Taj79 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Well, that was one of the worst kept surprises of the year, eh? I loved how, in Caliapri's opening statement, he said they were all here to declare their intentions. That kind of made me go -- click --- back to the hockey game. Here's a take on it from Dana O'Neil: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/58071/no-need-to-condemn-uk-for-one-and-done It's the right-on bull's eye of the world of college basketball as it is today. Get used to it. There is hope for the mid-majors of the world, programs that keep and develop thje traditional college player over four years of enrollment but you have to hit the mark with your recruits and you have to grow the players as well as their eventual replacements. And even if you do that, I sincerely doubt anyone outside of college basketball's royalty programs will ever win the national title. The ride, ala Butler three years ago against Duke, would be phenominal for sure but only a once in a lifetime achievement. Calipari also made an interesting statement in that opening when he looked across the dias and said "they are all finishing the term. Right guys? You are all finishing the term?" Sounds like that's how he and Kentucky beat the APR issue. I'm sure there is a semi-contract in place. Yopu do your part, do your 24 credit hours per year, pass the grades (at a UK, what's the hardest thing they coudl "study" --- introductory to an undeclared major?), and move on to your NBA millions. And you can use us here at Kentucky like a Secret Service "escort" in Columbia. You pay, we pay. All is right in the world. Now we all get to hear about Nerlens Noel for the next college year. Hooah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taj79 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 One rather learned and respected man's answer to just what the problem is: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/58041/coach-k-wants-to-fix-college-hoops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 The NCAA has a relationship w/ both the NFL and MLB. I like the MLB model the best. You can go pro right out of HS, but if you choose to go to college, you must stay at least 3 years as I understand it. What's wrong with the BB deal is it makes a complete mockery of the term student-athlete, as well as allowing a coach like Calipari to craft a team of pros every year to compete w/ amateurs. Of course, maybe we should be glad JC does this. He's only won one national championship and if he had his current team coming back they'd have a lock on it for the next 2 years. And I'd be shocked if any of those kids from KY are attending their pop culture classes today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 -for all the complaining about what calipari has done at ky it appears he did it while operating under the rules set by the ncaa, if there is angst direct it at the ncaa and have them change the rules, i am not a fan of the ncaa as an organization but their treatment of uconn shows they are trying, not effectively or apparantly efficiently but trying -isn't it the college presidents that craft the rules? these are supposed to be smart folks given their day jobs, if they messed up blame them for poor rules, or too many rules or whatever but they set the rules and expect the member institutions to follow them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Cowboy, agreed that he's not breaking any rules. And, I guess in the end, there's really no use berating the guy. It's up to the NCAA to do something about the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 The NCAA has a relationship w/ both the NFL and MLB. I like the MLB model the best. You can go pro right out of HS, but if you choose to go to college, you must stay at least 3 years as I understand it. What's wrong with the BB deal is it makes a complete mockery of the term student-athlete, as well as allowing a coach like Calipari to craft a team of pros every year to compete w/ amateurs. Of course, maybe we should be glad JC does this. He's only won one national championship and if he had his current team coming back they'd have a lock on it for the next 2 years. And I'd be shocked if any of those kids from KY are attending their pop culture classes today. I'm actually not really a fan of the MLB system. I don't know the number right now, but a few seasons ago this article came out that showed out of all 30 MLB teams only 26 guys - out of all active coaches and players - had a college degree. That's way less than football, less than hockey, and even less than the NBA despite being the league that gets all the negative attention about guys leaving school early to go pro (not to mention smaller roster sizes). And most pro baseball players that get drafted never even crack a Major League roster, leaving way, way more baseball players eventually retiring without degrees. If the big concern is the relationship between the NCAA and NBA, and guys giving up a college degree for a shot at the League, then baseball is absolutely not the system to emulate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB73 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Not breaking any rules? It's a joke. No way some of those kids didn't get big $$$$ under the table to play there. Most any BCS team that Calipari goes to, he would get (2-3) 5* kids and (2-3) 4* kids the first yr. The courses the so called KY student athletes DO take are like Missouri University's famed "Biology for Non Science Majors". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Not breaking any rules? It's a joke. No way some of those kids didn't get big $$$$ under the table to play there. Most any BCS team that Calipari goes to, he would get (2-3) 5* kids and (2-3) 4* kids the first yr. The courses the so called KY student athletes DO take are like Missouri University's famed "Biology for Non Science Majors". +1. Rules are being broken, and he'll eventually be exposed just like he was at previous schools. It only takes one person talking to trigger a full blown NCAA investigation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 +1. Rules are being broken, and he'll eventually be exposed just like he was at previous schools. It only takes one person talking to trigger a full blown NCAA investigation. It is quite possible that Cal is breaking rules. His two previous teams had to take on NCAA sanctions due to actions that occurred while he was there. The reputation for underhanded action is already there, and if there is smoke, many times there is fire. However, at this point at Kentucky, I doubt he or boosters need to pay kids to come there. If you are a player with obvious NBA talent, why wouldn't you go play for Kentucky for a year or two? With the high number of players leaving and declaring for the draft every season, it is obviously the best place for you to go play right away as a freshman. You get to play for a high-profile school, get on national TV, play in the NCAA tournament and build up your own name recognition. Doubt Cal even has to do much recruiting. All he needs to do is look at the latest list of McDonald's All-Americans, decide which ones fit his team best for the coming season and place a phone call. These kids already know that Kentucky is the place to go if you want to move onto the NBA. They don't need a booster coming around with an envelope full of 100's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicCityBilliken Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 +1. Rules are being broken, and he'll eventually be exposed just like he was at previous schools. It only takes one person talking to trigger a full blown NCAA investigation. Even UK fans admit that the championship banners are being hung with velcro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 It is quite possible that Cal is breaking rules. His two previous teams had to take on NCAA sanctions due to actions that occurred while he was there. The reputation for underhanded action is already there, and if there is smoke, many times there is fire. However, at this point at Kentucky, I doubt he or boosters need to pay kids to come there. If you are a player with obvious NBA talent, why wouldn't you go play for Kentucky for a year or two? With the high number of players leaving and declaring for the draft every season, it is obviously the best place for you to go play right away as a freshman. You get to play for a high-profile school, get on national TV, play in the NCAA tournament and build up your own name recognition. Doubt Cal even has to do much recruiting. All he needs to do is look at the latest list of McDonald's All-Americans, decide which ones fit his team best for the coming season and place a phone call. These kids already know that Kentucky is the place to go if you want to move onto the NBA. They don't need a booster coming around with an envelope full of 100's. I disagree. Why would these kids want to go to Kentucky and play without getting paid and go one-and-done when they can do the exact same thing while getting paid at a different school? Most of the guys they are getting would go one-and-done no matter what school they attend. Plus, a year is a long time for kids from impoverished families to wait to start making money. I don't buy that all of those kids are going to Kentucky without getting paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I disagree. Why would these kids want to go to Kentucky and play without getting paid and go one-and-done when they can do the exact same thing while getting paid at a different school? Most of the guys they are getting would go one-and-done no matter what school they attend. Plus, a year is a long time for kids from impoverished families to wait to start making money. I don't buy that all of those kids are going to Kentucky without getting paid. There are only a handful of players every year that are good enough to jump directly to the pros, and they only want to go to a handful of schools. Those schools are Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, Duke, Syracue, Ohio State and a few others here and there (like UConn, until recently.) They want to go to these schools not because of the money that local boosters can give them, but because of the visibility they get for playing at these programs. They get to play on national TV constantly during the regular season and end the season in the NCAA tournament, where they can continue to boost their stock. That is why they pick those schools. Not because Happy and his friends of the program drop off a bag of money at their house. These kids are already going to be making millions in the NBA. They have bigger people trying to get a slice of them, like agents who want to represent them in the pros. These agents, who have been tracking the kids since 8th grade or earlier at times, are the ones who are providing the kids with money from high school on. So, it is likely that there are many (if not all) one-and-doners getting money, but most likely it is not coming from school boosters or anyone representing the university. It is coming from people who want to represent the player in the NBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
