2023-2024 Season

[3star_recruit]

16 minutes ago, Compton said:

Hargrove started 16 games last year, averaged 19.8mpg, more than Forrester or Parker. In 2021-22 he started 16 games, averaged 21.5mpg which was #6 on the team.

Saying that "barely cracked the rotation" is a misrepresentation.

I'm not even sure what the source of the debate is.  Hargrove is a role player that gets plenty of minutes.  Are people arguing that giving him 3 more minutes a game would change the fortunes of the team?  Are they arguing he should be upgraded to starter minutes (28 minutes a game)?  I'm confused.

[VeniceMenace]

4 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

I'm not even sure what the source of the debate is.  Hargrove is a role player that gets plenty of minutes.  Are people arguing that giving him 3 more minutes a game would change the fortunes of the team?  Are they arguing he should be upgraded to starter minutes (28 minutes a game)?  I'm confused.

No, just that the leash the past couple years has been too short in some games vs. others on the floor…as it was last year for Parker.

[shempie]

1 hour ago, wgstl said:

According to T-rank we lost 6 of our 7 best defensive players(Gibby being the one).  We added Dalger who is or at least was a very poor defender, Meadows who is very average, and Ezewiro is is slightly below average defensively plus a bunch of unknowns. Bbrad and Mike would have been roughly the 6-7th best defenders on the team last year. 

We will have the roster to play bigger and I would guess our tempo is slower this year vs. last. That doesn't mean we are better defensively, but might hide some defencies on that end of the floor. The decline in defensive efficiency the last few years is one of the most alarming trends IMO, and is seemingly out of character for a TF team.

[shempie]

1 hour ago, wgstl said:

According to T-rank we lost 6 of our 7 best defensive players(Gibby being the one).  We added Dalger who is or at least was a very poor defender, Meadows who is very average, and Ezewiro is is slightly below average defensively plus a bunch of unknowns. Bbrad and Mike would have been roughly the 6-7th best defenders on the team last year. 

We will have the roster to play bigger and I would guess our tempo is slower this year vs. last. That doesn't mean we are better defensively, but might hide some defencies on that end of the floor. The decline in defensive efficiency the last few years is one of the most alarming trends IMO, and is seemingly out of character for a TF team.

[willie]

2 hours ago, 3star_recruit said:

I'm not even sure what the source of the debate is.  Hargrove is a role player that gets plenty of minutes.  Are people arguing that giving him 3 more minutes a game would change the fortunes of the team?  Are they arguing he should be upgraded to starter minutes (28 minutes a game)?  I'm confused.

I would argue that he should be more than a roll player. My points are his athletic ability has been underused. And I will say this about Parker- several times they were on a roll and subbed Out to put a starter back in yet Jimerson would never come out . Yes I would like to see what he can do with starter minutes not just starting a game and coming out at the first media timeout. 

[3star_recruit]

20 minutes ago, willie said:

I would argue that he should be more than a roll player. My points are his athletic ability has been underused. And I will say this about Parker- several times they were on a roll and subbed Out to put a starter back in yet Jimerson would never come out . Yes I would like to see what he can do with starter minutes not just starting a game and coming out at the first media timeout. 

If a guy is playing starter minutes, he needs to be one of your best offensive or defensive players.  Hargrove has been neither.  If Dalger is his primary competition for a starting spot this year, he may be.

[WVBilliken]

2 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Hey, I agree with you.  Okoro did demonstrate an ability to protect the rim via blocked shots, but he displayed no where near French Level defense.  And with all due respect to Mr. Collins, while he was 'voted' All D team, we all saw what Ace and others did to him.

As far as this year's D, to me it depends on who plays the minutes.  The majority of this board seemed to agree that Hughes was perhaps our best perimeter defender.  Perkins was limited on D last season with his knee issues. 

Improving the 3 point defense is imperative ..... it was damn horrible last year.  Perhaps taller guards like Hughes will help.  But the opposing teams were either wide open too often, or in the case of vertically challenged Collins .... just shot over him

[RUBillsFan]

2 hours ago, shempie said:

We will have the roster to play bigger and I would guess our tempo is slower this year vs. last. That doesn't mean we are better defensively, but might hide some defencies on that end of the floor. The decline in defensive efficiency the last few years is one of the most alarming trends IMO, and is seemingly out of character for a TF team.

I could see Ford going back to the 1-3-1 zone more often this season.  Collins playing 90% of the time & not being a great fit in the zone because he lacks length meant it didn't make a ton of sense to play zone a lot in recent years.  If you've got a lineup of with Hughes at PG, you have good length, but mostly mediocre one-on-one defenders.  That could be a formula for the zone being better than man to man.

