US News and World Report Rankings

[SLU_Lax]

I agree Rose is a great school.  I will knock Terra Haute though...that city stinks (other than stopping for gas on roadtrips).

[brianstl]

I am a little surprised SLU hasn't added a plant science program.  It would have made sense to do so years ago.  I am glad that they added a Geo-informatics & Geospatial Analytics Major last year.

[billiken_roy]

my b!tch with slu remains a proud placement program.   like i said, i got no help in 82, when my daughter, who came with spectacular credentials, interviewed with the head of engineering and asked about typical placement statistics, the head of engineering states, "most of our grads go on to grad school."  didnt even try to answer the question.   

that was a difference maker.   

[Lord Elrond]

Check out this article, makes you realize this whole ranking business is nothing to worry about…

 

https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/14/opinions/columbia-university-ranking-perry/index.html

[Box and Won]

We're at 105:

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

 

[OkieBilliken]

9 minutes ago, Box and Won said:

We're at 105:

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

 

The fact that Florida State is #54 and USF is #91 means that this is meaningless.   Florida State is where all in-state kids go who couldn't get in to U of Florida and USF is more of a skate park/meth lab that a national university, no offense.   

[Old guy]

As far as I am concerned, the only thing these kinds of reviews is useful for depends upon two things. 1. Were the parameters used for measuring the status of a school the same as in prior years? 2. If the parameters used were the same then, and only then, you can get a measurement of improvement or worsening in the status of a school when compared over the years the parameters used remained the same.

Any changes in the parameters or the way the ranking was measured negates the validity of comparing the ranking of a  school (is it getting better or worse) over a period of years.

[Box and Won]

1 hour ago, OkieBilliken said:

The fact that Florida State is #54 and USF is #91 means that this is meaningless.   Florida State is where all in-state kids go who couldn't get in to U of Florida and USF is more of a skate park/meth lab that a national university, no offense.   

Some schools have figured out a way to game the rankings in recent years.  Northeastern is probably the biggest offender.

[WUH]

59 minutes ago, Box and Won said:

Some schools have figured out a way to game the rankings in recent years.  Northeastern is probably the biggest offender.

I know the criteria has changed a number of times over the past decade, but at one time, alumni donations and denial rate were critical components so any institution with the means could do a lot to get a few dollars from a large pool of alumni or applications from students who had no chance of being admitted.  Other schools report false or falsified data.

[someoneelse]

On 9/24/2024 at 12:37 PM, Box and Won said:

Some schools have figured out a way to game the rankings in recent years.  Northeastern is probably the biggest offender.

The Temple business school head got caught and got convicted of fraud in 2021.  

[TheA_Bomb]

On 9/14/2022 at 1:21 PM, billiken_roy said:

my b!tch with slu remains a proud placement program.   like i said, i got no help in 82, when my daughter, who came with spectacular credentials, interviewed with the head of engineering and asked about typical placement statistics, the head of engineering states, "most of our grads go on to grad school."  didnt even try to answer the question.   

that was a difference maker.   

Can confirm SLU Engineering is little help in getting internships and jobs.

[willie]

On 9/14/2022 at 1:21 PM, billiken_roy said:

my b!tch with slu remains a proud placement program.   like i said, i got no help in 82, when my daughter, who came with spectacular credentials, interviewed with the head of engineering and asked about typical placement statistics, the head of engineering states, "most of our grads go on to grad school."  didnt even try to answer the question.   

that was a difference maker.   

Your daughter must take after her mother

[WUH]

OK, but to be fair, the Career Services office is larger than ever.

And students are generally dissatisfied with the quality of career advising.  Not just at SLU.

[MusicCityBilliken]

A lot schools over the years got caught sending in fabricated information:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/tulane-us-news-ranking_n_2395723

[TheA_Bomb]

13 hours ago, WUH said:

OK, but to be fair, the Career Services office is larger than ever.

And students are generally dissatisfied with the quality of career advising.  Not just at SLU.

Just because it's larger doesn't mean it's better.

You would think that in Engineering of all Majors (Mechanical), there would be many partnerships with area businesses or even public works to get students internships. There isn't.

To be fair, to your point, this is a problem not just at SLU. I say, can SLU just be a leader in something? Can SLU leadership recognize a problem and actually do something new, different, special, and or innovative?

It's like the Athletic Department; they're just meh. 

There's like one hairy political science professor studying state issues and trying to find common ground to advance legislation. Other than that, I'm just whelmed.

[WUH]

2 hours ago, TheA_Bomb said:

You would think that in Engineering of all Majors (Mechanical), there would be many partnerships with area businesses or even public works to get students internships. There isn't.

 

Do you have an example of a school that does this well?

[Young Charles]

I have some buddies that graduated from Rolla and UMSL (UMSL leverages Wash U's Program) in engineering that started working at Boeing or Lockheed right out of college. I'm not sure if the schools had any hand in getting them opportunities or if they just applied. 

