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Supreme Court rules college athletes are entitled to compensation


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2 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

I'm sure the schools and the NCAA will put language in the letters of intent and scholarship paperwork that will prevent players from being able to consider the prohibition on using schools' marks as a grievance that would permit them to transfer.  And for a school to allow athletes to profit from their marks should be an impermissible benefit, resulting in sanctions.

Is that already decided? That seems somewhat similar to the things that the Supreme Court found a little discerning about the NCAA. actions and collusion that would be unacceptable in any other industry.

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8 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said:

Is that already decided? That seems somewhat similar to the things that the Supreme Court found a little discerning about the NCAA. actions and collusion that would be unacceptable in any other industry.

I don't know if it's been decided, or not.  But perhaps you're not seeing the difference between the athlete's name, image, likeness and the school's marks (name, mascot, logo, colors, etc.).  Surely the Supreme Court isn't declaring athletes can use the school's marks any way they want.

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9 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

I don't know if it's been decided, or not.  But perhaps you're not seeing the difference between the athlete's name, image, likeness and the school's marks (name, mascot, logo, colors, etc.).  Surely the Supreme Court isn't declaring athletes can use the school's marks any way they want.

I think you are mistaken. I am not saying that the student athletes will be allowed to use the marks without permission. I am saying that Universities will bend over backwards to be accommodating to their student athletes in the near future. They will not block all student athletes from signing things while wearing a jersey. They will figure out a good route to accommodate these players making money. I also think some schools will fail to appreciate how important this new concept is to players. Those players will leave those schools. Then, those schools will figure out how to be more accommodating.

I am also of the opinion that the NCAA will not block transfers based on a student’s dissatisfaction with a school’s rules or attitudes towards NIL. I think the NCAA would lose a court case if they try.

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-do these NIL dollars have to come from a company for doing something or can I or any booster just go up to a player with an envelope full of cash?

-could I decide after a game to give the Player of the Game some money? or Players?

-does there have to be a contract? and if so, who has to approve of it? 

-I kind of like the Wild Wild West aspect of this, in some ways I don't, we'll see

-is Javonte the first Billiken to get a deal in this new era?

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12 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

I'm sure the schools and the NCAA will put language in the letters of intent and scholarship paperwork that will prevent players from being able to consider the prohibition on using schools' marks as a grievance that would permit them to transfer.  And for a school to allow athletes to profit from their marks should be an impermissible benefit, resulting in sanctions.

-yesterday couldn't kids transfer for any reason? is that changed today?

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Here's the Dayton letter: 

Dear Flyer Fans, Partners, and Community,

 

This is an important time for college sports, perhaps once in a generation, with significant issues ranging from broad legalization of sports gambling to the "transfer portal" to the recent Supreme Court ruling against the NCAA in an antitrust case. Many of these issues will evolve over the coming months with an impact on the University of Dayton and its student-athletes.

I write to you today specifically about the name, image, and likeness (NIL) compensation of student-athletes.

Ohio Governor Mike DeWine signed an Executive Order on Monday, June 28, permitting college student-athletes to begin to receive compensation from third parties (but not from their home institution) for use of their name, image and likeness in endorsements or business activities without jeopardizing their NCAA eligibility. Foundational prohibitions on “pay-for-play” and recruiting inducements remain.

A full copy of the Executive Order can be found at this link.

The nuance and complexity of all NIL regulations prevent me from describing them fully, but in short, student-athletes may receive compensation for commercial endorsements, advertisements, personal appearances, autographs, camps/clinics and a variety of other business opportunities, provided the NIL activity is consistent with applicable law, including the Executive Order. There are some parameters outlined in the Executive Order, which largely tracks legislation that nearly passed the Ohio legislature last week.

For example, the Executive Order requires disclosure and institutional review of proposed NIL contracts. There are some potential areas of conflict with certain categories outlined, such as controlled substances, marijuana products, alcoholic products, tobacco, vapor products, gambling, etc. In addition, student-athletes may not enter into contracts providing compensation to the student-athlete for use of their NIL during official team activities (games, practices, meetings, etc.). Their NIL endeavors are separate from organized team functions. Further, a student’s proposed NIL contract should not be in conflict with a provision of a contract to which the University is a party.

Our coaches, staff and/or contractors will not broker deals for student-athletes or make financial promises to prospects in the recruiting process. Student-athlete business activities to earn outside income are managed independently from the University with their own representatives. University of Dayton or Dayton Flyer athletics-related marks and logos cannot be used, including all aspects of the uniform, unless such rights have been secured from the University through a written agreement.

