Bills By 40 Posted November 28, 2022 Share Posted November 28, 2022 Perspective courtesy of a bored MBM stuck in the office: SLUMedBilliken15, slufanskip and dlarry like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraz Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 As a 2018 Mizzou grad, I have supported Billikens basketball over the Tigers almost to a fault. I grew up watching Marquee Perry, Reggie Bryant, Kevin Lisch and the like. I maintain that it’s impossible to root for both teams since we target the same recruits. There is a running joke in our friend group that I act as if “this is the year” every year. Only to be left out of the tournament, finish 4th in the A10, and get bounced in the NIT. Today, I was told Mizzou is better than SLU. Mizzou, 7-0 and receiving top 25 votes this week, have wins over D1 Powerhouses Penn, Lindenwood, Southern Indiana, SIUE, Mississippi Valley State, Coastal Carolina, and Houston Baptist. The road does get harder. I know that SLU is a better basketball team but it’s becoming harder and harder to get behind them as we can’t get over the hump. EVER! I guess this is just reality. I have no interest in “tampering expectations” or not watching with as much intent or interest. I hope we can still have a special season. Rant over CenHudDude, majerus mojo, Old guy and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraz Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 Also BB40, favored in the next 17 feels like a misprint. I guess at Dayton would be the next underdog spot. Have to figure we’ll drop a few, but looking decent if take care of business Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlarry Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 34 minutes ago, Fraz said: As a 2018 Mizzou grad, I have supported Billikens basketball over the Tigers almost to a fault. I grew up watching Marquee Perry, Reggie Bryant, Kevin Lisch and the like. I maintain that it’s impossible to root for both teams since we target the same recruits. There is a running joke in our friend group that I act as if “this is the year” every year. Only to be left out of the tournament, finish 4th in the A10, and get bounced in the NIT. Today, I was told Mizzou is better than SLU. Mizzou, 7-0 and receiving top 25 votes this week, have wins over D1 Powerhouses Penn, Lindenwood, Southern Indiana, SIUE, Mississippi Valley State, Coastal Carolina, and Houston Baptist. The road does get harder. I know that SLU is a better basketball team but it’s becoming harder and harder to get behind them as we can’t get over the hump. EVER! I guess this is just reality. I have no interest in “tampering expectations” or not watching with as much intent or interest. I hope we can still have a special season. Rant over Don’t let them fool ya. Even the Post Dispatch’s Jeff Gordon is still ranking The Bills over Mizzou and he is a huge Mizzou honk. SLUMedBilliken15, Fraz and billiken_roy like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennis_w Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 hour ago, Fraz said: As a 2018 Mizzou grad, I have supported Billikens basketball over the Tigers almost to a fault. I grew up watching Marquee Perry, Reggie Bryant, Kevin Lisch and the like. I maintain that it’s impossible to root for both teams since we target the same recruits. There is a running joke in our friend group that I act as if “this is the year” every year. Only to be left out of the tournament, finish 4th in the A10, and get bounced in the NIT. Today, I was told Mizzou is better than SLU. Mizzou, 7-0 and receiving top 25 votes this week, have wins over D1 Powerhouses Penn, Lindenwood, Southern Indiana, SIUE, Mississippi Valley State, Coastal Carolina, and Houston Baptist. The road does get harder. I know that SLU is a better basketball team but it’s becoming harder and harder to get behind them as we can’t get over the hump. EVER! I guess this is just reality. I have no interest in “tampering expectations” or not watching with as much intent or interest. I hope we can still have a special season. Rant over mizzou hasnt played a team with a pulse yet, next two weeks will tell if they are real Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquinas Posted November 29, 2022 Author Share Posted November 29, 2022 Right now, we are a little better than we were last year. Expectations this year of being significantly better depend largely on the recovery of Perkins. If memory serves me right, it took Erin C the better part of 2 months to return to form after sitting out a year, and he wasn't recovering from an injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 hour ago, dennis_w said: mizzou hasnt played a team with a pulse yet, next two weeks will tell if they are real Mi$$ouri still has a team? i just assumed since their best player from last year came to the billikens the tiger$ folded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennis_w Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 19 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: Mi$$ouri still has a team? i just assumed since their best player from last year came to the billikens the tiger$ folded. they actually are fun to watch playing the weakest schedule possible, wichita st. tonight is the best opponent they have so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 dennis the next time i watch mi$$ouri will be in person in the first of a 2 - 1 series. i.e. 2 at chaifetz one on a neutral floor. only way we should agree to play them. we have nothing to gain playing them. BuiltFordBills, dennis_w, bauman and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 14 hours ago, Fraz said: I have no interest in “tampering expectations” or not watching with as much intent or interest. I hope we can still have a special season. Hate to go all Thicks on you but.........please don't go tampering with your expectations. Occasionally you might have to temper them. Anyone getting on the undefeated Mizzou bandwagon is in for a rude awakening......and soon..