SLU Soccer 2017

[Bay Area Billiken]

19 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

I looked up the roster for the #1 seed in this NCAA College Cup, Wake Forest.  NC has become a hotbed of soccer.  Wake has only 3 players from NC plus only 2 more from GA and VA.  They have 5 foreign players and their top recruiting ground is NY/NJ with 6 players.  [No players are from the metro STL area.]  You need a 'wide net' in soccer.  You need a coach who can recruit world wide. 

I was personally present for the infamous SLU at Stanford NCAA Tournament (not A10 Tournament) Quarterfinal, played at Stanford's pitch, with the grandstand literally divided by a tree.  This SLU team was loaded with talent, Brad Davis, Dipsy Selolwane.  This was the game SLU lost on an errant goal kick, which has to be the most bizarre play I've ever seen in soccer.

Before the game the prototypical Stanford couple in their sweaters, call them Buffy and Jody, sat right behind us.  Buffy reviewed SLU's roster on the program, and bellowed out, "They don't have any players from California."  BAB turned around and responded, "You don't have any players from Missouri."

[billikenfan05]

1 minute ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

I was personally present for the infamous SLU at Stanford NCAA Tournament (not A10 Tournament) Quarterfinal, played at Stanford's pitch, with the grandstand literally divided by a tree.  This SLU team was loaded with talent, Brad Davis, Dipsy Selolwane.  This was the game SLU lost on an errant goal kick, which has to be the most bizarre play I've ever seen in soccer.

Before the game the prototypical Stanford couple in their sweaters, call them Buffy and Jody, sat right behind us.  Buffy reviewed SLU's roster on the program, and bellowed out, "They don't have any players from California."  BAB turned around and responded, "You don't have any players from Missouri."

We get it BAB you’ve attended SLU soccer games.

[Bay Area Billiken]

4 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

We get it BAB you’ve attended SLU soccer games.

But I haven't been at one in a long time.  Evidently neither have a lot of other alumni and fans.

[brianstl]

There really is no future for high level college soccer in this country.  The development system has been set up to actively discourage kids from playing college or even high school soccer.  SLU has to consider these facts when deciding how many resources they are willing to pour into the soccer program.

[brianstl]

3 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

But I haven't been at one in a long time.  Evidently neither have a lot of other alumni and fans.

Which, also, brings us back to what resources SLU should be willing to put into the soccer program going forward.

 

 

[Bobby Metzinger]

1 hour ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

I was personally present for the infamous SLU at Stanford NCAA Tournament (not A10 Tournament) Quarterfinal, played at Stanford's pitch, with the grandstand literally divided by a tree.  This SLU team was loaded with talent, Brad Davis, Dipsy Selolwane.  This was the game SLU lost on an errant goal kick, which has to be the most bizarre play I've ever seen in soccer.

Before the game the prototypical Stanford couple in their sweaters, call them Buffy and Jody, sat right behind us.  Buffy reviewed SLU's roster on the program, and bellowed out, "They don't have any players from California."  BAB turned around and responded, "You don't have any players from Missouri."

I appreciate your zest for the game, BAB. Jealous that you probably were able to witness, first-hand, the Golden Age of Billiken Soccer. I ran into Nick Walls in Milwaukee over the summer, just randomly in line for a beer at the Brewers/Cards game and we were discussing those great teams - we had a lot of talent come down from 'Sconnie too. Marquette Prep, Tosa West, Brookfield, etc. 

[HoosierPal]

2 hours ago, brianstl said:

Which, also, brings us back to what resources SLU should be willing to put into the soccer program going forward.

 

 

Really a good question. 

Winning the NCAA Soccer College Cup brings what to SLU?  Higher level of financial donations?  Higher number of applications for enrollment?  Can't say yes for sure to either.  We'd probably see a couple hundred really cool T-shirts and maybe double the home attendance at Herman. 

Winning the NCAA Basketball Championship, or even a Final Four run, brings what to SLU?  Higher level of financial donations?  Yes.  Higher number of applications for enrollment? - history has shown this to be true.  Butler applications spiked heavily after their two Final Four runs.

