billikenfan05 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Seriously? Yeah seriously. Travis Ford is an okay hire and that's fine. You post like an 8 year old throwing a temper tantrum. Just as coaches have to go through stepping stones so do programs. We're bottom the of NCAA now. Ford has to win. He can rehab this program and his career and when he leaves for greener pastures we'll he better positioned to bring in a hot shot up and comer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizziken Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 -check out Dawkins record at Stanford versus his predecessors, not good, what UCF sees in him is not what I see -Quinn, I don't think the Mizzou folks would consider him a success -Bender, not much -Capel is back under K's wing on the Duke bench, why? Blake Griffin was great on the elite 8 run but this points to one of my red flags on coaches, did they have success with one player or recruiting class that defines their time at that school, normally this happens to coaches at lower levels who get hired by the big boys, is the new OKST coach an example? I'm not sure -I'll give Collins and Wojo a pass -Brey is the lone bright light from what i see I'm not really advocating for any of these guys to be the next SLU coach...but I would take Capel and I would at least consider Dawkins. At the very least on par with Ford. I certainly wouldn't consider any of them (outside of Brey) to be home runs. But Dawkins did win the NIT twice and went to the Sweet 16 while at Stanford. That's a pretty good run considering the academic qualifications needed for the University. And Capel did okay at VCU. Sure he underachieved at Oklahoma, but he's had 5 years under Coach K to refine his skillset. He is being looked at for the GT job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 What's pathetic is that most fans have set the bar so utterly low for this program. It's not that we have unrealistic expectations, we just don't want to settle for being a mediocre program while having incredible facilities/funding which gives slu a very high ceiling. Reasonable Yeah seriously. Travis Ford is an okay hire and that's fine. You post like an 8 year old throwing a temper tantrum. Just as coaches have to go through stepping stones so do programs. We're bottom the of NCAA now. Ford has to win. He can rehab this program and his career and when he leaves for greener pastures we'll he better positioned to bring in a hot shot up and comer. Meh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Reasonable Meh Do we have the funds? I've heard that budget is currently a big issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Do we have the funds? I've heard that budget is currently a big issue. I thought we've been reading $1.5M+ for a new coach for weeks now... Is anything on this board based in fact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I thought we've been reading $1.5M+ for a new coach for weeks now... Is anything on this board based in factNo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChosenOne Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 That's why I prefer the nitwittery on 920. Oh gosh yeah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 No Cool. Just don't see a reason to rip other posters because they haven't "reached zen" with this hiring as quickly. You hated it immediately also did you not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Ford's assistants his last year were James Dickey - longtime head coach, can recruit in Texas, Butch Pierre, who was briefly the interim head coach at LSU and Bill Grier... this is a guy who could be a good fit as an assistant here. Fired from San Diego as HC, but was an assistant at Gonzaga for 15 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Cool. Just don't see a reason to rip other posters because they haven't "reached zen" with this hiring as quickly. You hated it immediately also did you not?I did indeed, however I wasn't screaming like chicken little with my head cut off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2010andBeyond Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I thought we've been reading $1.5M+ for a new coach for weeks now... Is anything on this board based in fact This and the handshake agreement with Drew were rumors started on this board. There has been ZERO insider info on our coaching search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChosenOne Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 That's just infuriating. Just because we don't want to settle for Travis Ford doesn't mean we expect an all-time great coach to land on campus. The other coaches most of us have said we'd prefer are