college rankings

[thefan]

Thought this was interesting from today's paper.

Washington U. ranked hign when Forbes Magazine released its list last week of America' best colleges.

West Point was first

Princeton was second

Wash U. was ranked 45th

Illinois was ranked 132

Mizzou was ranked 374

SLU was ranked 524

I am a graduate from SLU but always get very annoyed when some posters claim that SLU is the best thing ever. The only thing that really seperates SLU from the others is its Catholic i.d. I don't know what formula was used, but can we please stop the arguement that SLU academics is so superior then everyone else?

[bills10]

Thought this was interesting from today's paper.

Washington U. ranked hign when Forbes Magazine released its list last week of America' best colleges.

West Point was first

Princeton was second

Wash U. was ranked 45th

Illinois was ranked 132

Mizzou was ranked 374

SLU was ranked 524

I am a graduate from SLU but always get very annoyed when some posters claim that SLU is the best thing ever. The only thing that really seperates SLU from the others is its Catholic i.d. I don't know what formula was used, but can we please stop the arguement that SLU academics is so superior then everyone else?

i think you should look up the formula... Using 25% of the score from outdated ratemyprofessor.com ratings doesn't tell me which school is number 1. It's actually quite bogus, and think that other rankings (that have us much higher) are much more reputable.

[isotope]

It would be very enlightening to know what criteria Forbes used to determine their ranking. I can tell you that no one in academia (me included) would have ranked West Point first and Princeton second. So perhaps your conclusion is correct about SLU's place in the academic world, but basing your argument on Forbes' list is probably not a good idea.

[AlumniFan]

Thought this was interesting from today's paper.

Washington U. ranked hign when Forbes Magazine released its list last week of America' best colleges.

West Point was first

Princeton was second

Wash U. was ranked 45th

Illinois was ranked 132

Mizzou was ranked 374

SLU was ranked 524

I am a graduate from SLU but always get very annoyed when some posters claim that SLU is the best thing ever. The only thing that really seperates SLU from the others is its Catholic i.d. I don't know what formula was used, but can we please stop the arguement that SLU academics is so superior then everyone else?

God forbid a SLU graduate show any pride in his alma mater! That would be so horrible. I will just go around telling everyone that SLU sucks! Clearly, the only thing separating Meramec and SLU is SLU's Catholic identity...

BTW - Please do not tell people you are a SLU graduate because if they see the way you spell and compose sentences they will think SLU's academic prowess is as bad as you and Forbes suggest.

[SluSignGuy]

It would be very enlightening to know what criteria Forbes used to determine their ranking. I can tell you that no one in academia (me included) would have ranked West Point first and Princeton second. So perhaps your conclusion is correct about SLU's place in the academic world, but basing your argument on Forbes' list is probably not a good idea.

Seriously, Princeton second? Outraged! We just got an alum on the Supreme Court!

Those rankings (along with many college rankings) are a joke.

My thought (and hunch is) that at almost any school, you can get a pretty darn good education. The key is finding a few professors that will guide and push you the most. And even if you do go to a big name school, a lot of time the professors won't give you the time of day because they are so busy with their agendas. However, at all schools, there are some pretty darn good ones around, just got to find em.

[GOSLU68]

Seriously, Princeton second? Outraged! We just got an alum on the Supreme Court!

Those rankings (along with many college rankings) are a joke.

My thought (and hunch is) that at almost any school, you can get a pretty darn good education. The key is finding a few professors that will guide and push you the most. And even if you do go to a big name school, a lot of time the professors won't give you the time of day because they are so busy with their agendas. However, at all schools, there are some pretty darn good ones around, just got to find em.

This is a pretty fair rationale. I graduated over 40 years ago. I have two degrees from SLU and went to a couple of other schools for grad and undergrad.

I had great experiences at Illinois, BAC-now SWIC, I think. Wayne State, and of course SLU. I found excellent teachers and some barely tolerable

at most of the schools.