[HoosierPal]

1 hour ago, WVBilliken said:

Improving the 3 point defense is imperative ..... it was damn horrible last year.  Perhaps taller guards like Hughes will help.  But the opposing teams were either wide open too often, or in the case of vertically challenged Collins .... just shot over him

I'm agreeing on the 3 pt defense being bad.  Looking up the A10 full season stats, SLU was 10th in the league at 33.7% for opponents 3 pt shooting, right behind UMass at 33.1%.  St. Bonnie was tops at 28.7%.  Dayton was the only other team under 30% at 29.3%.

[willie]

14 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

I'm agreeing on the 3 pt defense being bad.  Looking up the A10 full season stats, SLU was 10th in the league at 33.7% for opponents 3 pt shooting, right behind UMass at 33.1%.  St. Bonnie was tops at 28.7%.  Dayton was the only other team under 30% at 29.3%.

I am not a fan of our approach. Maybe because we don’t have a lot of rim protectors but we start our defense inside out. With the 3 pointer being what it is I think you need to defend outside in. 

[wgstl]

Wonder if Gibby guarding the 3 more than the 2 helps with perimeter defense/defense in general. 

[SLU_Nick]

7 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

if that was our two best defenders last year and you think we will be even worse this year defensively overall............oh boy.   not good. 

100% agree, our "best" defenders could not defend at all.  Losing them is a net positive.  

Larry Hughes Jr had about 8 of the best 10 defensive plays of our team last year and he played 8 mins a game.

 

[johnbj14]

1 hour ago, SLU_Nick said:

100% agree, our "best" defenders could not defend at all.  Losing them is a net positive.  

Larry Hughes Jr had about 8 of the best 10 defensive plays of our team last year and he played 8 mins a game.

 

Yuri’s position as one of our two best defenders is probably debatable enough to the point where I shouldn’t have said that. Francis Okoro was a good defender though. He wasn’t the same level as French, but there will be a significant drop off from last year to this one on the inside, if what people have seen on Bruce is accurate. His length made up for a lot of missed rotations from other players on the court. 

[BrettJollyComedyHour]

12 hours ago, SLU_Nick said:

100% agree, our "best" defenders could not defend at all.  Losing them is a net positive.  

Larry Hughes Jr had about 8 of the best 10 defensive plays of our team last year and he played 8 mins a game.

 

Can't wait to see what he does unencumbered 

[Cowboy II]

-with classes starting this week, some questions/comments I have for the season

-In the duh category, life beyond Yuri, Fred and JPerk.

-Is it Larry? Cian? Meadows? Who runs the show most of the time?

-Guessing no waiver meaning our bigs are young, how are they used? How long a leash? Who plays?

-Speaking of a leash, who will have a short one and who will have a long one? 

-Is our offense changed or are the young bigs going to handle the ball at the top of the key like we have seen?  If so, do they have free reign to shoot 3’s? will they know how to set legal screens?

-In June on Frank’s show CFord said great things about Thames, does that translate to playing time?

-How do we change the trend line of decreasing defensive efficiency?  A fix here would be a big help for the season.

-When teams throw a blanket on GibJim what’s our answer?  

-Does CFord feel any heat?  Does his game behavior change?  Interaction with media change? 

-CMay was quoted in STLPD as saying “we have to take the next step of being in the NCAA Tournament and in position to make runs”  Just sayin’

[VeniceMenace]

24 minutes ago, Cowboy II said:

-with classes starting this week, some questions/comments I have for the season

-In the duh category, life beyond Yuri, Fred and JPerk.

-Is it Larry? Cian? Meadows? Who runs the show most of the time?

-Guessing no waiver meaning our bigs are young, how are they used? How long a leash? Who plays?

-Speaking of a leash, who will have a short one and who will have a long one? 

-Is our offense changed or are the young bigs going to handle the ball at the top of the key like we have seen?  If so, do they have free reign to shoot 3’s? will they know how to set legal screens?

-In June on Frank’s show CFord said great things about Thames, does that translate to playing time?

-How do we change the trend line of decreasing defensive efficiency?  A fix here would be a big help for the season.

-When teams throw a blanket on GibJim what’s our answer?  

-Does CFord feel any heat?  Does his game behavior change?  Interaction with media change? 

-CMay was quoted in STLPD as saying “we have to take the next step of being in the NCAA Tournament and in position to make runs”  Just sayin’

Only 4 guys on this roster, perhaps 5 counting Dalger, who are known quantities. The theme of your post, appropriately, is questions as so much just isn’t known.

Hard time recalling the last SLU preseason when so much was a toss up.

[HoosierPal]

5 hours ago, Cowboy II said:

-with classes starting this week, some questions/comments I have for the season

-In the duh category, life beyond Yuri, Fred and JPerk.

-Is it Larry? Cian? Meadows? Who runs the show most of the time?

-Guessing no waiver meaning our bigs are young, how are they used? How long a leash? Who plays?

-Speaking of a leash, who will have a short one and who will have a long one? 

-Is our offense changed or are the young bigs going to handle the ball at the top of the key like we have seen?  If so, do they have free reign to shoot 3’s? will they know how to set legal screens?

