billikenmetz Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Let's be clear here --- Saint Louis University basketball is at a crossroads right now. The book on the Romar era has officially been closed and all of King Brad's men are in place. So... what do we have to show for it? A couple of good runs in a brutal C-USA and a couple of NIT births. Big deal. You haven't impressed me at all, SLU. As a student during the last Romar year and years 1-3 of the Soderberg administration, I was fairly pleased with our output on the court; but a program isn't built on on-the-court success alone. Recruiting, scheduling, etc. is critical for our success, but so far, Brad has fallen below expectations. This is unfortunate because I think we all want Brad to be successful and bring our program back to one of college basketball elite programs. It can be done; but at what point do we collectively say to Brad in our best Donald Trump impressions --- "you're fired?" This has to be the year we make a run if Ian returns. I'm not chalking up the 06-07 season if our Wild Greek Stallion doesn't return to the Frost Campus, but we'll be watching another March Madness without Greg Gumbel calling our name out on Selection Sunday. I'm interested to see what other people are thinking for this year if Ian returns and if Ian doesn't come back to SLU. I don't think it's sink or swim with Ian, but we're missing a giant piece to the puzzle if Ian jumps ship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOSLU68 Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 he wasted everybody's time with people like Darius Miles who would never be eligible for college; he was very lucky to get out out of town when he did; name his big recruits, name his wins that came because of coaching; brad does have a clue about recruiting in the midwest and last year and this year have shown that he can get the right types; romar had real fan support and in spite of a lack of SLU background was really accepted by the fan base; if the media and fans gave brad half the credit and hope they gave romar we would be ahead of schedule. brad seemed a little younger but really had more experience at coaching and romar seemed very content to travel the west coast he was familiar with and to let the players play and not interfere very much. I would have liked brad to have assistants who were his equal and I think the one thing romar did to show he wanted to at least try in the midwest was hire brad-we have had growing pains with brad but he certainly has SLU way out ahead of MO or we would not have the new recruit from Linn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsboys Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Don't rip Lo Ro. Not only is he a great coach but a great man. Romar did a lot while he was here. He had SLU in the homes of kids that never had even heard of the school. He had some commitments, Hollins and Kern. I can remember Lo Ro introducing me to Salim Stoudamire and his mother on a visit. When you recruit the top kids you miss on alot of kids but if you get 1, that could lead to big things. I think we all remember Larry. Lorenzo knew if he kept going after the top kids he was going to start winning the recruiting wars. IMHO Romar is light years ahead of Brad with the recruiting. Remember Romar was recruiting Tommie while he was here and many felt that he would have had an earlier commitment from him if Romar had stayed. Lorenzo has a top 20 program now, so lets not try to compare brad and lorenzo, it's not really close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Can't support the idea that Zo was overly successful at SLU. Yeah, 2000 was a miracle, Spoon's recruits though. After that, his recruiting strategy was flawed with his going after kids that were longshots to pick SLU. His plan B's didn't pan out all that well...ask UB when 3 of them weren't there and his 2 recruits never showed. Also, SIU picked up the crumbs we ignored and were making dances with them during this period. Josh Fisher is the only good thing about Zo's time here. But a more important question for SLU and fans to ask is, "how has he become such a phenom at WU?" This was not a basketball school/powerhouse he took over. Now he lands top five recruiting classes. No doubt the man can sell his program there but couldn't here? Why? As for UB, he's got two years left to prove his mettle. Whether IV returns or not, he's got till 2008 to get us dancing...if not, well show him the door. Stability be damned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p diddy Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 simple, LoRo went after the area talent in seattle and got them to come to washington. a few players were in place such as nate, roy, conroy and co., but has had made UW the program that local kids want to go to. he is a great recruiter. he has proved that everywhere he's been (UCLA, Pepperdine, UW), except for SLU. I wish he would have recruited the local kids in stl as hard when he was here like he is in seattle. with his ability, we would have had players such as phillip gilbert, darren brooks, dan oppland, tamarr maclin and stetson hairston in the fold. They may not have been big names on the national level, but they were real good players that would have helped you win at the college level. those guys were not recruited and instead, he brought in randy pulley, floyd Mcclain, ross varner and John seyfert. check out the college stats that brooks, gilbert, oppland and hairston and compare what they did to what the guys we got in their place. That's the difference in returning to the ncaa and going 17-14 and 15-16 in his two years after the miracle in memphis. bad boyz for life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 I expect the Billikens to make the 2007 NCAA Tournament. I also think they'll compete for the A-10 regular season championship. That's provided Ian Vouyoukas returns to school and the big three stay healthy. Tommie Liddell needs to hit his jumpers from 15-19 feet more consistently. A forward needs to step up and help Vouyoukas clear the defensive boards to the tune of 6-8 boards per game. Perimeter shooting must improve so that teams can't pack it in against Vouyoukas and Liddell without being punished by three-point shots. The juniors (Dwayne Polk, Danny Brown, Luke Meyer, and Bryce Husak) must demonstrate more polish and confidence. This team should play in the NCAA Tournament. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTIME Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 >I expect the Billikens to make the 2007 NCAA Tournament. I >also think they'll compete for the A-10 regular season >championship. That's provided Ian Vouyoukas returns to >school and the big three stay healthy. > >Tommie Liddell needs to hit his jumpers from 15-19 feet more >consistently. A forward needs to step up and help Vouyoukas >clear the defensive boards to the tune of 6-8 boards per >game. Perimeter shooting must improve so that teams can't >pack it in against Vouyoukas and Liddell without being >punished by three-point shots. The juniors (Dwayne Polk, >Danny Brown, Luke Meyer, and Bryce Husak) must demonstrate >more polish and confidence. > >This team should play in the NCAA Tournament. Start Bryce and Ian together. He will have to be a pf to play at the next level anyway. Plus Bryce played well when given a chance. He can block shots and hit short jumpers. All he needs is a chance, just like Ian did. He's our best option inside. This is one instance where Brad should go with the vet and not one of the freshman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardball Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Not to mention if you believe what you here Galen Grimes would have been a Billiken. Romar would have beat out Mizzou and Kansas for a recruit. So I say to the Kool-Aid drinkers, I guess SLU can beat out the big time schools with the right coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorB Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 that sounds about right. Why should we not think that this team cannot compete for the conference championship?? I bet we are not preseason 13th this time! I'd like to see the schedule before guessing numbers, but i would almost guarantee we will not be .500 going in to 2007. We will win some of the close road games this time around. Darkhorse of the year=Justin, who I think will get decent minutes and decent rebounds. He is way ahead of Obi, light-years, in fact, for those of you who have not been to see for yourselves. JJ is ready to bust out for his senior season. I have high hopes for AK but I am willing to drink some more kool-aid, if I must, and believe the best for JJ. Go JJ!! How 'bout some love for JJ? (my darkhorse last year was AD--and I remember getting laughed at when I asked a year ago, how 'bout some love for Anthony?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Soderberg passed on Blake four + years ago.....and your still bitter. As it turns out, he did the young man a big favor. Since 90% of your post are either pro-BA or anti-Soderberg, it appears that you are going to hold your grudge in an Ozzie-like manner ..... get over it, and let some fresh air into your life! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 >Not to mention if you believe what you here Galen Grimes >would have been a Billiken. Romar would have beat out Mizzou >and Kansas for a recruit. So I say to the Kool-Aid drinkers, >I guess SLU can beat out the big time schools with the right >coach. Is Galen Grimes as bad as Kalen Grimes? They both suck. I'd rather land a player like Ian who can actually play as opposed to an over-hyped stiff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 I hope you're right again, Doc. If so, we could put together a very nice season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 At least Anthony was a half-way decent player before going into the tank his junior year. JJ has been in Coach's doghouse almost since the moment he stepped on campus. If their relationship hasn't changed, he won't be getting decent minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 I've always been high on JJ. He just needs the pt. Be careful posting anything positive around here, you'll get caned. Bottom Line: IV comes back, we make the tourney this year and next. He jumps somewhere, we don't make it this year and fight tooth and nail for next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Production at both ends of the court will dictate JJ's minutes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 That never dictated Drew Diener's minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 I don't know how any SLU fans could still be high on JJ. He has been here for four years, including the redshirt season when he practiced everyday, and has given us virtually NOTHING. He's soft, can't get his mind right, has been suspended multiple times for off-the-court reasons, and still has that baby-giraffe-like awkwardness that should disappear after freshman (or redshirt) season. There is no possible argument that JJ could make for any pt this or any other year. What has he done? This is an example of a recruit that we took in desperation, and has turned out to be a waste of a scholarship that Brad has too much principle to drop. The play that sums up JJ's career for me was his freshman year: first attempt at a dunk during garbage time vs. Louisville at the Savvis Center. JJ goes up uncontested, rejected by the rim. SLU was down about 26 at the time, but players on the bench, as well as a couple assistants, still managed to laugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUDrew Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Doc, for once we agree. JJ clearly has the tools to fill a critical role for this team. He and Danny Brown, in my mind, will dictate how far this team goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Hopefully Romar could have motivated Kalen Grimes, because he's turned out to be nothing more than a lazy underachiever. Romar may not have a lot on paper to show from his 3 years at SLU, but he was a fantastic coach who built great relationships with players and recruits. He may not have landed a couple big names, but he had the program on the verge. We were about to land a nice class of Hollins, Kern (who wouldn't have qualified at first, though), and the one people forget: Taj Gray. After that, Romar had every local talent wanting to play for him in the future. It's interesting to imagine where the program would be had he stayed, and he almost did. I'm a big Brad fan, too, but unfortunately he had to build from scratch when he started. He had no chance of keeping a very frustrated Floyd McClain, who stayed in school despite his injuries because of Romar, and Jason Edwin, who had a GPA the same as Bluto from Animal House. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Evidently, the head coach saw DD's contribution differently than you did! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 JJ supposedly walked last saturday. Anybody know what grad school he will be in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted May 25, 2006 Share Posted May 25, 2006 Evidently the head coach sees things differently on a basketball court than a lot of people. I think he devalues the contributions of kids who are high-energy guys but don't necessarily have a high basketball IQ. That's part of why the offer to Andrew Beinert, who who reportedly has a "high basketball IQ" and is "adept at using screens, and moves well without the ball" makes so much sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenmetz Posted May 25, 2006 Author Share Posted May 25, 2006 All we need is a miracle with Brad....look at the Marquette miracle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenmetz Posted May 25, 2006 Author Share Posted May 25, 2006 Grad school of hard knocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenmetz Posted May 25, 2006 Author Share Posted May 25, 2006 He walked every game too...does the Icky Shuffle out there....who dey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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