entirely reasonable hires for SLU - assistants, coaches from smaller programs. It's pathetic they have to make up a straw man in order to insult us. Yeah, that is pretty pathetic. All SLU fans don't love the hiring of a guy who is consistently an underachiever, viewed as a poor coach, and was fired, so they would only be happy with Coach K. Gotta love the base level arguments these sports media guys have with themselves. Choke on a sausage Bernie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Law Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I thought we've been reading $1.5M+ for a new coach for weeks now... Is anything on this board based in fact Damn good point. We've read $1.5 to $2 million. First, where did people get those amounts, and second, if Drew were making $300,000 at Valpo why would we be bidding against ourselves to give the guy a $1.7 million raise and pay more that double what the highest paid coach in the A10 currently makes> Now it is certainly possible the numbers are correct but likely the amount available for the entire coaching staff, not just the head coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Yeah, that is pretty pathetic. All SLU fans don't love the hiring of a guy who is consistently an underachiever, viewed as a poor coach, and was fired, so they would only be happy with Coach K. Gotta love the base level arguments these sports media guys have with themselves. Choke on a sausage Bernie. "I'm outraged about this thing that never happened!" It's insane behavior. SLU Fans: We need someone who can recruit and coach us to the Sweet Sixteen, and we can pay pretty well. We have the market, the facilities, and the resources. There's no reason a good coach can't succeed here. Local Media: The program is in the dumps, be happy with whatever you can get. SLU Fans: We have reasonable expectations - Bryce Drew, ideally, but if not, then a really solid assistant like Ingelsby, Rice, Oetzelberger - someone like that. Local Media: Tom Izzo?! Coach K?! What's wrong with you people?! SLU Fans: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 The financial situation is a terrible excuse, but it's the only excuse I could see for hiring Ford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheA_Bomb Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Do we have the funds? I've heard that budget is currently a big issue. 05 not sure why you're pumping sunshine. I'm normally even keel on these things but I'm real unhappy with this alleged hire. So I wanted to make sure my feelings were warranted with evidence. I feel that Leon Rice would be a better hire but he hasn't won in the NCAA either and has less games. So my feeling is based on what I think Leon Rice's potential ceiling compared to Ford. I think we can see what Ford's ceiling is 1-6 in the tournament, good recruiter, but underachieving. Here's a deeper look at his NCAA tournament games: 2005 (coaching EKU) 15 seed Loss to #2 Seed UK 72-64 (respectable) 2009 (now OSU 1st season as HC) 8 seed 77-75 win over Tenn; 84-76 loss to #1 seed Pitt (respectable) 2010 7 64-59 loss to #10 seed GT (meh) 2011 NIT 3 seed W over 6 seed Harvard 71-54 loss vs #2 seed Washington St 74-64 (ok) 2013 5 seed loss to #12 Oregon 68-55 (Oregon goes on to beat SLU) 2014 9 seed loss to #8 Zags 85-77 (ok) 2015 9 seed loss to #8 Oregon (ok) No runs, no Cinderella stories, all with bigtime players like Marcus Smart that run into the stands and attack the opposing FANS. It's on film watch it that's his recruit. Leon Rice on the other hand 2013 13 seed vs 13 LaSalle 80-71 Loss (OK) (first 4 game) 2015 11 seed vs 11 Dayton 56-55 Not enough evidence to make a definitive determination on his ceiling. Though I do like that Boise St. doesn't normally have BB success and he is doing well there and has years of experience at Gonzaga a school similar to SLU that we'd like to emulate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChosenOne Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 The financial situation is a terrible excuse, but it's the only excuse I could see for hiring Ford. Anyone who has followed the Big 12 at all over the past 10 seasons has to be questioning this one big time. He is the white country boy version of Frank Haith. Recruits well, but still manages to finish around .500 in conference play regardless of how good that talent is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 My thing about Ford is that terrible coaching is terrible coaching anywhere. Sure you can talk about hiring a great X's and O's assistant. Why didn't we hire a stud recruiter and a stud X's and O's guy to help out Crews? It's a great idea in theory, but I doubt it ever becomes more than an idea in