CAG Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 This is a quote from Ramsey, Roy and others. (Actually they used 13-7/7-13, however we only have 12 D1 wins and now 8 D1 losses). Is this really acceptable? Apparently it is acceptable to Ramsey. He's said so on 590 numerous times. Are any of you comfortable with this performance? Our avg. rpi loss is to a team ranked 107 while last year it was to a team ranked 87. We're 3-4 in a conference we all feel is sub par. Last year we finished tied for 3rd. This year we're 8th. At 4 games over .500 we have not improved. I'm just confused how anyone can find this acceptable. I'm not saying we should be undefeated but 16-4 is not out of the realm. SLU still needs $8 mil for this arena, they need a naming rights sponsor, and need to sell tickets to pay for this arena. If the program continues in this fashion, Cheryl is forced to bring in someone to create excitement and sell the Men's Basketball Program. Otherwise the typical St. Louis fan will continue not to care. Sometimes a ringing endorsement can be the kiss of death. It is crunchtime for Brad's team. CAG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 No it's not good enough. I bet if I say really stupid and negative ###### on Bills.com things will change. They are still my team, I will support them and remain positive while discussing the things that imo should change in a well thought out manner. When the season is over, it will be the time to assess the situation and decide if a change needs to be made. It's not now. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman Official Sponser of the Stemmler and Ahearn could and would have helped club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUDrew Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 "Sometimes a ringing endoresement is the kiss of death" Couldn't agree more. It has happened countless times Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Maybe, I read the CL article wrong. I took from it she will review at the end of the season. For right now, ie the current season, she isn't considering a change. Who in their right mind would? It's not like we're 1-20, players being suspended, or under investigation by the NCAA. What we're all hoping for is the light to go on for the Bills, they start a run in the remaining conference games, and somehow win the A-10 tourney. If there is no post season bid, and no signs of a spring recruiting class that is really going to improve us next year, granted that's a guessing game, CL may be forced to take some sort of action in the late spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 When we are not playing in the NIT this year, what will you whack jobs be saying? I'd love to think that'd we be playing in the NIT, but then again, I see it as a failure if we even do reach the NIT. Striving for a tournament in which we'll get knocked out in the 1st round isn't quite an accomplishment. Just curious as to how you accept such lowly play with such a talented team? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry the Legend Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 And things could get a lot worse. We have away games vs. St. Joe's, Xavier, Dayton, Rhode Island and UMass with home games vs. GW, LaSalle, Dayton, and Richmond. Mmmm, let's see: we might win 2 out of 5 on the road (noting SLU's lack of road wins) and 3 of 4 at home. That puts us 8 and 8 in a poor conference and most likely an 7 or 8 seed in the A 10 tourney. Not good enough in my opinion. No chance of an NIT bid unless we go to the championship game. How many spots do we have open for next year? 4 or 5? And Brad has signed no one as of today. Does he think that kids are just waiting for him to call them? Heck no! They are signing with other schools that show interest and have proven that they want to win. In SLU's case, I am beginning to wonder...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 canadian said, "Just curious as to how you accept such lowly play with such a talented team?" i say this team is not as good as we thought. if the current level of play of ian alone was known 4 months ago, do you think anyone would have been the same level of excitement? how about the month of december for kevin lisch with his elbow and finger injuries? obi not progressing? coach soderberg even told us in the fall that if luke meyer had to be our power forward that was a concern. he even expected either johnson or obi to step up. they didnt. the fact is the team is still building. next year we only lose johnson, bennett and vouyoukas. vouyoukas wont be as difficult to replace as we all once suspected. our three best players, lisch, liddell and meyer will all return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 larry, you do realize that no one has or is signing with any program since november and wont until late april when official signing period opens again. we have no idea what coach soderberg has going simply because he always plays his recruiting cards close to the vest. he always has. i prefer to wait until may before getting worked up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Canadian, I think it will be a failure if we don't make the NCAA much less the NIT. And, at this point the NCAA is probably 95% out. So, the season may end up being a failure in my eyes. That being said I still look at the big picture and try and see why we failed. If we don't make the NIT, I will be sick to my stomach and think the season is even more of a failure. Even so, I just can't see why anybody who advocates firing Brad mid-season thinks it is a good thing. Maybe I am not thinking correctly, so I'm truly interested in what benefits may come from it. Here's my reasons for not wanting to fire Brad mid-season. First off, what if there are recruits in the wings that he is going to sign this spring, because they like him and want to play for him. Will they sign if he is fired now? Also, not sure it will help the team this year one bit. I think it will kill our NIT chances and the tiny tiny chance of us winning the conference tourney. We still have hope and with him being gone, we have zero hope in my opinion. At the end of the season, we can access the situation and get a feel for what is the right thing to do. Right now any decisions about Brad will be based more on emotion as opposed to the big picture. At the end of the season, we'll be able to evaluate everything. How did we end up doing? Were we NIT? How far did we go in the NIT? Did we pull off a miracle in Atlantic City? What recruits do we have now going into next year? What is the morale and the pulse of the team. Do we have any verbals for Fall Signings? We can look back at the season and look at the losses and truly pinpoint injuries, player progression or regression, etc. As much as I would like to have a few more wins than we do and as much as I question Brad from time to time, we're in one of those situations that we just kind of have to deal with. It's not settling for mediocrity in any way. It's looking at the big picture and evaluating everything. The other thing people don't think about is the donors who love Brad. Look at this Board. There are the Brad supporters and those calling for his head. Why would you think it would be any different among the many donors who are not on this board. I am sure there are those who want him gone now and I am sure there are those who like the program he runs, like his personality, and believe he can turn things around. The AD certainly wouldn't want to jeopardize those donors by making a decision that may be to much a knee jerk reaction. Just some thing to think about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUSER Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Yeah Roy, I'm sure he has 4 blue chippers ready to sign in April that we all don't know