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 hour ago, Aquinas said: Right now, we are a little better than we were last year. Expectations this year of being significantly better depend largely on the recovery of Perkins. If memory serves me right, it took Erin C the better part of 2 months to return to form after sitting out a year, and he wasn't recovering from an injury. You're right, we are just slightly better than last year. Perkins injury isn't the only reason why we thought we would be further along than we are. We thought we would cut down on TO's We thought Perkins would be further along We thought Parker would come in and be instant offense, or at least hit a single 3 We though the 5 spot would be better than it is We thought defense would be better than it is bauman and billiken_roy like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennis_w Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 28 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: dennis the next time i watch mi$$ouri will be in person in the first of a 2 - 1 series. i.e. 2 at chaifetz one on a neutral floor. only way we should agree to play them. we have nothing to gain playing them. i understand, i live near columbia and feel i need to have someone to root against when all around me are saying how good the tigers are, i am no fan of mizzou basketball, go billikens billiken_roy likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 2 minutes ago, wgstl said: You're right, we are just slightly better than last year. Perkins injury isn't the only reason why we thought we would be further along than we are. We thought we would cut down on TO's We thought Perkins would be further along We thought Parker would come in and be instant offense, or at least hit a single 3 We though the 5 spot would be better than it is We thought defense would be better than it is Last year's team had no chance against a top 25 team on the road. Bills By 40 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 minute ago, wgstl said: You're right, we are just slightly better than last year. Perkins injury isn't the only reason why we thought we would be further along than we are. We thought we would cut down on TO's We thought Perkins would be further along We thought Parker would come in and be instant offense, or at least hit a single 3 We though the 5 spot would be better than it is We thought defense would be better than it is And the only game thus far that I feel bad about is Auburn. Should've beaten them. There are not many teams that would've beat Maryland on the night we lost to them. Maybe Majerus could've come up with something but we were just overwhelmed. Your items about Perkins and Parker are the story here. We thought we'd be raining threes down on opponents, leaving Okoro and Forrester room to work inside. It obviously hasn't worked out that way especially with Parker doing his Rashad Williams impression....... billiken_roy and bauman like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills By 40 Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 14 hours ago, Fraz said: Also BB40, favored in the next 17 feels like a misprint. I guess at Dayton would be the next underdog spot. Have to figure we’ll drop a few, but looking decent if take care of business Favored means statistically likely. It is not statistically likely that we do win all 17, just that one by one we have better odds than the opponent. And yes that Dayton game is the first where we're the underdog, but that could very well change by the time we get there. 14 hours ago, Fraz said: 1) I maintain that it’s impossible to root for both teams since we target the same recruits. 2) There is a running joke in our friend group that I act as if “this is the year” every year. Only to be left out of the tournament, finish 4th in the A10, and get bounced in the NIT. 3) Today, I was told Mizzou is better than SLU. Mizzou, 7-0 and receiving top 25 votes this week, have wins over D1 Powerhouses Penn, Lindenwood, Southern Indiana, SIUE, Mississippi Valley State, Coastal Carolina, and Houston Baptist. The road does get harder. 4) I know that SLU is a better basketball team but it’s becoming harder and harder to get behind them as we can’t get over the hump. EVER! I guess this is just reality. 5) I have no interest in “tampering expectations” or not watching with as much intent or interest. I hope we can still have a special season. Rant over 1) Correct. I appreciate this take. 2) I have the same issue with my buddies, most of whom I've been close to since 2016 - and the majority aren't even Mizzou fans. They all kind of want to be SLU fans, come to games with me, etc, but you're right it's hard to fully reel them in until we reach the next level. "Reaching the next level" is more of an optics thing, I truly think we're there - or at least banging our head on the glass ceiling. My rebuttal is that I've told them every year how much better we'll be than the year before - which is true. Every year since Ford came to SLU we've been better than the year before, especially from year 1 to year 2 and year 2 to year 3. Year 4 was poised to be the best yet before, ya know, Covid. Year 5 reassured that year 4 was going to be great before, ya know, Covid, until what happened? Covid screwed us even harder. Year 6 was a major setback in terms of roster, and then we doubled down on that setback when we lost JP. We all know whether we'll admit it or not that we majorly outperformed the readjusted expectations set when we lost JP so I still consider that a major success. This year looked like - and still does - it could be the best year of Ford's tenure, both on paper and in reality. 