SLUfan_42 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Jake Barnett is a senior. Ideally, your senior year should be your peak of development and production. Barnett not only hasn't done anything this year, he was better last year. At least last year he could make an open three and bring some energy. This, my friends, is a lost cause. This reminds me almost exactly of the Kyle Cassidy situation. He averaged 8.0 points as a junior and came in his senior year and averaged only 3.3. He had a very pure stroke from three, but was afraid to shoot it for whatever reason. Majerus used this as an opportunity to give both Mcall and Jett (both sophomores at the time) added minutes for long-term benefits. This is was Crews needs to do. Mcbroom and Crawford need minutes. Simple as that. They need experience under their belt to build familiarity with the offense and their teammates of the future. If a senior can't get it done, put someone who has potential in the future in to get his feet wet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 If we are just looking for outside shooting, why not have both McBroom and Barnett in the game with Jett on the bench? I will say that I would like to see McBroom get more PT than Barnett. There is no reason that he shouldn't be a great defender because of how quick he is. Perhaps fans who are angry with Jake should really be pissed that McBroom hasn't made more of an effort to improve his defense? He has a whole transfer year to work on it. Some of our best stretches of many games last year were with Mitchell, McCall, and Jett all in the game at the same time. There is no reason we can't do the same thing with McBroom in place of Mitchell. very good observation. agree completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUfan_42 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 If we are just looking for outside shooting, why not have both McBroom and Barnett in the game with Jett on the bench? I will say that I would like to see McBroom get more PT than Barnett. There is no reason that he shouldn't be a great defender because of how quick he is. Perhaps fans who are angry with Jake should really be pissed that McBroom hasn't made more of an effort to improve his defense? He has a whole transfer year to work on it. Some of our best stretches of many games last year were with Mitchell, McCall, and Jett all in the game at the same time. There is no reason we can't do the same thing with McBroom in place of Mitchell. Are you saying we could start Mcbroom instead of Agbeko and JJ play the 3? Cuz I'd be okay with that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 TL was hurting. He did not seem to move all that well. Suspect the travel call he had was in part due to his ankle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 When we needed outside shooting - the 3 pt - at the end of the game, why not have McBroom in versus Barnett? Coming into the game Jake was 6 for 18. Not great but not terrible either. Not defending having him in, but this talk that he's a terrible shooter is just wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Here are my thoughts. I've expressed them numerous times before. Saying something like: "Barnett played horrible that game. He missed key FTs and air balled 3 that could have tied the game. I would have liked to see McBroom playing instead." is perfectly fine. Saying: "Jake Barnett sucks. He is garbage. I wish he wasn't on the team." is out of line. Criticism of the play of a player is fine (although constructive criticism is the best) . Personal attacks on a player are wrong. I don't think it is too difficult to differentiate between the two and I don't think it is too much to ask. I don't disagree with you, but this board has never been a place where statements like that would get you a "cooling off period" nor should it become one. The other posters do just fine telling someone they are out of line. Saying a player sucks or he's garbage should not be moderated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 very good observation. agree completely. No - JB can not shoot - so having him on the floor is not a solution based on your observation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Coming into the game Jake was 6 for 18. Not great but not terrible either. Not defending having him in, but this talk that he's a terrible shooter is just wrong He hit a some shots early in the season but has not shot well since the SIUC game. The last two shots he took against WSU were tipped and there was no excuse for that. He is slow getting his shot off and when he does at least recently he has been off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Are you saying we could start Mcbroom instead of Agbeko and JJ play the 3? Cuz I'd be okay with that I don't know if we should start McBroom. Because JJ and the two MCs are the only guards that seem capable of playing the 1 and 2, we have to pick our spots going with all 3 of them in the game. I would love to McBroom to become good enough defensively that we can play all 3 at the same time during key stretches of games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 I don't disagree with you, but this board has never been a place where statements like that would get you a "cooling off period" nor should it become one. The other posters do just fine telling someone they are out of line. Saying a player sucks or he's garbage should not be moderated. I'm on board with this unless it gets excessive. As you said, we can generally police ourselves and call out the people going overboard. If they continue or take it too far though, I would not have a problem with some type of "cooling off period." In my experience this is how it has been and it has worked pretty well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 My issue isn't just that AM wasn't out there for the last possession, but that he didn't play for the last 8 or so minutes (can't remember exactly how long he was out). He didn't play for such a long stretch to end the game that I thought he might be hurt. Regarding the end of the game, does the 10 second rule to get across half court reset after a timeout? WSU got the ball with 30.x seconds after JB's made free throw and didn't cross half court until about 18 seconds, although there was a timeout in between. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JettFlight5 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 My issue isn't just that AM wasn't out there for the last possession, but that he didn't play for the last 8 or so minutes (can't remember exactly how long he was out). He didn't play for such a long stretch to end the game that I thought he might be hurt. Regarding the end of the game, does the 10 second rule to get across half court reset after a timeout? WSU got the ball with 30.x seconds after JB's made free throw and didn't cross half court until about 18 seconds, although there was a timeout in between. I thought it didn't. I remember some VCU guys saying how that rule would benefit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doowop Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 My issue isn't just that AM wasn't out there for the last possession, but that he didn't play for the last 8 or so minutes (can't remember exactly how long he was out). He didn't play for such a long stretch to end the game that I thought he might be hurt. Regarding the end of the game, does the 10 second rule to get across half court reset after a timeout? WSU got the ball with 30.x seconds after JB's made free throw and didn't cross half court until about 18 seconds, although