doowop Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Next year out only experienced big men will be Glaze and Manning. That's not a good sign. Neither is the word I heard that the coaching staff wants to give the final 2014 scholarship to a shooting guard. We need a big forward who is a strong rebounder. It is obvious we lack strong rebounding. The incoming big men are not athletic and are projected not to be ready to make an positive impact until a year or two. That's just my opinion. We have six guards for next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billboy1 Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 As said in another thread main problem is athletic bigs-can't handle 'em, don't have 'em Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drkelsey55 Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 The Billikens continue be built with defense in mind. Time to find a couple of lights out shooters. Some one who just doesn't miss. We haven't had anyone like that since Lisch and maybe Ecerle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 The Billikens continue be built with defense in mind. Time to find a couple of lights out shooters. Some one who just doesn't miss. We haven't had anyone like that since Lisch and maybe Ecerle. Maybe I'm remembering his Lisch's senior year too much but I don't think we've had a lights out shooter since H and Claggett....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVBilliken Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Well maybe SLU wants to go the way Villanova generally does, play 4 big guards. I'd be okay with another big shooting guard in the range of 6'5" or so. One that can hit the outside shot and take it to the hoop. College ball is a guard's game. Next year out only experienced big men will be Glaze and Manning. That's not a good sign. Neither is the word I heard that the coaching staff wants to give the final 2014 scholarship to a shooting guard. We need a big forward who is a strong rebounder. It is obvious we lack strong rebounding. The incoming big men are not athletic and are projected not to be ready to make an positive impact until a year or two. That's just my opinion. We have six guards for next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bauman Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I agree with you that this coaching staff missed multiple opportunities in OOC and some early conference games to get the freshmen some minutes when we were up 15 with 10 minutes to go or whatnot. The frosh often didn't see the court until 3 minutes to go and that made no sense to me. But I don't understand how you can say the 3 freshmen are "heads and shoulders above" JM, GG and JB. What, exactly, have they done on the court to make you think that is the case? For a while Crawford was playing comparable minutes to JB, but I didn't see anything super special out of him besides the one game that he hit 2 threes. Tanner lit it up against Fontbonne but hasn't done much since and is currently a defensive liability (one doesn't have to be an expert to see that). I do wish we had seen more of RA, but if he was really lighting practice up with killer crossovers and 20 rebound performances, I think even Crews would have played him more. There can be a very reasoned debate about why we didn't get the freshmen more minutes early in the season when we had some blowouts, but all three have had some chances and none of them seized the minutes the way they could have. My head and shoulders comment is based on what I think the three FR can offer (or could have offered if given the opportunity) versus what JM, GG and JB did contribute. In my mind, MC, TL and RA are far more talented than the three upperclassmen. If not we are in real trouble for the next few years, because if the upside for the FR is only what we are now getting from JM et al then the CBI will look real good in the next couple of years. I believe JC and the staff have missed a real chance at making us better this year and in the future by keeping the FR on the pine, rather than on the hardwood. Regarding your comment about the defensive shortcomings of Tanner, I see him as someone who should have gotten many of the minutes Grandy got. I've been to most games this year and I don't see Tanner as any less of a defender than Grandy, plus he can actually catch the ball and shoot the ball. (Really good skills for a college basketball player!) I'm not saying TL is a defender in the class of JJ (last year) and MM but he actually might have improved his defensive skills by playing and learning from mistakes. I've noticed that that is exactly what has happened with MC, who I now view as a better defender than he was at the beginning of the year, so much so that he is now a better defender than JB, who lately often has no idea where his man is. With regard to not making the most of "some chances", it's hard to seize the moment when those chances are a couple of minutes here and there at most. It's difficult when you play 5 minutes one game then none for the next 3-4 games. The use of the three FR has been inconsistent and haphazard which I believe has made them cautious when given the chance to play for short periods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 My head and shoulders comment is based on what I think the three FR can offer (or could have offered if given the opportunity) versus what JM, GG and JB did contribute. In my mind, MC, TL and RA are far more talented than the three upperclassmen. If not we are in real trouble for the next few years, because if the upside for the FR is only what we are now getting from JM et al then the CBI will look real good in the next couple of years. I believe JC and the staff have missed a real chance at making us better this year and in the future by keeping the FR on the pine, rather than on the hardwood. It all comes down to defense and understanding a complex offense. We have so much invested in this year's senior class and I'm sure the coaches want to take the best chance of winning this year. While giving the younger players experience would pay off in the long run, we had to take advantage of the senior class we have and making sure they won big. I got to believe if the freshman would have given us any chance of winning, they would have been playing more. If we're doing this correctly as a program, I highly doubt we'll see many freshman recruits come in and see much playing time. That being said, if we are doing things correctly as a program, a lot of the the SLU records should be safe for a while. There will rarely be a 4 year player with significant minutes and if there is, that would be a very special