Recruiting - 2017

[ACE]

On 7/28/2016 at 1:31 PM, Coach314 said:

Lol.  This is my second post on this forum.  You have just replied to my first. Vtime?? I didn't go to Vashon nor do I have a child that goes there.  I also do not coach at the school. I was just supplying factual information to the topic.  Not assumptions or myths. Another fact:  5 of the 6 Seniors that just graduated Vashon will be attending College on basketball scholarships. One of those kids barely played and it was his first year playing high school ball. Now,  maybe the high school programs you are used to are sending kids to high Major D1s but i think the objective is to continue on to the next level. Whatever level your talent/grades dictate.  Back on topic though...Levi's transcripts and ACT scores have been sent to each school that offered Stockard.  There has been NO talk of prep schools or jucos. Now...which is it going to be? You guys are complaining about local kids not staying home and wishing this or that kid attends SLU but when you find out SLU is not offering these kids you attack the post?  They are going heavy after the class of 2018...that's where their offers are going.  McKissic would consider SLU...IF THEY OFFERED!!  Gordon, Ramey,  Watson aren't coming to SLU.  But by all means...continue on with the assumptions and misinformation.

This was Coach314's second post back in July, right after brian called him out for being vtime.  Great prediction about Gordon!  And he is pushing the idea of SLU offering McKissic?!?!?! Classic vtime approach to SLU recruiting... we should focus on the second and third tier local recruits, while the BCS programs go after the top recruits.

BTW, we didn't need Stockard back in the fall, we signed two much more highly rated recruits in Goodwin and French. Glad Ford didn't follow your advice.

[HoosierPal]

21 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

Having said that.  Is there an actual need for Pickett with Thatch coming the year after and Goodwin being a combo guard as well?

As you should know, that comparison of Pickett and Thatch is way, way too far down the road.  A more logical comparison would be Watson and Thatch and that has already been discussed.  Between now and then there will be a full season of hoops, there will be transfers after next season, and there could or could not be VC's changing their mind.  If Pickett is Ford's choice, sign him now and figure out the season after this one when the time is right.  Always over recruit over what you have on hand.

[Glorydays2013]

I'm BAAAAAAAACCCK. 

 

But in all seriousness some good things are developing right now and people will be happy with the results. We have some big targets lined up. We will fill the gaps with bigs, but there is also room for guards. Remember Ford was a guard in college, so he will and has had a guard focused play-style. If you haven't noticed already Ford gets power athletes, the smallest Ty Graves is one of the most explosive on the team right now and is a beast in the gym. Pickett fits that mold. 

[RiseAndGrind]

27 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

Having said that.  Is there an actual need for Pickett with Thatch coming the year after and Goodwin being a combo guard as well?

Have you ever watched Villanova play basketball? 

[moytoy12]

28 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

Having said that.  Is there an actual need for Pickett with Thatch coming the year after and Goodwin being a combo guard as well?

Ford is just being proactive and preparing for Goodwin's departure. 

[kshoe]

57 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

Having said that.  Is there an actual need for Pickett with Thatch coming the year after and Goodwin being a combo guard as well?

You definitely need more than two guards on the team. 

[billikens747]

51 minutes ago, Glorydays2013 said:

I'm BAAAAAAAACCCK. 

 

But in all seriousness some good things are developing right now and people will be happy with the results. We have some big targets lined up. We will fill the gaps with bigs, but there is also room for guards. Remember Ford was a guard in college, so he will and has had a guard focused play-style. If you haven't noticed already Ford gets power athletes, the smallest Ty Graves is one of the most explosive on the team right now and is a beast in the gym. Pickett fits that mold. 

A post I didn't hate. Good work. 

[Coach314]

1 hour ago, ACE said:

What a surprise... we know you are hoping Pickett doesn't sign with SLU. If Ford thinks there is a need, I trust that he sees that he is a good fit. The thought of SLU loading up a talented roster is killing you.  Maybe Goodwin should just go ahead and transfer now.

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

I get the idea to paint me as a Mizzou lover.  It's simple and doesn't require much thought.  Grrr Slu good...Mizzou bad.  

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

[ACE]

1 minute ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

I get the idea to paint me as a Mizzou lover.  It's simple and doesn't require much thought.  Grrr Slu good...Mizzou bad.  

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

I trust Ford's recruiting a little more than your advice. If it were up to you, SLU would have had a recruiting class of McKissic and Stockard. I think I like Goodwin and French just a little bit better.

[ACE]

13 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

I get the idea to paint me as a Mizzou lover.  It's simple and doesn't require much thought.  Grrr Slu good...Mizzou bad.  

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

Regarding the question, the answer is quite simple... Pickett would be replacing Moore's spot and Thatch will be replacing Roby. I know you are likely trying to manufacture an issue, but it is being done the right way. It's not that complicated. 

