Pistol Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 This new MVC is nothing more than one reporter's pipe dream. This move would just entrench us in Mid-Major Hell, the biggest reason why I think joining the Valley would have been a big mistake for SLU in the first place. The A10 is the best non-BCS conference over the long term, and teams there don't quite have the ceiling that teams in other non-BCS conferences have- Xavier now, and in the past Temple, UMass, St. Joe's have shown that A10 programs can compete at the highest level. As it stands now, we're a program that's building and the goal is to be consistently in the top 50. Joining a conference like this would be pissing that goal away. It would feel to me like we'd be handcuffing our potential to grow. With that change of scenery, I'd also probably not renew my season tickets. I would have a tough time supporting a program that doesn't share my hopes for its potential. Plus, the MVC would never, ever just kick those 4 out without something unusual happening. And while it would be adding two big markets, it would also be adding two more small ones. I would never, ever want to be associated with a place like Oral Roberts, either- I would hope SLU does not share any ideological similarities with that place...or tax fraud habits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satrap Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 if they ever build a new gym they will imporve. I just don't seeing them replacing that gym, which is the oldest D1 gym still in use. Hopefully they will imporve because they are a similar school as Bay Area Bill said, catholic, jesuit, and don't forget urban. I was fooling around on their website the weekend we played them. Rose Hill Gym has been renovated in the recent past- it's old part is the outer edifice (which is beautiful and the only reason it's still used). So the reason for small crowds has nothing to do with the gym. A new gym would be a money pit and is out of the question, probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satrap Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 No, I'm a double SLU grad. But my son is a sophomore at Fordham. He was at the U2 concert today, which was less than a block from his dorm room. Fordham is great. I would love for my daughter to go there eventually. She won't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bay Area Billiken Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I think Fordham could improve if they want to. They have one benefit SLU does not have. They are in the capital of the world NYC. If they could get some of the numerous local recruits and if they ever build a new gym they will imporve. I just don't seeing them replacing that gym, which is the oldest D1 gym still in use. Hopefully they will imporve because they are a similar school as Bay Area Bill said, catholic, jesuit, and don't forget urban. Fordham fans post at www.fordhamfans.com, and they talk about the "Men in Black Suits," (the Jesuits). Those "Men in Black Suits" are the ones that ultimately will have to make the decision re Fordham hoops. I've met the Fordham President, Father McShane, several times. He doesn't seem to me like the guy that likes to lose. He's a New York native and a Yankee fan. When Fordham beat Holy Cross two years ago in football, Father McShane was the celebrant for the post-game Mass. He said, "Don't you wish we could truck Georgetown in here and play them tomorrow?" As for the facility, remember, if Fordham ever started winning again, since Fordham is in New York City, there are other big possible, albeit off campus venues, like Madison Square Garden, or the Nets' Arena across the Hudson River in the New Jersey Meadowlands. Last year's Fordham Seniors were the first Fordham class to never play a game at Madison Square Garden. Rose Hill Gym is not that bad; it's been renovated. It's just too small, and a lot of the seating is behind the baskets. Official capacity is 3,470, but they haven't needed all those seats this lost season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I would never, ever want to be associated with a place like Oral Roberts, either- I would hope SLU does not share any ideological similarities with that place...or tax fraud habits. But they have big praying hands on campus. Come on. BIG PRAYING HANDS, I SAY! Were they praying they wouldn't get caught? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bay Area Billiken Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 But they have big praying hands on campus. Come on. BIG PRAYING HANDS, I SAY! Were they praying they wouldn't get caught? It would seem better for SLU to be associated with Xavier, St. Joseph's, Fordham, Dayton, etc. than ORU. SLU's been there already. Plus, in the early MCC days, when I was still there, SLU had plenty of trouble with ORU. Where teams put their name on the baselines, ORU's court said, "Expect a Miracle." ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Mary's Dragon Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I was fooling around on their website the weekend we played them. Rose Hill Gym has been renovated in the recent past- it's old part is the outer edifice (which is beautiful and the only reason it's still used). So the reason for small crowds has nothing to do with the gym. A new gym would be a money pit and is out of the question, probably. The 3,470 seat gym-Fordham website I think this does have something to do with the gym. They usually don't fill it and for the big games, Xavier, theres only 3470 seats. Thats a 1/3 the size of Chaifetz at a university (thanks Bay Area) including grad students has almost 3000 more students than SLU, but is also in the biggest city in the US, far bigger than the STL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bay Area Billiken Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 The 3,470 seat gym-Fordham website I think this does have something to do with the gym. They usually don't fill it and for the big games, Xavier, theres only 3470 seats. Thats a 1/3 the size of Chaifetz at a university that is aproximately 2000 students smaller than SLU, but also in the biggest city in the US far bigger than the STL. If you count the grad students, Fordham has over 15,000 students, spread out over two principal campuses (Rose Hill in The Bronx and Lincoln Center on Manhattan). The football stadium seats 7,500, all on one side, and I've seen it filled or nearly filled twice. But I've been told that the two times I was there (Family Weekend) were the biggest crowds each season, which is understandable. I doubt Fordham would have any problem filling Rose Hill Gym if Fordham had a good basketball team. The current Fordham basketball situation reminds me in some ways of my SLU undergrad days during The Ron Ekker Era. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bay Area Billiken Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I was fooling around on their website the weekend we played them. Rose Hill Gym has been renovated in the recent past- it's old part is the outer edifice (which is beautiful and the only reason it's still used). So the reason for small crowds has nothing to do with the gym. A new gym would be a money pit and is out of the question, probably. Just so you folks know where my loyalty lies, when my son picked Fordham, I told him that SLU would beat his Fordham Rams all 4 years he is there. So far, SLU is 2-0 against Fordham, so I'm half way there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbofive Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Just so you folks know where my loyalty lies, when my son picked Fordham, I told him that SLU would beat his Fordham Rams all 4 years he is there. So far, SLU is 2-0 against Fordham, so I'm half way there. HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Are you sure Xavier and UD( particularly Xavier) are in this with you? Last re-structure you were confident that Depaul and Marquette were your buddies to the end. JMO but, next re-alignment, Xavier will be going alone to a big time conference (probably BE basketball teams). That is revisionist history. There may have been some wishful hoping by some at SLU but once it became apparent that it wasn't just Louisville leaving CUSA and that the Big East was going to this 16 team conference and would need 2 basketball only schools added to the mix, we knew our goose was cooked. I do agree that the idea of "once the Big East breaks up SLU will get into the perfect conference" talk is a bunch of bs. That will happen ONLY if SLU gets good and stays consistently good similar to where Xavier is currently at and becomes a desired commodity. I, for one, believe Majerus can make this happen but there is no doubt in my mind that if the break-up happened tomorrow we'd be left out in the cold. The break-up would be some form of the 8 Big East basketball only teams going off on there own and taking the top 4 (Xavier, Dayton, Temple, St. Joes, UMass) from this group to create a 12 team league. We need to get near the top of that list so that we can join the party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOSLU68 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 That is revisionist history. There may have been some wishful hoping by some at SLU but once it became apparent that it wasn't just Louisville leaving CUSA and that the Big East was going to this 16 team conference and would need 2 basketball only schools added to the mix, we knew our goose was cooked. I do agree that the idea of "once the Big East breaks up SLU will get into the perfect conference" talk is a bunch of bs. That will happen ONLY if SLU gets good and stays consistently good similar to where Xavier is currently at and becomes a desired commodity. I, for one, believe Majerus can make this happen but there is no doubt in my mind that if the break-up happened tomorrow we'd be left out in the cold. The break-up