Start of year starting lineup speculation

[SLU_Nick]

Crews would make Tatum "earn" it.  Ford understands that he had a major recruiting win and is not going to start any Crews recruit over a top 50 recruit. 

I do not understand the motivations of some on this board to expect us to compete for an at large bid this year AND have Roby, Bishop and Welmer play a role. 

I agree with Ace (replying to a post he made a couple pages back) in that Ford will be throwing everything we got to try to win in November and not try to ease anyone in.  Ford doesnt strike me as someone like RM who wants to install "the system" at the expense of wins.  Talent will play.  I hope Roby, Welmer and JB are ready to enthusiastically wave towels around. 

Henriquez, Bess, Goodwin, French, Foreman, and JJ on the court as much as possible. 

 

[Old guy]

1 hour ago, HenryB said:

My point was expressed very clearly in my original post - reread it.  That is some really twisted logic.  Perhaps you might want to change your handle to Pretzel !  In the future just respond to what people actually say rather that supporting your arguments by attributing statement to others that they have not said. Big Bill repeatedly has said how talented he thinks Goodwin is.  Everyone, including myself, feels the same way.  I would be shocked if Goodwin  doesn't start.  The simple point being made my Big Bill is that everyone, no matter how talented, still has to do it on the court.  

Hey Henry, you are new in the board and people are giving you a break. Pistol on the other hand has been around for a long time and is one of the most knowledgeable guys around in terms of recruiting and players. I think you are pushing this a bit too much and people will start ignoring you if you continue.

[HenryB]

8 minutes ago, Old guy said:

Hey Henry, you are new in the board and people are giving you a break. Pistol on the other hand has been around for a long time and is one of the most knowledgeable guys around in terms of recruiting and players. I think you are pushing this a bit too much and people will start ignoring you if you continue.

Hey Old guy.  I want to give you some instruction.  Do you know how to check user profiles?   Please check mine.  When you do, you will find out that I have been around since 2005. Does that make me a new guy?   Another classic example of someone running their mouth when they don't have a clue.  For the record, Old Guy, I don't give a rat's behind what you think.  I don't care if you or anyone ignores me.  I was very respectful to Pistol or did you miss where I called him the best and most respected poster on the board?  He by his own admission acknowledged that he was a smart ass to me.  I simply stated that it was wrong to attribute comments to another person that were demonstrably false.  He did that and I called him out on that.  If you don't like that....tough.  Since I have been around since 2005 and you have only been around since 2013 I will give you a break but if you continue being an ignoramus like you were in your post to me I will have to ignore you.  Get your facts right or don't post.

[bauman]

14 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

Crews would make Tatum "earn" it.  Ford understands that he had a major recruiting win and is not going to start any Crews recruit over a top 50 recruit. 

I do not understand the motivations of some on this board to expect us to compete for an at large bid this year AND have Roby, Bishop and Welmer play a role. 

I agree with Ace (replying to a post he made a couple pages back) in that Ford will be throwing everything we got to try to win in November and not try to ease anyone in.  Ford doesnt strike me as someone like RM who wants to install "the system" at the expense of wins.  Talent will play.  I hope Roby, Welmer and JB are ready to enthusiastically wave towels around. 

Henriquez, Bess, Goodwin, French, Foreman, and JJ on the court as much as possible. 

 

Nick, I like your 6, which includes my 5 starters, in the original post in this thread. As a number of people have stated, Bess might be a really good 6th man or first off the bench type.  I just wonder about not including Roby in the starting 5, based on what I perceive to be his stepping up as a team leader, much like a Captain on a hockey team.

Frankly, I don't much care about the nitpicking going on about Goodwin, being promised or needing to earn a starting spot.  No matter one's position on that "issue," Goodwin WILL start.

Since we can't id players anymore as a 1/2/3/4/5 or 4A/4B, I am confused on if a lineup of AD,JG,Bess (or Roby),French, Foreman (or Anthony) is a 3 guards or 3 forwards lineup-all because Ford made a comment in an interview that we are not going to play using those historic positions.  In spite of that TF comment about using those position identifiers, I think he knows what each player is.  Is Bess a guard or a forward?  All I think I know is that he will probably always be used as a #3.  Too small for a big forward (a #4A or 4B or a #4 or #5) and not skilled or a good enough perimeter shooter to be considered a PG/SG (or #1 or #2).  My point is we can get off on some of the dumbest arguments, somewhat unrelated to a thread topic, which have nothing to do with the price of milk!

[slufan13]

Ford just texted me saying Goodwin is really good at basketball 

[BIG BILL FAN]

2 hours ago, Pistol said:

THAT'S what this is about?

BBF said "You are insulting our Coach when you state that the amount of Goodwin's playing time is not dependent on his performance. He would also lose the the respect of the entire roster and coaching staff if he intentionally played Goodwin over a more deserving player."

To me, that sounds like he's saying that freshmen have to perform at a high level before getting a starting spot, so I said "Please name the player or players who is/are more deserving of a starting position than Goodwin. Why is the idea of a freshman starting so outrageous to you? Have you watched basketball in the past 30 years?"

