Femi John gets scholarship offer from SLU

[VTIME]

>A lot of time = start.

>

>That is quite a leap there V.

He said hand him the keys for FOUR YEARS. That sounds like he'll be initiating the offense as the starting pg for 4 years. He's been told he's going to start all 4 years. You can try and rephrase it all you want, but if a coach phrased it that way to you, you would be under the belief that at the very least he implied you would start all 4 years. Even if you are skeptical, thats still what he implied to you.

[billiken_roy]

nate said,

"basically tell the kid he's a piece of trash if he goes anywhere other than SLU."

nate lying again. the only one pathetic nate is you lying to suit your views.

no one said someone is a piece of trash for going elsewhere. but i and others have said, there is no reason to throw a parade and a champaign party if they go elsewhere. they become insignificant to slu fans thereafter. that is a big difference. we all recognize the likes of ryan robertson and chris carrawell etc were very good players, no great high school players, but once they decided to go off to kansas and duke they made their choice to distance themselves from the slu fandom and there is no reason to idolize or pander to them at that point. the same will be said if current at louis high school stars pick another path. good for them, now on to rooting for thompson, reed and mitchell as our darlings.

but no one but you made any such comment like you said above. and for you to put those words in association with me and the other billiken faithful is what is dispicable. you are the one pathetic for slandering us as such.

[Clock_Tower]

Nate, VTime and others. Last time I checked, this is the SLU Billikens board designed for SLU fans to post about their team. This is not a board to discuss the high school prep scene in general.

While I appreciate many of your insights to the high school prep scene, your audience on this Board (guys like me) is interested to see what prep school star might become a Billiken. I am a Billiken basketball fan and not a St. Louis prep scene basketball fan. As such, I have no interest in receiving updates on how some graudate from XYZ high school is doing at ABC college.

Put me down, like Roy, as not caring if some recruit goes elsewhere.

[VTIME]

With Meyer, Polk, Liddell, Lisch, Maguire, and Mitchell all on the team next year, that's 6 guys from the area. Knollmeyer is an in-state guy. That's more than half the team that's local. Plus with Reed, Thompson, and Relphorde all from not that far away you may have to excuse some local prep talk as the school has shifted very regional recruiting and this is looking like a upward swing for the program. I told you that you can win by just recruiting this area. I kept hearing about how the area was overrated and blah blah blah. Well Majerus believes in the area and that's all that matters. Most of the local guys being discussed are prospects.

[bauman]

Nate/Roy/Thicks, if we drop back and get the emotion out of this discussion, I think we might all come to an understanding of the "pathetic fan position."

Let's just look at the facts. Quite a few big name players have left St. Louis over the past 20+ years. If we look at how they have been treated by local fans/media then I think Nate and the players/family members of players being recruited could probably come to a rationale understanding of how STL would react to that player while in college and in the years after college.

A partial list of those who left include:

J. White

Chris Carrawell

Ryan Robertson

David Lee

feel free to add to this list.

We were NOT bitter and harsh to them or their families, but we also could not have cared less as their college careers were playing out. They chose to leave this area which was their right, but we no longer had any reason to follow them and/or care about how they were doing. Exceptions to this would probably be limited to their family, friens and classmates at their high schools. Also, I don't believe any local businesses would have been standing in line to offer them jobs after college. Just about every decision in life comes with consequences--some good and some bad. The decision to shun the STL for another area maybe a great decision for the player but realize that it will not result in any significant level of fan or media interest in STL either in the college years or after the conclusion of their playing days.

On the other side of the ledger we have good local players who decided to stay in the local community to play ball. A partial list includes:

A. Bonner

S. Highmark

Monroe D.

E. Claggett

Donnell Reid

Joe Wiley

Larry Hughes

feel free to add to this list.

All of them received tremendous publicity during their college careers, are considered St Louisans and had jobs available in the local area when they needed them. We didn't reject the others we just lost interest whereas the SLU players were accepted as part of the local environment. Nate, I suspect that you are struggling with this concept in as much as I seem to remember that you are not a native St Louisan. I'm sorry but one of the facts of life in STL is that we place a special value on "our own." Need another example---go ask the new, out-of-town owners/managers of KTRS who fired all the local talent shortly after taking over the station. Guess what---all the new "out of town talent" which was brought in to improve the station is now gone-fired. Nate, another example for you is the fact that most Cardinal fans to this day long for the return of Rick H. to the Cards' beat. Want another---what do you think has contributed to the coolness of STL to Tony L. versus Whitey. I know there are a number of factors but a BIG one is Tony continuing to live in Cal. (his right, but with a consequence).

Nate you and others can say we are wrong and maybe we are, but tht's the way St Louisans feel.

[Cowboy]

in the nate/roy pissing match, point of parliamentary procedure, i do not recall roy saying kids were pieces of trash if they do not go to slu, imo nate got this wrong as this choice of words imo is a level or two more than what i recall being said

however,no ONE speaks for all billiken fans

[slufanskip]

thanks

Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman

Official Sponser of the Stemmler and Ahearn could and would have helped club.

