OT: Midtown Development

[billiken_roy]

45 minutes ago, TheChosenOne said:

Wow, hot take. Not sure many people will support you on that one.

I will support that.   i think new Orleans is greatly overrated.  They do have a wonderful cruise port but beyond that if I never go back there the rest of my life I will be fine.   Just about the dirtiest most disgusting place I've ever been.

[billikenfan05]

2 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

I will support that.   i think new Orleans is greatly overrated.  They do have a wonderful cruise port but beyond that if I never go back there the rest of my life I will be fine.   Just about the dirtiest most disgusting place I've ever been.

The pizza on bourbon is dope. From what I remember. 

[DoctorB]

I've been around the block, here and abroad, and STL is a pretty good city for restaurants.  Excellent in terms of certain ethnic foods, like Italian on the Hill or Vietnamese and some variation thereof;  there are some excellent hole in the wall BBQ joints too.   Nationally I'm sure STL is underrated; since being considered near the bottom is unfair to say the least.  We just hosted an elite professional from DC (with its awesome food scene) and he was completely blown away with what we showed him of STL:  his idea of it, never having been here, was pretty grim.  And the prices!!  You ought to see the crap $40 will get you in Venice or even some American cities...

True:  Seafood not so great -- actually, lousy at times -- that's what 4 years in Japan will do for you.  I also am not a fan of the Mexican scene here, having spent much time in New Mexico and California.

I agree with what someone else suggested:  after Chicago, probably the best in the midwest flyover area.  And ps:  what's really terrific here is the pricing, which would be double for similar meals -- or more -- on the coasts. 

[Old guy]

Doctor B, having lived in the Boston area for 24 years with fairly frequent flights to NYC and DC, I completely agree that what you get for a set amount of money in either of those cities is much less than what you get in STL for the same amount of money. This is particularly true if you include the cost of parking your car and the cost (oftentimes in tolls) to just get where you are going. 

[Spoon-Balls]

Has anyone else heard anything about a potential city/county merger bill being put on a "state wide" ballot? I just got to reading this article (not surprised that Sunset Hills would maintain its separatist stance... you have to love the part where it says "there was no discussion")

 

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/more-st-louis-county-cities-oppose-potential-merger/article_1554b5e0-7c5a-5e9e-9551-23f695d389b9.html

[RiseAndGrind]

18 minutes ago, Spoon-Balls said:

Has anyone else heard anything about a potential city/county merger bill being put on a "state wide" ballot? I just got to reading this article (not surprised that Sunset Hills would maintain its separatist stance... you have to love the part where it says "there was no discussion")

 

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/more-st-louis-county-cities-oppose-potential-merger/article_1554b5e0-7c5a-5e9e-9551-23f695d389b9.html

http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/trail-joplin-lawmaker-says-state-should-redesign-st-louis-region-local-officials-balk#stream/0

[willie]

3 hours ago, DoctorB said:

I've been around the block, here and abroad, and STL is a pretty good city for restaurants.  Excellent in terms of certain ethnic foods, like Italian on the Hill or Vietnamese and some variation thereof;  there are some excellent hole in the wall BBQ joints too.   Nationally I'm sure STL is underrated; since being considered near the bottom is unfair to say the least.  We just hosted an elite professional from DC (with its awesome food scene) and he was completely blown away with what we showed him of STL:  his idea of it, never having been here, was pretty grim.  And the prices!!  You ought to see the crap $40 will get you in Venice or even some American cities...

True:  Seafood not so great -- actually, lousy at times -- that's what 4 years in Japan will do for you.  I also am not a fan of the Mexican scene here, having spent much time in New Mexico and California.

I agree with what someone else suggested:  after Chicago, probably the best in the midwest flyover area.  And ps:  what's really terrific here is the pricing, which would be double for similar meals -- or more -- on the coasts. 

I have had maybe 20 meals in Chicago over the last decade. Granted these were all in the Miricle Mile area but there was nothing you couldn't find in Clayton. One of the better restaurants Capital Grill is now in Clayton. Sea Food is a problem unless you like Mississippi River cat fish. We could also use a couple of good French Restaurants. 

[TheChosenOne]

21 minutes ago, willie said:

We could also use a couple of good French Restaurants. 

I really like Bar Les Freres and Brasserie is also quite good. In the past I had good meals at Vin de Set, but the past few times I have gone it wasn't as good. The Crossing in Clayton is another good option.

[Old guy]

There is a Cafe Provencal in Kirkwood, I have not gone in years since a bad experience there but they used to be reasonably good.

[615Billiken]

13 hours ago, DoctorB said:

I've been around the block, here and abroad, and STL is a pretty good city for restaurants.  Excellent in terms of certain ethnic foods, like Italian on the Hill or Vietnamese and some variation thereof;  there are some excellent hole in the wall BBQ joints too.   Nationally I'm sure STL is underrated; since being considered near the bottom is unfair to say the least.  We just hosted an elite professional from DC (with its awesome food scene) and he was completely blown away with what we showed him of STL:  his idea of it, never having been here, was pretty grim.  And the prices!!  You ought to see the crap $40 will get you in Venice or even some American cities...

True:  Seafood not so great -- actually, lousy at times -- that's what 4 years in Japan will do for you.  I also am not a fan of the Mexican scene here, having spent much time in New Mexico and California.

I agree with what someone else suggested:  after Chicago, probably the best in the midwest flyover area.  And ps:  what's really terrific here is the pricing, which would be double for similar meals -- or more -- on the coasts. 

