STL Hoops Insider Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Great post! We couldn't have gotten McLemore or Young eligible, so we can toss them out the window. Tatum is going to be a big time prospect. Most likely a top 10-15 type kid, and if he keeps growing and developing, possibly top 5. Some people don't realize that it's not realistic to expect us to land kids like that. I think we'll have more of a chance with him than we did with Beal, but still it's a huge long shot. Its a standardized sliding scale. If BJ Young was eligible to play at Arkansas last year, he was eligible to play at SLU. The incoming freshman eligibility requirements are the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Assuming arkansas didnt utilize any of the derrick rose academic standards fulfillment paths Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Its a standardized sliding scale. If BJ Young was eligible to play at Arkansas last year, he was eligible to play at SLU. The incoming freshman eligibility requirements are the same.While you're off in la-la land let me reiterate, BJ Young would not have met eligibility requirements if he tried to come to SLU. If you need me to explain the situation in simpler terms, I can. I don't need you to tell me about the eligibility process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseAndGrind Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 No I do not believe he did have an offer from SLU - he wanted one but never got it that is why he ended up at SMS. Actually I think it was pulled after DE committed, or right before. He got an offer after a SLU camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Actually I think it was pulled after DE committed, or right before. He got an offer after a SLU camp.Yep, he had an offer from us at one point. I think us and MSU were his only D1 offers. I've heard he's struggled big time at MSU, so I don't think it was much of a loss for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken4life5 Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Yep, he had an offer from us at one point. I think us and MSU were his only D1 offers. I've heard he's struggled big time at MSU, so I don't think it was much of a loss for us. Yes and no. He was all freshman team for the valley his first year but struggled last year. Of course, Cuonzo leaving didn't help I'm sure. Either way does not appear one we should be too overly upset over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL Hoops Insider Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 While you're off in la-la land let me reiterate, BJ Young would not have met eligibility requirements if he tried to come to SLU. If you need me to explain the situation in simpler terms, I can. I don't need you to tell me about the eligibility process. Please explain. Here are the requirements. https://web1.ncaa.org/eligibilitycenter/hs/d1_standards.pdf Show me where there is a disclaimer or exemption for SLU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmbilliken Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Please explain. Here are the requirements. https://web1.ncaa.or...1_standards.pdf Show me where there is a disclaimer or exemption for SLU I thought that was one deals Spoon got when he came here and has remained intact since. If a student could qualify per NCAA requirements he will be admitted even if he doesn't meet the normal SLU requirements. That was a reassurance needed so we could be compete for a wider group of players after the Upchurch fiasco. Now we can get them in, but that doesn't mean we can keep them eligible and get them to graduation so we still don't want to bring someone in we don't think can cut it academically. However there are students that meet the NCAA requirements but are below the norm for SLU admission that will be able to make it at SLU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Please explain. Here are the requirements. https://web1.ncaa.or...1_standards.pdf Show me where there is a disclaimer or exemption for SLU There are NCAA minimum elgibility requirements, and then there are the school's own eligibility requirements. A student-athlete may meet the minimum NCAA elgibility requirements while at the same time not being able to meet the academic requirements of a certain school. While SLU could have brought in a certain student-athlete who met the minimum requirements of the NCAA, it doesn't mean that that student-athlete would've been able to handle the course load at SLU. I believe this is what FDL was trying to convey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 There are NCAA minimum elgibility requirements, and then there are the school's own eligibility requirements. A student-athlete may meet the minimum NCAA elgibility requirements while at the same time not being able to meet the academic requirements of a certain school. While SLU could have brought in a certain student-athlete who met the minimum requirements of the NCAA, it doesn't mean that that student-athlete would've been able to handle the course load at SLU. I believe this is what FDL was trying to convey.That and the fact that I've talked to someone who has seen his transcript and test numbers and swears he couldn't be D1 eligible. Nothing against the kid. He's going to make a ton of