Season off to a bummer start

[slu72]

Anyone else feeling a lack of enthusiasm for this season? Strange, a brand new state of the art facility, which we've screamed for for years, a top 40 incoming class, a possible HOF head coach, two Sr's who have been two of SLU's best players....and the board is not talking as much about it as we have in the past. Of course, the schedule, the lack of any TV time, and no radio contract at this point are really disappointing. I guess we're all too worried about our 401k's, home values, etc so Billiken hoops tends to fall on the priority list. Honestly though, in this offseason I've sensed the board's interest is way down from previous years. Wonder why?

[Box and Won]

I guess we're all too worried about our 401k's, home values, etc so Billiken hoops tends to fall on the priority list.

Pretty much.

[Iggy]

Pretty much.

I've only got a 201(k) now.

[jimbofive]

I've only got a 201(k) now.

Hahahaha, let's play the game, if anyone's willing to. All I can do is laugh about it, though I'm young, so for those of you that are really getting hosed, I apologize. But my buddy and I were talking last night and he shared that his 401(K) had lost 31.7% YTD and I responded that mine had lost 31.3%. Any other horror stories? Anybody worse? I thought I was King $h!t last year making ~20%, but I guess that's out the window at this point.

[Billikan]

Anyone else feeling a lack of enthusiasm for this season? Strange, a brand new state of the art facility, which we've screamed for for years, a top 40 incoming class, a possible HOF head coach, two Sr's who have been two of SLU's best players....and the board is not talking as much about it as we have in the past. Of course, the schedule, the lack of any TV time, and no radio contract at this point are really disappointing. I guess we're all too worried about our 401k's, home values, etc so Billiken hoops tends to fall on the priority list. Honestly though, in this offseason I've sensed the board's interest is way down from previous years. Wonder why?

The content and tone on this board has materially changed over the past few years. It is the stat of the board, not the state of the Billikens that make for the lack of posting.

[NashvilleBilliken]

The content and tone on this board has materially changed over the past few years. It is the stat of the board, not the state of the Billikens that make for the lack of posting.

Give me a break, Billikan. I really enjoy your posts and agree with much of what you say...but it's too bad all these "fans" are a bunch of cry babies. We have the occasional troll who is awful and generally gets dealt within a week. Other than that, it's relatively civil discussion. People disagree...such is life.The best post we had in like 6 months was from Courtside. This is a poster that is controversial on this board...to say the least. He gets grief from just about everybody...but he still posted great information and we applauded him for it. If you have stuff to say, you should say it. you obviously still read the board. Not trying to be a dick, but I would question why you are even reading this board cause you surely aren't getting any Billiken information from it....none of us are.

[slu72]

Give me a break, Billikan. I really enjoy your posts and agree with much of what you say...but it's too bad all these "fans" are a bunch of cry babies. We have the occasional troll who is awful and generally gets dealt within a week. Other than that, it's relatively civil discussion. People disagree...such is life.The best post we had in like 6 months was from Courtside. This is a poster that is controversial on this board...to say the least. He gets grief from just about everybody...but he still posted great information and we applauded him for it. If you have stuff to say, you should say it. you obviously still read the board. Not trying to be a dick, but I would question why you are even reading this board cause you surely aren't getting any Billiken information from it....none of us are.

You made my point better than I did, Nashville. Material on or about the team is rather thin these days. Legit hoops topics even tend to change in mid thread and next thing you know we're way off subject or lobbing rotten eggs at one another.

[Box and Won]

Hahahaha, let's play the game, if anyone's willing to. All I can do is laugh about it, though I'm young, so for those of you that are really getting hosed, I apologize. But my buddy and I were talking last night and he shared that his 401(K) had lost 31.7% YTD and I responded that mine had lost 31.3%. Any other horror stories? Anybody worse? I thought I was King $h!t last year making ~20%, but I guess that's out the window at this point.

I just logged into my account - it only lists YTD figures through 9/30, at which point it was down 17.4%. Obviously, it's taken some major hits in the last 10 days. The value of my account is down about 35% from where it stood on September 1.

Our company stock is getting hit hard too.

Obviously, I hate losing money, but I feel especially bad for the baby boomers approaching retirement.