For-DaLove Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 There are only a handful of players every year that are good enough to jump directly to the pros, and they only want to go to a handful of schools. Those schools are Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, Duke, Syracue, Ohio State and a few others here and there (like UConn, until recently.) They want to go to these schools not because of the money that local boosters can give them, but because of the visibility they get for playing at these programs. They get to play on national TV constantly during the regular season and end the season in the NCAA tournament, where they can continue to boost their stock. That is why they pick those schools. Not because Happy and his friends of the program drop off a bag of money at their house. These kids are already going to be making millions in the NBA. They have bigger people trying to get a slice of them, like agents who want to represent them in the pros. These agents, who have been tracking the kids since 8th grade or earlier at times, are the ones who are providing the kids with money from high school on. So, it is likely that there are many (if not all) one-and-doners getting money, but most likely it is not coming from school boosters or anyone representing the university. It is coming from people who want to represent the player in the NBA. The schools you listed just further play into my point. I'm sure all of those schools pay players. They all have the resources and boosters to do so. Look at the one-and-doners that Memphis had in the past. They sure as hell weren't going there for the schools history or exposure. Cal made sure they got eligible and got paid. There's no doubt in my mind he funnels players to the agents, handlers, boosters, etc who give the players money. The sad part about the whole thing is that Cal is finally somewhere that has enough history to make his corruption look legitimate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I'd love to take a look at the transcripts of the top 5 on that team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB73 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Are you kidding? A lot of the Kentucky "student athletes" get paid cash by alumni, through go-betweens, agents, buffers, AAU power brokers, et all. It happens other places, too, but Kentucky is probably the most blatant at present. Wake up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Are you kidding? A lot of the Kentucky "student athletes" get paid cash by alumni, through go-betweens, agents, buffers, AAU power brokers, et all. It happens other places, too, but Kentucky is probably the most blatant at present. Wake up. i doubt this happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 i doubt this happens. -is it reality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 -is it reality? It may or may not be reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 -it is good to speculate on this stuff, but where is the smoke in lexington? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 It may or may not be reality. -what does mom say? she knows more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I'm actually not really a fan of the MLB system. I don't know the number right now, but a few seasons ago this article came out that showed out of all 30 MLB teams only 26 guys - out of all active coaches and players - had a college degree. That's way less than football, less than hockey, and even less than the NBA despite being the league that gets all the negative attention about guys leaving school early to go pro (not to mention smaller roster sizes). And most pro baseball players that get drafted never even crack a Major League roster, leaving way, way more baseball players eventually retiring without degrees. If the big concern is the relationship between the NCAA and NBA, and guys giving up a college degree for a shot at the League, then baseball is absolutely not the system to emulate. Don't really understand your argument here. You are comparing a league with a huge amount of foreign players, a huge draft pool, and a massive minor league system to a league with no minor league system (for draft purposes the NBDL does not count) and does not allow teams to sign 16 year olds. Completely apples to oranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlarry Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 -it is good to speculate on this stuff, but where is the smoke in lexington? Im pretty sure a lot of cars and couches are still smouldering from the victory riots. Probably a lot of smoke there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 The problem with burning your couch in Kentucky is the potential damage to your front porch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbofive Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 The problem with burning your couch in Kentucky is the potential damage to your front porch and your sister and the kids you share together. and all their mongoloid macaroni artwork... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 -it is good to speculate on this stuff, but where is the smoke in lexington? I'm not so sure this money thing is as prevalent as it used to be, ie before SMU. I'm not naive and there are constant reminders it's still going on, see C.Newton and Auburn, but I don't think KY's sending anymore Fedex envelopes to their recruits. I just watched the HBO documentary on St. Patrick's bid for an undefeated season in '11. It's where Kidd-Gilchrist went along w/ 3 other D1 recruits. There was nothing implying any wrong doing about any of their recruitments, but all of these kids had pretty strong support groups, family, friends, and am sure there were some street agents in the mix as well, who probably contribute a few bucks during their short stint of playing college student. And all the parents of a future NBA star would have to do would be to go to a bank in Lexington and take out a short term loan of $5 to 10k to fund the 6 months he's going to be in school. I've been told by bankers in Columbus this happens all the time at Ohio State. But I'd have to go along w/ whoever said above, schools really don't need to risk it for the short time they're at places like KY or Duke. Now if a kid was going to be there for 3-4 years, like FB players who are way more likely to receive under the table funding and loaner Escalades, then a guy like Calipari would bear watching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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