money in the league someday. But Mr. Anderson did a little work to get him into Arkansas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 The problem with this "if a kid is eligible per NCAA rules then he is now eligible at SLU thing" is that just because a school somehow manages to get a kid eligible from whatever dubious actions they pull does not mean that SLU would have done those dubious things. So when the big programs manage to get a kid eligible they are doing things that many other schools would not even consider - see Memphis when Calipari was there and how he managed to leave just as the NCAA was closing in on him for the Rose thing. KU is also under some scrutiny for a variety of things so who knows what if anything will come from that stuff. Nobody is questioning that if a kid is legit NCAA qualified but does not meet SLU's standards that the bb coach can get him in - the question is about the kid who is not legit NCAA qualified and to what extent will a school go to make him look eligible? Remember we helped and waited for Willie Reed to make up all those classes he missed when his senior year went down the toilet when he transfered to that bogus high school in Kansas City. The difference here is that Willie actually had slight chance as opposed to none without trickery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB73 Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 The problem with this "if a kid is eligible per NCAA rules then he is now eligible at SLU thing" is that just because a school somehow manages to get a kid eligible from whatever dubious actions they pull does not mean that SLU would have done those dubious things. So when the big programs manage to get a kid eligible they are doing things that many other schools would not even consider - see Memphis when Calipari was there and how he managed to leave just as the NCAA was closing in on him for the Rose thing. KU is also under some scrutiny for a variety of things so who knows what if anything will come from that stuff. Nobody is questioning that if a kid is legit NCAA qualified but does not meet SLU's standards that the bb coach can get him in - the question is about the kid who is not legit NCAA qualified and to what extent will a school go to make him look eligible? Remember we helped and waited for Willie Reed to make up all those classes he missed when his senior year went down the toilet when he transfered to that bogus high school in Kansas City. The difference here is that Willie actually had slight chance as opposed to none without trickery. Exactly. I am sure we could get most all of the dummies that others enroll into SLU for the first semester; but they would not make it very long. We do not have all of the absolute dumb football jock type classes that many others do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlarry Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 Would it be nice if a local player played for SLU? I guess, but honestly, I dont really care. I actually find it a lot cooler when an out of towner comes to SLU and then stays after graduation. I guess it could help attendance with the STL high school basketball junkies but I dont think there are enough of them to make a difference. If the winning continues the local players will come but I just dont think its a big deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Would it be nice if a local player played for SLU? I guess, but honestly, I dont really care. I actually find it a lot cooler when an out of towner comes to SLU and then stays after graduation. I guess it could help attendance with the STL high school basketball junkies but I dont think there are enough of them to make a difference. If the winning continues the local players will come but I just dont think its a big deal. Actually, those h.s. junkies - more than you think - do come to the games but their first love is h.s. games so whether we have local kids or not they would still come now and then as they do now but still keep attending h.s. games as they do now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Updated List (EDIT: I got rid of the strikethrough lines but have the caveat that not all of these guys would have been/will be eligible): College/Graduated/Pro: Jared Swopshire (2008) - IMG/Louisville/Northwestern Nathan Scheer (2010) - Borgia/Missouri State - Not entirely convinced he'd be much of a contributor on our roster. Ben McLemore (2010) - Everywhere/Kansas B.J. Young (2011) - McCluer North/Arkansas Bradley Beal (2011) - Chaminade/Florida/Washington Wizards Roosevelt Jones (2011) - O'Fallon/Butler Cameron Biedscheid (2012) - Ritter/Notre Dame Jordan Granger (2012) - McCluer North/Auburn Ryan Rosburg (2012) - Marquette/Mizzou - Not entirely convinced he will be much of a factor at Mizzou. Darrell Johnson (2012) - Parkway North/Kansas State High School: Nolan Berry (2013) - DeSmet/Butler Malcolm Hill (2013) - Belleville West/Illinois Jordan Martin (2013) - Hazelwood Central - Mizzou and Illinois are mentioned. As thetorch says, SLU may have offered. Jordan Swopshire (2013) - Montrose Christian (MD) - SLU, Arizona, Florida, Louisville, Illinois, Iowa, Marquette, Mizzou, SIUC, Texas Anthony Virdure (2013) - Lutheran North - Not finding much info on who is recruiting or may have offered, but