SLU Men's Basketball Head Coaching Candidates

[DOC]

8 hours ago, billikenfan05 said:

Do people normally get congratulated or job well done'd for correcting their mistake? They deserve appreciation on a macro level for their contributions, but nobody really deserves any sort of praise for the Travis Ford contract extension. Now if someone new showed up to help with the buyout, I'd like to shake their hand and thank them personally.

So now you’re saying the extension was the boosters fault as well. Interesting after reading you say 100 times it was all Mays fault. And I didn’t say anyone deserved praise for the extension, but to those who paid the buyout/bailout. Jesus. 

[cheeseman]

2 minutes ago, DOC said:

So now you’re saying the extension was the boosters fault as well. Interesting after reading you say 100 times it was all Mays fault. And I didn’t say anyone deserved praise for the extension, but to those who paid the buyout/bailout. Jesus. 

I am not speaking for billikefan05 but I would think that May went to these big donors and made the case for extending Ford and paying him so much.  I doubt seriously that any of the donors called May up and said let's give Ford an out sized contract.  I don't blame the donors except for the ones who derailed those willing to buy Ford out last year.  May was behind the wheel and he got the gas to drive us into a ditch.

[slu92]

1 hour ago, cheeseman said:

I am not speaking for billikefan05 but I would think that May went to these big donors and made the case for extending Ford and paying him so much.  I doubt seriously that any of the donors called May up and said let's give Ford an out sized contract.  I don't blame the donors except for the ones who derailed those willing to buy Ford out last year.  May was behind the wheel and he got the gas to drive us into a ditch.

I hate defending Chris May, he should be fired, however he has no authority to tell big donors, like Chaifetz, what to do. He is their little gopher, only reason it explains why he hasn’t been fired over all these years. Chaifetz mainly and a few others really run things and let May take all the hits for them. Again, same guys who got slu in this mess 2x are now tasked for a third time to fix it. Billionaires don’t fire themselves. Hopefully they get it right this time. Fingers crossed!

[slu92]

1 hour ago, cheeseman said:

I am not speaking for billikefan05 but I would think that May went to these big donors and made the case for extending Ford and paying him so much.  I doubt seriously that any of the donors called May up and said let's give Ford an out sized contract.  I don't blame the donors except for the ones who derailed those willing to buy Ford out last year.  May was behind the wheel and he got the gas to drive us into a ditch.

For sure May went to donors and told them Ford is leaving we gotta do this and this to keep him. I still say a guy like Chaifetz, who wants badly to be an nba owner, should’ve questioned that contract/decision. Nobody in their right mind was worried about losing Ford. Worst contract ever. I just think May is a puppet, that’s it. He is not telling anyone to do anything. He does as he’s told. 

[Pistol]

2 hours ago, DOC said:

Schertz has a proven record of success at the college level. He has 4 national championships. Ahearn hasn’t even coached a college game. 
Schertz coached the #1 offense in the country. Ahearn did not. 
Schertz is on most everyone’s short list. He is a hot commodity. Ahearn is only on a few boosters short list. 
There’s no comparison between what the 2 bring to the table. None. So why do you think Ahearn deserves Schertz money? He doesn’t. 

I mean, I agree with all of this, which is why I'd hire Schertz and not even interview Ahearn.

I just don't think the dollars would ultimately be as far apart as you had said. My reason is more that SLU would overpay Ahearn - i.e. "This is the range we pay our head coach" - and not that Schertz would be underpaid relative to our competition.

[cheeseman]

92 - I am sure big donors who have a good relationship with May do listen to him.  They usually have people who do all the leg work and present them with a plan.  They either accept or reject the plan.  Obviously they accepted May's plan.  Do big money people always make the right decision of course not but this is how the world works those with the money get to dance and those who don't sit along the wall.  All of us are very indebted to the big donors but like always, we are buffeted by their decisions and their confidence in May.  

[slu72]

We should all be thankful SLU has a number of whales that see the importance athletics plays in the overall functioning of the school. For far too long we’ve screwed up the hiring or retention of coaches. Spoon showed us how popular a winning program could become in the community. Our response was to make him buy his own ice cream cones. Majerus does the same and we reneged on the use of private aircraft. Ford, a somewhat splashy hire, does not meet expectations but gets all the benefits we denied our two greatest modern era coaches. Then they over reacted for the wrong guy. We need to get this one right, otherwise we may risk the whales turning off the spigot. Hopefully, Schertz is the right guy and we get ourselves a Mark Few and Randy Bennet type long term coach.

[slu92]

14 hours ago, Pistol said:

I mean, I agree with all of this, which is why I'd hire Schertz and not even interview Ahearn.

I just don't think the dollars would ultimately be as far apart as you had said. My reason is more that SLU would overpay Ahearn - i.e. "This is the range we pay our head coach" - and not that Schertz would be underpaid relative to our competition.