I made the simple step in logic that no freshman can start under these (nonsensical) conditions because they have no record of performance at the college level yet. But my point is that he's already performed at a high level! That's why he's such a highly-rated recruit. Giving him the pitch I paraphrased earlier in the thread is how a program like SLU landed a recruit like him. It would be foolish not to give him a starting role with big minutes immediately - the role he was promised in his recruitment.

This is obvious, and yet I'm the one accused of making weak points and insulting the coach.

Jordan Goodwin is a talented player, but he is a 4 star not a 5 star recruit. He is most certainly not a one and done player. He's also an athlete coming off of a serious injury. Jordan's success has primarily come from dominating in the paint, his perimeter game is very suspect at this time. There is definitely going to be an adjustment period for him going up against much bigger and quicker interior players. That said you certainly have a right to your opinion, but why is it so difficult for you to accept that others have that right as well? 

[3star_recruit]

Wow, this thread turned wild and wooly in a hurry.  Goodwin is going to start.  The question is whether he does it as a point forward from the very beginning or as a point guard.  I suspect it will be the former.  Otherwise 1) Henriquez will be the only shooter on the floor and 2) defenses will exploit our lack of ballhandling.

[majerus mojo]

2 hours ago, HenryB said:

Hey Old guy.  I want to give you some instruction.  Do you know how to check user profiles?   Please check mine.  When you do, you will find out that I have been around since 2005. Does that make me a new guy?   Another classic example of someone running their mouth when they don't have a clue.  For the record, Old Guy, I don't give a rat's behind what you think.  I don't care if you or anyone ignores me.  I was very respectful to Pistol or did you miss where I called him the best and most respected poster on the board?  He by his own admission acknowledged that he was a smart ass to me.  I simply stated that it was wrong to attribute comments to another person that were demonstrably false.  He did that and I called him out on that.  If you don't like that....tough.  Since I have been around since 2005 and you have only been around since 2013 I will give you a break but if you continue being an ignoramus like you were in your post to me I will have to ignore you.  Get your facts right or don't post.

[Old guy]

HenryB please ignore me as soon as possible, do not delay please.

[STL Hoops Insider]

5 hours ago, brianstl said:

I don't know why people can't realize that Goodwin will start and get a lot of minutes for at least the first half of the season regardless of performance.  He is the first top flight recruit SLU has had in more than two decades.  Ford is going to start and play him no matter what.  The last thing Ford needs to be making the rounds in St Louis prep basketball scene is that he didn't give Goodwin a fair shot on a team that won 12 games the season before.  The guys that hold sway with the players we want to recruit don't give a sh!t about Goodwin having to earn it.  What they will see is a local kid who was one of top recruits in the country getting buried at what has been one of the worst programs in the country over the last 3 seasons.  Goodwin would have to prove beyond any doubt he can't play before he gets pulled from the starting line up.

Best post all day

[slufanskip]

13 hours ago, slufan13 said:

Ford just texted me saying Goodwin is really good at basketball 

Texted you? He calls me, I'm just sayin...

[slufanskip]

I can't imagine Goodwin won't be starting on day 1. Why? Because he will earn it at practice. Now some could say he didn't need to earn it as it was going to be his regardless, but that is irrelevant as he will earn it with his skill, hustle, and drive. So really claiming it's just his regardless is silly as it will be his because he deserves (has earned) it

[brianstl]

36 minutes ago, slufanskip said:

I can't imagine Goodwin won't be starting on day 1. Why? Because he will earn it at practice. Now some could say he didn't need to earn it as it was going to be his regardless, but that is irrelevant as he will earn it with his skill, hustle, and drive. So really claiming it's just his regardless is silly as it will be his because he deserves (has earned) it

I agree completely.  I think he will be our best all around player this season.

[CBFan]

10 hours ago, Old guy said:

HenryB please ignore me as soon as possible, do not delay please.

I ignored that guy a long time ago, he is unable to have any kind of civil debate and is a waste of your time.

 

[CBFan]

10 hours ago, STL Hoops Insider said:

Best post all day

+1 coach

[HenryB]

7 minutes ago, CBFan said:

I ignored that guy a long time ago, he is unable to have any kind of civil debate and is a waste of your time.

 

Lol....for someone who has ignored me you sure love to mention me.  Another classic example of someone who can dish it out but can't take it.  

[Box and Won]

Just checked this thread for the first time since early yesterday.

[Box and Won]

17 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

OK, who has a twitter account?  I don't or I would do this.

How about asking Jordan Goodwin if he wants a starting position given to him or if he wants to earn it?  Then copy and send to Coach Ford also.  Ask Coach if he also has guaranteed Gordon a starting spot the following season.  (If so, he will run out of guaranteed spots pretty quickly.)   Report back the responses.

Thanks.

 

[Old guy]

4 hours ago, CBFan said:

I ignored that guy a long time ago, he is unable to have any kind of civil debate and is a waste of your time.