There was a difference for me at SLU-with many professors and students there was a a feeling of being there because they were happy with their choice.

[Box and Won]

God forbid a SLU graduate show any pride in his alma mater! That would be so horrible. I will just go around telling everyone that SLU sucks! Clearly, the only thing separating Meramec and SLU is SLU's Catholic identity...

BTW - Please do not tell people you are a SLU graduate because if they see the way you spell and compose sentences they will think SLU's academic prowess is as bad as you and Forbes suggest.

Seriously. (I may even be a little skeptical of the original poster's veracity.)

I think all of us who went to SLU have a pretty good understanding of where it stands in comparison to other colleges. It's a solid school. It's not Duke or Stanford by any means, but it's better than most.

I'm proud of my SLU degrees, and I'm constantly meeting or hearing about other SLU grads who are bright, quality people making a difference in the world.

Forbes, in its various rankings, would also have you believe that St. Peters is one of the top 10 places to live in the country, so take anything they say with a grain of salt.

[Taj79]

I have come to the conlcusion that the name of the school, sans a few elite schools in specialized fields, does not matter. What does matter is what YOU make of that education. Do YOU apply yourself? Do YOU go the extra mile to put your education to work? Do YOU inquire as to just what that extra mile is and how do YOU get to it or at least nearby?

A bachelor's degree is a prerequisite today. Much like a high school diploma was back in the 60's. Some guys in the 50's didn't even have that. But that is just the escalation. My kid today is being told that to practice physical therapy, they need a doctorate by 2012. My friend's kid just did her PT stuff --- undergrad at UofI and then on to the doctorate at University of Indianapolis. My other kid has a BS degree in paralegal in case she decides to go to law school. But that's the way the whole world is going. I don't believe one school means much over another. In fact, if you are going to go to school to be a teacher (which my wife is), I would offer that it makes more sense to go to a state school and get the prerequisites and bachelor's degree out of the way at a lesser cost. Going here to Towson for $6K a year makes much better sense than a McDaniel College for $28K a year for essentially the same degree. And even if you do get that BA in Maryland, and get certified, you still need essentially a Master's within the next six years.

Some schools do matter and if you're going to go be an engineer, well going to Georiga Tech, and Virginia Tech and Penn State makes better sense than a Towson or even a St. Louis University. Journalists (if that's even a job in today's world) should strongly consider going to Mizzou. Penn has a great school in the Warton School of Business. However, if you're an undecided major, I'd recommend hitting the community college until you know where you're headed.

When I was a kid and visiting college for the first time, we drove onto the campus of Ohio State. We got "stuck" behind a coed on a bike. Her black lace panties were hanging out the bottom of her cut-off shorts. In that arena, Ohio State will always be #1 to me. First impressions are lasting ones! Going to undergrad doesn't mean today what it meant a few short decades ago.

[courtside]

Seriously, Princeton second? Outraged! We just got an alum on the Supreme Court!

Those rankings (along with many college rankings) are a joke.

My thought (and hunch is) that at almost any school, you can get a pretty darn good education. The key is finding a few professors that will guide and push you the most. And even if you do go to a big name school, a lot of time the professors won't give you the time of day because they are so busy with their agendas. However, at all schools, there are some pretty darn good ones around, just got to find em.

+1

[SShoe]

Forbes, in its various rankings, would also have you believe that St. Peters is one of the top 10 places to live in the country, so take anything they say with a grain of salt.

Based on this ranking alone, I consider most Forbes lists to be about as credible as Andy Strickland's SLU connection.

[bills10]

Criteria: The methodology used in Forbes' 2008 inaugural edition of "America's Best Colleges" rankings has been modestly revised for 2009. As in 2008, we base 25% of the rankings on student satisfaction with their course instruction. Also, like last year, we base another 25% on indicators of post-graduate employment success, and one-sixth (16.67%) on the likelihood of graduation from college within four years. Last year, we weighted the estimated average four year student loan debt at one-sixth (16.67%) in the rankings. Given the rising costs, debt levels and associated concerns with this issue, we have increased the weight to 20% this year.