every article/profile indicates he might be the best pure PG in the class and is flying under the radar despite getting some Big Ten looks. Derreon Reddick (2014) - Belleville East - SLU, Xavier, Mizzou, Michigan, DePaul, SIUC, and Tennessee are in the mix. DePaul has offered for sure. Darius Austin (2014) - Cahokia - SLU, Xavier, Mizzou, Illinois, Iowa, DePaul, Cincinnati, Michigan, and Tennessee are in the mix. SLU and DePaul have definitely offered. C.J. Rivers (2014) - Cahokia - SLU, Xavier, Illinois, Mizzou, and Tennessee are in the mix. Raymond Doby (2014) - CBC(?) - Mizzou, Illinois, and "several Big Ten schools" are in the mix. Can't find any word that SLU might be involved. I'm seeing some word that he may have left CBC; if so, this would be the second school he has left, Cahokia being the first. Red flag? Jordan Barnett (2014) - CBC - SLU, SIUC, Mizzou, Michigan State, Butler, and Purdue are in the mix. Patrick McCaw (2014) - CBC - SLU and Mizzou are listed. Justin Diecker (2014) - Freeburg - SLU, Marquette, SIUC, Iowa State, Missouri State, Illinois State, Murray State, and Tennessee State are in the mix. Rashad Lindsey (2014) - MICDS - Iowa State has offered; SLU, Loyola-Chicago, Wichita State, and Mizzou are also involved. Austin Gillman (2014) - Oakville - SLU and Xavier are involved; can't find any other names listed. Jordan Barnes (2016) - CBC - Guard, played last week in Atlanta at the Fab Frosh Camp, which features the early top 100 players in the class. Jayson Tatum (2016) - Chaminade - Projects as a potential 7-footer (6-5 now) and top-tier recruit. Named a top 5 player at the Fab Frosh Camp. Will Gladson (2016) - Chaminade - Post player, already 6-6. Also played at the Fab Frosh Camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Updated List: College/Graduated/Pro: Jared Swopshire (2008) - IMG/Louisville/Northwestern Nathan Scheer (2010) - Borgia/Missouri State - Not entirely convinced he'd be much of a contributor on our roster. Ben McLemore (2010) - Everywhere/Kansas B.J. Young (2011) - McCluer North/Arkansas Bradley Beal (2011) - Chaminade/Florida/Washington Wizards Roosevelt Jones (2011) - O'Fallon/Butler Cameron Biedscheid (2012) - Ritter/Notre Dame Jordan Granger (2012) - McCluer North/Auburn Ryan Rosburg (2012) - Marquette/Mizzou - Not entirely convinced he will be much of a factor at Mizzou. Darrell Johnson (2012) - Parkway North/Kansas State High School: Nolan Berry (2013) - DeSmet/Butler Malcolm Hill (2013) - Belleville West/Illinois Jordan Swopshire (2013) - Montrose Christian (MD) - SLU, Arizona, Florida, Louisville, Illinois, Iowa, Marquette, Mizzou, SIUC, Texas Derreon Reddick (2014) - Belleville East - SLU, Xavier, Mizzou, Michigan, DePaul, SIUC, and Tennessee are in the mix. DePaul has offered for sure. Darius Austin (2014) - Cahokia - SLU, Xavier, Mizzou, Illinois, Iowa, DePaul, Cincinnati, Michigan, and Tennessee are in the mix. SLU and DePaul have definitely offered. C.J. Rivers (2014) - Cahokia - SLU, Xavier, Illinois, Mizzou, and Tennessee are in the mix. Raymond Doby (2014) - CBC- Mizzou, Illinois, and "several Big Ten schools" are in the mix. Can't find any word that SLU might be involved. I'm seeing some word that he may have left CBC; if so, this would be the second school he has left, Cahokia being the first. Red flag? Jordan Barnett (2014) - CBC - SLU, SIUC, Mizzou, Michigan State, Butler, and Purdue are in the mix. Patrick McCaw (2014) - CBC - SLU and Mizzou are listed. Justin Diecker (2014) - Freeburg - SLU, Marquette, SIUC, Iowa State, Missouri State, Illinois State, Murray State, and Tennessee State are in the mix. Rashad Lindsey (2014) - MICDS - Iowa State has offered; SLU, Loyola-Chicago, Wichita State, and Mizzou are also involved. Austin Gillman (2014) - Oakville - SLU and Xavier are involved; can't find any other names listed. Jordan Barnes (2016) - CBC - Guard, also played at the Fab Frosh Camp. Jayson Tatum (2016) - Chaminade - Projects as a potential 7-footer (6-5 now) and top-tier recruit. Named a top 5 player at the Fab Frosh Camp last week in Atlanta, which features the early top 100 players in the class. Will Gladson (2016) - Chaminade - Post player, already 6-6. Also played at the Fab Frosh Camp. Pistol, you've done a decent amount of research in this thread. My hat's off to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Pistol, you've done a decent amount of research in this thread. My hat's off to you! Thanks! Seems like we get recruiting info piecemeal, so I figured it'd be nice to have a master list. The fun thing about looking all this stuff up is that it's clear SLU is very, very involved in recruiting locally, even if the roster doesn't show it at the moment. My hunch is that some of these 2014-2016 local guys (and there will be some new names in all three classes as time goes on) will be Billikens. Another thing I've noticed is that Xavier and Butler are recruiting the St. Louis area well, and a couple other A10 schools, to a lesser extent. I know it's tough to see a couple nice local players end up at places like those, but in the long run having other A10 programs visiting here frequently probably works to further legitimize the conference in the eyes of local recruits, coaches, and fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetorch Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 