about. Honestly, I think the only thing that saves Brad's job is the spring recruiting class. IF he doesnt land top recruits, he will get fired immediately. There is no way CL can fill the new arena (which she has to do) if the program continues to go in the opposite direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 tonka said, "First off, what if there are recruits in the wings that he is going to sign this spring, because they like him and want to play for him. Will they sign if he is fired now?" and let's not lose sight of the fact that the st louis junior and sophomore high school class is reputed to be the best in the area history. brad currently has a built in advantage because his son plays summer ball with all of the best that he gets to sit with those parents every single game in the summer. yeah, he is supposed to be a parent and not the coach of saint louis university at those games, but how many of those parents can differentiate that and care to do that? my guess is that he is building an unbelievable amount of credibility, confidence and loyalty at those aau games that cannot be discounted. now will it be good enough to overcome the prestige of high majors come calling? bruce weber couldnt land his own brother's best player when duke came calling? shawn livingston reversed his verbal committ to illinois to commit to duke when duke called. there is no denying that is going to be hard to overcome with the very top of the st louis prospects. however, they arent all going to get the duke and north carolina calls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 i do agree with your point that losing IV isn't looking as devestating as it was at the beginning of the year. I will concede that my anticipation for next year has grown from being just a dismal state to thinking we could make some noise in the A-10. That being said, we still clearly need the recruits talked about ad nausem on here to fill the 4 and 5 spots. I don't buy the injury excuse. I really doubt lisch's injury was as bad as proclaimed on this board because his shooting in practice didn't suffer. I never counted on Obi. From the moment I saw his fat ass waddle out on the court I knew he'd never contribute. If we continue to improve, we should be in decent/good shape going into next year. But then again, that's not a guarentee. i.e. IV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 >vouyoukas wont be as difficult to replace as we all once suspected. >our three best players, lisch, liddell and meyer will all return. True, but if Brad doesn't come through on those spring signings, it won't matter much. I'm hoping that the a couple of juco players we're after can look past having to practice in West Pine for a year. Lisch and Liddell need some serious help. As it stands, when they don't both play well, we don't win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 >bruce weber couldnt land his own brother's best player when >duke came calling? shawn livingston reversed his verbal >committ to illinois to commit to duke when duke called. >there is no denying that is going to be hard to overcome >with the very top of the st louis prospects. however, they >arent all going to get the duke and north carolina calls. From what I've seen this year Roy, Suggs is the only blue chipper in the local 2008 class. Brandenburg's inability to finish or rebound against dimunitive frontlines on anything resembling a consistent basis has been baffling. Femi John looks the part but the kid has been struggling mightily from the perimeter and the free throw line and is a nonfactor on the boards. There's so much pressure on these kids to live up to the hype I'm afraid it's stunted their development. East St. Louis's Anthony Mitchell, a kid I never even heard of last year, is probably the 2nd best junior in the St. Louis area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 The scary thing about if you fire Brad is that all of the top junoir talent and a lot of the sophomore talent are friends with Kramer. Some really good friends. Add to that the fact all of their parents really seem to like Brad. I think this would really be a set back to any new coach when it comes to getting some of the best talent ever to come out of the area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 opposite direction? we will win more games than we did last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUSER Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 We will???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Is SLU better than last year? Well let's take a look. The answer is no. SLU is basically the same, possibly worse. ...and if it doesn't want to be worse, needs to only lose 2 more games this year. Pacific and Loyola not turning out to be good wins...so home win over Ole Miss and MO St vs home win over SIU last year...worse in conference this year. http://slubillikens.cstv.com/sports/m-bask...sched-2005.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Regression could also be evidenced by the fact that we were beaten more soundly by UNC (at home) and A&M this year than we were last year by UNC (at UNC) and Gonzaga. Win-loss record doesn't tell the whole story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUSER Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 According to Roy it does. We are heading in the wrong direction not only because of our record and performance this year, but because Brad followed up his liddell and lisch signings with knollmeyer, mcguire, two guys that no longer play for us and that's it! how do you do that to TL and KL? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 >Brandenburg's inability to finish or rebound against dimunitive >frontlines on anything resembling a consistent basis has been >baffling. Sounds like he'd be perfect for us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Funny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kappy96 Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 I made the win-loss isn't the only measuring stick arguement with Roy a few weeks ago as well. It's a cop out argument that neglects to look at the entire state of the program and we are worse off now then we were when I made that point. The spring recruiting class is key to Brad keeping this program from sliding to the bottom half of the A-10 next year. I think most people would agree with that. If he strikes out again then SLU is going to be sitting next to Duquesne and Richmond in detention for a while. I am not sure what to think and have to go off what I read here. I have read posts on this board that are extremely positive about UB's chances to land some difference makers in the spring and some that simply let his recent track record speak for itself (not good). I believe CL has a pretty easy decision if UB falls on his face this spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 hey, one good recruiting class every 5, 6, or 7 years ain't bad! next time I screw up at work, I'm going to tell my boss, "Hey boss, I only need to perform well once every 6 years! Look at Brad Soderberg! He's makin $500,000+ by doing it that way"! Get serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Are you even able to comprehend what you read? Have you just not noticed my other post when I said Brad needed a change in results to retain his job? Maybe Doctor B is right about the people they are admitting to SLU these days. Forgive me for pointing out that firing Brad might put the new coach behind the eight ball when it comes to that group of kids. Did I say we should retain him because of that? No, I just pointed out the relationships Brad and his son have with these players and their parents might hurt a coach taking over for Brad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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