3) I've heard it too, plenty have. They fall higher in some rankings because of their meaningless record and inflated offensive numbers. If we played nobody but the Evansville's and Paul Quinn's of the world we'd have an undefeated record and multiple 100 point games too. The moral of the story is they're only 5 spots ahead of us in KenPom despite being 7-0, but looking deeper they haven't defeated a single team in the top-150, only won by two possessions versus the best two teams they have played (156th and 192nd, both at home), and have a strength of schedule of 297 !!! That's embarrassing. They have their first real test tonight @ 85th ranked Wichita State and I hope every one of us MBM's is tuned in and rooting for their failure. I fully believe they'll have 4 losses, at least 1-2 more than us, by the turn of the calendar year. 4) We've established ourselves as a nationally relevant mid-major program and have been in the tournament or at least in the conversation each of the last four years. Had Covid not happened, objectively and unbiasedly speaking, we would have had at least 1 more and likely 2 more tournament appearances. Because we can't technically credit Ford for tournament appearances in those two years, the least we can do is not fault him for the lack thereof, and in that scope we are left with what? 1 tournament appearance in 4 years, two of which were major rebuilding years with significant improvement in both, and the third of which we were a bubble team. The glass ceiling is growing tired of us banging our heads on it...patience. I'm with you, it's tough, but look at the trending direction. Future is very bright. 5) You shouldn't tamper expectations, I know I'm not and I hope nobody's asking you to. I still expect us to be a tournament team and I still expect us to be much better in 3-5 years than we were 3-5 years ago. That's all we can ask for. Rant over Fraz, shempie and dennis_w like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said: Last year's team had no chance against a top 25 team on the road. While you're not wrong, I'll be shocked if auburn remains ranked. Maryland was a legit T25, Auburn so far is not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said: Last year's team had no chance against a top 25 team on the road. Last year’s team won at Boise St. Boise St finished the season ranked 23 in the AP poll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 minute ago, brianstl said: Last year’s team won at Boise St. Boise St finished the season ranked 23 in the AP poll. The Boise St team we beat had losses to UC Irvine and Cal State Bakersfield. They were not a top 25 team at the time in fact or in performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said: The Boise St team we beat had losses to UC Irvine and Cal State Bakersfield. They were not a top 25 team at the time in fact or in performance. But they were great right after the played us and ran off a 13 game winning streak? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills By 40 Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 12 minutes ago, wgstl said: You're right, we are just slightly better than last year. Perkins injury isn't the only reason why we thought we would be further along than we are. We thought we would cut down on TO's We thought Perkins would be further along We thought Parker would come in and be instant offense, or at least hit a single 3 We though the 5 spot would be better than it is We thought defense would be better than it is I don't think it's fair to expect of any these by November. Mid-december, pre-conference play? Sure. Perkins is showing improvement, at least physically, game over game which is all we can ask for - we never expected him to be 100% before what, January? We (and he) have (has) time. We haven't cut down as much as we'd like to on turnovers but it is better. Yuri is averaging about 1 less turnover per game already, despite playing the toughest schedule he's ever seen at SLU. The team itself is down from 12.57 TO/G through 7 games last year to 11.28 TO/G through 7 games...and our schedule is FAR MORE DIFFICULT. How much more difficult? SOS today - 21st. SOS on 11/29/21 - 165. Thinking Parker would be instantly adjusted to the D1 game was unfair, though I admit I might've been guilty myself I think we can agree that was a blue kool-aid side effect. Not to mention we've given him the hardest stretch of schedule he may ever see in his time at SLU. I agree I'd have liked more out of him in our lesser games but again, let's circle back to him in a month. Perkins only averaged 6 points per game through his first 7 and again, he didn't have to do that with the 21st ranked schedule in the nation. The 5 spot has time. It's still not out of the question to see Cisse develop into a 5-6MPG player especially against lesser competition, Okoro isn't the Okoro we know he can be yet, and Forester still has time to acclimate to his new team. Our 5 spot today is still better than it was - at least as good - at this point last year. Defense is better than it was IMO. If for no reason other than what we did with Memphis and at Auburn. 