[HoosierPal]

27 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

Today we have 11 on scholarship.  I classify six as Wings / Ballhandlers and five as Power / Paint players.  Ford likely will run 3 of the first and 2 of the later group out there most of the time.  So there is no imbalance today.  Adding one in each category still makes the numbers work. 

[Bills_06]

30 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

I get the idea to paint me as a Mizzou lover.  It's simple and doesn't require much thought.  Grrr Slu good...Mizzou bad.  

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

I wouldn't paint you as a Mizzou lover necessarily but there is no doubt you view SLU as an inferior program that top local kids shouldn't go to.  Your post history shows this and you can try and act neutral but you aren't.  You will come and talk about SLU losing next year so Goodwin should trasfer before rosters are even set or kids will want to go to better programs just because they get an offer.  That's great but that doesn't mean it's whats best for them.  

Please, continue acting like all you care about is what's best for the kids when in reality, all you want is the kids to go to programs you view better than SLU.  

[RiseAndGrind]

35 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.  I see other people have concerns about the same issue in other threads,  but oh well.

I get the idea to paint me as a Mizzou lover.  It's simple and doesn't require much thought.  Grrr Slu good...Mizzou bad.  

Now can we get back to talking basketball.  

 

Then you also saw a lot of the responses - yet you felt the need to ask the question again. 

 

[JMM28]

43 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I thought that was a legitimate question with the # of guards and wings on the roster already.  I have no problem with ANY team loading up a roster if it is done the right way.  Sorry for being concerned about kids i know.

Unfortunately it is too many peoples (especially parents, coaches, and handlers) expectation that a freshman has to play significant minutes right away. Obviously SLU has a talent problem, but are we sure a guy like Thatch or Pickett will be ready to play Day 1? UIUC was taking about a redshirt year for Pickett.

I don't think either are redshirting, or will be lacking for playing time at SLU from day1. I just wonder what happened to the idea of spots 11-13 on a roster occupied by freshmen developing. Any lack of PT is some sort of serious slight and these guys are flying the coop, getting no playing time by sitting out the next year. 

Bottom line - these perceived roster crunches one or two offseasons away always work themselves out through transfer, injury, or guys not developing. 

[3star_recruit]

I'm one of those other voices who has raised concerns. Ford has a history of redshirting high upside players when minutes are scarce. If Pickett comes and the minutes aren't there, I hope he is one of those players. I seriously doubt more than 9 guys get double digit minutes this year. Again, that's Ford history when he has a good team.

[Quality Is Job 1]

3 minutes ago, Bills_06 said:

I wouldn't paint you as a Mizzou lover necessarily but there is no doubt you view SLU as an inferior program that top local kids shouldn't go to.  Your post history shows this and you can try and act neutral but you aren't.  You will come and talk about SLU losing next year so Goodwin should trasfer before rosters are even set or kids will want to go to better programs just because they get an offer.  That's great but that doesn't mean it's whats best for them.  

Please, continue acting like all you care about is what's best for the kids when in reality, all you want is the kids to go to programs you view better than SLU.  

One thing that that has irked me as a St. Louis basketball fan is that, almost universally outside of devoted SLU fans, people consider Saint Louis U. to be inferior, as if by birthright and that Missouri and Illinois are entitled to be better — better recruits, better media coverage, better conference affiliation, what have you.  My dad appears to harbor that attitude, as well as many others.

I would even suggest it extends beyond the region.  Several years ago I hosted and chauffeured around a cousin from Cleveland (who attended Ohio State), and when we talked about the college basketball teams I root for, he said, "St. Louis U?!  Are they even Div. 1?"  Really, Cuz?  Maybe he thought I was talking about UM-St. Louis (where I attended).  And there are probably a number of people outside of the region who don't understand the distinction between the two schools!

I think the prevailing attitude is a large part of the reason people advocate for SLU's joining the Missouri Valley Conference and don't think it "deserves" to be a member of the Big East or any other "power 5 [or 6]" conference.  Haters, the whole lot of them!  SLU and many other mid-major or non-FBS schools are the Rodney Dangerfields of sports.

[cgeldmacher]

I'm friends with a Mizzou grad.  We were at a bar watching the Blues game and talking about college hoops.  He mentioned that he thought SLU should join the Mo Valley and I just about popped him.  I explained to him that moving to the Valley would be a huge step down for SLU, and he just rolled his eyes.

It is absolutely a thing that SLU outsiders, even in St. Louis and members of the media, think that SLU doesn't deserve to take the step up that we want SLU to take.  They don't care about finishing top ten in the country recently.  They feel like that level of success should be reserved for Mizzou and Illinois in this region.  Screw them all!

[Quality Is Job 1]

4 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

I'm friends with a Mizzou grad.  We were at a bar watching the Blues game and talking about college hoops.  He mentioned that he thought SLU should join the Mo Valley and I just about popped him.  I explained to him that moving to the Valley would be a huge step down for SLU, and he just rolled his eyes.

