Majerus recap

[cheeseman]

all i know is the students want to be included and we are hearing about being insulted with the space being reserved for students yet they do nothing to show they will be a serious attendance force when things get moved on campus. they want to b!tch about buses and inconvienence (which sorry, imo isnt an acceptable excuse.) it should be a students resposibility to get to the games. back in the day, the likes of old man Taj and myself figured out how to get to the arena which was even more inconvienent than the current scott trade. but we were there because as students we believed it was our duty to support the team.

and to say winning is required to expect student attendance? b.s. we sat thru eckerball. wtf was a win.

so along comes this event last night on campus, free food, plenty of room, hell if nothing else seniors get to mingle with alums with jobs. and the report today is a poor student turnout.

sorry if i dont get behind the "let's reserve the front row for the students" campaign.

I wonder if the problem was that the students did not have any hand in organizing the event. It seems when the Blue Crew scheduled it they got their peers to show up.

[cheeseman]

if majerus wants to be taken serious by the players, just sitting liddell for a closed practice scrimmage isnt the answer. liddell has to actually conform or else if majerus caves the first real game, that threat will ring pretty hollow.

as to maguire, folks need to remember that dustin was a high school center. there is a learning curve. justin love went off to jucoland for two years to convert from high school center to division one wing. what makes anyone believe maguire will figure it out any sooner? if majerus didnt think he had it, he would chase him now. he wouldnt be talking about keeping him or possibly red-shirting him. the truth is that maguire does one thing very well apparently, shoot. that might be worth waiting for. let it play out instead of campaigning for a trade to umsl.

on polk, while i dont think it is appropriate to be talking about these kids grades specifically, i do think it is relevant to point out dwayne's high school experience academically. he was amongst the best students at the absolute worst academic high school in st louis (ironically according to rft articles, polk shouldnt have even been at vashon. ironic that it comes back to bite him later in life). i.e. is the best at the worst translate into a slu caliber student? not necessarily.

if there is one thing i think all prospective college athletes need to zero in on is the importance of setting themselves up academically by doing the right thing academically starting as a freshman in high school already. the truth is very few of these college kids will make a living playing sports, someone needs to do the right thing advising them. unfortunately, the easy thing to do as an "advisor" is to tell them what they want to hear and assure them they are nba potential. the likes of floyd irons should be in jail.

DP's situation - maybe he missed a couple of classes or missed turning in an assignment - who knows.

[cheeseman]

if majerus wants to be taken serious by the players, just sitting liddell for a closed practice scrimmage isnt the answer. liddell has to actually conform or else if majerus caves the first real game, that threat will ring pretty hollow.

as to maguire, folks need to remember that dustin was a high school center. there is a learning curve. justin love went off to jucoland for two years to convert from high school center to division one wing. what makes anyone believe maguire will figure it out any sooner? if majerus didnt think he had it, he would chase him now. he wouldnt be talking about keeping him or possibly red-shirting him. the truth is that maguire does one thing very well apparently, shoot. that might be worth waiting for. let it play out instead of campaigning for a trade to umsl.

on polk, while i dont think it is appropriate to be talking about these kids grades specifically, i do think it is relevant to point out dwayne's high school experience academically. he was amongst the best students at the absolute worst academic high school in st louis (ironically according to rft articles, polk shouldnt have even been at vashon. ironic that it comes back to bite him later in life). i.e. is the best at the worst translate into a slu caliber student? not necessarily.

if there is one thing i think all prospective college athletes need to zero in on is the importance of setting themselves up academically by doing the right thing academically starting as a freshman in high school already. the truth is very few of these college kids will make a living playing sports, someone needs to do the right thing advising them. unfortunately, the easy thing to do as an "advisor" is to tell them what they want to hear and assure them they are nba potential. the likes of floyd irons should be in jail.

DP's situation - maybe he missed a couple of classes or missed turning in an assignment - who knows.

[cheeseman]

Majerus has a reputation as a straight shooter. If he's giving off vibes that we'll be pretty mediocre this year it's because he thinks we will be. As for Tommie, I understand that RM wants to help him take his game to another level but if Tommie doesn't embrace this tough love we will be worse than mediocre.

Agreed - I really do not think that RM is playing down expectations as a game - he really is unsure of how the year will go. That is my impression from what I have heard him say on more than one occasion.

[TheBand]

Are these functions really geared toward the students? Or is this more of an alumni and press event?