[Billikan]

Give me a break, Billikan. I really enjoy your posts and agree with much of what you say...but it's too bad all these "fans" are a bunch of cry babies. We have the occasional troll who is awful and generally gets dealt within a week. Other than that, it's relatively civil discussion. People disagree...such is life.The best post we had in like 6 months was from Courtside. This is a poster that is controversial on this board...to say the least. He gets grief from just about everybody...but he still posted great information and we applauded him for it. If you have stuff to say, you should say it. you obviously still read the board. Not trying to be a dick, but I would question why you are even reading this board cause you surely aren't getting any Billiken information from it....none of us are.

I read the board occasionally but the board has fundamentally changed from when it started when 98% of the posts were about Billiken basketball. Now it is a forum for numerous topics by poeple, some of whom are Billiken fans and many who are not. I have a lot of information about the team, the coach and the program that I would never post on this board because it gets used by people trying to hurt the program. I have talked to a number of people who feel the same way. Once the season starts, and we can talk real basketball, maybe the board will be busier.

[Westy03]

I read the board occasionally but the board has fundamentally changed from when it started when 98% of the posts were about Billiken basketball. Now it is a forum for numerous topics by poeple, some of whom are Billiken fans and many who are not. I have a lot of information about the team, the coach and the program that I would never post on this board because it gets used by people trying to hurt the program. I have talked to a number of people who feel the same way. Once the season starts, and we can talk real basketball, maybe the board will be busier.

Gimme a break, its a freakin message board. Plus I would bet that 99.5% of posters on here are billiken fans. If you have info on the team then post it but if you are going to act like a 5 year old then just dont post at all.

[NashvilleBilliken]

I read the board occasionally but the board has fundamentally changed from when it started when 98% of the posts were about Billiken basketball. Now it is a forum for numerous topics by poeple, some of whom are Billiken fans and many who are not. I have a lot of information about the team, the coach and the program that I would never post on this board because it gets used by people trying to hurt the program. I have talked to a number of people who feel the same way. Once the season starts, and we can talk real basketball, maybe the board will be busier.

I would be very curious to hear when information on this board has hurt the program. The only instance I can think of was when Tommie's dad came on here and said some things he regretted. Other than that, I can't think of one piece of information that was shared that hurt the program. Personally, i think that by NOT sharing information, it shows our fan base is weak. I'd venture to guess we are the only program in the top 200 whose message board doesn't have one single post about on campus scrimmaging and player encounters. It's very hard being an out of town Billiken fan. When you're fellow fans decide who is cool enough to know about the team and who isn't, it makes it even harder.

[Westy03]

I would be very curious to hear when information on this board has hurt the program. The only instance I can think of was when Tommie's dad came on here and said some things he regretted. Other than that, I can't think of one piece of information that was shared that hurt the program. Personally, i think that by NOT sharing information, it shows our fan base is weak. I'd venture to guess we are the only program in the top 200 whose message board doesn't have one single post about on campus scrimmaging and player encounters. It's very hard being an out of town Billiken fan. When you're fellow fans decide who is cool enough to know about the team and who isn't, it makes it even harder.

I agree. Billikan use to provide some great information but now is in hiding for some reason. If I knew when the scrimmages were I would check them out and give some reports. We are starving for info...

[jimbofive]

I just logged into my account - it only lists YTD figures through 9/30, at which point it was down 17.4%. Obviously, it's taken some major hits in the last 10 days. The value of my account is down about 35% from where it stood on September 1.

Our company stock is getting hit hard too.

Obviously, I hate losing money, but I feel especially bad for the baby boomers approaching retirement.

No kidding. As long as things don't start costing more and my credit rates don't go up and I don't lose my job, doesn't really affect me that much, for right now. But some people are HURTING.

[Pistol]

No kidding. As long as things don't start costing more and my credit rates don't go up and I don't lose my job, doesn't really affect me that much, for right now. But some people are HURTING.

I've got you beat by a hair. I'm down 32.0% YTD. I just ushered in my 401(k) from my former employer to my new one, but it's down the same either way. Fortunately, it's not killing me because I'm 25 and don't have a ton in there. I do feel bad for my parents' generation, though.