reality. There have been complaints from OK St and UMass fans that Ford never recruits a complete roster. Ends up with 6'6 skinny guys as his big men. Ends up with a backcourt of drivers and no shooters. Ends up with a shooter who can't see the floor because he can't defend. I assume he will bring in good talent here, but if they don't fit into a 13 man team and he can't coach them, who the hell cares? Ford will elevate our program from the dumpster that Jim Crews and Jim Platt put us in to. In 5 years, I see Ford either having done so great that he leaves and leaves us with hopefully a better roster than Crews has left us (our roster is terrible despite what some thing) or he leaves us with a talented roster that is finishing .500 in the A10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 05 not sure why you're pumping sunshine. I'm normally even keel on these things but I'm real unhappy with this alleged hire. So I wanted to make sure my feelings were warranted with evidence. I feel that Leon Rice would be a better hire but he hasn't won in the NCAA either and has less games. So my feeling is based on what I think Leon Rice's potential ceiling compared to Ford. I think we can see what Ford's ceiling is 1-6 in the tournament, good recruiter, but underachieving. Here's a deeper look at his NCAA tournament games: 2005 (coaching EKU) 15 seed Loss to #2 Seed UK 72-64 (respectable) 2009 (now OSU 1st season as HC) 8 seed 77-75 win over Tenn; 84-76 loss to #1 seed Pitt (respectable) 2010 7 64-59 loss to #10 seed GT (meh) 2011 NIT 3 seed W over 6 seed Harvard 71-54 loss vs #2 seed Washington St 74-64 (ok) 2013 5 seed loss to #12 Oregon 68-55 (Oregon goes on to beat SLU) 2014 9 seed loss to #8 Zags 85-77 (ok) 2015 9 seed loss to #8 Oregon (ok) No runs, no Cinderella stories, all with bigtime players like Marcus Smart that run into the stands and attack the opposing FANS. It's on film watch it that his recruit. Leon Rice on the other hand 2013 13 seed vs 13 LaSalle 80-71 Loss (OK) (first 4 game) 2015 11 seed vs 11 Dayton 56-55 Not enough evidence to make a definitive determination on his ceiling. Though I do like that Boise St. doesn't normally have BB success and he is doing well there and has years of experience at Gonzaga a school similar to SLU that we'd like to emulate. All things being equal, I think Rice is a more promising coach, but I'm not sure he is a better fit here. His entire coaching experience has been out West. Not sure how long it would take for him to adjust to the A-10 and the Midwest/East. Ford has already been in our league... his traditional recruiting area is also closer to us. I think he is more likely to hit the ground running on the recruiting trail. Also, he can bring along Bill Grier, his assistant from Okie State who was at Gozaga for 15 years if we want some of that Zags magic. He is also 6 years younger than Grier, so maybe still some room for improvement - even though it seems like he has been around a long time. As far as the assistants, I'd rather go with Ford. For every young hot shot like Brad Stevens, there are dozens of Dickie Pitino Jr. types. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 I'm not really advocating for any of these guys to be the next SLU coach...but I would take Capel and I would at least consider Dawkins. At the very least on par with Ford. I certainly wouldn't consider any of them (outside of Brey) to be home runs. But Dawkins did win the NIT twice and went to the Sweet 16 while at Stanford. That's a pretty good run considering the academic qualifications needed for the University. And Capel did okay at VCU. Sure he underachieved at Oklahoma, but he's had 5 years under Coach K to refine his skillset. He is being looked at for the GT job. -I understand you aren't advocating for them -look at Stanford's NCAA history pre Dawkins and then during his tenure, in the tourney 12 out of 13 times before he got there and once in his 8 years, I doubt their academic standards changed during this period so his time on The Farm is a big negative -this is my point, the Coach K tree isn't bearing fruit, with the exception of Brey, when seeds are taken outside Cameron so I would avoid it when picking a coach -I anticipate K's retirement in a few years and will be interested in who they select and how they do with K watching from the stands, or not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheA_Bomb Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 All things being equal, I think Rice is a more promising coach, but I'm not sure he is a better fit here. His entire coaching experience has been out West. Not sure how long it would take for him to adjust to the A-10 and the Midwest/East. Ford has already been in