NashvilleBilliken Posted December 13, 2006 Share Posted December 13, 2006 Are we so used to losing that we can't recognize a good thing when it happens? C'mon guys, we're 7-2. We just won on the west coast. Enjoy it. I keep reading about us not being a good team, but we have 7 wins in early December!! The important thing is we're winnnig. We are a better team today than we were a month ago. We're gonna continue to get better. After every loss, we come back and win. TAMU beat us by 33. They beat Pacific by 12 at home. We beat Pacific by 7 on the road. What does that mean? Absolutely nothing. That's why they play the games. We're winning...enjoy the ride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Of those 7 wins 5 are of the teams are ranked 250 or worse. We have not looked good in some of those wins. It is completely understandable to still have doubts about this team. Go 3-1 in the next 4 and you can erase all the doubts but if we go 2-2, I hope people aren't telling me how wonderful 9-4 is when anybody can see that 6 of those 9 wins are against 250+ RPI teams. nothing has been proven, one way or another, about this team which leaves you only with subjective opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorB Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I am extremely happy and proud to say so. The team is getting better and will be much much better by February. I began glowing as we got stop after stop in the 2nd half Tuesday night. Great stuff, even though we had some clunker shots. I believe we still ended up shooting 51% for the game. I guess my secret is that I am a huge fan but not obsessive about it anymore. May be a sign of aging. My personal energy and mood are pretty much unrelated these days to the outcomes of sporting events in general. My guess is some of the most virulent and obnoxious posters on here are in their 20s or younger. Hormones still steaming in overdrive through the veins. I am happy happyhappyhappyhappyhappy. . . . . and may even be happier if we can win a few of the next 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Majerus Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Thanks to Nark for the use of the Billiken You're too young for testopause...:+ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Kshoe, I have questions in the back of my head and I believe they are legit. Those questions tend to wrestle with my general optimism going into every game. Here's something about our record that I am happy with. 5 of our wins may be against teams with bad RPI's but I happy that they are wins. We have sat through many seasons where don't win those road games where we should win regardless of a team's RPI. The Loyola win on the road this year says a lot for the team. I also think the Pacific win on the road says a lot. I think Pacific says a lot because in year's past we would not have come back from that halftime deficit. One could argue that we should not have been down to begin with, but the kid was on fire in his home gym in the first half. I am thrilled with our record right now and happy with where we are at as a team. Tommie and KL are showing they will be there every night and a force for a team to plan against. Luke will leave it out on the floor every night. JJ is showing more and more than he can be a guy that does go out there and just do what Coach asks of him. Is JJ fully proven - no. But, I think more so than ever he shows he will contribute in areas we need him to. DP is playing better this year than I thought he would. It's still early to know for sure on AK, but I like what I have seen and think he will only get better. IV has perplexed me but I now think that is 2 fold. I was throwing it all on Ian's back to get more aggressive and I still feel that way. But, I am reading now he has not been 100% healthy. I also think some of that falls back on Coach. A week or so ago people were ranking Coach on some things. He got high marks in pre game planning from what I remember. I think he can do a better job with Ian and planning. There are situations where Ian will be doubled teamed and triple teamed and I don't know if Ian responds very well in those situations. I think Coach can game plan slightly better around that. Lastly, I think we have a ways to go on defense. I think we'll get answers on our defense over this next home stretch. All in all, it's tough not to be high on the team. The record is good. Aside from KL's elbow we are pretty healthy. We have more options from the bench than year's past. We have shown more offense than we have in years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Band Legend Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Every good team in college basketball, and I mean every one, plays at least some blood donors. The vast majority of teams with glitzy records at this point in the season has fattened up with above 200 rpi teams. So don't give me this crap about us not having beaten anybody. We're just members of the club. The only crushing disappointment of this season so far was not showing up for the A&M game. I've gotten over that, so you can too, Kshoe. It's ok to be optimistic. The people on this board are like a bunch of old ladies; *****, *****, *****. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltiedave Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 It's really popular to be down on the team, so in case we don't make the dance ya can say "I told you so." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 at this point in the season to label a team a 250+ rpi team is overly simple. Pacific will most likely be a team with an RPI less than 200, as will Loyola,. SO I would not call those wins inconsequential yet. We may look back and see that we beat some good teams in Loyola, Houston, and Pacific. IF this team play defense as well as they did in the second half for a full 40 minutes, we may actually do better than 3-1 in the next four games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Today Houston's RPI is 153 They have a tough December..... Sun.....Arizona RPI 1, Followed by Charlotte and I think other TBA at tourney in Hawii, UNLV December 30th, Kentucky then start CUSA with Memphis. I hope those other starters play and contribute and they come away with a few wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 actually since Quincy is a D 2 team it does not count. 2 wins are against loyola (53) and Houston (153). Two on neutral courts and two road wins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 we have to be pleased with 7-2. As many have said, in the past we're probably losing to Loyola, possibly Houston, and Pacific. So yes, it's safe to say we're a better team than years past. Hopefully, what this team takes away from the Pacific game is how important it is to play old style Billiken defense. Just a theory on the games prior to Pacific: in their minds these guys were so hyped about up tempo offense they kind of dogged it on defense thinking we can get it all back. Recall the three opening games; our point totals were two in the eighties one in the seventies. Pinch me, is this really the SLU Billikens, a team that usually struggles to score plus 50+? These games may have given us a false sense of security in our new found offensive prowress. A&M was a wake up call that didn't get answered until Pacific. Yes this team scores better than any in recent memory. Now, couple that with our traditional in your face defense, and we might be on to something good. Even, UB said, after the WI game, he was mystified