there was a timeout in between. Yes it resets. It does not seem fair but it is the rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOSLU68 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 I am guessing that Agbeko never played again because his man figured out how to beat him more ways than one as he is a freshman; but you can not argue with + and - minutes, we were up a ton and rebounding when he was in. I may not have put him into the game in the last three minutes I would have gone for AM despite the fact that he likes to hold the ball waiting for his chance rather than looking for assists. I would say we were winning whenever we scored off defence and if we stood around waiting to have someone become free because no one was guarding him, well Jake Barnett stood in the corner a lot and he was rewarded with a couple of chances. Other games I remember Jake making his defender work but tracking him around the court-was he just too tired out because he did try for a lot of minutes on defence. I also wonder why JJ did not guard 31 although after one of his falls going to the basket you could see he is playing with pain-hip pointers? broken tailbone? JJ is giving us a lot when he forgets what is bothering him but something is definitely wrong there. If Mike Crawford can shoot a three I would trust him to be in at the end of the game from the limited time we have seen him play unless he is too slow and is a duplicate of JB only younger? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Yes it resets. It does not seem fair but it is the rule. Thanks. I figured that was the case as no one was causing a stink about it. I also agree about RA. Would have liked to see him in there in the second half. I'm not sure he played any minutes in the 2nd half. Yes, he got beat a couple of times, but the offense seemed to flow better with him in there (or maybe I think that because we just happened to hit a few outside shots while he was in). He definitely fights for boards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 I'm on board with this unless it gets excessive. As you said, we can generally police ourselves and call out the people going overboard. If they continue or take it too far though, I would not have a problem with some type of "cooling off period." In my experience this is how it has been and it has worked pretty well. Name the poster that's gotten a cooling off period for calling a player garbage or saying he sucks. If that was the case we'd have had 2 posters during KC's time. Roy and ... ok, 1 poster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 My issue isn't just that AM wasn't out there for the last possession, but that he didn't play for the last 8 or so minutes (can't remember exactly how long he was out). He didn't play for such a long stretch to end the game that I thought he might be hurt. Regarding the end of the game, does the 10 second rule to get across half court reset after a timeout? WSU got the ball with 30.x seconds after JB's made free throw and didn't cross half court until about 18 seconds, although there was a timeout in between. I asked the same thing during the game ... is AM hurt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 He hit a some shots early in the season but has not shot well since the SIUC game. The last two shots he took against WSU were tipped and there was no excuse for that. He is slow getting his shot off and when he does at least recently he has been off. This isn't true. In the 4 games since SIU he was 3-8 from the 3. 2-2/1-3/0-0/0-3. So really coming into the game he was 0-3 in his previous game but 6-15 on the season before that. He shot poorly yesterday and should have never taken the last shot. But the previous one he was set with a good look and I'd have him shoot that one again. I don't believe the 2nd to the last 3 was tipped it was strong off the back of the rim So many posters want to exagerate regarding JB to make their point. Doesn't work. JB isn't a super star nor is he a great shooter. He's a decent shooter when he catches and is squared up. He's got good court sense and seems to understand the game. He's not overly athletic nor should he put the ball on the floor and drive into a crowd. He's that solid 7th or 8th guy. Nothing more, nothing less. Over his career he's made some nice defensive steals by understanding the game and anticipating where the ball was going. To claim he shouldn't even be on a D1 roster (not saying you did) is ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Name the poster that's gotten a cooling off period for calling a player garbage or saying he sucks. If that was the case we'd have had 2 posters during KC's time. Roy and ... ok, 1 poster. I don't think anyone has ever really taken it too far and I'm not a mod, so I don't know if any posters have gotten a "cooling off period." I might be mis-remembering, but I thought Roy had always backed KC (he is after all a So. Illinois guy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 I don't think anyone has ever really taken it too far and I'm not a mod, so I don't know if any posters have gotten a "cooling off period." I might be mis-remembering, but I thought Roy had always backed KC (he is after all a So. Illinois guy). You misunderstand Skip's joke. He's saying that Roy would be the only poster left not in "timeout." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonwich Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Did anyone see clearly -- did JB completely airball that last shot, or was it blocked/tipped/he got fouled? We were directly behind him and couldn't tell. Also, two of us had an interesting theory on no-time-lost, out-of-bounds foul on Jake, which is that it was actually intentional (not by-the-rules intentional, merely that WSU instructed its players to try to foul). That said, that's another rule change that I think should be implemented -- if you foul when the clock is stopped, it's an automatic intentional foul. Maybe not for the full game, but at least for the final 2 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Did anyone see clearly -- did JB completely airball that last shot, or was it blocked/tipped/he got fouled? We were directly behind him and couldn't tell. Also, two of us had an interesting theory on no-time-lost, out-of-bounds foul on Jake, which is that it was actually intentional (not by-the-rules intentional, merely that WSU instructed its players to try to foul). That said, that's another rule change that I think should be implemented -- if you foul when the clock is stopped, it's an automatic intentional foul. Maybe not for the full game, but at least for the final 2 minutes. I had a pretty good view and it looked to be blocked/tipped. It didn't look close to being a foul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUBillsFan Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 You misunderstand Skip's joke. He's saying that Roy would be the only poster left not in "timeout." Yes. Apparently, I can't read. Thanks for clarifying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 At this point, we're really just speculating on what we've got in the FR. Hopefully, over the next 7 OOC games we'll have a chance to see them get more than 5 minutes of playing time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufan13 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 From my view (which was pretty good) it didn't seem tipped. The ball didn't seem to change rotation at all but I guess it still ccould've been tipped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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