our league... his traditional recruiting area is also closer to us. I think he is more likely to hit the ground running on the recruiting trail. Also, he can bring along Bill Grier, his assistant from Okie State who was at Gozaga for 15 years if we want some of that Zags magic. He is also 6 years younger than Grier, so maybe still some room for improvement - even though it seems like he has been around a long time. As far as the assistants, I'd rather go with Ford. For every young hot shot like Brad Stevens, there are dozens of Dickie Pitino Jr. types. You guys really over state the Mid-west ties angle. If you're a good recruiter you get in good with the local coaches etc. Not all that magical. That can take time but it's not some insurmountable obstacle. I could see the argument for Stallings as we were already in recruiting battles with him so we were in the same hunting grounds. Rice has shown an ability to go where ever it takes to get recruits Australia, Germany, TX all outside the CONUS. I know ya'll don't speak English correctly in STL but do ya'll also drive on the wrong side of the road? Are elevators referred to as Lifts and toilets flush backwards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsmith19 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 Now Cusumano is implying that because Ford took a Big 12 state school to the tourney, he can take a private Jesuit A10 school to the tourney. Who is overrating the stature of the SLU program now? Totally upside down complaint about SLU fan expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 "I'm outraged about this thing that never happened!" It's insane behavior. SLU Fans: We need someone who can recruit and coach us to the Sweet Sixteen, and we can pay pretty well. We have the market, the facilities, and the resources. There's no reason a good coach can't succeed here. Local Media: The program is in the dumps, be happy with whatever you can get. SLU Fans: We have reasonable expectations - Bryce Drew, ideally, but if not, then a really solid assistant like Ingelsby, Rice, Oetzelberger - someone like that. Local Media: Tom Izzo?! Coach K?! What's wrong with you people?! SLU Fans: You hit the nail on the head re: the local sports media's -- particularly Bernie's -- behavior. Beyond having very little insight into SLU's program -- the Fastlane recently advocated for the Bills to join the MVC! -- it is the extreme pendulum swinging of reactionary hot takes that is damn near impossible to sit and listen to. Bernie, for instance, will create straw man after straw man from non-existent message boarders and internet commenters just so he can make some arbitrary point and grace us all with his infinite wisdom on whatever particular subject he is a definitive expert on. Look, I get that know-it-all bluster, 'strong' opinions and black-and-white debate are the name of the game, but can you keep it somewhere in the realm of reality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 30, 2016 Share Posted March 30, 2016 05 not sure why you're pumping sunshine. I'm normally even keel on these things but I'm real unhappy with this alleged hire. So I wanted to make sure my feelings were warranted with evidence. I feel that Leon Rice would be a better hire but he hasn't won in the NCAA either and has less games. So my feeling is based on what I think Leon Rice's potential ceiling compared to Ford. I think we can see what Ford's ceiling is 1-6 in the tournament, good recruiter, but underachieving. Here's a deeper look at his NCAA tournament games: 2005 (coaching EKU) 15 seed Loss to #2 Seed UK 72-64 (respectable) 2009 (now OSU 1st season as HC) 8 seed 77-75 win over Tenn; 84-76 loss to #1 seed Pitt (respectable) 2010 7 64-59 loss to #10 seed GT (meh) 2011 NIT 3 seed W over 6 seed Harvard 71-54 loss vs #2 seed Washington St 74-64 (ok) 2013 5 seed loss to #12 Oregon 68-55 (Oregon goes on to beat SLU) 2014 9 seed loss to #8 Zags 85-77 (ok) 2015 9 seed loss to #8 Oregon (ok) No runs, no Cinderella stories, all with bigtime players like Marcus Smart that run into the stands and attack the opposing FANS. It's on film watch it that's his recruit. Leon Rice on the other hand 2013 13 seed vs 13 LaSalle 80-71 Loss (OK) (first 4 game) 2015 11 seed vs 11 Dayton 56-55 Not enough evidence to make a definitive determination on his ceiling. Though I do like that Boise St. doesn't normally have BB success and he is doing well there and has years of experience at Gonzaga a school similar to SLU that we'd like to emulate. I'm not happy about this hire but i think most of the posters who are losing their are going overboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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