I bet Ahearn makes almost double if not more than Schertz does now. NBA assistant coaches make great money, that’s why jobs are so competitive and hard to get. So, just going off that what Ahearn would want vs what SLU would be willing to give him IF it came down to it, the two sides probably wouldn’t agree upon. I don’t think SLU pays Schertz anything close to what Ford was making as well. 

[slu92]

1 hour ago, cheeseman said:

92 - I am sure big donors who have a good relationship with May do listen to him.  They usually have people who do all the leg work and present them with a plan.  They either accept or reject the plan.  Obviously they accepted May's plan.  Do big money people always make the right decision of course not but this is how the world works those with the money get to dance and those who don't sit along the wall.  All of us are very indebted to the big donors but like always, we are buffeted by their decisions and their confidence in May.  

Great post. Sums it up. The big donors confidence in May is the blind spot. As long as he is involved with this third hire, I’m always hopeful but my expectations are low. Anything this guy touches falls apart. Schertz better negotiate a Ford like buyout and get everything in writing or else! I’ve said it before Chris May would derail Taylor Swifts career if he was her manager within a month. 

[gobillsgo]

9 minutes ago, slu72 said:

We should all be thankful SLU has a number of whales that see the importance athletics plays in the overall functioning of the school. For far too long we’ve screwed up the hiring or retention of coaches. Spoon showed us how popular a winning program could become in the community. Our response was to make him buy his own ice cream cones. Majerus does the same and we reneged on the use of private aircraft. Ford, a somewhat splashy hire, does not meet expectations but gets all the benefits we denied our two greatest modern era coaches. Then they over reacted for the wrong guy. We need to get this one right, otherwise we may risk the whales turning off the spigot. Hopefully, Schertz is the right guy and we get ourselves a Mark Few and Randy Bennet type long term coach.

I think we need to stop primarily looking for this type of coach, at least while we are still in the A10. If Schertz comes in and turns us into a regional hoops power and stays for 30 years, awesome. But there’s nothing wrong with consistently getting to VCU’s level either. Hiring up and comers and moving them on to bigger programs every 3-4 years after a few NCAA tournaments is nothing to scoff at for an A10 program. Obviously we’d all like more than that, but that’s a good place to start. I don’t think willingness to stay for 20+ years should be a main criteria in our coaching search. 

[TheA_Bomb]

16 minutes ago, slu72 said:

We should all be thankful SLU has a number of whales that see the importance athletics plays in the overall functioning of the school. 

I agree with this, our big money boosters have shown that they are willing to do what it takes to support SLU basketball.

During the season when Ford's termination was unclear I was upset that their part in this tied us to a losing coach for years because they would not pay the buyout.

However, they corrected part of the mistake and paid dearly for it.

Full correction requires a change of Athletic Director to help guide our dedicated big money boosters when it comes to hiring, extensions, market value.

But today after this firing I feel better about the boosters.

[billiken_roy]

29 minutes ago, slu92 said:

I bet Ahearn makes almost double if not more than Schertz does now. NBA assistant coaches make great money, that’s why jobs are so competitive and hard to get. So, just going off that what Ahearn would want vs what SLU would be willing to give him IF it came down to it, the two sides probably wouldn’t agree upon. I don’t think SLU pays Schertz anything close to what Ford was making as well. 

if ahearn is making so much money, why would he take a 50% pay cut?   

i sure hope whomever the billikens end up with as a coach we dont pay them anywhere close to what ford was getting paid.   since ford signed that contract it seems recruiting is less a factor by far.   i.e. ford's only redeeming quality meant nothing.   we need cash to pay players now.  so pay the new coach a max of $1m (maybe even less) and use the rest to assist with pay to play.  

[Soderball]

Just now, billiken_roy said:

if ahearn is making so much money, why would he take a 50% pay cut?   

i sure hope whomever the billikens end up with as a coach we dont pay them anywhere close to what ford was getting paid.   since ford signed that contract it seems recruiting is less a factor by far.   i.e. ford's only redeeming quality meant nothing.   we need cash to pay players now.  so pay the new coach a max of $1m (maybe even less) and use the rest to assist with pay to play.  

You still need a guy who can evaluate talent and knows what the market value for a given player/position is. He also has to be able to teach and get guys to buy in and play a system.

There's no obligation for the player to play good basketball after they got their cash.

I hear you i'm just saying you can't downplay the coach. There are new skills that are relevant now though. The salesmanship of Ford is worthless in the market now IMO. The coaching skills and budget management Schertz has shown at Lincoln and ISU are the hot skills to get.

[DeSmetBilliken]

6 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

if ahearn is making so much money, why would he take a 50% pay cut?   

 

That’s a small price to pay for Frank Cusumano to keep his primo access.

[slu92]

6 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

if ahearn is making so much money, why would he take a 50% pay cut?   

i sure hope whomever the billikens end up with as a coach we dont pay them anywhere close to what ford was getting paid.   since ford signed that contract it seems recruiting is less a factor by far.   i.e. ford's only redeeming quality meant nothing.   we need cash to pay players now.  so pay the new coach a max of $1m (maybe even less) and use the rest to assist with pay to play.  

