SLU Soccer 2017

[billikenfan05]

1 hour ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

In the glory days of SLU Soccer, SLU had only 2 Coaches, Bob Guelker, who started the SLU program and then went to SIUe, and Harry Keough, who was the Coach when I was at SLU.  The best players in St. Louis almost invariably went to SLU as their #1 choice.  SLU had a built in de facto farm system, starting in the CYC, moving to the St. Louis Area Catholic high schools, but also covering the St. Louis Area public high schools.

In the glory days, one of SLU's best games was the annual scrimmage between the North Siders and the South Siders, who were both on the same SLU team.

In the glory days, SLU was known as the UCLA of College Soccer.  Although I have never understood what my St. Louis friends called the "nuances" of Soccer, SLU played what was known as the St. Louis Style, and the College Soccer World knew what that meant.

Joe Clarke kept the tradition alive.  The only outside Coach that really thrived at SLU was Bob Warming, in between his stints at Creighton.  

I'll say it again, the SLU Soccer Coach needs to be from St. Louis.

 

 

All you talk about it the glory days. The glory days are long gone. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

1 minute ago, billikenfan05 said:

All you talk about it the glory days. The glory days are long gone. 

Why 05?  Why are the glory days long gone?  

If it isn't broken, and it wasn't, then don't fix it.

[almaman]

I was under the impression that once the glory days were over St.Louis still was producing a high # of players relative to metro size but that they were going to other schools such as Indiana? is that no longer the case?

[Bay Area Billiken]

10 minutes ago, almaman said:

I was under the impression that once the glory days were over St.Louis still was producing a high # of players relative to metro size but that they were going to other schools such as Indiana? is that no longer the case?

Indiana made recruiting inroads into St. Louis, no question.  But then SLU hired a series of coaches (3) who weren't from St. Louis, didn't have the roots into the St. Louis Soccer pipeline. 

Moving to the A10 did not help SLU Soccer either.

[Tilkowsky]

1 hour ago, slufanskip said:

Why? St.Louis doesn' produce enough talent to have most of our roster from here. Soccer in the US has changed dramatically since SLU was the UCLA of soccer. 

Look at the National team.

The last Saint Louisan (sort of) who received significant minutes was Brian McBride.

[Clock_Tower]

So to summarize, and not proclaiming to be the college soccer expert, it sure sounds like high school soccer players want to follow and play for the best coach possible.  Shocking!!

And a few false conclusions:   just because high level, local high school players leave to play elsewhere does not mean they would never play for SLU, that kids today must leave town, that they refuse to play in the A10 or that they must play for P5 team.  Instead, it is very likely that they either don't like SLU's coaches and/or they prefer another coach better. 

Funny that Goodwin and Gordon chose to stay home and play in the A10 for a non-P5 team as soon as we got rid of Jim Crews.  Maybe the education, facilities, league and past performances really are a distant second to the coach.   Maybe if SLU hires the next Bob Guelker or Harry Keough, then SLU becomes the 4th non-P5 team to win the National Championship.   And not that I believe SLU's goal should be that of the runner up instead of the champion, but I would sure be fine being one of the 10 or 11 non-P5 programs to make the finals these past 30 years.  Even the Final Four of soccer would be great for me!!   And as far as hiring St. Louisans, let me remind everyone that Indiana did that very thing and the rest is history.  Even hiring an excellent non-St. Louis coach (Bob Warming) helped bring the locals back from UCONN and elsewhere.  Can our team, or should our team, be comprised solely of St. Louis kids?  Of course not.  But it is true that our best years were definitely with quite a few local kids on the roster. 

In short, local kids are just like non-local kids -- they want to play for a great, winning coach... and our team has not won under Donigan and McGinty. Win games, win the league, win in the NCAA Tourney... and good kids (locals and non-locals alike) will be lined up out the door come here.

[William Iken]

8 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

I disagree.  Back in the glory days, one of the other powers was the USF Dons, who had a lot of foreign players.  SLU more than held its own with USF.  Sometimes SLU beat USF, sometimes USF beat SLU.  

Who decided that SLU should give up on local recruiting?  At least the Coach should be from St. Louis.  I'm not saying the whole roster should be from St. Louis like in the glory days.  But there aren't enough local players on that SLU roster.  This also has had a severe adverse effect on Soccer attendance, wherein the attendance Is too often now measured in the low 3 figures.  SLU Soccer attendance is a mere shell of what it used to be. 

For that matter, SLU Soccer is a mere shell of what it used to be.  When I was at SLU, merely making the NCAA Playoffs, most assuredly, was not the goal.  And I came on board after the 10 NCAA Championships.  But SLU had great players when I was at SLU:  Ty Keough, Don Huber, Larry Hulcer, Steve Sullivan, and from my class John Hayes and Mark Fredrickson, who lived on our Cellblock 6G and was an excellent guard on our intramural basketball team.  From the class below me was Bill McKeon.  All of those guys were from St. Louis.

 

When you were at SLU, very few other schools prioritized or fully funded soccer. Things have changed. Competition is much, much tougher. I agree with other points raised above by others, so no need to repeat them. And for whatever reason, St Louis isn't leading the nation as a 'hotbed' anymore, and hasn't for a long time. So other regions have also caught up...