As for board content and traffic, it's the quiet before the storm. We've let it build to a fever pitch before the season in prior years but with minimal quality information- this year, people are laying low a little bit and waiting for things to get going. That's my theory.

[moytoy12]

I read the board occasionally but the board has fundamentally changed from when it started when 98% of the posts were about Billiken basketball. Now it is a forum for numerous topics by poeple, some of whom are Billiken fans and many who are not. I have a lot of information about the team, the coach and the program that I would never post on this board because it gets used by people trying to hurt the program. I have talked to a number of people who feel the same way. Once the season starts, and we can talk real basketball, maybe the board will be busier.

You guys forget that everyone is out to sack the Bills; it's a conspiracy.

Billikan, this is just silly. Fine, take your ball and go home.

Agreed with Nash on this.

[Clock_Tower]

I have another theory on why there is less true basketball discussion: our practices are not open to the public, we stopped the midnight madness event, we turned an exhibition game into a closed practice our HC is more concerned with turning around this program (and IMO doing a great job) than with keeping some of us fans updated (not so good and no one else is stepping forward to do the "heavy lifting", we have a "weak" or "not deep" local Senior high school class (less discussions about our need to sign xyz....) and RM is not dependent upon locals (as we have been) for his recruiting thereby resulting in less "I saw our HC at xyz high school last night" or "I overheard our HC talking to to xyz's coach at the local high school tournament last night" or "xyz is leaning toward SLU" from a guy with access to the local AAU coach. When you get kids from Oregon, Wisconsin and Ohio, there are less leaks and discussions. Further, very few posters have personally seen the non-local kids and thus there is less debate over we should have signed xyz from Ohio rather than Jonathan Smith from Ohio. We had all kinds of discussions about who's better: Roundtree, Booker and Femi John. Just some thoughts.

[slufanskip]

I have another theory on why there is less true basketball discussion: our practices are not open to the public, we stopped the midnight madness event, we turned an exhibition game into a closed practice our HC is more concerned with turning around this program (and IMO doing a great job) than with keeping some of us fans updated (not so good and no one else is stepping forward to do the "heavy lifting", we have a "weak" or "not deep" local Senior high school class (less discussions about our need to sign xyz....) and RM is not dependent upon locals (as we have been) for his recruiting thereby resulting in less "I saw our HC at xyz high school last night" or "I overheard our HC talking to to xyz's coach at the local high school tournament last night" or "xyz is leaning toward SLU" from a guy with access to the local AAU coach. When you get kids from Oregon, Wisconsin and Ohio, there are less leaks and discussions. Further, very few posters have personally seen the non-local kids and thus there is less debate over we should have signed xyz from Ohio rather than Jonathan Smith from Ohio. We had all kinds of discussions about who's better: Roundtree, Booker and Femi John. Just some thoughts.

I think you're right on the money (despite your negative label )

There just isn't that much info. RM plays recruiting close to the vest and they could come from anywhere, so when we get a commit like Jonathan Smith it's a bit of a surprise. Plus, we can't really even discuss whether it's good or bad, because no one has seen him play. (We have an Ohio poster, who btw should get flogged for not knowing about this recruit. You live in Ohio, it becomes your teritory and you become responsible) Like you said, we can't watch scrimmages or practices ... there just isn't much there.

[Taj79]

You know '72, its when people like you post topics like this one, then the bullsh*t flies. I'm not talking about you in a personal sense, but you wonder why there's no SLU chatter, then go further on to list items like homes, 401(k)s and so on. Jimbo starts talking about his losses. Billikan starts espousing about the board's tone. Others start talking about their losses. Then an arse like me comes on and points all this out. And you wonder?!?!?!

It is October 10th. In the old days, even if you had Midnight Madness, it didn't kick off until October 15th. Reality check is also such that we--- the Saint Louis University Billikens --- are not a collegiate basketball powerhouse. Most in our own city may not know much about us and the media outlets in our city are in disagreement with our leadership about the value of a basketball rights package. We are not Duke. We are not UCLA. We are not Gonzaga.