[billiken_roy]

54 minutes ago, WUH said:

Do you have an example of a school that does this well?

Rose Hulman is all about placement and getting the students opportunities.   in most years they are within a handful of students to get 100% placement within their graduation year.   my daughter had a paid internship the summer after both her sophomore and junior year and had her current job by January of her senior year.  

 

[WUH]

10 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

Rose Hulman is all about placement and getting the students opportunities.   in most years they are within a handful of students to get 100% placement within their graduation year.   my daughter had a paid internship the summer after both her sophomore and junior year and had her current job by January of her senior year.  

 

I have no doubt that Rose-Hulman has great job placement rates as one of the top engineering schools.  I am sure they also do a lot on the career services side.

I was thinking more specifically about the partnerships suggestion.

I would be surprised if SLU engineering graduates are not finding jobs at rates similar to UMSL, Mizzou and so on.

[TheA_Bomb]

1 hour ago, WUH said:

I have no doubt that Rose-Hulman has great job placement rates as one of the top engineering schools.  I am sure they also do a lot on the career services side.

I was thinking more specifically about the partnerships suggestion.

I would be surprised if SLU engineering graduates are not finding jobs at rates similar to UMSL, Mizzou and so on.

Marc Andreessen (the guy who created the first web browser) credits the UofI Engineering Co-Op program as helping him. Other schools have a co-op program semester in class, semester at internship partnership with private industry. That's one way. 

I suggest having greater ongoing partnerships with area businesses to coordinate internships and placements. To my knowledge, this was limited at SLU. Students who study in Madrid did visit some European businesses during their semester abroad.

[WUH]

SLU has a co-operative education course in every undergraduate engineering major that allows students to work during the Fall or Spring and remain enrolled full-time for health insurance purposes.  This is typical for most engineering schools.

Universities court employers to varying degrees (SLU does this!), but I do not think anyone has a program in which students are placed in the job.  As I understand, most employers prefer to recruit and interview prospective interns.

[billiken_roy]

18 hours ago, WUH said:

I have no doubt that Rose-Hulman has great job placement rates as one of the top engineering schools.  I am sure they also do a lot on the career services side.

I was thinking more specifically about the partnerships suggestion.

I would be surprised if SLU engineering graduates are not finding jobs at rates similar to UMSL, Mizzou and so on.

When my daughter was deciding on college it came down to SLU or Rose.   I already had the fantastic  placement information from Rose Hulman in hand when I asked the SLU engineering department head about SLU placement.

His answer, "well most of our engineering majors head to graduate school so our numbers are skewed."

Thus ended any chance of my daughter being a Billiken like the rest of her family 

[WUH]

Rose-Hulman is a great school with a beautiful campus, even if it is in Terre Haute (actually, I know very little about Terra Haute).

[billiken_roy]

18 minutes ago, WUH said:

Rose-Hulman is a great school with a beautiful campus, even if it is in Terre Haute (actually, I know very little about Terra Haute).

Ha I can assure you Terre Haute is NOT a vacation destination.

[TheA_Bomb]

2 hours ago, WUH said:

SLU has a co-operative education course in every undergraduate engineering major that allows students to work during the Fall or Spring and remain enrolled full-time for health insurance purposes.  This is typical for most engineering schools.

Universities court employers to varying degrees (SLU does this!), but I do not think anyone has a program in which students are placed in the job.  As I understand, most employers prefer to recruit and interview prospective interns.

My information is anecdotal and two years old. The support my daughter received from SLU was very limited to non-existent. She did get an engineering job at one of the world's largest car manufacturers, so it all worked out.

Glad to hear SLU has a program. It doesn't appear to be well communicated, supported or known. 

How big is the program? How many students are in the program?  How many want to be in the program? How do they decide who can take part? What businesses are part of the program? How do they advertise it to perspective students, businesses/partners, parents? 

All questions someone interested in this might have. Let's Google and find some answers....

https://www.slu.edu/science-and-engineering/index.php

Summary: Nothing. Not a mention.

https://www.slu.edu/science-and-engineering/about/industry-partners.php

Summary: SLU partners with industry, no mention of which specific businesses besides Boeing if you're an employee you can take classes at SLU. If you're a pilot we have a mentorship program.

Now let's compare to University of Texas, I know this is #9 engineering School in the country and has big time $. But this is a website with actual information that's useful. 

https://cockrell.utexas.edu/student-life/career-services/co-ops-and-internships

Summary: outlines the process, the benefits, the business that do coop by major, and internships 

This is a very specific example, based on the anecdotal experience of two posters on this message board. My overall point, is that higher education needs to change. SLU is just treading water, doing better than most by surviving in this tough environment but not doing anything innovative future facing. If they are, they don't communicate it well.

There's a growing sentiment that a 4 year degree isn't necessary anymore, especially one that costs over $200k. So what can SLU do to have a value proposition to over come that sentiment and attract quality students to prepare them for work/life?