[cgeldmacher]

18 hours ago, Tilkowsky said:

Look at the National team.

The last Saint Louisan (sort of) who received significant minutes was Brian McBride.

I kid from O'Fallon was just put on the team.

[cgeldmacher]

3 hours ago, Tilkowsky said:

The last select team to win a Snickers Youth Championship from St. Louis was 2005. 

That tells you all you need to know about St. Louis talent.

ClockTower - Who was the last high profile Saint Louis high school soccer player to play st SLU?

Who else was recruiting Goodwin or Gordon?

 

 

It took me ten seconds to Google this and prove you wrong, troll.  Notice the 13U Nation Champions for 2017.

http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/2017_us_youth_soccer_national_champions/

[cgeldmacher]

By the way, that 13U boys Scott Gallagher team might be a wealth of recruiting prospects that could be snagged up if we hire the right coach.

[cheeseman]

14 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

By the way, that 13U boys Scott Gallagher team might be a wealth of recruiting prospects that could be snagged up if we hire the right coach.

I must have missed it - did we fire McGinitty?

[billikenfan05]

3 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

I must have missed it - did we fire McGinitty?

Yeah

[Bay Area Billiken]

2 hours ago, Bobby Metzinger said:

I appreciate your zest for the game, BAB. Jealous that you probably were able to witness, first-hand, the Golden Age of Billiken Soccer. I ran into Nick Walls in Milwaukee over the summer, just randomly in line for a beer at the Brewers/Cards game and we were discussing those great teams - we had a lot of talent come down from 'Sconnie too. Marquette Prep, Tosa West, Brookfield, etc. 

Thanks, Metz.  The real Golden Age of Billiken Soccer, when SLU was winning the National Championships  was when I was growing up in Quincy, before I arrived at SLU in 1978.  But I do remember some from those times.  Once we finally had Cable TV in our house, that meant we received the St. Louis TV channels, and the Soccer Billikens were covered on the weekend News.  I remember one National Championship game vs. Howard.  I also was aware of the mighty St. Louis U Billikens coming to Quincy because the Billikens were Quincy's biggest game.  Billikens was truly the magical name in College Soccer then.  SLU was known as the UCLA of College Soccer.  Our fine posters Tar Heel, slu72, and Willie must have been at SLU during that era.

SLU was certainly still a Soccer powerhouse when I was at SLU.  Those Billikens had troubles with Guelker's SIUe Cougars in the NCAA Playoffs.  I remember SLU losing a memorable Playoff game at Edwardsville when I was a sophomore, when Steve Sullivan was SLU's Striker and Don Ebert was SIUe's Striker.

SLU did do well in the annual Bronze Boot Games vs. SIUe at Busch Stadium II, which invariably were followed by a rematch with SIUe in the NCAA Playoffs.  At the Bronze Boot Game my Senior year, 1981, the Billiken mascot (under my direction) made his heralded return from Ekker exile.  My SLU roommate and I told Ekker, who in addition to being the Men's Basketball Coach was also the AD, that we were not leaving his office until he let us have back the Billiken.  Finally, Ekker relented.  We took possession of "the Head," we were able to get a dorm mate from Cellblock 6G to serve as the Billiken for that one night, we dressed the Billiken in an old SLU Hockey jersey, white with Columbia Blue letters and dark blue piping, and had 2 SLU female tennis players escort him when we took the "walk" on the North side of Busch Stadium II, which was always the SIUe side.  At this and other Bronze Boot games, SIUe had a live cougar, and always paraded him in front of us on the SLU (South) side.  When we coaxed our friend to be the Billiken, his only stipulation was that he did not have to get near that live cougar.

One of those Bronze Boot Games when I was at SLU drew 22,000.  One was accompanied by an Air Supply concert.  Those Bronze Boot games routinely drew in the 5 figures.