It is actually a long article, found at http://www.forbes.com/2009/08/02/best-coll...nions-ccap.html SLU is way better than where this list has it, imo

[TheA_Bomb]

TheFan is TheFake now way that dude went to SLU. SLU is the best University on the Planet because I went there. That is how I feel and will always feel no rankings will ever change that.

Many different ways to evaluate a school

You may want big state school with Football Saturdays

You may want a great books curriculum with with unique tests

You want military/tradition

You may want Catholicism, small classes, urban campus

It all depends on what you want and where you fit.

[tenthyearsenior]

These rankings are crazy. Mizzou can't have better academics and basketball program. That can't be right. F U Forbes.

[GOSLU68]

TheFan is TheFake now way that dude went to SLU. SLU is the best University on the Planet because I went there. That is how I feel and will always feel no rankings will ever change that.

Many different ways to evaluate a school

You may want big state school with Football Saturdays

You may want a great books curriculum with with unique tests

You want military/tradition

You may want Catholicism, small classes, urban campus

It all depends on what you want and where you fit.

When I was younger I would meet people who had no degree and confessed this as a ###### in their armor early on in your conversation as if it was holding them back. As I aged I met quite a few successful people who had no degree, yet succeeded and in some cases adopted a school like Notre Dame to follow and even support financially,

To me it is a matruing time that helps people learn how to persevere with the deadlines of institutions.

In some cases companies simply won't look at candidates who have not completed a four year degree. They miss some indendent thinkers but

they also miss a lot of people who just have too many distractions to fit in.

You can go to a small school like Fontbonne and take a number of Wash U classes for less money. You can do two years at a community college

and transfer to a larger school. Not everyone can make it in 4 years and some it takes many years. Some graduate with a C average and some

nearly straight A average. The regimen of college means more to the student than to the world he is trying to fit

[Basketbill]

criteria is quite suspect

"They based 25 percent of their rankings on seven million student evaluations of courses and instructors, as recorded on the Web site RateMyProfessors.com. Another 25 percent depended upon how many of the school’s alumni, adjusted for enrollment, are listed among the notable people in Who’s Who in America. The other half of the ranking was based equally on three factors: the average amount of student debt at graduation held by those who borrowed; the percentage of students graduating in four years; and the number of students or faculty, adjusted for enrollment, who have won nationally competitive awards like Rhodes Scholarships or Nobel Prizes. CCAP ranked only the top 15 percent or so of all undergraduate institutions."

[saluki762]

West Point was number 1 because it is free education for all students. I can agree with that. Other than that it is a joke.

[Billikan]

I am a big skeptic of all of the rankings but the one you cite is ridiculous.

the report on the most recent US News Report rankings--which are not perfect by any means but they are widely used show:

Wash U in STL at 12

St Louis U at 88

Missouri at 102

[Bay Area Billiken]

I am a big skeptic of all of the rankings but the one you cite is ridiculous.

the report on the most recent US News Report rankings--which are not perfect by any means but they are widely used show:

Wash U in STL at 12

St Louis U at 88

Missouri at 102

These rankings are controversial. SLU keeps falling in the US News & World Report rankings, albeit gradually, which is a bit disconcerting. People do watch and consider these rankings.

Re the Catholic schools, Notre Dame is at 20, Georgetown 23, Boston College 34, Fordham 61, Marquette 84, and now SLU at 88.

SLU's rating in the past was ahead of Marquette.

[Billikan]

These rankings are controversial. SLU keeps falling in the US News & World Report rankings, albeit gradually, which is a bit disconcerting. People do watch and consider these rankings.

Re the Catholic schools, Notre Dame is at 20, Georgetown 23, Boston College 34, Fordham 61, Marquette 84, and now SLU at 88.