However, we can and will provide educational programming to our students on NIL and associated regulations, including how they can provide value to the greater Dayton business community, in their hometowns and beyond. We must ensure the University of Dayton serves as a strong public relations platform for student-athletes to engage in NIL activity should they choose to do so.

If your organization, business or nonprofit can benefit from collaborating with University of Dayton student-athletes, please consider them in legitimate and fair market-based ways. We will and must ensure our students have lawful opportunities in Dayton comparable to any other community.

While many of these changes appropriately modernize rules and intend to provide fundamental fairness for student-athletes, unintended consequences will result. We know some institutions and unscrupulous fans may create sham opportunities for students with inflated market values or ‘no show’ work, and include impermissible booster activity and recruiting inducements. As a community, we aim to comply with all NCAA, conference, state, and federal regulations related to NIL or any other area. Together, through legal, transparent and permissible means, we can aggressively support our students in marketing themselves. I believe our strong and loyal fan base, along with our market position, is advantageous relative to many other areas of the country, and my hope is that they display the highest ethics in that regard too.

The market reaction to these new laws and regulations remains a great unknown over the coming weeks and months. What is known is that we must face the new realities of college sports with appropriately balanced aggressiveness, or we will fall behind in a hypercompetitive environment. We must continue to make the Flyers a destination program for athletes across the country and the world.

While the University will not broker or serve as matchmaker with third parties, you may contact Krystal Warren at [email protected] for general questions related to evolving NCAA policy or the Executive Order.

As always, we thank you for your loyal support of Dayton athletics and know that you expect first-class, competitive programs that represent our University, our city and our community in the best possible way. Together, that’s what we expect to continue delivering.

Go Flyers!

 
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Neil Sullivan

Vice President and Director of Athletics

 
 
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1 hour ago, AnkielBreakers said:

I think you are mistaken. I am not saying that the student athletes will be allowed to use the marks without permission. I am saying that Universities will bend over backwards to be accommodating to their student athletes in the near future. They will not block all student athletes from signing things while wearing a jersey. They will figure out a good route to accommodate these players making money. I also think some schools will fail to appreciate how important this new concept is to players. Those players will leave those schools. Then, those schools will figure out how to be more accommodating.

I am also of the opinion that the NCAA will not block transfers based on a student’s dissatisfaction with a school’s rules or attitudes towards NIL. I think the NCAA would lose a court case if they try.

You could be right, but I think the Dayton letter Taj posted in this thread suggests otherwise.

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14 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

 

I felt if this endorsement deal became the law UD would benefit greatly over other A10 schools. That whole community gets behind the Flyers in a big way. Great recruiting tool for Grant. As for other A10 teams not so much. My guess as to which teams benefit the most would be as follows: 

1.) UD- see comments above plus they have no competition with Pro teams. 

2.) SLU- We could if the team generates wins and excitement. We are the only D1 program in a major metro area and have a few locals staying home. Granted they'll compete with the Blues and Card players, but would Bills will come at a reduced rate. Again, the team has to generate excitement but the potential is there. Recall Spoonball years. Mizzery might cut into us a bit. 

3,) URI- Although, it's New England which is Pro dominant vs Colleges. However, they cold be a big name in the state as they are the only real D1 program. Brown, meh. They are somewhat like SLU in that they have potential but the team has to create excitement. They could be like a UConn in RI but have to win.  

4.) ST. B's and Davidson- Very limited market size for both small town schools. However, St. B's is the only game in town next to Iditarods and Snow Mobile competitions. But I can't see small town local merchants shelling out major $$ to the Bonnie players. Ditto for Davidson plus they are in the heart of ACC country and have Charlotte Pros to compete with. Maybe a lot of free pizza and subs, but not much cold hard cash for both schools.  

5.) Both A10 Philly teams are basically screwed. Way too much competition both from Philly Pro Sports teams and other schools. All the 5 Philly college teams will be scraping for the dregs at the bottom of the endorsement barrel. 

6.) Richmond, GMason,  and VCU-Probably should be ranked above Philly teams. Richmond's really only got them to root for, but they also will compete against UVA and VT. Their drawback is they are in ACC country. Ditto for Mason, plus they've sucked for too long. 

7.)Duquesne and UMass both are in pro sports dominate areas/city plus multiple competing schools. Again the Pros will limit their marketability. 

8.) Fordham and GW- They are both in key big market metro areas but both dwarfed by DC Pros and surrounded by other bigger name schools. They'll do well to get free meals. 

