OT: FBI Arrests NCAAB Asst. Coaches

[brianstl]

"Coach 2" was Pitino

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20848092/louisville-cardinals-basketball-coach-rick-pitino-coach-2-federal-complaint-source

[HoosierPal]

Here is a quote from Ohio State AD Gene Smith as to why he fired Thad Matta.  You can supply your own translation, but this statement looks pretty stupid right now.

"Recruiting was a major part of that plan," Smith said of his initial meetings after the 2016-17 season. "We weren't winning the battles in recruiting that I thought we had a chance to win, so as we started talking about that on Friday ... the flow of the conversation took me to the reality."

 

[Coach314]

7 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Here are three ways to clean this mess up.

1) Give the 'death penalty' to the coaches, not schools, involved in major violations.  Draw a line in concrete.  'These are Major Violations".  Cross the line, you no longer coach in the NCAA. 

2) Get the NBA to trash the One and Done rule.  These 15 to 20 players per year are the targets for the big bucks from the shoe company.  If you are an exec for Adidas, who do you target, the Justin Tatum's of the world or the Aaron Hines'?  (Names only for examples.)

3) Dismantle the AAU circuit.  The primary goal of the AAU system is to fund itself.  Once you get to the higher AAU levels, the goal is to bring in enough money to keep your machine running.  It is not about the players, it is about the people running the show.  Their hands are out all the time.  "Give our team your shoes and we will talk later."  Do you think these players are paying their airfare to places like Atlanta, Vegas, etc?  Are they paying for their $200 per night hotel room?  The money is coming from 'sponsors' who aren't sponsoring these teams as a matter of civic pride. They know there is payback down the line.

I agree with your first two points.  As for AAU...the shoe companies have ruined it.  At the high level most AAU teams are sponsored by shoe companies.  They give them a budget to pay for their season.  They put the demands on coaches to produce results or lose their sponsorship.  So you can imagine the battle for the accumulation of players. Some of these coaches have no shame in that regard.  In addition they have the teams play in tournaments and Leagues so the college coaches sometimes get exclusive looks at the players in an effort to steer them to a University they sponsor.  Shoe companies even sponsoring High Schools now.  The competition to find the next "star" to promote is becoming unhealthy for the sport.  

[billiken_roy]

i hate all select/aau programs regardless of sport, sex etc.   sickening imo.   

[Coach314]

10 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i hate all select/aau programs regardless of sport, sex etc.   sickening imo.   

I can understand that opinion 

[CGMAN618]

7 hours ago, STL Hoops Insider said:

People who are already rich don't commit financial crimes?

Never said that,  and didn't mean to imply it.  Just stating what the shoe exec. said and giving my opinion as to whether BU was involved.  I can't imagine the shoe company was paying 2 coaches to do 1 job given what the agent stated and that they have had Evans tapped since before he joined up with BU at OSU. My opinion is if they had dirt on BU already he would have been named by now.   That being said,  do I think BU is going to be questioned by the FBI, yes.   Do I think that 95% of all high major D1 coaches and probably many more than that are gonna be questioned as well, absolutely.  I would even bet that Travis Ford gets questioned as well (not implying i think he done anything)  this investigation is going to be an ongoing thing for a while and who knows how far it will stretch

[Cowboy]

1 hour ago, Coach314 said:

I agree with your first two points.  As for AAU...the shoe companies have ruined it.  At the high level most AAU teams are sponsored by shoe companies.  They give them a budget to pay for their season.  They put the demands on coaches to produce results or lose their sponsorship.  So you can imagine the battle for the accumulation of players. Some of these coaches have no shame in that regard.  In addition they have the teams play in tournaments and Leagues so the college coaches sometimes get exclusive looks at the players in an effort to steer them to a University they sponsor.  Shoe companies even sponsoring High Schools now.  The competition to find the next "star" to promote is becoming unhealthy for the sport.  

-guessing the shoe companies pay the AAU coaches?

[willie]

7 hours ago, STL Hoops Insider said:

People who are already rich don't commit financial crimes?