player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billikenboy Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I do not think with the Frosh it's an issue of the coaching staff not seeing enough from them it was a matter of having players who can play those role now with experience. An opportunity was missed not giving the Frosh significant minutes because here we are at the end of the season with tired players. Tons of mental mistakes on the court and fundamental errors. Granted it has been said TL and RA were not healthy but do we know that for a fact or was the staff simply saying that to keep playing the lineup that worked. Either way, you have to play them now if you want a fighting chance in the A10 tourney or the Dance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Next year out only experienced big men will be Glaze and Manning. That's not a good sign. Neither is the word I heard that the coaching staff wants to give the final 2014 scholarship to a shooting guard. We need a big forward who is a strong rebounder. It is obvious we lack strong rebounding. The incoming big men are not athletic and are projected not to be ready to make an positive impact until a year or two. That's just my opinion. We have six guards for next year. Which really isn't enough. You can only put so many bigs on your roster before you have too many for two spots. You have six roster spots claimed by Glaze, Manning, Agbeko, Lancona, Jolly, and Gilliam next year. You already have five roster spots for after next season claimed by Welmer, Agbeko, Lancona, Gilliam and Jolly. Fact is we have multiple holes on the roster for next year and not enough roster spots to fill them. I would love another big man, but the college game is a guards game and you need multiple guards who can shoot on your roster. Don't think any of the guards or 3s we are bringing in are known as gunners. I suggested someone already on the roster could be shown the door to create another spot on the roster earlier this season. That idea didn't go over very well on here. We are going to need Reggie to step up next year and fill the banger/rebounder role next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastBilliken Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I suggested someone already on the roster could be shown the door to create another spot on the roster earlier this season. That idea didn't go over very well on here. We are going to need Reggie to step up next year and fill the banger/rebounder role next year. And which player would be shown the door? We are losing 5 as it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorB Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 the freshmen will be fine down the line but I trust Coach Crews and staff about how they have prepared the team for this year's tournament. I think some of the comments underestimate how fine-tuned our defense is, and how hard it is to step in and play much. Right now our rotation is basically 9 or 10-man at most, which is about right. Crawford will get minutes but unless we get into major foul problems, that's about it, I think. For those worried about rebounding next year, I presume RA will step in for a lot more minutes. Believe me when I say, he can rebound at this level. I think a lot of teams are getting tired right about now. the rubber meets the road in March, as we all (should) know by now. Some teams do come out of nowhere seemingly (i.e. keep an eye on St. Joe's). Honestly, we probably are not consistently top-10 material; I think we all might need to readjust our expectations a bit. Our athletic bigs have been exposed somewhat. And as I've said all year: we sink or swim via shooting (see Oregon). This is a funny year and I'm wondering about the no-name surprises who will somehow find a way into the sweet 16. A lot of top-10 teams are like us: they are not consistently top-10 material... I'm also starting to wonder if we could have a shot at the first 40-0 team in the history of college basketball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bauman Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 It all comes down to defense and understanding a complex offense. We have so much invested in this year's senior class and I'm sure the coaches want to take the best chance of winning this year. While giving the younger players experience would pay off in the long run, we had to take advantage of the senior class we have and making sure they won big. I got to believe if the freshman would have given us any chance of winning, they would have been playing more. If we're doing this correctly as a program, I highly doubt we'll see many freshman recruits come in and see much playing time. That being said, if we are doing things correctly as a program, a lot of the the SLU records should be safe for a while. There will rarely be a 4 year player with significant minutes and if there is, that would be a very special player. Tonka, while I always appreciate your posts, this one is really just general philosophy, and not specific analysis. Additionally, my post doesn't really dwell on playing the FR instead of the SRs. Only JB is a SR in my post. To disagree with my position, I would hope that you feel that we were a better team by playing JM. GG and JB instead of MC, RA and TL. If you do then that's fine we just have a different opinion-no problem. But your play the seniors reply did not really respond to my suggested approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I do not think with the Frosh it's an issue of the coaching staff not seeing enough from them it was a matter of having players who can play those role now with experience. An opportunity was missed not giving the Frosh significant minutes because here we are at the end of the season with tired players. Tons of mental mistakes on the court and fundamental errors. Granted it has been said TL and RA were not healthy but do we know that for a fact or was the staff simply saying that to keep playing the lineup that worked. Either way, you have to play them now if you want a fighting chance in the A10 tourney or the Dance. Lets just stop this false narrative right now. The only starters that are averaging more MPG than last season are Loe, Jett, and Barnett. Those three don't look like they are worn out from playing too many minutes. Jett is leading the team in MPG and that number isn't outlandish at 31 MPG. Evans' MPG has actually gone down slightly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Just for a comparison look at the MPG for the Wichita St. roster and compare it to the SLU roster. http://statsheet.com/mcb/teams/saint-louis/players http://statsheet.com/mcb/teams/wichita-state/players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Share