UD players will lock up some good perks. SLU could if the AD markets the team well, plus our local player flavor can't hurt. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Taj79 said:

Here's the Dayton letter: 

Dear Flyer Fans, Partners, and Community,

 

This is an important time for college sports, perhaps once in a generation, with significant issues ranging from broad legalization of sports gambling to the "transfer portal" to the recent Supreme Court ruling against the NCAA in an antitrust case. Many of these issues will evolve over the coming months with an impact on the University of Dayton and its student-athletes.

I write to you today specifically about the name, image, and likeness (NIL) compensation of student-athletes.

Ohio Governor Mike DeWine signed an Executive Order on Monday, June 28, permitting college student-athletes to begin to receive compensation from third parties (but not from their home institution) for use of their name, image and likeness in endorsements or business activities without jeopardizing their NCAA eligibility. Foundational prohibitions on “pay-for-play” and recruiting inducements remain.

A full copy of the Executive Order can be found at this link.

The nuance and complexity of all NIL regulations prevent me from describing them fully, but in short, student-athletes may receive compensation for commercial endorsements, advertisements, personal appearances, autographs, camps/clinics and a variety of other business opportunities, provided the NIL activity is consistent with applicable law, including the Executive Order. There are some parameters outlined in the Executive Order, which largely tracks legislation that nearly passed the Ohio legislature last week.

For example, the Executive Order requires disclosure and institutional review of proposed NIL contracts. There are some potential areas of conflict with certain categories outlined, such as controlled substances, marijuana products, alcoholic products, tobacco, vapor products, gambling, etc. In addition, student-athletes may not enter into contracts providing compensation to the student-athlete for use of their NIL during official team activities (games, practices, meetings, etc.). Their NIL endeavors are separate from organized team functions. Further, a student’s proposed NIL contract should not be in conflict with a provision of a contract to which the University is a party.

Our coaches, staff and/or contractors will not broker deals for student-athletes or make financial promises to prospects in the recruiting process. Student-athlete business activities to earn outside income are managed independently from the University with their own representatives. University of Dayton or Dayton Flyer athletics-related marks and logos cannot be used, including all aspects of the uniform, unless such rights have been secured from the University through a written agreement.

However, we can and will provide educational programming to our students on NIL and associated regulations, including how they can provide value to the greater Dayton business community, in their hometowns and beyond. We must ensure the University of Dayton serves as a strong public relations platform for student-athletes to engage in NIL activity should they choose to do so.

If your organization, business or nonprofit can benefit from collaborating with University of Dayton student-athletes, please consider them in legitimate and fair market-based ways. We will and must ensure our students have lawful opportunities in Dayton comparable to any other community.

While many of these changes appropriately modernize rules and intend to provide fundamental fairness for student-athletes, unintended consequences will result. We know some institutions and unscrupulous fans may create sham opportunities for students with inflated market values or ‘no show’ work, and include impermissible booster activity and recruiting inducements. As a community, we aim to comply with all NCAA, conference, state, and federal regulations related to NIL or any other area. Together, through legal, transparent and permissible means, we can aggressively support our students in marketing themselves. I believe our strong and loyal fan base, along with our market position, is advantageous relative to many other areas of the country, and my hope is that they display the highest ethics in that regard too.

The market reaction to these new laws and regulations remains a great unknown over the coming weeks and months. What is known is that we must face the new realities of college sports with appropriately balanced aggressiveness, or we will fall behind in a hypercompetitive environment. We must continue to make the Flyers a destination program for athletes across the country and the world.

While the University will not broker or serve as matchmaker with third parties, you may contact Krystal Warren at [email protected] for general questions related to evolving NCAA policy or the Executive Order.

As always, we thank you for your loyal support of Dayton athletics and know that you expect first-class, competitive programs that represent our University, our city and our community in the best possible way. Together, that’s what we expect to continue delivering.

Go Flyers!

 
6012f25ad8a2c.jpg

Neil Sullivan

Vice President and Director of Athletics

 
 
Image
 
Facebook Twitter Instagram
 
 

 

Coached won't use it in recruiting.... wink wink. 

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9 minutes ago, slu72 said:

3,) URI- Although, it's New England which is Pro dominant vs Colleges. However, they cold be a big name in the state as they are the only real D1 program. Brown, meh. They are somewhat like SLU in that they have potential but the team has to create excitement. They could be like a UConn in RI but have to win.  

I'm guessing Providence hoops is probably a bigger deal in that state than Rhody.

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5 minutes ago, slu72 said:

Coached won't use it in recruiting.... wink wink. 

And nothing prevents a local business from reaching out to a prospective recruit just to let them know what deals might be available to them

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13 minutes ago, slu72 said:

I felt if this endorsement deal became the law UD would benefit greatly over other A10 schools. That whole community gets behind the Flyers in a big way. Great recruiting tool for Grant. As for other A10 teams not so much. My guess as to which teams benefit the most would be as follows: 

1.) UD- see comments above plus they have no competition with Pro teams. 