Not true. Bernie Madoff, Ken Lay, the tyco guy, countless rich guys being indighted for security fraud. 

[CGMAN618]

39 minutes ago, willie said:

Not true. Bernie Madoff, Ken Lay, the tyco guy, countless rich guys being indighted for security fraud. 

He was questioning a statement I made about how the shoe exec. stated that they don't go after head coaches because they made too much money already

[brianstl]

I think I read somewhere last night that congressional hearings are on the way.

[CGMAN618]

1 hour ago, brianstl said:

I think I read somewhere last night that congressional hearings are on the way.

Yep.  House Energy and Commerce committee wants to be briefed

[CGMAN618]

I would be willing to bet before it is all said and done,  there will be some NCAA officials that go down for this as well

[HoosierPal]

1 hour ago, CGMAN618 said:

I would be willing to bet before it is all said and done,  there will be some NCAA officials that go down for this as well

I have no idea who in the NCAA might get the axe.  But for sure, there will be cosmic changes in the NCAA, and they better be sooner than later.  The NCAA cannot wait for the FBI to get done with this investigation and say, okay, thanks for cleaning this up, we're good to go.  Change in the NCAA is normally exceeding slow. On this issue, they need immediate action.  Unfortunately, the Committee's in the NCAA are comprised of school officials.  Do they have the cojones to cut their money tree down.?

The FBI didn't spend 2 years investigating this case to nail four idiot assistant coaches.  There will be more.  If you are a Top Level Recruit, you are under suspicion.  Sorry.  If you are a top level recruit who recently flipped a commitment, you are under high suspicion.  If you are a P5 (or 6) school, your are guilty until cleared.   Unfortunately, in the eyes on the public, or maybe I should say in my eyes, you are guilty until shown innocent. 

So what will the NCAA do?  Why didn't the NCAA police this?   They don't have the power of subpoena, coaches don't have to talk to them, but they got caught with their pants down.

Will this be the trigger for the 4 leagues x 16 teams, with the 64 teams leaving the NCAA? 

Will the NCAA ban contracts with shoe companies? 

Paying players may be the right thing to do, but that won't stop this nonsense.  NCAA:  "Here  Player 1 is your check for $10,000.  There will be a similar check each year you play at any NCAA university."  Adidas, "Hey, come play at Louisville and I'll give you $100,000 you can add to the NCAA $10,000."

 

[RUBillsFan]

This is probably useful in assessing which recruits might end up where.  Just cross reference with the players AAU team.  Unfortunately A-10 is not listed.  We know SLU is Nike I'm assuming we can fill in the others pretty easily.

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/10/02/adidas-nike-under-armour-contracts-schools-conferences?utm_campaign=si-ncaabb&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&xid=socialflow_twitter_si

AMERICAN

Cincinnati: Under Armour
Connecticut: Nike
East Carolina: Adidas
Houston: Nike
Memphis: Nike
SMU: Nike
South Florida: Under Armour
Temple: Under Armour
Tulane: Nike
Tulsa: Adidas
UCF: Nike
Wichita State: Under Armour

ACC

Boston College: Under Armour
Clemson: Nike
Duke: Nike
Florida State: Nike
Georgia Tech: Russell Athletic*
Louisville: Adidas
Miami: Adidas
NC State: Adidas
North Carolina: Nike
Notre Dame: Under Armour
Pittsburgh: Nike
Syracuse: Nike
Virginia: Nike
Virginia Tech: Nike
Wake Forest: Nike

*Georgia Tech will switch to Adidas in 2018

BIG 12

Baylor: Nike
Iowa State: Nike
Kansas: Adidas
Kansas State: Nike
Oklahoma: Nike
Oklahoma State: Nike
TCU: Nike
Texas: Nike
Texas Tech: Under Armour
West Virginia: Nike

BIG EAST

Butler: Nike
Creighton: Nike
DePaul: Nike
Georgetown: Nike
Marquette: Nike
Providence: Nike
Seton Hall: Under Armour
St. John’s: Under Armour
Xavier: Nike
Villanova: Nike