3 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said: And the only game thus far that I feel bad about is Auburn. Should've beaten them. There are not many teams that would've beat Maryland on the night we lost to them. Maybe Majerus could've come up with something but we were just overwhelmed. Your items about Perkins and Parker are the story here. We thought we'd be raining threes down on opponents, leaving Okoro and Forrester room to work inside. It obviously hasn't worked out that way especially with Parker doing his Rashad Williams impression....... Before the game? We should not have expected to beat Auburn. During the first half? We should've expected to hang with Auburn. During the second half? We were hanging with Auburn, good. Late in the second half, yeah, we should've been able to hang on to that lead, but I don't think it's fair to say covering the spread and losing by less than two possessions against a top-13 team on their home court is the failure some are acting it is. I don't think Majerus could've even beaten Maryland that day. Maybe limit them to winning by less than 30, but where Majerus excelled in defense he lacked in offense. We still wouldn't have been more efficient or productive on that side of the court as them. I think Maryland could've beaten anybody in the nation that day. I sound like a broken record, but, let's circle back in a month or so. It's too early to be thinking we've hit or missed expectations, especially with the schedule we've played. Not fair. Rashad already had three years of proven success at the D1 level. Give Sincere time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 46 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said: Hate to go all Thicks on you but.........please don't go tampering with your expectations. Occasionally you might have to temper them. Anyone getting on the undefeated Mizzou bandwagon is in for a rude awakening......and soon..... What happen to Thicks? slufanskip likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 1 minute ago, Bills By 40 said: Perkins is showing improvement, at least physically, game over game which is all we can ask for - we never expected him to be 100% before what, January? We (and he) have (has) time. This is true, although its happening incredibly slowly. 1 minute ago, Bills By 40 said: We haven't cut down as much as we'd like to on turnovers but it is better. Yuri is averaging about 1 less turnover per game already, despite playing the toughest schedule he's ever seen at SLU. The team itself is down from 12.57 TO/G through 7 games last year to 11.28 TO/G through 7 games...and our schedule is FAR MORE DIFFICULT. How much more difficult? SOS today - 21st. SOS on 11/29/21 - 165. I'm too lazy to look it up, but are we forcing TO's at a slower pace than last year? If so, then I don't really see it being much of a positive than we cut down by 1 TO per game. 2 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said: Thinking Parker would be instantly adjusted to the D1 game was unfair, though I admit I might've been guilty myself I think we can agree that was a blue kool-aid side effect. Not to mention we've given him the hardest stretch of schedule he may ever see in his time at SLU. I agree I'd have liked more out of him in our lesser games but again, let's circle back to him in a month. Perkins only averaged 6 points per game through his first 7 and again, he didn't have to do that with the 21st ranked schedule in the nation. I didn't see Parker being much of anything this year, I never trust JUCO's their first year. But I did expect to see at least 30% from 3 at this point in the season. 4 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said: The 5 spot has time. It's still not out of the question to see Cisse develop into a 5-6MPG player especially against lesser competition, Okoro isn't the Okoro we know he can be yet, and Forester still has time to acclimate to his new team. Our 5 spot today is still better than it was - at least as good - at this point last year. Defense is better than it was IMO. If for no reason other than what we did with Memphis and at Auburn. The thing about the 5 spot, we knew it would dominate A10, but we needed it for the OOC. I think the defense is bad, with signs that it can be very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 28 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said: The moral of the story is they're only 5 spots ahead of us in KenPom despite being 7-0, but looking deeper they haven't defeated a single team in the top-150, only won by two possessions versus the best two teams they have played (156th and 192nd, both at home), and have a strength of schedule of 297 !!! That's embarrassing. You are giving Mizzou too much credit here with their schedule. KenPom has their current non-conference SOS as 361st in the nation. That's 3rd from the bottom as KenPom lists 363 teams. Bills By 40 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 11 minutes ago, brianstl said: But they were great right after the played us and ran off a 13 game winning streak? Kudos to Boise State for turning their season around because they certainly sucked up until then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 I've watched a few mizzou games this year. My friends are drunk as hell off the kool-aid, most saying they should - at worst - split the illinois ku games. I think their offense will make them fun to watch, but they're far from being a good team. Probably end up around 16-18 wins on the year thanks to the schedule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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