[Clock_Tower]

Agree. By St. Louisan, I believe you are including non-St. Louisans who have played here for SLU.

I don't have any jobs to offer anyone but if I did, I would give one to Jamaal Walker or H Waldman over Chris Carawell and David Lee.

[Billikan]

Nate, I am delighted that you have jumped on the Billiken bandwagon and appear to be positive at this point about our Billikens. But your comment about you knowing that things being posted on this board can have an impact on recruiting makes me very upset. I said that exact same thing when people, including you, were ripping Brad and insisting that he should be fired. I suggested that such negative posts could have a major impact on Brad and his recruiting and you gave that the back of your hand and said you were not a reporter and you were free to say anything you wanted, even if it was very negative.

I have always believed that posts on this board could have an impact so I have tried to be upbeat and never insult any player or recruit. I wish you would have had your new attitude when Brad was coach.

Let's all be positive. Bills fans do not ever refer to anyone as trash and your comment to that effect is totally unwarranted and you should apologize. Then we should just move on.

[thetorch]

Once again Nate goes over the line.

Hey we all appreciate ya posting here but uh pick your battles a little better. This is really a non issue.

If a kid like Suggs or anybody wants to go to SLU so be it. There will be perks that come with that for the rest of his life if he chooses to pursue them in the area. If kid goes to Chapel Hill, Gainesville, LA, DC, Lawrence, etc etc he can be expected to have a few perks in those areas but not in the STL. There will not be any parades thrown for Loren Woods, Chris Carrawell, Jahidi White, David Lee at anytime.

If recruits are swayed at all by what is stated on this board or others like them they need get their heads on straight. Frankly I wouldn't want a kid who spends his time lurking on internet boards for the latest opinions on himself.

[Guest BillikenReport]

I don't have a problem with the things I said about Brad, like that I hardly ever saw him out recruiting around the area. There were people who admitted after Brad was fired that he didn't recruit as hard as he did.

What's happening here is people talking about 17- and 18-year-old kids — kids who still haven't made their college decisions and acting like they've already chosen other schools so people here can say whatever they want about them.

- Nate

[Guest BillikenReport]

This is my last post on this subject.

The point of my comments, which were a generalization and not a direct quote from anybody, is the attitude that St. Louis area high school basketball players will not be embraced by the STL community if they choose to go somewhere else for college.

I understand the thinking here, but I think its flawed.

For one, you're talking about kids who have yet to choose their college destinations and are still considering SLU among other schools. If they don't choose SLU, they better not try to work in St. Louis after college.

I'm sure all the backside-kissing toward Griffster on here for the last year or two will still continue if Tyler chooses Mizzou. Right? The same people who couldn't wait to kiss the kid's butt will be calling him a traitor or worse.

I've seen recruits ripped on here. I've seen current players ripped on here. I've seen former players ripped on here.

How many people here have helped former players get jobs after their college careers?

I don't know how many recruits read this message board. I hope none of them do. I know parents of recruits and players visit here because some have openly admitted it. I've had parents of recruits tell me they can't stand some of the posters here. One told me the next time he sees a certain poster in public, he's going to knock the guy out for what he's said on this board.

If you want to make me the bad guy, fine. I've already been labeled some awful things this week by someone on this board, things that person wouldn't dare say to my face.

My point is when you guys trash KIDS on this board it does get back to them and their families. Is that really something you want Saint Louis University to be associated with?

- Nate

[billiken_roy]

the point is though nate, YOU were the one that defined our indifference as "trashing". the truth is as i said, bauman said, torch said, clock tower said, thicks said, and many others, is that if they dont come to slu, they become insignificant.

it seems you want billiken fans to endorse or give permission for st louis kids to go elsewhere. and for the life of me, i cant understand that line of thinking. of course we have no input in their decision but of course we want the local stars to become billikens. when they dont, they become insignificant and those players that do become billikens, local or not, become our lifelong players of choice.

what you want to do is start a local high school message board. then you can get unendorsed opinions when the players concerned go to illinois, mi$$ouri, duke or wherever. but to expect billiken fans to be thrilled when players go elsewhere.....you arent even coming close to thinking straight on that.

p.s. why am i not surprised you didnt bother to apologize for accusing billiken fans of calling these kids "pieces of trash". you have once again demonstrated your colors.

[LoveforVouk]

Thats your opinion and I hope you end up being right. I am assuming you and V-Time are one in the same and you base the majority of your evaluation of a player on what zip code he is from.

What other D-I offers does he have and did he have a year ago?