-In June on Frank’s show CFord said great things about Thames, does that translate to playing time?

-How do we change the trend line of decreasing defensive efficiency?  A fix here would be a big help for the season.

-When teams throw a blanket on GibJim what’s our answer?  

-Does CFord feel any heat?  Does his game behavior change?  Interaction with media change? 

-CMay was quoted in STLPD as saying “we have to take the next step of being in the NCAA Tournament and in position to make runs”  Just sayin’

Fun points to throw around opinions:

Who runs the show?  I think you stated this correctly as who runs the show rather than who is the point guard.  If you recall, when Mike Crawford played, Ford called him a Point Forward.  He didn't bring the ball up the floor, but he was instrumental in setting up the offense and running the play.  So it may be one of the three you list, or it could be one of about 3 others.

Leashes?  Gibson will of course play as many minutes as possible.  I'm going to throw out Hargrove as having a longer lease than last season, as well as Parker.  Short leases will be the Freshmen, until they show they can handle D1.

Bigs handling the ball:  Brad Ezewiro said a major reason he signed up here was that he was going to play at the top of the key.  Of course, we will all be glad if he plays anywhere this season.  But if that is a lead in, maybe our bigs will play more out in the offense.  No one knows if Zhang or Van Bussell or Magassa can operate up top.

Thames is an enigma.  He is more or less a freshman, but does have one year's worth of 'experience' watching and participating.  I'll be interested in seeing where F6'6" or  6'7" CG plays, can he handle an opponent's 6'7"+ power player?  Could he guard DeRon Holmes?  I'll be interested to see what he can do.  It is really hard to predict his role, but he certainly will have one. 

Teams tried to put a blanket on Jimerson last season, and some were more effective then others.  Collins, Perkins and Pickett were all double digit scorers.  This season, I am looking for Dalger, Parker and maybe Hargrove to average double digits, so they would be our answer.

Does Ford feel the heat?  Of course he does.  He has been around long enough to be fully aware that a significant number of D1 Head Coaches get fired every year for results. 

Thanks for throwing these questions out there. 

[HoosierPal]

A couple of recent listings on the College Sports Madness Top 144 are of interest.

Loyola is listed at 79, 4th in the Atlantic 10.  They had a horrible first season in the A10, but more than one pundit is high on the Ramblers.  They lost Kennedy and Golden (who to me didn't live up to expectations) and loaded up with Transfers.  Of interest to me are the big from Dartmouth and Watson from Davidson.  Alston and Norris are both back and they both are solid.  It will be interesting to see if Valentine can turn a 10-21 and 4-14 season around.  I've penciled them in for middle third of the A10, not top third as they would be at 4th.

Drake, a potential opponent - has anyone seen it verified?- came in at 82 and first in the Valley.  They lost three starters but return DeVries, which says enough.  Anyway, this has the potential to be a Q1 away game, if it is on our schedule. 

[Cowboy II]

21 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

A couple of recent listings on the College Sports Madness Top 144 are of interest.

Loyola is listed at 79, 4th in the Atlantic 10.  They had a horrible first season in the A10, but more than one pundit is high on the Ramblers.  They lost Kennedy and Golden (who to me didn't live up to expectations) and loaded up with Transfers.  Of interest to me are the big from Dartmouth and Watson from Davidson.  Alston and Norris are both back and they both are solid.  It will be interesting to see if Valentine can turn a 10-21 and 4-14 season around.  I've penciled them in for middle third of the A10, not top third as they would be at 4th.

Drake, a potential opponent - has anyone seen it verified?- came in at 82 and first in the Valley.  They lost three starters but return DeVries, which says enough.  Anyway, this has the potential to be a Q1 away game, if it is on our schedule. 

-there is no way he has eligibility, he's been there a long time, didn't he play with Alfredrick the Great?

[HoosierPal]

34 minutes ago, Cowboy II said:

-there is no way he has eligibility, he's been there a long time, didn't he play with Alfredrick the Great?

Ha. I had to look him up. He played 2018-19 at Oakland, sat out 19-20 as he transferred to Loyola, and has played 3 seasons there. This is his Covid season. So he is old. Yeah. 

[wgstl]

5 hours ago, Cowboy II said:

 

-When teams throw a blanket on GibJim what’s our answer?  

 

Parker will run wild on whoever does this

[CenHudDude]

11 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Parker will run wild on whoever does this

Let’s hope.

[VeniceMenace]

4 minutes ago, CenHudDude said:

Let’s hope.

Did Parker and GibJim see much court time together last season? Seemed like in most instances they alternated, but could be mistaken.

[willie]

2 minutes ago, VeniceMenace said:

Did Parker and GibJim see much court time together last season? Seemed like in most instances they alternated, but could be mistaken.

Gibson never came out so they must have played together some. 

[wgstl]

21 minutes ago, willie said:

Gibson never came out so they must have played together some. 

Yep.  In conf Gibby played 35 min and Parker 13 min