Someone pointed out that practices are closed. Midnight Madness is not an option. And our HOF coach isn't concerned as much about an unimportant fan base as the vocal folks on this board really are. How Brett Thompson or Willie Reed or Femi John look in practice also don't matter. The bottom line is what's on the scoreboard at the end of 40 minutes. That won't be a reality until sometime in December. I suspect that come December, the discussions will be all where we want them. Until then, the number one sport in this country, is and will be, football.

Seriously '72, sit back and relax. We won't get anything of any real value until at least mid-December. I'm in no hurry -- it will come soon enough.

[Pistol]

You know '72, its when people like you post topics like this one, then the bullsh*t flies. I'm not talking about you in a personal sense, but you wonder why there's no SLU chatter, then go further on to list items like homes, 401(k)s and so on. Jimbo starts talking about his losses. Billikan starts espousing about the board's tone. Others start talking about their losses. Then an arse like me comes on and points all this out. And you wonder?!?!?!

It is October 10th. In the old days, even if you had Midnight Madness, it didn't kick off until October 15th. Reality check is also such that we--- the Saint Louis University Billikens --- are not a collegiate basketball powerhouse. Most in our own city may not know much about us and the media outlets in our city are in disagreement with our leadership about the value of a basketball rights package. We are not Duke. We are not UCLA. We are not Gonzaga.

Someone pointed out that practices are closed. Midnight Madness is not an option. And our HOF coach isn't concerned as much about an unimportant fan base as the vocal folks on this board really are. How Brett Thompson or Willie Reed or Femi John look in practice also don't matter. The bottom line is what's on the scoreboard at the end of 40 minutes. That won't be a reality until sometime in December. I suspect that come December, the discussions will be all where we want them. Until then, the number one sport in this country, is and will be, football.

Seriously '72, sit back and relax. We won't get anything of any real value until at least mid-December. I'm in no hurry -- it will come soon enough.

So basically we're not allowed to discuss anything other than final scores? Might as well just read Timmerman's write-up in the P-D. Why mid-December, when the non-conference schedule is halfway over? We have games before that and most of them count. Two more months is too long for me. We've been waiting too long, and it's just about time to see this team again.

You seem to be missing the fact that the whole point of a message board is so that we fans can get together and discuss all the finer points about our favorite team. These might vary in tone, quality, and quantity, but I think there is a lot more than scores to discuss in a meaningful way. And who cares if we're not Duke, UCLA, or Gonzaga? We didn't come to billikens.com by accident.

Feel free to reply, if by chance you sign on again before mid-December.

[GOSLU68]

Hahahaha, let's play the game, if anyone's willing to. All I can do is laugh about it, though I'm young, so for those of you that are really getting hosed, I apologize. But my buddy and I were talking last night and he shared that his 401(K) had lost 31.7% YTD and I responded that mine had lost 31.3%. Any other horror stories? Anybody worse? I thought I was King $h!t last year making ~20%, but I guess that's out the window at this point.

Fortunately, about 18 months ago I went all cash because I was too busy to figure out something to buy. My wife said I could have found higher rates wiith CD's; I told her I still thought I would find a buy eventually. Money in the sock drawer would have been wise for Joe six pack.

Merrill Lynch guy called and said what are you going to do after about 2 months; I said I can't find anything I trust if you have a recommendation call me.

Second piece of good luck he never called back.

Our house and office cleaner a single mom parent of 2 kids who grosses about $55K a year said she was worried her customers would fire her if they kept losing money.

Of course the current talking heads and some politicians say there is no trickle down effect. I told her it was probably not a good time to ask for a raise.

[Pistol]

Fortunately, about 18 months ago I went all cash because I was too busy to figure out something to buy. My wife said I could have found higher rates wiith CD's; I told her I still thought I would find a buy eventually. Money in the sock drawer would have been wise for Joe six pack.

Merrill Lynch guy called and said what are you going to do after about 2 months; I said I can't find anything I trust if you have a recommendation call me.

Second piece of good luck he never called back.

Our house and office cleaner a single mom parent of 2 kids who grosses about $55K a year said she was worried her customers would fire her if they kept losing money.