Yes, THIS event was specificly geared towards the students and not the press. There were no TV cameras there, nor Timmerman from the Post. Bob Ramsey and Earl Austin were there as university broadcasters, but not in a "media" type capacity.

And to say that just because the students didn't organize it, thats why they didn't show up? It was on a monday nite, at a convenient time in a convenient location. If they can't make it to the center of Campus at 7 pm for FREE Dogs, brats, chips and drinks on a pleasant evening...I just don't get it!! The Blue Crew should have been there in force....and were not. I'm curious what the explanation will be for that. Remember they claimed 400+ members last year, was there a drop off in numbers after Sodeberg was fired? Was HE the reason they all joined?

Perhaps my expectations of Blue Crew are just too high, but I want this group to be the most Rabid SLU basketball fans out there. The rest of the student section can go to a handful of games if they want, but this group needs to be the most reliable group possible that will trudge through rain,sleet,snow to games when the busses don't come. The BLUE CREW should be the group that shows up win, lose, power outage, inconvenience etc. To contunue to give them an "out" does not do what needs to be done at SLU, namely, Change the Basketball Culture. Remember Gary Pinkel from Mizzou a couple of years back when he was mad at the fans for accepting "moral victories"? He wants the same thing that I do...change the culture to one of a WINNING ONE.

We have the Coach to get it started, we have the Building on the way, we have assistants who apparantly can recruit (look at next year's class), but we need to get it going NOW!!!

(ok, off the soapbox. I rarely rant like that anymore, whew!)

[Major Majerus]

Ace, you should know better than to ever expect a logical response to a question on this board that involves the name Ahearn. No player has ever galvanized this board more than him.

Ahearn sighting - I was shooting hoops at the Clayton Center and Blake was doing shooting drills and a really, really cute young woman was rebounding for him. He DOES have NBA 3 pt range.

[bauman]

Yes, THIS event was specificly geared towards the students and not the press. There were no TV cameras there, nor Timmerman from the Post. Bob Ramsey and Earl Austin were there as university broadcasters, but not in a "media" type capacity.

And to say that just because the students didn't organize it, thats why they didn't show up? It was on a monday nite, at a convenient time in a convenient location. If they can't make it to the center of Campus at 7 pm for FREE Dogs, brats, chips and drinks on a pleasant evening...I just don't get it!! The Blue Crew should have been there in force....and were not. I'm curious what the explanation will be for that. Remember they claimed 400+ members last year, was there a drop off in numbers after Sodeberg was fired? Was HE the reason they all joined?

Perhaps my expectations of Blue Crew are just too high, but I want this group to be the most Rabid SLU basketball fans out there. The rest of the student section can go to a handful of games if they want, but this group needs to be the most reliable group possible that will trudge through rain,sleet,snow to games when the busses don't come. The BLUE CREW should be the group that shows up win, lose, power outage, inconvenience etc. To contunue to give them an "out" does not do what needs to be done at SLU, namely, Change the Basketball Culture. Remember Gary Pinkel from Mizzou a couple of years back when he was mad at the fans for accepting "moral victories"? He wants the same thing that I do...change the culture to one of a WINNING ONE.

We have the Coach to get it started, we have the Building on the way, we have assistants who apparantly can recruit (look at next year's class), but we need to get it going NOW!!!

(ok, off the soapbox. I rarely rant like that anymore, whew!)

Really, is there still a Blue Crew. Last year at this time it seemed some of them were all over this Board. Is there a new President? Isa there student life out there? Maybe all they need is 25 tickets!

SLU students, shame on you!

[Band Man]

Agreed - I really do not think that RM is playing down expectations as a game - he really is unsure of how the year will go. That is my impression from what I have heard him say on more than one occasion.

It is highly probable that RM is unsure of how the year will go. However, we have to keep RM's expectations in perspective. RM is a very detailed orientated coach, and it is a well known fact that he is a perfectionist. As a result, he is a very tough critic and similarly I'd imagine that it's difficult to earn his praise. I can envision times this year where we will win several games, but RM will be very unhappy with the team's play. The fact that RM seems to think his team has some flaws, doesn't mean that overall we aren't highly improved from last year (a team that struggled, but somehow managed to win 20 games). Under the past coaching regime, it seemed to me that things were very result oriented. As long as we got the 'W' things were OK. This is no longer the case. It's a new culture, and anything less than perfection will fall short of RM's expectations.