[William Iken]

8 hours ago, Bobby Metzinger said:

That's amazing... wow. And to think we have a polarizing country here. This is an every second of every day thought of matters of life and death and literally being caught on the wrong side of the fence. Trying to think of a book I read back at SLU called the "Dirty Wars," the author escapes me at the moment, but the amount of turned UDF/Provie IRA agents, double-agents, etc. was just fascinating; while the book read at a solid pace, it was so hard to even keep track who's side people were on by the end. Indiscriminate killings, kidnappings were a daily occurrence at the height of the Troubles. County Armagh was probably one of the most dangerous places in the world during the 1980s. 

Seriously, Americans are myopic in regards to polarization. When I was small (before we got the heck out, to Australia) there were 2 - count them 2 - "mixed" schools which accepted both Catholics and Protestants. Still today at Queens University, at orientation you get Catholics on one side and Prods on the other. Don't believe the hype that everything is merry - it's merry as long as there is no economic downturn. If there is, trouble will flare up. It does every time.

But there is a charming element to our mutual distrust/hatred. A few years back a tourist got a bit lost and ended up in a heavily Protestant part of town. Not knowing who this stranger is, a group of locals thought he was a Catholic doing no good so they beat the crap out of him - seriously so.  So what's the charming element to this story - upon realization he was a tourist, the locals took up a collection pot and gave the guy several thousand pounds...

[Bay Area Billiken]

5 hours ago, William Iken said:

When you were at SLU, very few other schools prioritized or fully funded soccer. Things have changed. Competition is much, much tougher. I agree with other points raised above by others, so no need to repeat them. And for whatever reason, St Louis isn't leading the nation as a 'hotbed' anymore, and hasn't for a long time. So other regions have also caught up...

The last 3 coaches have not been from St. Louis.  The only one that was successful by SLU standards was the first of the three, Bob Warming, and even Warming didn't bring home the big prize like Bob Guelker and Harry Keough did.  The emphasis on recruiting, and in particular not recruiting local players, has clearly changed.  The results on the field speak for themselves. 

[billikenfan05]

23 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

The last 3 coaches have not been from St. Louis.  The only one that was successful by SLU standards was the first of the three, Bob Warming, and even Warming didn't bring home the big prize like Bob Guelker and Harry Keough did.  The emphasis on recruiting, and in particular not recruiting local players, has clearly changed.  The results on the field speak for themselves. 

You completely missed the point. The last time we had a St. Louis coach we were focused on our soccer program like a football program while everyone else was focused on their football. It was a different landscape and bringing in a St. Louis coach who gets St. Louis kids is not a guarantee solution. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

I am not the one missing any point ...

The results on the field speak for themselves.  The current way is clearly not working.  The former way clearly did work. 

With the current way, relying on outside coaches and outside players, not working, why wouldn't anyone that desires the SLU Soccer Program to succeed want to at least follow the way that did work? 

The last time I saw a SLU Soccer game, I sat in stunned disbelief as Santa Clara scored 4 goals on SLU.  Soccer players used to tell me that losing by 3 goals in Soccer was like losing by 3 Touchdowns in (American) Football.  That fiasco was, and the current SLU Soccer situation is, unacceptable.

[slufanskip]

I partially agree with Bay Area that we need to prioritize local recruiting, however, that's only if the talent is here. 

Bay Area ... Soccer has just changed since you were at SLU. At that time St. Louis was soccer city USA. It produced far more talent then probably any are of the country. I grew up in Garland Tx and Simi Valley Ca. In the mid to late 70's soccer was big in Simi and SoCal, but everyone I knew was aware of and knew about STL soccer. Today there are many of the countries that produce as much if not more talent than STL. We just can't dominate having the majority of our roster from here. There just isn't enough talent. 

[slufanskip]

37 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

You completely missed the point. The last time we had a St. Louis coach we were focused on our soccer program like a football program while everyone else was focused on their football. It was a different landscape and bringing in a St. Louis coach who gets St. Louis kids is not a guarantee solution. 

And even if you did. STL doesn't dominate the soccer talent in the USA like it used to so there just isn't enough talent to think that would work. It's not that STL has gotten  worse it's just that the rest of the country has caught up.

[Bay Area Billiken]

I realize that Soccer has changed, that the rest of the Nation has caught St. Louis.

But my main point is that the SLU Soccer Coach should either be from St. Louis or have strong St. Louis Soccer ties.

I am not saying all the players should be from St. Louis, like in the Glory Days. 

I grew up in Quincy, Illinois,  up river, 125 miles to the North.  The then Quincy College (now Quincy University) Hawks were an NAIA Soccer power, playing then on the Baseball side of Q-Stadium.  The biggest game for Quincy, bar none, was when the mighty St. Louis U Billikens of Coach Harry Keough came to town.  When I was in high school we used to sit on the Q-Stadium grass right behind Eric Delabar in Goal.

