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TF interview with Frank

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5 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

I know French and Goodwin missed some bunnies last year but I didn't realize they missed 72 of them 🙂

some games i swear we missed 72 bunnies in that game.

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1 hour ago, Sheltiedave said:

Between French and Goodwin, last year they went a combined 109/247 from the charity stripe. That is 44.1%.

If they hit at 65% and 75%, we would have averaged an extra 2.1 points a game, less points scored from offensive rebound score possessions from the bricks.

This year they are going to be upgraded to the first and second offensive choices, rather than the third and fourth options. If they don’t markedly improve from the line, every team in the country will be coached to foul foul foul them. Can’t get any better defense than giving up a forecasted 0.44 point per possession rate.

This is the driving force for Ford to rapidly develop a beautiful game, bring Collins in rapidly, and get Hargrove, Jimerson, and Perkins up to speed before conference play. We have little choice but to push offense development over what normally would be defensive rotation sets.

Goodwin hit 69.1% of his free tosses his Fr year.  So we are really looking at getting back to his freshman form and wiping last season's 51.1% off the map.  I'll take 70% from Mr. Goodwin and keep him on the floor at crunch time.

Conversely, Mr. French hit 36.4% his first season and 34.9% last season.  Fairly consistent, unfortunately.

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10 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Goodwin hit 69.1% of his free tosses his Fr year.  So we are really looking at getting back to his freshman form and wiping last season's 51.1% off the map.  I'll take 70% from Mr. Goodwin and keep him on the floor at crunch time.

Conversely, Mr. French hit 36.4% his first season and 34.9% last season.  Fairly consistent, unfortunately.

i've said it before and i stil question this.   Ford was an incredible shooter in college.   46% for his college career from the field, 42% from the 3 point line, and 88% from the free throw line.  His senior year he shot 91% free throws.

so how is it he hasnt been able to translate that skill to his billiken players thus far?   i understand the student has to want to learn, but there isnt an indication that i am aware of that goodwin and french are bad students?   

 

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2 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i've said it before and i stil question this.   Ford was an incredible shooter in college.   46% for his college career from the field, 42% from the 3 point line, and 88% from the free throw line.  His senior year he shot 91% free throws.

so how is it he hasnt been able to translate that skill to his billiken players thus far?   i understand the student has to want to learn, but there isnt an indication that i am aware of that goodwin and french are bad students?   

 

Believe their issues are more mental than physical.  Teach form, technique, pace, routine, boost confidence... but not sure what more a coach can do. 

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Unfortunately, and this is absolutely correct, there are things that can be done regularly by a coach, but cannot be fully taught to players. It happens with the market as well, rules and measurements work reasonably well, but the fine points of doing it are very hard to pass down to someone else.

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well all i have to refer to is the job soderberg did teaching tommie liddell to shoot.  as a freshman he shot under 10% from the 3 point line.   Soderberg spent the entire summer breaking down his shot and he never shot under 34% from the 3 point line thereafter and had a high of 45% the season after his "classes".  he improved his free throws from a freshman low of 62% to a 76% the season after "classes".   so pardon me if i dont buy the all on the player line.   it is pretty obvious the time line of liddell suggests quite the coincidence.  

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Roy, they are bad students at the charity stripe.

A free throw is first about the release point, repetitive mechanics, and having your body still. They both have way too much play, and little consistency. You vary your release point by three inches, let your elbow fly, change the shot trajectory, reposition your hands, and move a large part of your body, your shot will vary by a foot every time. Tommie learned this, and he learned to square up, not float, and shoot with a quiet body. It works quite well.

They both are going to have about 200 free throws projected for this season. That hits 170 pts, 170/400, which will knock us down by 1.9 ppg compared to Bess and Isabell going 237/314 last season. We are going to lose three more games this year due solely to projected piss poor FT shooting.

if they really spend quality time and hit both their metrics, 400 ft x 70% would generate 280 pts, not the miserly 170 pts.

Forget about the missed bunnies, it is the missed free throws that will kill us.

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12 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

well all i have to refer to is the job soderberg did teaching tommie liddell to shoot.  as a freshman he shot under 10% from the 3 point line.   Soderberg spent the entire summer breaking down his shot and he never shot under 34% from the 3 point line thereafter and had a high of 45% the season after his "classes".  he improved his free throws from a freshman low of 62% to a 76% the season after "classes".   so pardon me if i dont buy the all on the player line.   it is pretty obvious the time line of liddell suggests quite the coincidence.  

How come there are professionals in the NBA with personal shooting coaches who are still poor free throw shooters? Sometimes shooting instruction takes but most times it doesn't.  It's one of the great mysteries of the universe. 

