slu72 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 You're dreaming. There's way too much money in the current set up for college basketball. And a lot of that is due to the possibility of mid-majors upsetting power conference teams in the tourney. TJ's not far off here, FDL. There was a day when the old NFL said they'd never accept the AFL. I don't know if I'll see it in my lifetime, but I can see the day where the big time money making college sports are controlled by the big 4 conferences, and mid major upsets will become a trivia question. Keep in mind state budgets are under strain these days and good ol State U's budgets will be tightened. Therefore, ADs will be forced to create more revenue streams. And you can bet they've got their eyes on the dollars the smaller conferences get from the NCAA tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 This is all happening quicker than I expected. http://m.espn.go.com/wireless/story?storyId=8742607 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Wow. I agree as I thought this would be a 1-2 month process. Should be an interesting 48 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 With some of the stuff I have read over the last 24 hours, I feel pretty good how this will end up playing out for SLU. I would be scared right now if I was Dayton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 TJ's not far off here, FDL. There was a day when the old NFL said they'd never accept the AFL. I don't know if I'll see it in my lifetime, but I can see the day where the big time money making college sports are controlled by the big 4 conferences, and mid major upsets will become a trivia question. Keep in mind state budgets are under strain these days and good ol State U's budgets will be tightened. Therefore, ADs will be forced to create more revenue streams. And you can bet they've got their eyes on the dollars the smaller conferences get from the NCAA tournament. Marquette's AD had a very good point. You don't know what football is going to look like in 15 years. These conferences/networks are signing long TV deals based on football. There is a chance football could be a neutered version of itself in 10 years with the head injury issues. Basketball could shift to be the dominant player in these talks again, and a league that was built upon that foundation would be sitting pretty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 With some of the stuff I have read over the last 24 hours, I feel pretty good how this will end up playing out for SLU. I would be scared right now if I was Dayton. We offer pretty much everything (geography, tv market, facilities, etc.) except a historically dominant basketball program. Details! I really like the fact we were reportedly one of 3 teams mentioned in the Sunday meeting. We still need the leadership of the university to step up and finish the deal though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Temple wouldnt be in the Basketball BEAST though correct? -who knows at this point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe_davola Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 We offer pretty much everything (geography, tv market, facilities, etc.) except a historically dominant basketball program. Details! I really like the fact we were reportedly one of 3 teams mentioned in the Sunday meeting. We still need the leadership of the university to step up and finish the deal though. Exactly. Market size and our facilities have put us in a good position. Great timing in building the Fetz even though it was welllll overdue. I'd love to see some of the matchups with these 7 schools. I thought this was a fantasy, but that article mentioning our name from an inside source really has me excited. Looking forward to seeing how this all unfolds in the next couple days. Could be a very good Christmas for many Billiken fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 With some of the stuff I have read over the last 24 hours, I feel pretty good how this will end up playing out for SLU. I would be scared right now if I was Dayton. -I am scared and I am a SLU fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 -so the article is talking about disolving the Beast, does this basically mean the 7 will kick out the fball schools, keep the name and keep the NCAA credits? too much egg nog last night, I guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 We offer pretty much everything (geography, tv market, facilities, etc.) except a historically dominant basketball program. Details! I really like the fact we were reportedly one of 3 teams mentioned in the Sunday meeting. We still need the leadership of the university to step up and finish the deal though. Is it just me or do you guys think it would be a done deal for SLU to the new Catholic Conference if RM was still in charge? Just don't have the confidence in our administration. BUT... I guess the new A10 is pretty good too, so it's a win/win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 -so the article is talking about disolving the Beast, does this basically mean the 7 will kick out the fball schools, keep the name and keep the NCAA credits? too much egg nog last night, I guess I am sure it will result in legal battles regarding the monies owed by the NCAA. The Big East pledges like Tulane, Boise, etc. will probably just remain where they are with no issue. The question would be with big east actives like UConn, South Florida, Cincinnati that have tourney credits and such. Where do they go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwyjibo Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Great timing in building the Fetz even though it was welllll overdue. Actually, no. These urban schools generally play in pro style arenas not on campus (Villanova plays on campus but they are suburban). Also, the loss of attendance created by moving to Chaifetz may hurt a bit as well. SLU has a lot to offer and Chaifetz may have some symbolic benefit (showing commitment) but they would be better off in a large capacity, better attended arena. The practice facilities, while probably minor, will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milwaukeebill Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 -who knows at this point? Well played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastBilliken Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 I have heard a 1000 different scenarios so far, and I guess I am slow. So, are the 7 Catholic Schools looking to jump from the Big East? lf so, where are they planning on going? Where does this leave SLU? Personally, I think an All Catholic Conference would be huge for SLU. I think it would give us some prestige and name recognition coast to coast instead of just in Missouri, allow us to create solid rivalries with similar Universities on and off the floor, allow many of our students to relate to the Universities we play (maybe this even encourages them to start to follow our basketball program and go to games), etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillikenFriar Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Basically this. It will end in the courts though inevitably. Word here in Providence is that they want to start with 10 teams, stabilize and then expand. SLU is often mentioned in that second phase. The idea is to keep teavel costs down initially, prove the product is valuable and then grow. -so the article is talking about disolving the Beast, does this basically mean the 7 will kick out the fball schools, keep the name and keep the NCAA credits? too much egg nog last night, I guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 This guy (http://www.udpride.com/forums/showthread.php?p=285791#post285791) makes an interesting argument that the current A-10 is better than the big east 7 