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

[RiseAndGrind]

13 minutes ago, 615Billiken said:

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

Not hole in the wall, but you should check out:

Shaved Duck (located in Tower Grove East)

Big Baby Q (Maryland Heights)

I'm totally blanking on some of the smaller places. 

[DeSmetBilliken]

1 hour ago, 615Billiken said:

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

Also not really a hole in the wall, and maybe you just neglected to mention it, but Sugarfire has to be included in any St. Louis BBQ discussion. Locations in Downtown, Olivette, Fenton, 2 in St. Charles County, and Washington, MO.

[brianstl]

1 hour ago, 615Billiken said:

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

Adam's Smokehouse.

[billikenfan05]

Stopped by Center Ice Brewery after the Blues preseason game Saturday. Really nice setup. Good beers. 

[wgstl]

are they still limited to just a few beers?  although they had just opened, I heard they only had like 2-3 beers to choose from at the time. 

[almaman]

I like all the above mentioned Q except the Saloon and Big Baby Q which I have not been. The real hole in the wall is C n K a fave of mine for 40 years. Recent visits not as great as most the time in the past but it's totally different than any of the above.  My new fave for me which it took me a while to get to and now it's like sex right when done I start dreaming about the next time; Beast Craft in Belleville. I find it a cut above all the rest even my national fave Bryant's in KC. and current top dog up there Kansas City Joe's. Finally made it to 17 st Bbq in Marion, good but still pales compared to Beast Craft. Making me hungry just typing this. they are all great though, also along with Adam's another Pappy off shoot that's great is Dalies in sw county. Pastrami melts in your mouth.

[billikenfan05]

42 minutes ago, wgstl said:

are they still limited to just a few beers?  although they had just opened, I heard they only had like 2-3 beers to choose from at the time. 

Probably 5-6

[DeSmetBilliken]

11 minutes ago, almaman said:

Finally made it to 17 st Bbq in Marion, .

Food's the same, but unless you're going with a large group, I'd recommend the original location in Murphysboro. More of the "hole in the wall" vibe.

[billiken_roy]

22 minutes ago, almaman said:

I like all the above mentioned Q except the Saloon and Big Baby Q which I have not been. The real hole in the wall is C n K a fave of mine for 40 years. Recent visits not as great as most the time in the past but it's totally different than any of the above.  My new fave for me which it took me a while to get to and now it's like sex right when done I start dreaming about the next time; Beast Craft in Belleville. I find it a cut above all the rest even my national fave Bryant's in KC. and current top dog up there Kansas City Joe's. Finally made it to 17 st Bbq in Marion, good but still pales compared to Beast Craft. Making me hungry just typing this. they are all great though, also along with Adam's another Pappy off shoot that's great is Dalies in sw county. Pastrami melts in your mouth.

i will also endorse the Beast.   i love the ribs and rib tips.  they have the big pork steak.   brisket is always wonderful.   but dont try to walk in near to closing.  they will be sold out of most choices.   if you get a tuesday off where you can get there for lunch, as good a snoot as i have ever eaten.  but no chance the snoots would be left after about as the place is packed for snoot day.      and of course dont miss getting brussel sprouts.   NEVER in my life thought i would recommend brussel sprouts!   as good of fries as there is in the st louis area.  and if you'd rather get potato salad, just awesome.   

 

[billiken_roy]

10 minutes ago, DeSmetBilliken said:

Food's the same, but unless you're going with a large group, I'd recommend the original location in Murphysboro. More of the "hole in the wall" vibe.

agree go to murphysboro or dont go.   

as to st louis, i'll take bogarts in soulard.   but pappy's will do.   

[almaman]

Ditto on Beasts' sprouts. all sides are killer. My fave is the house salad a rarity for a BBQ place. With good Q I'm all about the meat so getting the salad small nod to my health and it has their caramelized bacon in it which by itself is one of their sides. Mac n cheese incredible too. One of their meats another not regular bbq item is pork belly. Love the attitude over their too. Not a beer guy but they have very interesting selection of micro brews from all across the midwest.

[DoctorB]

5 hours ago, 615Billiken said:

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

Are you good with a little ride north??  Try the ribs at Roper's Ribs on West Florissant, up on the north side:  do any of you guys remember the little joint Frank Underwood goes to at the beginning of House of Cards???

Also, Capitalist Pig is organic and pretty good, but like Pappy's, get there early since once they sell out, they close.  Very cool space, too: in south Soulard on 12th.

[bonwich]

4 hours ago, brianstl said:

Adam's Smokehouse.

Adam's and Dalie's are, like Bogart's, Pappy's cousins. 

[bonwich]

6 hours ago, 615Billiken said:

What are some good hole in the wall BBQ joints. I'm Relatively new to the city. I'm familiar with Pappys and Bogarts as well as the uppity joints like Salt and Smoke and BBQ Saloon. Are there any different, more homey places?

Eat your heart out, so to speak. The first article in the link goes through a couple dozen barbecue joints. I need to find the link to all the places they sent me to in the heart of the 'hood. 

https://www.stlmag.com/topics/bbq-the-lou/

[almaman]

2 minutes ago, bonwich said:

Adam's and Dalie's are, like Bogart's, Pappy's cousins. 

Indeed and all pretty equal imo (haven't been to Bogart's but tasted at some event). The amount of good BBQ here and around the country is unprecedented.