One of SLU's first key non-St. Louis Soccer players was Greg Reis, who was a major star, a 2 time Parade All-American coming from my Alma Mater, Quincy Notre Dame.   Reis is the long time and current Soccer Coach at our Alma Mater, Quincy Notre Dame. 

After Greg Reis, major star Brian McBride from Arlington Heights, IL came to SLU.  Later Jack Jewsbury from Springfield, MO starred at SLU.  McBride, of course, was a mainstay on the US National Team for years, played in both the MLS and the English Premier League.  Jewsbury played in the MLS.

So I am not saying all the SLU players need to come from St. Louis.  I am saying the SLU Coach should be from St. Louis or have strong St. Louis Soccer ties.  I see that as the middle ground, the area for compromise, for resolution.

[Bay Area Billiken]

A review of the current SLU Soccer roster of 29 players reveals:

10 players from foreign countries;

Only 6 players from St. Louis;

4 players from the Metro East, so if those are counted as St. Louis players, which I would so count, then 10 players from the St. Louis Metropolitan Area.

2 players from the Kansas City Area, both from the Kansas side.

[billikenfan05]

24 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

A review of the current SLU Soccer roster of 29 players reveals:

10 players from foreign countries;

Only 6 players from St. Louis;

4 players from the Metro East, so if those are counted as St. Louis players, which I would so count, then 10 players from the St. Louis Metropolitan Area.

2 players from the Kansas City Area, both from the Kansas side.

Cool? 

[Bay Area Billiken]

4 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Cool? 

In a word, No.

7-9-1, 4-4 in the lowly A10 Soccer Conference, #8 Seed in the A10 Tournament with a quarterfinal (first round) A10 Tournament (not NCAA Tournament) exit is not Cool.

SLU Soccer has become like the New York Yankees from 1965-1975.  But the 27 Time World Series Champion Yankees rebounded from that lost decade.  SLU Soccer can too.  The next coaching hire is critical.

[TFord and TRavs]

Absolutely does not have to be a local coach. These are much bigger teams than basketball. You need to fill talent from across the country. 

[Bobby Metzinger]

36 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

II grew up in Quincy, Illinois,  up river, 125 miles to the North.  The then Quincy College (now Quincy University) Hawks were an NAIA Soccer power, playing then on the Baseball side of Q-Stadium.  The biggest game for Quincy, bar none, was when the mighty St. Louis U Billikens of Coach Harry Keough came to town.  When I was in high school we used to sit on the Q-Stadium grass right behind Eric Delabar in Goal.

 

Love this for obvious reasons - where my Mom and Dad met! Pops played for Dewey Kalmer. Get some Tower Pizza! 

[billikenfan05]

1 minute ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

In a word, No.

7-9-1, 4-4 in the lowly A10 Soccer Conference, #8 Seed in the A10 Tournament with a quarterfinal (first round) A10 Tournament (not NCAA Tournament) exit is not Cool.

SLU Soccer has become like the New York Yankees from 1965-1975.  But the 27 Time World Series Champion Yankees rebounded from that lost decade.  SLU Soccer can too.  The next coaching hire is critical.

Yes but you are off base to insist that the next head coach is a st louisan. 

[hoppybeer]

A quality head coach would do wonders no matter where they're from. If you feel the need to have some St. Louis ties, pull in an assistant from the club scene to round out the staff. 

[HoosierPal]

I looked up the roster for the #1 seed in this NCAA College Cup, Wake Forest.  NC has become a hotbed of soccer.  Wake has only 3 players from NC plus only 2 more from GA and VA.  They have 5 foreign players and their top recruiting ground is NY/NJ with 6 players.  [No players are from the metro STL area.]  You need a 'wide net' in soccer.  You need a coach who can recruit world wide. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

12 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Yes but you are off base to insist that the next head coach is a st louisan. 

St. Louisan or St. Louis Ties.

I agree with the below, how about a Coach from a St. Louis Club team?

The other way is clearly not working.  I'd compromise and take back a Bob Warming type, who came from Creighton.   Warming was a winner.  I sat behind him in the stands at Edwards Stadium in Berkeley.  He is a good coach.

How about this, the next SLU Soccer Coach should come from the Midwest, preferably from but not limited to St. Louis?  I think you get my point.

I have to believe there is a good Coach in the St. Louis Area who is worthy of being hired as the next SLU Coach.  And there is no doubt a Coach in the Midwest qualified to so serve.

[Tilkowsky]

1 hour ago, slufanskip said:

And even if you did. STL doesn't dominate the soccer talent in the USA like it used to so there just isn't enough talent to think that would work. It's not that STL has gotten  worse it's just that the rest of the country has caught up.

The last select team to win a Snickers Youth Championship from St. Louis was 2005. 

That tells you all you need to know about St. Louis talent.

ClockTower - Who was the last high profile Saint Louis high school soccer player to play st SLU?

Who else was recruiting Goodwin or Gordon?

 

 

[Spoon-Balls]

1 minute ago, Tilkowsky said:

The last select team to win a Snickers Youth Championship from St. Louis was 2005. 

That tells you all you need to know about St. Louis talent.

ClockTower - Who was the last high profile Saint Louis high school soccer player to play st SLU?

Who else was recruiting Goodwin or Gordon?