alone. I'm not sure I buy that, he is using current RPI which we know is not the best measure (RPI sucks in general, early season sucks even more, and he is including Temple in the A-10). However, it is interesting and I tend to agree that most of the big east hype is due to the name. Georgetown & Marquette are the only programs that would really be top tier in the A-10. Nova would be a middle tier program and the rest would be middle to lower tier. While none are as bad as the very bottom of the A-10, as a group they really aren't full of (current) basketball powers. In terms of recent NCAA tournament success, I think Butler, VCU, and Xavier trump Marquette, Georgetown, & Villanova. Meanwhile St. Johns, Seton Hall, DePaul, & Providence don't have much recent tournament success at all. I'd say Dayton, SLU, St. Joes, Richmond easily match or better those schools recent tournament success. As long as SLU doesn't get left out of the dance again and stuck in an A-10 without Xaiver, Butler, Dayton, and/or VCU, I think it will be fine whether they join the big east 7 or are left with the current A-10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milwaukeebill Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 In terms of recent NCAA tournament success, I think Butler, VCU, and Xavier trump Marquette, Georgetown, & Villanova. Meanwhile St. Johns, Seton Hall, DePaul, & Providence don't have much recent tournament success at all. I'd say Dayton, SLU, St. Joes, Richmond easily match or better those schools recent tournament success. As long as SLU doesn't get left out of the dance again and stuck in an A-10 without Xaiver, Butler, Dayton, and/or VCU, I think it will be fine whether they join the big east 7 or are left with the current A-10 Brands matter. Why do you think everyone is freaking out about who gets to keep the "big East" name. MU, GU, Nova, STJ all have better brands than anyone in the A10. Also all the #1 schools in their city. Something that cant really be said for alot of A10 programs. Thats why these 7 have the power. Last sentence is spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 That would be a serious misreading of what makes people watch March Madness, in my opinion. One of the reasons March Madness became so huge is that it draws in people who don't watch a single game of college basketball Nov - Feb, but are glued to their TV for 3 weekends in March. Take away the David v. Goliath upsets in the first round, or Cinderellas in the second weekend, and they will lose a huge portion of the TV audience. Actual fans of the teams competing will still watch, but casual fans will leave in droves. so what you are saying is that the fans really care about the lesser teams. if true, why is there no tv market for the D2 and D3 tourney's? in reality the ncaa tourney will become the "D2" tourney. what's the difference? meanwhile the #64 team of the new 4 conference dream alliance would still be the "cinderella" role that the tv markets will play up. "Northwestern beats Duke" will be the headline and the ratings would be amazing. meanwhile the crippled NCAA has Xavier playing BYU for the national championship and they had a first round upset of the south regional where VCU was beaten by Winthrop. just isnt the same. understand i am not advocating the above, i just feel that is the angle the big 4 conferences see and are moving towards. and most importantly, the big 4 conferences will not have to split any money with the other 300 schools left in the ncaa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 so what you are saying is that the fans really care about the lesser teams. if true, why is there no tv market for the D2 and D3 tourney's? in reality the ncaa tourney will become the "D2" tourney. what's the difference? meanwhile the #64 team of the new 4 conference dream alliance would still be the "cinderella" role that the tv markets will play up. "Northwestern beats Duke" will be the headline and the ratings would be amazing. meanwhile the crippled NCAA has Xavier playing BYU for the national championship and they had a first round upset of the south regional where VCU was beaten by Winthrop. just isnt the same. understand i am not advocating the above, i just feel that is the angle the big 4 conferences see and are moving towards. and most importantly, the big 4 conferences will not have to split any money with the other 300 schools left in the ncaa The value of the first weekend of the NCAA tourney is watching teams like Lehigh and Norfolk st beat teams like duke and mizzou. The tv networks certainly understand this and would bid accordingly. The big schools don't share that much money with the lower conferences. You get paid on how many games you play and there are only about 30 spots guaranteed to the lower conferences. With about 130 units to be had, the big schools still control over 75% of the revenues as long as they win the early round games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Is it just me or do you guys think it would be a done deal for SLU to the new Catholic Conference if RM was still in charge? Just don't have the confidence in our administration. BUT... I guess the new A10 is pretty good too, so it's a win/win. rickma didnt want anything to do with an eastern conference. he wanted to be in the mvc. i have all the confidence in the world in Chris May as long as he is given the opportunity to make decisions. i fear that the good father will get in the way. however one would think the opportunity to link up with these other catholic schools would be huge. i would hope this isnt about just a 10 team conference (7 big east and 3 A-10) i would rather see more of a merger with some sort of two conference arrangement coming out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 rickma didnt want anything to do with an eastern conference. he wanted to be in the mvc. Horse truffles! I heard the Big East come out of Rick's mouth mostly...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Schools like NC and Duke would go to one of the 16 school conferences. Those 64 schools then leave the NCAA to form its own basketball post season. Isn't going to happen. First they would be buried in anti-trust suits. Second they would not want to tempt the wrath of Congress this would bring. This would freeze out the states of 28 senators, would negatively impact the schools 58 senators attended, would leave out the Ivies, and leave out the Service Academies. Sure, the schools in the big four that rely on federal funding would want to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Horse truffles! I heard the Big East come out of Rick's mouth mostly...... Precisely Marty! Rick and many others called this many years ago and mentioned several times about being ready for the ensuing conference changes based on the BE breakup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 those four conferences dont want to share any of the revenue. and like i said, overall, they can still present a somewhat david vs goliath first round atmosphere and the finals of the two fairy tale organizations would undoubtedly be more presentable to the casual fan by far. the casual fan will lose interest quickly in the remaining ncaa while they would be all about the big four likely championship. again, i am not that fan. hell i go watch D-3 softball and basketball games now. i appreciate the true student athlete far more than the one and done athletes. but i have to say, you all are not seeing the true over the life of the whole tourney effect to the ratings and such. yes we all like to talk about those great david goliath first and second round upsets, but when it gets to the end, the final fours with the big boys always draw the bigger ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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