BIG TEN

Illinois: Nike
Indiana: Adidas
Iowa: Nike
Maryland: Under Armour
Michigan: Nike
Michigan State: Nike
Minnesota: Nike
Nebraska: Adidas
Northwestern: Under Armour
Ohio State: Nike
Penn State: Nike
Purdue: Nike
Rutgers: Adidas
Wisconsin: Under Armour

PAC-12

Arizona: Nike
Arizona State: Adidas
California: Under Armour
Colorado: Under Armour
Oregon: Nike
Oregon State: Nike
Stanford: Nike
UCLA: Under Armour
USC: Nike
Utah: Under Armour
Washington: Nike
Washington State: Nike

SEC

Alabama: Nike
Arkansas: Nike
Auburn: Under Armour
Florida: Nike
Georgia: Nike
Kentucky: Nike
LSU: Nike
Mississippi State: Adidas
Missouri: Nike
Ole Miss: Nike
South Carolina: Under Armour
Tennessee: Nike
Texas A&M: Adidas
Vanderbilt: Nike

[majerus mojo]

NY Times with a good read on details surrounding the scheme/Bowen: https://nyti.ms/2xUgm3X

[Pistol]

Really good read. I doubt he ever plays a college basketball game. Are there any other players implicated (yet)? With 6 schools and at least 10 individuals so far, there are certainly other players who were involved but I haven't seen any others.

Meanwhile, the NCAA says it will announce infractions for UNC tomorrow at noon. This process has been interminable.

[RiseAndGrind]

6 minutes ago, Pistol said:

Really good read. I doubt he ever plays a college basketball game. Are there any other players implicated (yet)? With 6 schools and at least 10 individuals so far, there are certainly other players who were involved but I haven't seen any others.

Meanwhile, the NCAA says it will announce infractions for UNC tomorrow at noon. This process has been interminable.

If I'm Bowen, I'm just headed overseas. Get a couple hundred grand and wait for he draft. Then again, if I was any McDonald's All American, that is what I would do, regardless of eligibility issues or not. 

[Cowboy]

42 minutes ago, Pistol said:

Really good read. I doubt he ever plays a college basketball game. Are there any other players implicated (yet)? With 6 schools and at least 10 individuals so far, there are certainly other players who were involved but I haven't seen any others.

Meanwhile, the NCAA says it will announce infractions for UNC tomorrow at noon. This process has been interminable.

-i agree that's a good read of a slimy subject - - I have not seen more on this since the initial activity

-so what does UNC get, if anything?  does the NCAA feel some wind in their punishment sails with this FBI deal to throw the book at Saint Roy and the rest of the Tar Heels? I think not, I will be surprised if the punishment is more than what would be categorized as a slap on the wrist and one of the reasons will be that the student/athletes now at the school were not the ones there at the time of the academic fraud - -I hope to be surprised

[Pistol]

I have no idea what to guess, in terms of UNC's penalties. It's hard to look at it without greater context now. Part of me thinks they moved up the announcement (it was expected weeks later, from my understanding) to assert themselves because the FBI is doing what they've never been able to do, and therefore they'll want to show some muscle. The other part of me thinks that they're using this timeline because they know the story will go underreported while a much bigger story is swirling. Or maybe it has nothing to do with it, and the timing is a coincidence, and the penalties for UNC will not be affected by wider circumstances. You'll probably hear cases for all three of these perspectives once UNC's verdict is announced, depending on the writer's perspective.

[willie]

They are going to throw the book at UNC. 

[cheeseman]

35 minutes ago, Cowboy said:

-i agree that's a good read of a slimy subject - - I have not seen more on this since the initial activity

-so what does UNC get, if anything?  does the NCAA feel some wind in their punishment sails with this FBI deal to throw the book at Saint Roy and the rest of the Tar Heels? I think not, I will be surprised if the punishment is more than what would be categorized as a slap on the wrist and one of the reasons will be that the student/athletes now at the school were not the ones there at the time of the academic fraud - -I hope to be surprised

You can make that argument for any penalty the NCAA hands down seldom does it affect the coach or players who were there at the time of the infraction.  Punishment is still handed down.