Posted March 3, 2014 Lets just stop this false narrative right now. The only starters that are averaging MPG than last season are Loe, Jett, and Barnett. Those three don't look like they are worn out from playing too many minutes. Jett is leading the team in MPG and that number isn't outlandish at 31 MPG. Evans' MPG has actually gone down slightly. Despite this, I think some of our starters look like they are wearing down more than last year. Also just because Wichita St's guys can play heavy minutes doesn't mean that our guys can. Maybe the stress of the minutes that our guys have played is weighing on us more. Either way I really hope Crews uses the bench even a little bit more down the stretch. I have more confidence in Crawford to hit a 3 than I do with Barnett. I probably have more confidence in Agbeko to go in and box out and pull down a rebound than I do with Glaze. Because he didn't play them early in the season, Crews can't give any of these guys significant minutes now, but I think Crawford can play more than 1 minute in the 2nd half which is what he's played the last 2 games combined. I also think Agbeko and Lancona could get a handful of minutes too to keep Dwayne fresher (since we all agree he's battling an injury that's probably worse than he leads on). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Despite this, I think some of our starters look like they are wearing down more than last year. Also just because Wichita St's guys can play heavy minutes doesn't mean that our guys can. Maybe the stress of the minutes that our guys have played is weighing on us more. Either way I really hope Crews uses the bench even a little bit more down the stretch. I have more confidence in Crawford to hit a 3 than I do with Barnett. I probably have more confidence in Agbeko to go in and box out and pull down a rebound than I do with Glaze. Because he didn't play them early in the season, Crews can't give any of these guys significant minutes now, but I think Crawford can play more than 1 minute in the 2nd half which is what he's played the last 2 games combined. I also think Agbeko and Lancona could get a handful of minutes too to keep Dwayne fresher (since we all agree he's battling an injury that's probably worse than he leads on). This I would agree with. But, let's not act like Evans is breaking down because of minutes played. Last year he got stronger as the season went along playing slightly more per game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billikenboy Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 DE has been consistently in foul trouble thus your reduction in minutes. As for JJ I think he plays hurt or is struggling with some type of aggravation. I hope I am wrong but we will see soon enough. We are barely out of the woods here but I see the writing is on the wall already. Things must change but mainly guys need to step up even if they are tired but it will be harder to do without use of the Frosh. I am always glad to see the Frosh in there learning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billikenboy Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 If DE is hurt and JJ is playing hurt as I stated, it will soon start to get very interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 That Evans has been in foul trouble doesn't change the fact he is playing slightly less MPG this year than last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 All of this "more freshmen minutes(!)" talk with 2 games left in the regular season is quite comical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majerus mojo Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 The STL mag Evans piece had a point about a heated team meeting yesterday. Look for that to hopefully get the guys back on track as opposed to the 3 minutes TL may or may not get each game. "On Sunday afternoon, Evans and the rest of the team took part in a lengthy meeting, which Evans said was about saying the things that need to be said, addressing the issues of the last week, since we have two big games coming up. It wasnt a meeting for the faint of heart, with coaches giving direct feedback to the players, particularly the five starting seniors." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Share Posted March 3, 2014 This I would agree with. But, let's not act like Evans is breaking down because of minutes played. Last year he got stronger as the season went along playing slightly more per game. I agree with that. Honestly I wasn't able to pay super close attention to the VCU game, but in the Duquesne game, I didn't get much of a sense of effort from a lot of the guys. I'm hoping that was due to lack of concentration and maybe overlooking Duquesne and not because they are worn down. If Crews feels that he can't use his freshmen any more than he is now, then we at least need to give different looks on offense. Evans hanging out in the post and Jordair driving to the basket is getting pretty easy to scout. What happened to that article about a month ago about how we have a ton of offensive sets that haven't left the practice court yet? Glaze still looks lost and I agree with what MB said last week that he was better when he was bigger and slower and all he does is clog the lane more anyway. Agbeko has shown that he can actually handle the ball away from the basket and Lancona at least has a perimeter game. I still think Crawford is better offensively than Barnett. And please. No matter what happens. Please no more lineups where Glaze is at the 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 All of this "more freshmen minutes(!)" talk with 2 games left in the regular season is quite comical. Water over the dam at this point. I think Evans and Jett would look a whole lot "better rested" if they weren't pressing things inside that aren't there due to us not having a consistent deep threat...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Water over the dam at this point. I think Evans and Jett would look a whole lot "better rested" if they weren't pressing things inside that aren't there due to us not having a consistent deep threat...... Ding, we have a winner. That said, I do think that Evans has been playing hurt the last few games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Share Posted March 3, 2014 That Evans has been in foul trouble doesn't change the fact he is playing slightly less MPG this year than last. He had 92 fouls in 35 games last year and has 80 in 29 games this year. So he's up about .2 fouls per game. That probably leads to more minutes on the bench. Although I should add, nothing too significant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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