 

 

[Bay Area Billiken]

45 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

It took me ten seconds to Google this and prove you wrong, troll.  Notice the 13U Nation Champions for 2017.

http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/2017_us_youth_soccer_national_champions/

Sign them up!

[Clock_Tower]

4 hours ago, brianstl said:

There really is no future for high level college soccer in this country.  The development system has been set up to actively discourage kids from playing college or even high school soccer.  SLU has to consider these facts when deciding how many resources they are willing to pour into the soccer program.

Yes and no.  Yes, the best are leaving college soccer early or are skipping high school and college entirely.  But how is this any different than college baseball?  Andy Benes was drafted #1 right out of high school and played only professional baseball.  Same with alot of baseball players.  Many feel that college baseball results in too few of games overall, bad techniques/habits from "non-professional" coaches, guys pitching too often and blowing out their arms...  Then again, alot of college baseball players play some college, many graduate college and then play professionally.  Go to a College World Series game and enjoy the high level play even if many of the top players their age are already playing professionally.

Same with college basketball as Euro guys go straight to the NBA, some Americans consider playing 1 year in Europe before the NBA while most play only 1 year of college before going to NBA (see Tatum).

So what if the top 20 American kids never play college soccer.  Local talent nowadays similar to Taylor Twellman and Brad Davis may never play college soccer.  OK.  I get it. Move on.   Get kid #21, coach them up and win some games... Soccer is not a major revenue sport but hopefully can raise enough money to be self-supporting and not a drain on the Athletic Department and basketball program.  Either field a team and try to win the national championship or drop the program.  Does anyone truly think SLU basketball and most of the other non-P5 teams will win the NCAA Championship in basketball each year?  Is expecting an A10 league championship (regular season or tourney) and an NCAA bid too much to expect out of our soccer program?  Again, I will take regularly making the NCAA Tourney (Joey Clarke teams) and getting to the Final Four (Bob Warming team).

[Tilkowsky]

9 hours ago, cgeldmacher said:

I kid from O'Fallon was just put on the team.

Josh Sargent has never played in a World Cup. He was placed on the team for the friendly in Portugal in which he didn't appear.

You must have missed the words World Cup and significant minutes. The game in Tuesday was in no way part of the World Cup.

 

 

 

 

[Tilkowsky]

9 hours ago, cgeldmacher said:

It took me ten seconds to Google this and prove you wrong, troll.  Notice the 13U Nation Champions for 2017.

http://championships.usyouthsoccer.org/2017_us_youth_soccer_national_champions/

Thank you for telling me. I had no idea.

 

However one trophy in twelve years doesn't exactly tell me Saint Louis is a juggernaut of talent,

If St. Louis had eight trophies out of twelve years you might have something.

 

 

[William Iken]

16 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

I was personally present for the infamous SLU at Stanford NCAA Tournament (not A10 Tournament) Quarterfinal, played at Stanford's pitch, with the grandstand literally divided by a tree.  This SLU team was loaded with talent, Brad Davis, Dipsy Selolwane.  This was the game SLU lost on an errant goal kick, which has to be the most bizarre play I've ever seen in soccer.

Before the game the prototypical Stanford couple in their sweaters, call them Buffy and Jody, sat right behind us.  Buffy reviewed SLU's roster on the program, and bellowed out, "They don't have any players from California."  BAB turned around and responded, "You don't have any players from Missouri."

Where do I start with this, @Bay Area Billiken. Two multi-part questions:

1. Would you recommend a local coach and (predominantly) local players for women's soccer, men's basketball, women's volleyball, or any other SLU sport? What about locals for the Blues or Cardinals? If the answer is "of course not", then why would you make the recommendation for men's soccer?

2. If your goal is winning, and I think it is since you repeatedly point out the 3 last 'foreign' (my tongue in cheek phrase) coaches have not done so, how would this accomplish that goal? St. Louis youth programs no longer dominate and to be honest the area hasn't produced that many college stars of late either. How many St. Louisans have been on the roster of the final 4 teams in , say, the last 20 years. I'd say it's only a handful. And how many of those have been key players. So why would the local approach lead to victory?