[billiken_roy]

4 minutes ago, willie said:

They are going to throw the book at UNC. 

i hope you are right, but i think as one of the blue bloods that more or less run the ncaa i say it will be a slap on the wrist.   now if the offending party was some mid major from the midwest with little national success......yes they would throw the book at them.  i would love to celebrate a massive penalty to unc tomorrow though so i hope i am wrong.  

[Cowboy]

-from a Raliegh paper, i highlighted a part that makes me think not much is happening as why would what I will call justice for 18 years of fraud be delayed for the start of a fund raising campaign? and they couldn't upset the Chapel Hill social calendar....

CHAPEL HILL The NCAA’s final investigative report in the long-running UNC-Chapel Hill case will not be released on Friday, as was originally intended, the university announced on Thursday.

Parties associated with the investigation received notice on Thursday morning that the NCAA Committee on Infractions planned to release its final report, which will include penalties, on Friday at noon, according to a source with knowledge of the case.

Based on the source’s report that an email had been sent out by the NCAA, The News & Observer tweeted on Thursday morning that the ruling was expected to be released on Friday.

Hours after the NCAA sent that email, though, the university announced that the NCAA’s final report would not be released on Friday due to “scheduling circumstances.” UNC on Friday is set to announce a multibillion-dollar fundraising campaign, and campus events are scheduled throughout the weekend.

“Due to scheduling circumstances, there will be no release (on Friday) regarding the NCAA Committee on Infractions decision,” Joel Curran, UNC’s vice chancellor of communications, said in a statement. “We have not yet received the Committee’s public infractions report. We anticipate we will be informed 24 hours prior to the actual release at a later date.”

Institutions under major NCAA investigation are notified 24 hours before the NCAA Committee on Infractions intends to release its final investigative report. Though schools receive a day’s notice that the report is coming, they might not receive a copy of the report until the morning before it is released.

That the NCAA intended to release its findings on Friday indicates that the infractions committee completed its work sooner than anticipated. The standard length of time for the committee to release its findings is between eight to 12 weeks; UNC appeared before the committee about seven weeks ago.

That appearance, in Nashville, Tenn., spanned two days. University officials, including chancellor Carol Folt and athletic director Bubba Cunningham, attended the hearing, which lasted approximately 15 hours. UNC men’s basketball coach Roy Williams attended the hearing for both days, as did women’s basketball coach Sylvia Hatchell. Larry Fedora, the football coach, attended the first day.

The NCAA’s investigation has focused on how bogus African Studies courses helped UNC athletes maintain their eligibility. The classes existed for 18 years, from 1993 through 2011, but the NCAA investigation has focused on half that time – from 2002 through 2011.

UNC is facing five Level I allegations – the most serious the NCAA can levy. Among those allegations are a lack of institutional control, and that the university’s athletic department conspired to provide athletes impermissible benefits in the form of access to the courses at the heart of the investigation.

The case has been marked by several unusual delays. The NCAA issued its first Notice of Allegations in May 2015, before UNC provided the NCAA with new information that halted the case. The NCAA then issued a second NOA in April 2016.

The case then appeared headed for a date with the infractions committee, but a procedural hearing with members of that committee brought another delay. The NCAA issued a third NOA last December, and the case finally went before the infractions committee in August.

The penalties that UNC is facing have remained uncertain. At their most severe, the sanctions could include postseason bans and the vacation of victories, including, potentially, at least one national championship in men’s basketball. More benign penalties could include probation and a fine.

[Old guy]

Correct me if I am wrong in this one but it seems to me that the NCAA investigation actions and assessment of penalties is running in parallel to the FBI fraud investigation and arrests of multiple coaches. 

[kshoe]

https://www.diehards.com/oklahoma-state/new-york-grand-jury-subpoenas-oklahoma-state-ncaa-violations-records

 

http://newsok.com/article/5567594?utm_source=NewsOK.com&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=ShareBar-Twitter

This isn't good. Says they are requesting extensive information for all current OSU players going back to Jan 1. 2014.