Of course the current talking heads and some politicians say there is no trickle down effect. I told her it was probably not a good time to ask for a raise.

There's a trickle down effect when times are bad. That's when fat cats like to share. There's a burden to bear, and that's going to get spread around to as many people as they can manage to tag. I haven't seen much of a trickle down effect when times are good (the cleaning lady wasn't going to pull down $125K if a few of her customers had a great year). I didn't see hedge fund managers, investment bankers, or all the other big-swinging d***s sharing much when they were taking home 7-to-10 figures in a year. But when it all comes down, everyone- everyone- gets taken down.

Amendment: I don't want to get into politics on this board, really. So to lighten it up, I'll give a concession to the trickle-down set:

http://www.theonion.com/content/news/reaga...y_trickles_down

[billiken_roy]

no offense taj, but imo if there ever was a year that slu should have been beating the drum and working the masses this was it. hall of fame head coach now firmly in place, new arena ready to roll out, new athletic director in place, two future billiken hall of fame senior guards out for their last hurrah, rams down, cardinals go out on a whimper, fans dying to "get in the game" (just paid the highest dollar per seat in program history), certain high profile local media ready to make peace for the first time in history, etc.

instead we basically did nothing, now hearing we apparently have this inflated opinion of the worth of the program when no one is knocking down their door to do tv and radio coverage. the CIA appearance has never been higher imo.

at some point the fans will just "oh well" it and move on. it shouldnt be based on the bet that a big time season is coming which will solve all. it should all be pushed to the nth degree now, and when the big time season comes the masses that didnt give us a thought, will be left out in the cold begging to get in and THAT is when the payday comes.

sorry, i dont get the wait and see attitude from the athletic dept. from long time fans, from anyone. show a little sense of urgency, an over the top presentation and effort and it will pay off far more down the road imo.

missed opportunity.

[brianstl]

I guess the fact they have billboards, they have had more radio ads for season tickets than ever before, the ads they have on stltoday.com and insidestl.com don't count as marketing the team in Roy's book. They have done more to market this team than any I can rember. If it doesn't directly involve Rickma making the rounds it doesn't count for Roy.

[kevinfootes]

I guess the fact they have billboards, they have had more radio ads for season tickets than ever before, the ads they have on stltoday.com and insidestl.com don't count as marketing the team in Roy's book. They have done more to market this team than any I can rember. If it doesn't directly involve Rickma making the rounds it doesn't count for Roy.

The ads have been pretty good this year. It IS a shame that they haven't found a radio home yet. It would be nice to have all of the hosts talking about the "home of the Billikens"...except of course that the all sports stations in town get horrible ratings.

IMO there's nothing happening now that a few wins won't fix. If the wins don't come, that's another story.

[Clock_Tower]

I guess the fact they have billboards, they have had more radio ads for season tickets than ever before, the ads they have on stltoday.com and insidestl.com don't count as marketing the team in Roy's book. They have done more to market this team than any I can rember. If it doesn't directly involve Rickma making the rounds it doesn't count for Roy.

Brian. You and Roy are talking about 2 different items: ticket sales promotions and sports marketing are not exactly the same. Yes, SLU is definitely doing a good job trying to sell season tickets. Good job for that SLU. If successful, we will increased revenue and no empty seats in the new arena. At the same time, SLU has done nothing to promote the team. Why not take a lesson from the Blues who have a bunch of young, talented guys with much promise to go with a few solid veterans - sound familiar? Various guys from owner Dave Checkets (Fr. Biondi) to GM John Davidson (Chris May) to assistant GM/director Larry Pleau (our assistant coaches/Doug M.) to even head Andy Murray (RM) have talked the team up on radio, tv, in the paper, on the net, etc. Running sales ads without marketing seems hollow.

Oh, I forgot. Conventional wisdom says no one talks about basketball at this time of the year. Instead, we need to be like Mizzou (also no talk about them now) and simply sit back and, like them, enjoy our beautiful 1/2 empty building. Memo to conventional wisdom: Grandpa, people really will/do watch a cable show that it dedicated to 24 hours per day; sports talk radio (24 hours per day) really will/does work; and sports, in general, has become year round for both players and fans. Welcome to 2008.