 

Agree CBFan, I also ignored him already, but I do not want to make him suffer through my posts so I want him to ignore me too. He can then live happily in his own world.

[HenryB]

22 minutes ago, Old guy said:

Agree CBFan, I also ignored him already, but I do not want to make him suffer through my posts so I want him to ignore me too. He can then live happily in his own world.

Lol...the difference between me and you is that you have zero impact in my world period.  You condescendingly ran your mouth and lectured me that I was new on the board.  I then embarrassed you by countering your idiotic post with the fact that I have been around longer than both you and Pistol. Fact...I have been around since 2005, Pistol 2006, and you 2013.  You couldn't handle being exposed for the obnoxious fool you are and continue your ridiculous insults.  Since you seem to lack basic comprehension skills let me repeat what was stated very clearly earlier.  I don't give a rat's behind what you or anyone else thinks. I don't care who or who you don't ignore.  My original intent for participation in this thread was to simply defend a poster who was accused of something that he didn't say.  I was 100% correct in what I said...the posts prove it.  Again for the dimwitted....if you don't like that.....tough.  Again for the slow of learning....my happiness is totally unimpacted by you so please get over your alleged self importance.

[RiseAndGrind]

10 minutes ago, HenryB said:

Lol...the difference between me and you is that you have zero impact in my world period.  You condescendingly ran your mouth and lectured me that I was new on the board.  I then embarrassed you by countering your idiotic post with the fact that I have been around longer than both you and Pistol. Fact...I have been around since 2005, Pistol 2006, and you 2013.  You couldn't handle being exposed for the obnoxious fool you are and continue your ridiculous insults.  Since you seem to lack basic comprehension skills let me repeat what was stated very clearly earlier.  I don't give a rat's behind what you or anyone else thinks. I don't care who or who you don't ignore.  My original intent for participation in this thread was to simply defend a poster who was accused of something that he didn't say.  I was 100% correct in what I said...the posts prove it.  Again for the dimwitted....if you don't like that.....tough.  Again for the slow of learning....my happiness is totally unimpacted by you so please get over your alleged self importance.

Hey man it's just a message board 

[cgeldmacher]

We're wasting a lot of keystrokes over not much of an issue.  Some think Jordan should start immediately.  Some, myself included, think it would better for him to get thirty two minutes a game off the bench for a few games and then have a moment when Coach tells him "Congratulations, kid.  You earned a starting spot with your outstanding play."  Either way, let's just be happy that we have a guy that this is even a question about.

Some of the arguments for him starting have swayed me a little bit, but I still think he and French are better served coming off the bench at the very beginning.  Either way, I don't think anyone, Goodwin, French, local recruits, local coaches, etc. are going to meltdown if these guys don't aren't starting right away.  If the team and coaching staff would read this thread, I bet they would laugh their asses off.

[hsmith19]

13 minutes ago, HenryB said:

Lol...the difference between me and you is that you have zero impact in my world period.  You condescendingly ran your mouth and lectured me that I was new on the board.  I then embarrassed you by countering your idiotic post with the fact that I have been around longer than both you and Pistol. Fact...I have been around since 2005, Pistol 2006, and you 2013.  You couldn't handle being exposed for the obnoxious fool you are and continue your ridiculous insults.  Since you seem to lack basic comprehension skills let me repeat what was stated very clearly earlier.  I don't give a rat's behind what you or anyone else thinks. I don't care who or who you don't ignore.  My original intent for participation in this thread was to simply defend a poster who was accused of something that he didn't say.  I was 100% correct in what I said...the posts prove it.  Again for the dimwitted....if you don't like that.....tough.  Again for the slow of learning....my happiness is totally unimpacted by you so please get over your alleged self importance.

 

[cgeldmacher]

13 minutes ago, HenryB said:

Lol...the difference between me and you is that you have zero impact in my world period.  You condescendingly ran your mouth and lectured me that I was new on the board.  I then embarrassed you by countering your idiotic post with the fact that I have been around longer than both you and Pistol. Fact...I have been around since 2005, Pistol 2006, and you 2013.  You couldn't handle being exposed for the obnoxious fool you are and continue your ridiculous insults.  Since you seem to lack basic comprehension skills let me repeat what was stated very clearly earlier.  I don't give a rat's behind what you or anyone else thinks. I don't care who or who you don't ignore.  My original intent for participation in this thread was to simply defend a poster who was accused of something that he didn't say.  I was 100% correct in what I said...the posts prove it.  Again for the dimwitted....if you don't like that.....tough.  Again for the slow of learning....my happiness is totally unimpacted by you so please get over your alleged self importance.

I'm sure you don't care, but I've only known that you were a poster for a few minutes now, and I have zero respect for the fact that you don't seem to know how to have a conversation without obnoxious insults.  This is in no way a comment about any argument you have attempted to make above.  Simply a comment on the way you have conducted yourself while trying to make your points.

Please proceed now with hitting me with all sorts of childish insults.  I'm ready.

[Westy03]

nm