2.) SLU- We could if the team generates wins and excitement. We are the only D1 program in a major metro area and have a few locals staying home. Granted they'll compete with the Blues and Card players, but would Bills will come at a reduced rate. Again, the team has to generate excitement but the potential is there. Recall Spoonball years. Mizzery might cut into us a bit. 

3,) URI- Although, it's New England which is Pro dominant vs Colleges. However, they cold be a big name in the state as they are the only real D1 program. Brown, meh. They are somewhat like SLU in that they have potential but the team has to create excitement. They could be like a UConn in RI but have to win.  

4.) ST. B's and Davidson- Very limited market size for both small town schools. However, St. B's is the only game in town next to Iditarods and Snow Mobile competitions. But I can't see small town local merchants shelling out major $$ to the Bonnie players. Ditto for Davidson plus they are in the heart of ACC country and have Charlotte Pros to compete with. Maybe a lot of free pizza and subs, but not much cold hard cash for both schools.  

5.) Both A10 Philly teams are basically screwed. Way too much competition both from Philly Pro Sports teams and other schools. All the 5 Philly college teams will be scraping for the dregs at the bottom of the endorsement barrel. 

6.) Richmond, GMason,  and VCU-Probably should be ranked above Philly teams. Richmond's really only got them to root for, but they also will compete against UVA and VT. Their drawback is they are in ACC country. Ditto for Mason, plus they've sucked for too long. 

7.)Duquesne and UMass both are in pro sports dominate areas/city plus multiple competing schools. Again the Pros will limit their marketability. 

8.) Fordham and GW- They are both in key big market metro areas but both dwarfed by DC Pros and surrounded by other bigger name schools. They'll do well to get free meals. 

UD players will lock up some good perks. SLU could if the AD markets the team well, plus our local player flavor can't hurt. 

 

 

You probably framed this correctly, but all you need is one wealthy alumni to change the landscape.  Our example is obvious, Dr. Chaifetz.  It doesn't need to be local, but only an interested alumni who wants to help the program. I would suspect any sponsor doesn't plan on any windfall from a sponsorship.  How many people will use College Hunks Hauling Junk because they are sponsoring Miami QB King?  An extra $20K is a lot of junk to haul to break even on their deal. 

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16 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

You probably framed this correctly, but all you need is one wealthy alumni to change the landscape.  Our example is obvious, Dr. Chaifetz.  It doesn't need to be local, but only an interested alumni who wants to help the program. I would suspect any sponsor doesn't plan on any windfall from a sponsorship.  How many people will use College Hunks Hauling Junk because they are sponsoring Miami QB King?  An extra $20K is a lot of junk to haul to break even on their deal. 

They got more than their money's worth already in free advertising from this, but this one is definitely different because it's timing means it is getting a ton of attention.  

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28 minutes ago, slufanskip said:

And nothing prevents a local business from reaching out to a prospective recruit just to let them know what deals might be available to them

Not even the fact that the university is sending the letter spelling out the rules to boosters and sponsors?  If such businesses do offer such inducements to recruits and the school finds out, they'll have to declare the recruit ineligible and ask the NCAA to reinstate the recruit's eligibility while the school imposes sanctions on the offending booster/sponsor.  And if the school "doesn't find out," then when someone blows the whistle, the NCAA will investigate.  This is why schools have been hiring consultants or staff to get out ahead of this change in the landscape.

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Jordan Schultz of ESPN reported at 12:21 a.m. -- one minute after the Dreamfield news was released -- that King, Milton and Hurricanes defensive back Bubba Bolden signed deals with College H.U.N.K.S. Hauling Junk & Moving. King and Bolden will both receive $20,000 in the deal with the moving company, according to Schultz. The company was founded in Washington, D.C., but now is headquartered in Tampa. It was created in 2003 by a college student who was looking for extra money during summer break.

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2 hours ago, slu72 said:

I felt if this endorsement deal became the law UD would benefit greatly over other A10 schools. That whole community gets behind the Flyers in a big way. Great recruiting tool for Grant. As for other A10 teams not so much. My guess as to which teams benefit the most would be as follows: 

1.) UD- see comments above plus they have no competition with Pro teams. 

2.) SLU- We could if the team generates wins and excitement. We are the only D1 program in a major metro area and have a few locals staying home. Granted they'll compete with the Blues and Card players, but would Bills will come at a reduced rate. Again, the team has to generate excitement but the potential is there. Recall Spoonball years. Mizzery might cut into us a bit. 