[cheeseman]

Nate, I appreciate your work and efforts on the new board you are sponsoring. I also appreciate your posts. Any kid who goes where they want can work and get jobs in StL without being a Billiken player - look at Ryan Robertson. It just is that if they stay and play at SLU they may have more doors potentially open is all that is being said. Truth be told if you graduate from out of state and want even a teaching job you will have a higher hill to climb then if you stayed in state and understand all the accrediting requirements and have the chance to student teach locally and show your stuff than if you did not. That is true everywhere. No one wishes them harm if they go some place else just that nobody is going to go out of their way either. And Nate, yes I have personally gotten jobs for athletes from SLU - not BB players but others. Did the fact they went and played at SLU help them - yes it did. Now if they were not a fit for the job then no but when they had the qualifications I did feel more inclined to give them the nod. Finally, it has nothing to do with being from StL - this attitude is in lots of places.

[VTIME]

I've been somewhat critical of recruit John Brandenburg's game. If I'm the one who is going to be knocked out, can you send me a pm, so I can know to look over my shoulders. I havent insulted the kid, just said I didnt get the hype. I dont know if that warrants being knocked out, but you never know how people react to things. Let me know if I'm a target.

[NashvilleBilliken]

Doubtful, V. My money would be on Metz. That guy isn't making any friends around Billiken basketball.

[Billiken Rich]

"I'm sure all the backside-kissing toward Griffster on here for the last year or two will still continue if Tyler chooses Mizzou. Right? The same people who couldn't wait to kiss the kid's butt will be calling him a traitor or worse."

Nate

Ah Nate? You are talking through your backside with that garbage. Traitor? Do you have any proof of this sort of name calling? Did somebody call Stemler's Dad a pinhead?

You are assaulting probably the tamest message board and fans on the planet. If Tyler Griffey goes to Illinois or Indiana no one will be calling out Griffster or Tyler. You are 100% looney Tunes if your think so. If Tyler goes to MU, SLU fans will feel more the jilted lover. In any case, should Griffster come back here and make a classy, "sorry it wasn't slu" sort of post, NO ONE (other than maybe Metz) would go nuts on him. We'd certainly treat him better than Norm Stewart treated Ryan Robertson's dad.......

Keep reporting the news as I appreciate it. I'm amazed that you bother, given how you see us as fans.

[billiken_roy]

i agree with you rich. the board will become indifferent. not nasty as nate is claiming.

apparently what nate wants is for us to cheer these kids for going elsewhere. i say, hey congrats. but dont look to us to throw a parade and champaign party. look to your new school for that.

[Sheltiedave]

VTime, when we bought our latest used car, I handed the keys to my wife and said she would have the keys to the car for the next four years. I still drive the car at least once a week.

Mitchell has the talent to start at PG for the next four years. His situation is the same situation that Liddell, Lisch, and Polk have. You don't promise a position to a player for four years, unless he is NBA talent - and then he won't be with you four years. RM recruited him because he COULD have the keys for the next four years. It is up to the player to PROVE he has the keys and won't give them up to ANYONE.

[bauman]

Nate, I appreciate the info you provide to readers of this Board, but even you shouldn't be referring to "things you know as an insider" such as what some parent or recruit told you about how this Board was having a negative impact on their recruiting with regard to SLU. If you want to support your arguments with such "insider" info then you should provide the details not some vague reference.

I notice that you are not making any further posts in this thread and I am not asking you for a reply, but I hope you read my post #54, above, to get some idea of the feelings of many of the posters on Bilikens.com re young men who reject SLU for another school. We still can respect them and their families, however, they have no reason to expect any favors from this community later. Just the facts Nate, just the facts.

[Billiken Rich]

If I was Femi John and I were dumb enought to read this board, I'd be totally pissed that A bunch of old guys who mostly haven't seen me play were relegating me to "plan-B" status.

Again Tigerboard makes our board look like dial-a-prayer but Nate may have a very small point.......

[billiken_roy]

considering he was all about verbally committing when he had his unoffical visit, i am wondering why he hasnt jumped all over coach majerus's offer last week? it seems odd he didnt take it and run. what the hell happened?

[thetorch]

Obviously Roy he read some of our comments about him and has now decided to become a saluki.

Now I know why Brad played his recruiting so close to the vest. So billikens.com posters wouldn't run off all the players. ;-)

PS Per Nates comments I have now hired a bodyguard to attend all basketball related events with me. I suggest everyone else do the same.

[Pistol]

Two quick observations after reading this monstrous thread:

1. So we have 3 scholarships left, and at least 4 offers out there. So what? Why is this a bad thing? We have under-offered in the past, and look what it got us: unused scholarships and players who might not be D1 caliber (won't name names because this is a particularly sensitive thread).

2. Whether anyone thinks that comments on a message board affect a recruit's decision of where to sign, that should not change what people post. It's an open forum for opinions. If a recruit wants to read it and risk having his feelings hurt because not everyone thinks he's an All-American, that is his problem. Suggs has publicly stated that he reads no press or nothing online about him, and that's the smart way to do it if you're in the public eye. Once you start letting some unknown person's opinion from an online forum affect you, you are going to have more issues to deal with. No good can come from it, and recruits have to be mature enough not to read this kind of stuff. Whether individual recruits are mature enough or not, that's their problem, not the people posting here.