SLU's rating in the past was ahead of Marquette.

so much of determination of these rankings is subjective that it is difficult to really understand them but even at 88 SLU is well ranked--just not as high as many of us would like

Other Catholic schools that I saw:

Loyola Chicago 119

Catholic U 121

San Francisco 121

Duquesne 128

Unranked-- over 128-- DePaul, Seton Hall and St. Johns.

[Bay Area Billiken]

so much of determination of these rankings is subjective that it is difficult to really understand them but even at 88 SLU is well ranked--just not as high as many of us would like

Other Catholic schools that I saw:

Loyola Chicago 119

Catholic U 121

San Francisco 121

Duquesne 128

Unranked-- over 128-- DePaul, Seton Hall and St. Johns.

We wonder how these rankings in the National Universities categories compare to those schools ranked in the Master's Universities categories. For example, Villanova is ranked #1 in the North in the Master's Universities, with Creighton ranked #1 in the Midwest (Xavier is tied for #3), and Santa Clara #2 in the West.

For instance, how is USF to be compared with Santa Clara in these rankings?

Another case is Fordham, which is often compared back East with Villanova. Many students choose between the two.

[billiken_roy]

just too brag, but my daughter starts college at rose next week. the rose hulman ranking remains #1 engineering school

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews....pec-engineering

[Box and Won]

SLU's rating in the past was ahead of Marquette.

They're only one slot ahead of us, so I don't feel too bad about it.

Our recent slips are a little disconcerting though. I think we were in the 70s a few years ago.

Our acceptance rate seems awfully high - I wonder if that has anything to do with it.

[jimbofive]

They're only one slot ahead of us, so I don't feel too bad about it.

Our recent slips are a little disconcerting though. I think we were in the 70s a few years ago.

Our acceptance rate seems awfully high - I wonder if that has anything to do with it.

Chicks are definitely getting hotter. So, of course, they're bringing the brain average down. Pick your battles I guess.

[cheesycow]

I think where colleges and universities are rated nowadays matters far less than the fact that 95% of college students are coming out of college with as much debt as their parents and grandparents have had in a lifetime.

How are people in my generation supposed to generate a thriving economy when we're hundred's of thousands of dollars in debt before we've even received our first paycheck?

The schools that rate highly on those lists are routinely the ones that leave you 200k in the hole by the time you're finished. If I could do it all over again I would have gone to Community College for two years, then UMSL for 2 more.

Experience > name on the degree

[Clock_Tower]

I think where colleges and universities are rated nowadays matters far less than the fact that 95% of college students are coming out of college with as much debt as their parents and grandparents have had in a lifetime.

How are people in my generation supposed to generate a thriving economy when we're hundred's of thousands of dollars in debt before we've even received our first paycheck?

The schools that rate highly on those lists are routinely the ones that leave you 200k in the hole by the time you're finished. If I could do it all over again I would have gone to Community College for two years, then UMSL for 2 more.

Experience > name on the degree

Chees. I would have strongly opposed your viewpoint 20 years ago, and even most recently as a few years ago. Now, however, I agree with you. There is no way my parents could afford today's tuition at my undergra nor could I afford truly afford my graduate degree at SLU. First, the tech bubble, then the housing bubble, next the credit card and the commercial retail bubbles with pop and soon the university bubbles will go. There is no way we can sustain these increases in price. Also, while few would doubt the difference in quality between a Harvard degree and that of UMSL, many students find jobs without the need the for their expensive degrees. Aside from making me a bit more attractive on my graduate school application, my undergrad degree has done nothing for me that an UMSL degree could not have done. At some point, paying $200,000 to slightly move ahead on a subjective standards list anyway is downright foolish. Schools like SLU need to be careful. Building up $100 million endowments to spend on non-essential, but required, items to keep up with the other schools is not the best use for a university committed to offering a Catholic education to the upper-middle class.