3,) URI- Although, it's New England which is Pro dominant vs Colleges. However, they cold be a big name in the state as they are the only real D1 program. Brown, meh. They are somewhat like SLU in that they have potential but the team has to create excitement. They could be like a UConn in RI but have to win.  

4.) ST. B's and Davidson- Very limited market size for both small town schools. However, St. B's is the only game in town next to Iditarods and Snow Mobile competitions. But I can't see small town local merchants shelling out major $$ to the Bonnie players. Ditto for Davidson plus they are in the heart of ACC country and have Charlotte Pros to compete with. Maybe a lot of free pizza and subs, but not much cold hard cash for both schools.  

5.) Both A10 Philly teams are basically screwed. Way too much competition both from Philly Pro Sports teams and other schools. All the 5 Philly college teams will be scraping for the dregs at the bottom of the endorsement barrel. 

6.) Richmond, GMason,  and VCU-Probably should be ranked above Philly teams. Richmond's really only got them to root for, but they also will compete against UVA and VT. Their drawback is they are in ACC country. Ditto for Mason, plus they've sucked for too long. 

7.)Duquesne and UMass both are in pro sports dominate areas/city plus multiple competing schools. Again the Pros will limit their marketability. 

8.) Fordham and GW- They are both in key big market metro areas but both dwarfed by DC Pros and surrounded by other bigger name schools. They'll do well to get free meals. 

UD players will lock up some good perks. SLU could if the AD markets the team well, plus our local player flavor can't hurt. 

 

 

Richmond and Davidson both are elite Southern private schools. Both have huge endowments. Many of the alums are very wealthy local business owners. Like car dealership chains, restaurants, etc... Possibly some options. 

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3 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

Not even the fact that the university is sending the letter spelling out the rules to boosters and sponsors?  If such businesses do offer such inducements to recruits and the school finds out, they'll have to declare the recruit ineligible and ask the NCAA to reinstate the recruit's eligibility while the school imposes sanctions on the offending booster/sponsor.  And if the school "doesn't find out," then when someone blows the whistle, the NCAA will investigate.  This is why schools have been hiring consultants or staff to get out ahead of this change in the landscape.

Why? So I can pay him for services after he signs but not before? 

This is a can of worms about to be open. So I don't say if you sign with St. Louis, but I say if you are living here in St Louis next year these are some endorsement deals I might have available to you. 

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Interesting paragraph in a CBS article

 https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-ushering-in-the-nil-era-marks-the-beginning-of-the-end-for-college-athletes-being-treated-unfairly/

What's more profitable -- being the fifth-best recruit at Kentucky or the top recruit at Ole Miss? For the past decade-plus, if a borderline top-50 prospect was being recruited by Kentucky and Ole Miss, he'd almost certainly pick Kentucky even if he were the least-heralded prospect in UK's class and unlikely to play as a freshman. But, in this new world, the smarter move for that exact prospect might be to pick Ole Miss over Kentucky, become the prize of the Rebels' recruiting class, start as a freshman and cash-in with Allen Samuels Jeep Ram of Oxford or some other car dealership in the area.

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27 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Interesting paragraph in a CBS article

 https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/ncaa-ushering-in-the-nil-era-marks-the-beginning-of-the-end-for-college-athletes-being-treated-unfairly/

What's more profitable -- being the fifth-best recruit at Kentucky or the top recruit at Ole Miss? For the past decade-plus, if a borderline top-50 prospect was being recruited by Kentucky and Ole Miss, he'd almost certainly pick Kentucky even if he were the least-heralded prospect in UK's class and unlikely to play as a freshman. But, in this new world, the smarter move for that exact prospect might be to pick Ole Miss over Kentucky, become the prize of the Rebels' recruiting class, start as a freshman and cash-in with Allen Samuels Jeep Ram of Oxford or some other car dealership in the area.

-nice angle on this, perhaps only because in the example it is UK getting the short end

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CNBC had a segment today on the Cavinder twins. Women’s basketball players at some west coast school. They were some kind of social media stars on tik tok . They have been hired by some management company to a contract . Didn’t disclose the monetary value but said it was significant. I am sure their fame is not hurt by the fact that they are very attractive and wear little clothes. Yes. I checked. 

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10 minutes ago, willie said:

CNBC had a segment today on the Cavinder twins. Women’s basketball players at some west coast school. They were some kind of social media stars on tik tok . They have been hired by some management company to a contract . Didn’t disclose the monetary value but said it was significant. I am sure their fame is not hurt by the fact that they are very attractive and wear little clothes. Yes. I checked. 

cavinder-twins.jpg

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