as to the team's poor play on defense. On the post game Pacific show, he said he didn't rant and rave at halftime, just told them this was a game they needed if they were going to reach their goal of making the dance, and the only way they were going to win it was by making a conscious decision to play D. They did and, voila, you have a come from behind road win. What was even more impressive was they scored 34 in the process. You've got to admit, that's a new twist for us. Teams have watershed momentsduring a season where the light goes on. I'm hoping the Pacific game was it for us. If so, and that D effort is applied for 40 mpg, then, yes, this team is a legit dance contender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I think you are right about this with regard to the Pacific game. Teams improve in small steps. This team I hope found itself defensively. Talent is what it is, but teams win. Before teams win on the road and learning to win is the key. We did not play well offensively in the last minute of the game, but we won because we rebounded, played good defense, and hit FT. I hope we look back at the UoP game and see that was a turning point in the season. step one first win check step two neutral court win check step three road win Check, double check step four win over top 50 team step five win over top 10 team lets get the last two steps accomplished Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I don't disagree that the RPIs will most likely change and maybe Pacific can climb above 200 but the other four wins are over bums (LaMar, La Tech, Quincy, and Western Ill.) Yes, a couple of those were neutral court bums but bums nevertheless. Pacific is mostllikely going to be 2-9 in a couple weeks after they play a couple top 25 teams so we need to keep that win in perspective. 7-2 is fine. It is exactly where we should be at this point but lets not act like we've beaten a single team that is likely to be in the NCAA tourney, because we haven't. Thus, any argument that goes like "why are people still critical of this team, we have proven we are good because we are 7-2" is garbage in my opinion. The fact is, nothing has been proven at this point except that we are capable of playing very good ball at times and very bad ball at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 That is exactly what it is. They want to be able to say see I told you. If the Bills make the dance they will say well they should have. Then they will ***** if we don't make the sweet 16 and blame Brad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 You mean the same team that beat RPI 96 BYU last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I am very happy to hear about that. Still, they are 3-6 right now. I may wait a while before I pencil them into the NIT though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 to not be very happy with this season thus far is crazy kshoe. it is pretty obvious that the naysayers and haters (which i now include you in these days) are pretty much just making things up in their personal vendetta's with coach soderberg. as the shoe family loves to accuse me on issues i have had in the past, i can only assume that soderberg ran over the shoe dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 i dont think it is an "i told you so" thing. i think it is personal hatred for coach soderberg and nothing else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I say I wasn't content with this season thus far? And what did i make up? The fact that 5 of our 7 wins are against teams ranked 250 or worse. Is that made up? A dose of reality is necessary here. Very little has been proven about this team at this point. Few feel stronger about our NCAA potential than they did at the beginning of the year and few feel worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 i disagree. a lot has been proven. they have shown a lot of fortitude to win games that billiken teams in the past would not have won. successful teams find ways to win when key players are hurt, having bad days etc. middle of the road team lose those games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SShoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 agree with KShoe here though. At the start of the year, we thought this was a Billiken team that would win games which previous SLU teams would've lost, hence why many us had us billed to be a tourney team. So nothing is lost, but nothing is really gained. We're right where we should be, which in mind is a good thing because I thought we'd be a good team and potential tournament team. Status quo is not great (and great would've been 8-1 or even 9-0), but certainly not bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 "it is pretty obvious that the naysayers and haters (which i now include you in these days) are pretty much just making things up in their personal vendetta's with coach soderberg." They hate coach soderberg? They have a personal vendetta with coach soderberg? And who's making stuff up? So people either hate SLU and the results thus far or love SLU and the results thus far. This season is not black and white. Some good, some bad, some average. One of the Shoe's makes a good point below, most of us thought this team was a tourney team at the beginning of the year. So why are we comparing it to years past? If we are going to have a dialogue about this team, it should only concern the results of this team this year against this year's opponents. Now if we want to discuss the growth of the program, that comparison might very well be justified. Looking at this team this year, we have beat 5 below average teams and struggled to win on a few occasions (and just because i start with this topic sentence does not exclude the fact that i'm excited about some positives in the same games). The folks that expect SLU to be in the tourney are justified in having doubts based on these results and those doubts have been expressed. Also, the same people are acknowledging the positive results and therefore have continued hope (in response to the constant "why do you even cheer, you're such a hater" chorus"). Certain of you are befuddled as to why some people have doubts. I'm equally befuddled at why you are befuddled. How could one not have doubts if the expectations are to make the tourney? Having doubts and supporting the team are not mutually exclusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 I think what is encouraging is that we were able to fight back after being down in two road wins (Loyola and Pacific). What is troubling is that when we faced a top team, we got thumped. To this point, I'm still right in the middle and a lot remains to seen about this team. We'll get another opportunity to play an elite team (UNC) and a very good team (Mo St.). The next month will really prove what we're made of. We gotta go 7-1! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 what probability did you give the Bills to make the dance before the season started and what probability do you currently give them? My answer to this question was 50% before the season started and 40% right now, largely because of the decline of the A-10 and the effect that will have on our RPI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted December 14, 2006 Share Posted December 14, 2006 Let's call them the hate Brad first crowd! As we've saw in the old political debates, setting up the strawman is a common tactic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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