I haven't heard that Doby was leaving CBC. Despite some of his problems their coach reaffirmed that he would be on Varsity at the end of last season. He did attend SLU's camp along with several other players we may not be recruiting. A couple to add to your list Jordan Martin 6'7 Haz Central '13 - SLU offered at one time, maybe not anymore, has some mid major offers and looks from Big Ten schools. Anthony Virdure 5'10 Lutheran North '13 - No SLU offer though they have watched him, he may have a big ten offer. I don't know if he has any interest in SLU or not but IMO he's small but the best lead guard in the area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 -pistol, good job on the list but how many of them can meet the most important criteria, that being can they dunk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 I haven't heard that Doby was leaving CBC. Despite some of his problems their coach reaffirmed that he would be on Varsity at the end of last season. He did attend SLU's camp along with several other players we may not be recruiting. A couple to add to your list Jordan Martin 6'7 Haz Central '13 - SLU offered at one time, maybe not anymore, has some mid major offers and looks from Big Ten schools. Anthony Virdure 5'10 Lutheran North '13 - No SLU offer though they have watched him, he may have a big ten offer. I don't know if he has any interest in SLU or not but IMO he's small but the best lead guard in the area. Yeah, with Doby I'm seeing nothing better than rumors that he's leaving or staying. I guess we'll see once this school year starts. Updated the list with the other two names. -pistol, good job on the list but how many of them can meet the most important criteria, that being can they dunk? That remains to be seen. I'll eventually update the list with dunk videos for each. If I can't find one for a given recruit, he will be removed from the list and most likely never heard from again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 -pistol, good job on the list but how many of them can meet the most important criteria, that being can they dunk? +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Exactly. I am sure we could get most all of the dummies that others enroll into SLU for the first semester; but they would not make it very long. We do not have all of the absolute dumb football jock type classes that many others do. Good point. So if we get the questionable academics player into SLU b/c he is local, and if he is forced to take legitimate college classes b/c SLU does not offer Phys Ed and the other such majors like the BCS schools, if SLU continues to demonstrate that it abides by the NCAA rules and that it values academic integrity over sports, and if he struggles and/or drops out, then what about our APR numbers? I don't want to put the program and post-season at risk for taking unnecessary risks. Just b/c a kid can get into Arkansas and obtain a degree there, does not mean that he can do so at SLU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 2012-2013 will mark the 2nd straight year no one from St. Louis is on the team.I understand we can't get Bradley Beal or Cameron Biedschied.We can't even get the grandson of Ed Macauley,the greatest Billiken ever.There must be somebody that RM deems worthy of giving a chance.Anthony Bonner,Erwin Claggett,Roland Gray,Monroe Douglass,Scott Highmark,Harry Rogers,Larry Hughes and even Kevin Lisch and Tommie Liddell are our history.It's more enjoyable when you have something in common with the members of the team. No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 Good point. So if we get the questionable academics player into SLU b/c he is local, and if he is forced to take legitimate college classes b/c SLU does not offer Phys Ed and the other such majors like the BCS schools, if SLU continues to demonstrate that it abides by the NCAA rules and that it values academic integrity over sports, and if he struggles and/or drops out, then what about our APR numbers? I don't want to put the program and post-season at risk for taking unnecessary risks. Just b/c a kid can get into Arkansas and obtain a degree there, does not mean that he can do so at SLU. Do the have to graduate or just simply earn 96 hours - 12 per semester? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doowop Posted July 16, 2012 Share Posted July 16, 2012 I haven't heard that Doby was leaving CBC. Despite some of his problems their coach reaffirmed that he would be on Varsity at the end of last season. He did attend SLU's camp along with several other players we may not be recruiting. A couple to add to your list Jordan Martin 6'7 Haz Central '13 - SLU offered at one time, maybe not anymore, has some mid major offers and looks from Big Ten schools. Anthony Virdure 5'10 Lutheran North '13 - No SLU offer though they have watched him, he may have a big ten offer. I don't know if he has any interest in SLU or not but IMO he's small but the best lead guard in the area.Virdure outplayed Biedscheid when their teams played this year for the right to go to state. He is really good but his lack of height may stop some D-1 schools from recruiting him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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