I understand your emotive stance, but evidence-based decision-making should determine approach.

[William Iken]

12 hours ago, Clock_Tower said:

Yes and no.  Yes, the best are leaving college soccer early or are skipping high school and college entirely.  But how is this any different than college baseball?  Andy Benes was drafted #1 right out of high school and played only professional baseball.  Same with alot of baseball players.  Many feel that college baseball results in too few of games overall, bad techniques/habits from "non-professional" coaches, guys pitching too often and blowing out their arms...  Then again, alot of college baseball players play some college, many graduate college and then play professionally.  Go to a College World Series game and enjoy the high level play even if many of the top players their age are already playing professionally.

Same with college basketball as Euro guys go straight to the NBA, some Americans consider playing 1 year in Europe before the NBA while most play only 1 year of college before going to NBA (see Tatum).

So what if the top 20 American kids never play college soccer.  Local talent nowadays similar to Taylor Twellman and Brad Davis may never play college soccer.  OK.  I get it. Move on.   Get kid #21, coach them up and win some games... Soccer is not a major revenue sport but hopefully can raise enough money to be self-supporting and not a drain on the Athletic Department and basketball program.  Either field a team and try to win the national championship or drop the program.  Does anyone truly think SLU basketball and most of the other non-P5 teams will win the NCAA Championship in basketball each year?  Is expecting an A10 league championship (regular season or tourney) and an NCAA bid too much to expect out of our soccer program?  Again, I will take regularly making the NCAA Tourney (Joey Clarke teams) and getting to the Final Four (Bob Warming team).

Good post. I made the baseball analogy a few days ago - the key is getting the top recruits who will play college soccer. Those that don't play are irrelevant. Same point on the future of college soccer. Again, see baseball. Or a whole bunch of other non-revenue sports or sports where there really is no higher level. It's about inter-collegiate competition and the formation of young members of society, not just sending players to the pros. There is value in that alone.

[Bay Area Billiken]

3 hours ago, William Iken said:

Where do I start with this, @Bay Area Billiken. Two multi-part questions:

1. Would you recommend a local coach and (predominantly) local players for women's soccer, men's basketball, women's volleyball, or any other SLU sport? What about locals for the Blues or Cardinals? If the answer is "of course not", then why would you make the recommendation for men's soccer?

2. If your goal is winning, and I think it is since you repeatedly point out the 3 last 'foreign' (my tongue in cheek phrase) coaches have not done so, how would this accomplish that goal? St. Louis youth programs no longer dominate and to be honest the area hasn't produced that many college stars of late either. How many St. Louisans have been on the roster of the final 4 teams in , say, the last 20 years. I'd say it's only a handful. And how many of those have been key players. So why would the local approach lead to victory?

I understand your emotive stance, but evidence-based decision-making should determine approach.

1.  Apples and oranges.  As for Men's Basketball, the best SLU teams, sans the anomaly of the Majerus Era, had a number of key local players:  Easy Ed Macauley, Bob Ferry, Anthony Bonner, Roland Gray, Monroe Douglass, Larry Hughes, et al. As for Coaches, Rich Grawer is from St. Louis.  Charlie Spoonhour was from Rogers, Arkansas and the University of the Ozarks in Southwest Missouri.  Current SLU Coach Travis Ford is from Kentucky, a 3 hour drive from St. Louis.

The Cardinals and Blues are professional sports, apples and oranges, completely different systems. As a sidebar, 2 successful Cardinal Managers,  Red Schoendienst and Whitey Herzog, are from nearby small towns across the Mississippi River in Illinois. 

2.  You answered your own question in your last paragraph. The evidence indeed shows, in fact proves, that SLU won, as in winning its 10 National Championships in Men's Soccer, when the Coaches were from St. Louis.  

More recent great SLU teams?  Brian McBride is from Arlington Heights, IL, Chicago suburb. His teammate Matt McKeon is from St. Louis.  Brad Davis is from the St. Louis Area. Jack Jewsbury is from Springfield, MO.  Jason Cole is from Kansas City. As such, those Billiken Soccer greats are native Midwesterners.