I didn’t say he’s making a million dollars. Not sure how you came to that conclusion? Right now Schertz is making around $300k and Ahearn I’d imagine is making almost double that in NBA. 
 

What’s amazing is your buddy Chris May is gonna survive this deal. He messed up only major sport and one job and cost the boosters millions, in top of not getting us in Big East. May thought they were bluffing, conference would take SLU over anyone else bc of media market alone. Then he is allowed to stay. How him and Oberle have run that department into the ground is all going to come out very soon I hope. 

[slu92]

9 minutes ago, DeSmetBilliken said:

That’s a small price to pay for Frank Cusumano to keep his primo access.

If I was Ahearn I’d send Frank a restraining order asap. If Frank recommends you, might as well just quit on the spot. Curse of death. Same with King Kevin! Frank absolutely is a total joke now and a clown. Slaten I didn’t even know was still on, so chalk that up to if a tree falls does it make a sound if nobody is around. 

[wgstl]

4 minutes ago, slu92 said:

If I was Ahearn I’d send Frank a restraining order asap. If Frank recommends you, might as well just quit on the spot. Curse of death. Same with King Kevin! Frank absolutely is a total joke now and a clown. Slaten I didn’t even know was still on, so chalk that up to if a tree falls does it make a sound if nobody is around. 

If not for Frank, Aherns name would never even have been heard or thought of in the coaching search. 

[AGB91]

To be fair, Tom Holley and Rich Grawer brought up Blake's name on his show before Frank did.

[slu92]

10 minutes ago, wgstl said:

If not for Frank, Aherns name would never even have been heard or thought of in the coaching search. 

And that would’ve been good for him! I heard DeVries was number one target and he turned down job instantly because of athletic department reputation. It’s such a small network of coaches and agents. Nice to see word is out on May, even if slu leadership doesn’t want to face the facts. Hope it doesn’t deter Schertz! On a positive note, Majerus was able to win despite May. So there is hope. 

[cheeseman]

36 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

if ahearn is making so much money, why would he take a 50% pay cut?   

i sure hope whomever the billikens end up with as a coach we dont pay them anywhere close to what ford was getting paid.   since ford signed that contract it seems recruiting is less a factor by far.   i.e. ford's only redeeming quality meant nothing.   we need cash to pay players now.  so pay the new coach a max of $1m (maybe even less) and use the rest to assist with pay to play.  

I think someone posted that Schertz will make 1.1 or so next year at ISU.  If this is true he won't come for a million or even this same amount.  I would figure we will have to get up into the 1.8-2 million range to lure him away.  Now if he thinks the facilities and the upside is here over ISU then a little less may make it happen but not a million.

[billiken_roy]

11 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

I think someone posted that Schertz will make 1.1 or so next year at ISU.  If this is true he won't come for a million or even this same amount.  I would figure we will have to get up into the 1.8-2 million range to lure him away.  Now if he thinks the facilities and the upside is here over ISU then a little less may make it happen but not a million.

wow a 300% raise?   i'd like to see the wording on that contract!

[TheA_Bomb]

10 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

I think someone posted that Schertz will make 1.1 or so next year at ISU.  If this is true he won't come for a million or even this same amount.  I would figure we will have to get up into the 1.8-2 million range to lure him away.  Now if he thinks the facilities and the upside is here over ISU then a little less may make it happen but not a million.

It seemed like the ISU board was saying he makes $300k now and was offered $800k.  I would hope we offer $1.5mil range. That's squarely in line with the higher salaries of the conference. It gives room, if he does well to increase.

For reference A10 coach salaries

[cheeseman]

1 minute ago, TheA_Bomb said:

It seemed like the ISU board was saying he makes $300k now and was offered $800k.  I would hope we offer $1.5mil range. That's squarely in line with the higher salaries of the conference. It gives room, if he does well to increase.

For reference A10 coach salaries

Ok - I thought they said he was getting a 800K raise and he made like 350K but I could have misread it.  Actually what you are saying makes more sense.

[billikenfan05]

24 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

I think someone posted that Schertz will make 1.1 or so next year at ISU.  If this is true he won't come for a million or even this same amount.  I would figure we will have to get up into the 1.8-2 million range to lure him away.  Now if he thinks the facilities and the upside is here over ISU then a little less may make it happen but not a million.

I think you nailed it in your last sentence. That and more opportunity. Getting snubbed this year might not have only saved us money and trouble with other suitors, but also made a move more imperative in his mind. 

[Slu let the dogs out?]

12 minutes ago, TheA_Bomb said:

It seemed like the ISU board was saying he makes $300k now and was offered $800k.  I would hope we offer $1.5mil range. That's squarely in line with the higher salaries of the conference. It gives room, if he does well to increase.

For reference A10 coach salaries

This is correct. Some of the more knowledgeable posters on their board claim that Schertz has the updated contract ($800K) on his desk he just needs to sign it. SLU offering in the $1.5-2M range is what I was thinking.