It is absolutely a thing that SLU outsiders, even in St. Louis and members of the media, think that SLU doesn't deserve to take the step up that we want SLU to take.  They don't care about finishing top ten in the country recently.  They feel like that level of success should be reserved for Mizzou and Illinois in this region.  Screw them all!

Glad to see I'm not the only one who's noticed.  Even what Travis Ford's been doing regarding bringing in better talent hasn't been changing the perceptions of casual fans quickly.  Fortunately, he has more charisma with area players and coaches.

[Bizziken]

11 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

I'm friends with a Mizzou grad.  We were at a bar watching the Blues game and talking about college hoops.  He mentioned that he thought SLU should join the Mo Valley and I just about popped him.  I explained to him that moving to the Valley would be a huge step down for SLU, and he just rolled his eyes.

It is absolutely a thing that SLU outsiders, even in St. Louis and members of the media, think that SLU doesn't deserve to take the step up that we want SLU to take.  They don't care about finishing top ten in the country recently.  They feel like that level of success should be reserved for Mizzou and Illinois in this region.  Screw them all!

I have had similar experiences with friends who are graduates of Mizzou, Illinois, and Ohio State...the profound ignorance is what is most infuriating. 

[prebilliken]

4 minutes ago, Bizziken said:

I have had similar experiences with friends who are graduates of Mizzou, Illinois, and Ohio State...the profound ignorance is what is most infuriating. 

I think a lot of this is driven by a certain sense of privilege and denial. All of my cousins and my Uncles went to U of I, my Dad only didn't because his family moved his senior year away from Illinois. They are college ball junkies, some of them even went to SLU law, they are well aware of SLU's success. 

I think their mentality is driven by an annoyance that a B1G program is being out recruited and often seeing less success than a lil ol A10 program at a private school. Its not that they aren't aware of SLU's success, its annoyance. And these are my cousins and uncles, I love them to death. 

We could win a National Championship, reveal the banner the next season, and Mizzou still wouldn't put us on the schedule. 

[615Billiken]

9 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

I'm friends with a Mizzou grad.  We were at a bar watching the Blues game and talking about college hoops.  He mentioned that he thought SLU should join the Mo Valley and I just about popped him.  I explained to him that moving to the Valley would be a huge step down for SLU, and he just rolled his eyes.

It is absolutely a thing that SLU outsiders, even in St. Louis and members of the media, think that SLU doesn't deserve to take the step up that we want SLU to take.  They don't care about finishing top ten in the country recently.  They feel like that level of success should be reserved for Mizzou and Illinois in this region.  Screw them all!

I am an incoming student from outside of the region, but have followed SLU and this forum for about 4 years now. Because of this, I think that I have developed a good perspective of both sides and have not yet become myopic about SLU's reality in the college basketball landscape. 

I think that historically and because of recent years SLU is viewed nationally as a MO Valley quality team that had a recent good spell. That is where the results place us. 

Now from a fan perspective, I think we see everything the school has to offer (academics, facilities, home town glory for local players, etc.) all the time and see ourselves as deserving of better. 

I think both perspectives have truth to them and we should instead focus on our potential. I believe when Travis Ford took the job he spoke to SLU's hidden potential. We are not Big East material, but have the potential to be. This potential has to be developed and we have to have years of consistent success.

[Coach314]

2 hours ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Have you ever watched Villanova play 

1 hour ago, Bills_06 said:

I wouldn't paint you as a Mizzou lover necessarily but there is no doubt you view SLU as an inferior program that top local kids shouldn't go to.  Your post history shows this and you can try and act neutral but you aren't.  You will come and talk about SLU losing next year so Goodwin should trasfer before rosters are even set or kids will want to go to better programs just because they get an offer.  That's great but that doesn't mean it's whats best for them.  

Please, continue acting like all you care about is what's best for the kids when in reality, all you want is the kids to go to programs you view better than SLU.  

Lot of speculation going on in your post.  I thought that was frowned upon in here.  Carry on though...i find it amusing.

[Coach314]

58 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

I'm one of those other voices who has raised concerns. Ford has a history of redshirting high upside players when minutes are scarce. If Pickett comes and the minutes aren't there, I hope he is one of those players. I seriously doubt more than 9 guys get double digit minutes this year. Again, that's Ford history when he has a good team.

Be cautious of what you type.  Some people don't want to hear such nonsense. ?

[Bills_06]

5 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

 

Well I speculate on what a guy who posts on a message board thinks.  You speculate ways for an 18 year old kid to find out he made the wrong decision about which school he decided to go to before he even steps foot on the campus for the summer.  

[Coach314]

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Today we have 11 on scholarship.  I classify six as Wings / Ballhandlers and five as Power / Paint players.  Ford likely will run 3 of the first and 2 of the later group out there most of the time.  So there is no imbalance today.  Adding one in each category still makes the numbers work. 

Ok.  Now we are talking basketball.  So in your opinion what would the starting five be?