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23 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

Believe their issues are more mental than physical.  Teach form, technique, pace, routine, boost confidence... but not sure what more a coach can do. 

It is mental. I wonder if they have thought about a sport shrink. I know I could use one for my putting stroke. 

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4 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

How come there are professionals in the NBA with personal shooting coaches who are still poor free throw shooters? Sometimes shooting instruction takes but most times it doesn't.  It's one of the great mysteries of the universe. 

did the likes of shaq have a personal shooting coach?   i dont know.   just asking.   without looking i would say he did not and had no interest in it since his other attributes did him fine in his hall of fame career.   the billikens we are collectively concerned about are not shaq.   might not even play professional basketball.   especially if they dont improve their weaknesses.   they need to improve in their actual basketball skills because they are not 7 foot tall, 300 lbs of natural god given muscle.   

regardless, the likes of our billikens (maybe with the exception of jimmmerson) they all could use a shooting coach.   a shooting coach with a history of supreme success shooting the basketball like travis ford.

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21 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

How come there are professionals in the NBA with personal shooting coaches who are still poor free throw shooters? Sometimes shooting instruction takes but most times it doesn't.  It's one of the great mysteries of the universe. 

This... Shaq had multiple shooting coaches lol

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Ahearn is a great mechanics shooting coach.

The mental part is reinforcement for the physical, but you first need to understand the mechanics of your shot.

It is a lot like playing golf. There are a lot of pro players from other sports, but the ones who have great mechanics(Jordan, Elway, Quinn) are the consistently good golfers.

the mechanics comes first, then the touch, then the confidence game. Nick Anderson is one of the most famous NBA players to ever develop the free throw yips...he lost his mojo.

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23 minutes ago, willie said:

It is mental. I wonder if they have thought about a sport shrink. I know I could use one for my putting stroke. 

Anyone remember Mark Dressler? Great local player, played for Grawer at DeSmet, no issues in high school at the FT line, struggled at Mizzou, Norm Stewart tried everything, coaches, hypnotized by therapist...nothing seemed to work...

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Shaq was particularly miserable, like Chamberlain, because they were shooting down at the hoop. The physics of their parabola was radically different.

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I think Goodwin will shoot better from the line this year.

As for French, I say you bring in Rick Barry and teach him to shoot FTs underhanded.

Swallow your pride and do what will make you a better player.

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10 minutes ago, Sheltiedave said:

Shaq was particularly miserable, like Chamberlain, because they were shooting down at the hoop. The physics of their parabola was radically different.

Another reason to raise the hoop to 11 foot👍🏼

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14 minutes ago, Sheltiedave said:

Shaq was particularly miserable, like Chamberlain, because they were shooting down at the hoop. The physics of their parabola was radically different.

i call b.s. on your physics excuse.   i would bet durrant has as long if not greater wing span.   he shoots 90% with roughly the same "parabola" as shaq.   

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It's mental at this point for French. He's clearly is uncomfortable at the line. Actually, I think he's a little terrified he won't even hit the rim. Could be he knows all eyes in the house are now focused on him alone, and he just gets the yips due to nerves. Block out the crowd, Hasahn. 

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Big improvements in shooting from years 2 or 3, to the next are uncommon. Bess was exceptional, in going from a poor shooter to a good shooter. I think FT shooting got in Goodwins head, I am hopeful he can shake that off, and be an average shooter. Hopefully our new shooters will do well and that success will rub off.

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50 minutes ago, Aquinas said:

Big improvements in shooting from years 2 or 3, to the next are uncommon. Bess was exceptional, in going from a poor shooter to a good shooter. I think FT shooting got in Goodwins head, I am hopeful he can shake that off, and be an average shooter. Hopefully our new shooters will do well and that success will rub off.

Ya just need both of them to get off to good starts from the line so they can get the monkey off their backs and it becomes less of a talking point.

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Roy, google shaq free throws

google Durant free throws

on YouTube.

Watch the commentators diagram and talk about Shaq and his line drive, or his right hand moving sideways. Watch Durant shoot a baby set jump shot - same motion as his three.

A shot put line drive vs an arcing set shot...voila the difference.

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10 hours ago, Sheltiedave said:

Last year was a total aberration because we had the best defender in the conference.

We still have the best defender in the league....THATCH.

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French was on 550 this pm.  Yes, he has been practicing FT.  Yes, he knows that he is leaving points on the floor.  Yes, he is ready to be a leader.  Yes, he is excited about the progress Goodwin and Thatch are making. Yes, he is excited about every newcomer. Yes, he thinks the 'outsiders' are selling this team short.

But nice to hear him.  This is the first time I have heard him interviewed.  A good speaker and a good representative of SLU.

 

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