would be some form of the 8 Big East basketball only teams going off on there own and taking the top 4 (Xavier, Dayton, Temple, St. Joes, UMass) from this group to create a 12 team league. We need to get near the top of that list so that we can join the party. Could the moderators close this thread and start a OT for people who want to worry about something that is not going to happen in the foreseeable future. We are in the A-10 conference because the jebbies consider this the right fit for us. You want your kids to go to grad school in Northern Iowa wherever that is or Evansville that is fine; if I was spending the bucks it takes to go to SLU and I have two degrees from SLU although a long time ago I sure wouldn't aspire to a teaching degree from the third or fourth best public school in a state. You are going to spend a career at UMSL or a JUCO as a teacher you are not going to be a much discussed academic who has papers and books that are referred to as expert. You are condemning yourself to 2nd or 3rd class citizenship. These are all great schools for an undergrad degree but we are talking about academic presitiege. We may be a level below Michigan or Harvard or Yale because of East Coast bias but we have invaded the East Coast population by being part of the A10. If Doug Elgin leaves the MVC which is going to happen by either career change or retirement you have an absolutely barren league that used to have Memphis, Depaul, Louisville, SLU, etc. That is ancient history. It is a wanabee group trying to cling on to a history that ceased to exist 20 or more years ago-let it live on its on merits as a one seed league. ok in some years two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB73 Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 We shoulda gone to the MVC. Too late now. Most Billiken fans know this, except a few 2,000-posts-a-month-guys on this message board keep saying that it is right that we got into the A-10 because of philisophical similarities. Like fans, players, etc, pay attention to that Does Duke leave the ACC even though they are a top 5-10 school but Fla State is a school with thug athletes garlore? We needed a geographical conference, we are a mid major. OF COURSE it would be great if everything falls into line and we wind up with X, Dayton, DePaul, Marq, ND, etc. Not going to happen. A-10 = huge mistake; live with it and gut it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majerus Magic Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Wait a second. I thought we wanted to kick out Fordham. But then we couldn't promise recruits those great trips to New York city. Because you know how important that is to a recruit. They have all that free time to go to the Met and MOMA. I wonder how KU suceeds in convincing kids to go to little ol Lawrence and make trips to Ames and Columbia, etc.Agree with Post. It doesn't matter if they are going to NYC to play....in Rose Hill Gym. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STLfan Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What do you think about a conference like this. Play everyone home and away. Help build rivalries. New Conference Butler Bradley Creighton Drake Dayton Duquesne Evansville Saint Louis Xavier Facilities: Arena Capacity 17,560 – Creighton 13,409 – Dayton 12,116 – Evansville 11,433 – Bradley 10,600 – Saint Louis 10,250 – Xavier 10,000 – Butler 7,002 – Drake 6,200 – Duquesne 2007-2008 Attendance 15,333 – Creighton 12,479 – Dayton 10,008 – Xavier 9,600 – Bradley 8,837 – Saint Louis 6,038 – Drake 5,945 – Butler 5,486 – Evansville 3,091 – Duquesne NCAA Tournament Bids 19 – Xavier 16 – Creighton 13 – Dayton 8 – Bradley 8 – Butler 6 – Saint Louis 5 – Duquesne 5 – Evansville 4 – Drake Enrollment 10,633 – Saint Louis 9,970 – Dayton 9,617 – Duquesne 6,716 – Creighton 6,646 – Xavier 6,105 – Bradley 5,221 – Drake 4,200 – Butler 2,350 – Evansville Drake, Evansville, and Duquesne aren't world beaters but every conference has a few teams like this. Plus it would be great to play Bradley, Butler, Creighton, Dayton, and Xavier home and away every season. All private schools in a conference that should be good enough to get 3 or 4 bids to the dance each year. A conference like this could be a long term home for SLU and these other programs. Also it doesn't include any unrealistic Big East teams leaving the Big East on their own or waiting around till the Big East explodes. I think this league would immediately be the deepest and most consistent non-bcs basketball conference out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satrap Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What do you think about a conference like this. Butler Bradley Creighton Drake Dayton Duquesne Evansville Saint Louis Xavier That is a great conference, seriously. The only thing missing is Fordham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 What do you think about a conference like this. Play everyone home and away. Help build rivalries. New