[Gremio14]

2 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

1.  Apples and oranges.  As for Men's Basketball, the best SLU teams, sans the anomaly of the Majerus Era, had a number of key local players:  Easy Ed Macauley, Bob Ferry, Anthony Bonner, Roland Gray, Monroe Douglass, Larry Hughes, et al. As for Coaches, Rich Grawer is from St. Louis.  Charlie Spoonhour was from Rogers, Arkansas and the University of the Ozarks in Southwest Missouri.  Current SLU Coach Travis Ford is from Kentucky, a 3 hour drive from St. Louis.

The Cardinals and Blues are professional sports, apples and oranges, completely different systems. As a sidebar, 2 successful Cardinal Managers,  Red Schoendienst and Whitey Herzog, are from nearby small towns across the Mississippi River in Illinois. 

2.  You answered your own question in your last paragraph. The evidence indeed shows, in fact proves, that SLU won, as in winning its 10 National Championships in Men's Soccer, when the Coaches were from St. Louis.  

More recent great SLU teams?  Brian McBride is from Arlington Heights, IL, Chicago suburb. His teammate Matt McKeon is from St. Louis.  Brad Davis is from the St. Louis Area. Jack Jewsbury is from Springfield, MO.  Jason Cole is from Kansas City. As such, those Billiken Soccer greats are native Midwesterners.

Personally, get us a Sorber, or convince a guy like McBride to take up coaching, and I would be totally supportive of a coach with Billliken and/or St. Louis roots.  At the end of the day it’s all about getting the best guy available....I’d be completely happy with a soccer Travis Ford....

BTW, I’m surprised by two of your omissions.  You left out the best Billiken in the past ten years = Tim Ream, and, being a Quincy guy, you left out the son of the best ever Hawk player,  Will John, just saying...

 

[Clock_Tower]

Bob Warming brought St Louis kids back home from places like UConn and also kept some but not all local talent. We reached the Final Four under Warming. I will take that. 

Jim Crews recruited St Louisans such as  Austin Gilman and Zeke Moore as compared to Goodwin and Gordon by Coach Ford.  There are  St Louisans... and then there are St Louisans. In theory, it should be easier to land a top St Louisan than. Top non-St Louisan bc of ease of recruiting, play in front of friends and family, be a legend in town after playing career, job opportunities...

[Bay Area Billiken]

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jose-de-jesus-ortiz/ortiz-slu-seeks-path-back-to-soccer-glory/article_92e37eba-dc3b-5e43-8bd1-6b1906569821.html

Ortiz is spot on.

Make Billiken Soccer Great Again.  Hire Mike Sorber.  The "search" does not need to be lengthy or long.  The best candidate is right there to be hired.

 

[Clock_Tower]

48 minutes ago, Gremio14 said:

Personally, get us a Sorber, or convince a guy like McBride to take up coaching, and I would be totally supportive of a coach with Billliken and/or St. Louis roots.  At the end of the day it’s all about getting the best guy available....I’d be completely happy with a soccer Travis Ford

 

I could provide you with a huge list of great players who were bad coaches. And there is not a single former SLU basketball player I would want coaching our team instead of Ford. And speaking of Ford, time will tell but he (a former great player) is now at his 4 th school and I believe he has learned from his prior coaching successes and failures and is a better coach today bc of it. I don’t want to convince a former great player to take up coaching. Prior experience or do not apply. 

[billikenfan05]

21 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jose-de-jesus-ortiz/ortiz-slu-seeks-path-back-to-soccer-glory/article_92e37eba-dc3b-5e43-8bd1-6b1906569821.html

Ortiz is spot on.

Make Billiken Soccer Great Again.  Hire Mike Sorber.  The "search" does not need to be lengthy or long.  The best candidate is right there to be hired.

 

Will Sorber want it? Chris May HAS to commit to improving facilities. Not just leaving coaches to do it themselves. Just hiring the right guy is not enough.