, it goes on and on. Systemically something has got to shift at the university, we don't even talk about the potential victims in this case or that we have student athletes' careers and futures in limbo. Just the acknowledgement from someone saying we are on top of this from the start and where we are today might be a little better. That's all I'm saying. It's sad, especially if the AD "assumes" there will be a statement. Either he is throwing that ball back over to the presidents yard or he is out of the loop. Just a bad situation and very frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NH Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 I think that news via Rosenblum/Kilcoyne is good. Means the lawyers are confident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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