Conference Butler Bradley Creighton Drake Dayton Duquesne Evansville Saint Louis Xavier Facilities: Arena Capacity 17,560 – Creighton 13,409 – Dayton 12,116 – Evansville 11,433 – Bradley 10,600 – Saint Louis 10,250 – Xavier 10,000 – Butler 7,002 – Drake 6,200 – Duquesne 2007-2008 Attendance 15,333 – Creighton 12,479 – Dayton 10,008 – Xavier 9,600 – Bradley 8,837 – Saint Louis 6,038 – Drake 5,945 – Butler 5,486 – Evansville 3,091 – Duquesne NCAA Tournament Bids 19 – Xavier 16 – Creighton 13 – Dayton 8 – Bradley 8 – Butler 6 – Saint Louis 5 – Duquesne 5 – Evansville 4 – Drake Enrollment 10,633 – Saint Louis 9,970 – Dayton 9,617 – Duquesne 6,716 – Creighton 6,646 – Xavier 6,105 – Bradley 5,221 – Drake 4,200 – Butler 2,350 – Evansville Drake, Evansville, and Duquesne aren't world beaters but every conference has a few teams like this. Plus it would be great to play Bradley, Butler, Creighton, Dayton, and Xavier home and away every season. All private schools in a conference that should be good enough to get 3 or 4 bids to the dance each year. A conference like this could be a long term home for SLU and these other programs. Also it doesn't include any unrealistic Big East teams leaving the Big East on their own or waiting around till the Big East explodes. I think this league would immediately be the deepest and most consistent non-bcs basketball conference out there. The Dukes seem out of place. I'm not sure why you include Evansville. There must be better options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownwolves Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 By Tom Timmermann ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH 03/07/2009 "A year ago, St. Louis University's basketball season trailed off into oblivion., SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and Duquesne" " This season is showing some resemblance to last year, SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and lost a late lead and fell at Duquesne. " and you guys want to go where??? Just because your going to another Confrence your going to somehow do better there??? YOU CANT EVEN WIN THE A-10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesycow Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Bernie made an interesting point about the geographical notion on his radio program the other day. Talked about how in this economy it must be expensive to send the non-revenue sports to the east coast all the time for their games. Obviously SLU wouldn't go under or anything, but it is an interesting consideration. When your closest road game is in ohio, you're spending a lot of change on travel expenses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 By Tom Timmermann ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH 03/07/2009 "A year ago, St. Louis University's basketball season trailed off into oblivion., SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and Duquesne" " This season is showing some resemblance to last year, SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and lost a late lead and fell at Duquesne. " and you guys want to go where??? Just because your going to another Confrence your going to somehow do better there??? YOU CANT EVEN WIN THE A-10. congratulations on another A-10 championship for St Bonaventure. the Bonnies are the example that the whole league should strive to become. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesycow Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 congratulations on another A-10 championship for St Bonaventure. the Bonnies are the example that the whole league should strive to become.go easy on him roy, he's still on his troll-training wheels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 go easy on him roy, he's still on his troll-training wheels.They are pumped in Olean. It is not every year they get a chance to play in the conference tournament. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownwolves Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 It seems you guys are the one who want to jump ship. Us poor dumb country welders just enjoy taking your money and this listening on the radio how SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and Duquesne. Please don't go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 It seems you guys are the one who want to jump ship. Us poor dumb country welders just enjoy taking your money and this listening on the radio how SLU got thumped by St. Bonaventure and Duquesne. Please don't go!Are you guys going to put up a banner for making the A-10 tournament? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLIKNS Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 One thing I have to wonder is will any Valley schools will look to turn to D-1A??SIU,Northern Iowa and Mo State have had strong programs in the past,could football become an issue with the Valley? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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