[Billikan]

It is highly probable that RM is unsure of how the year will go. However, we have to keep RM's expectations in perspective. RM is a very detailed orientated coach, and it is a well known fact that he is a perfectionist. As a result, he is a very tough critic and similarly I'd imagine that it's difficult to earn his praise. I can envision times this year where we will win several games, but RM will be very unhappy with the team's play. The fact that RM seems to think his team has some flaws, doesn't mean that overall we aren't highly improved from last year (a team that struggled, but somehow managed to win 20 games). Under the past coaching regime, it seemed to me that things were very result oriented. As long as we got the 'W' things were OK. This is no longer the case. It's a new culture, and anything less than perfection will fall short of RM's expectations.

[Billikan]

I do not want to start a big discussion about Brad but he was anything but a coach who thought things were fine no matter how we played provided that we just won the game. In my view, the opposite was true and it may have been one of his failings because he would call out players who played bad even if we won the game.

I will be very surprised if this team is "much improved" if Mitchell is hurt and Tommie does not play extremely well. I hope you are right but I see a very mediocre season if AM is hurt and Tommie does not play up to expectations. In spite of what everyone says, Ian will be missed.

[Band Man]

Every is talking on this board assuming that Tommie will not "play well" this year based on the fact that RM isn't starting him against UMSL. I'm going to agree with those on the board who say it is really a non-story. Tommie will perform like he has the past two years at the minimum. Personally, I think RM is using this as a motivation tactic because he knows what Tommie is capable of. When needed, Tommie will perform as expected. If Tommie's ability is our biggest concern then we don't have much to worry about.

[billiken_roy]

Rick needs bodies this year. If he told Dustin to transfer we would barely have enough to practice. We cant scrimmage as it is because of the lack of bodies. I know hes not shutting the door on Dustin completely but to say that since he didnt tell him to transfer he will be able to contribute is a big stretch in my opinion. Also, Roy said look at what Justin Love did after two years of JUCO. To compare Maguire to Love is pretty obsurd if you ask me. Justin Love was one of the most athletic guards to ever to play at SLU. If DM has some of his athleticism then I can see the comparison, but its obvious he doesnt.

the justin love we saw at slu wasnt the justin love that graduated from high school as a pudgy undersized center with marginal ball skills and no consistent outside shot. the experience at juco ball and the sheer hard work made justin love what he turned into the last two years.

am i saying maguire will be justin love after two years? no. i am saying that for anyone to expect a front line guard after playing center in class A ball (only played at edwardsville senior year) for most of his high school career to be ready to step in and be what most seem to have apparently expected.

as to the "we need the bodies" talk, we have more than enough guards to practice without dustin maguire. unless you are telling me he is lining up at power forward in practice. and if you are saying that, are you sure that is a worthy contribution?

[Cowboy]

I was not at the activity last night but I have heard RM talk about the conference thing twice before and I never got the impression that he would be even remotely interested in the MVC. He always talked about bigger name conferences. So, if he said something specific about the MVC then say what it was - if you are just making a guess then my bet is that you misunderstood him.

Cheese, I think if Rick were given the choice right now about MVC vs A10 he takes MVC.

The point is NOT to stir this debate again, we are where we are, but these are his comments.

My reasons for leaping to this based on his comments last night....spoke about attendance in Atl City (4000) vs MVC (sellout)....proximity to other schools in the conf....getting parents to go to games....recruits having familiarity with schools (he asked the crowd who could name all 14 A10 schools, one guy tried and got 11 before he needed help) ......not getting press in the big markets but you would get a bunch in Omaha World Herald.....even going to NY as a glamourous city with NCAA rules you can't do anything with the team anyway....travel time and cost for other sports.....schools in the corner of the conf geographically cannot dominate the league.....size of the league too big.....St Joe's not here this yr, not next yr and haven't been since we joined the league (this is an incorrect stmnt and to me shows more of his dislike).....CSTV is a minor league deal......geographic proximity to game referees....our time zone vs every other school in the league

I could probably remember a few more if given the time.

He bashed the league at the minimum, imo, and I stand by how I got to my thought of what he thinks

[Billikan]

Cheese, I think if Rick were given the choice right now about MVC vs A10 he takes MVC.

The point is NOT to stir this debate again, we are where we are, but these are his comments.

My reasons for leaping to this based on his comments last night....spoke about attendance in Atl City (4000) vs MVC (sellout)....proximity to other schools in the conf....getting parents to go to games....recruits having familiarity with schools (he asked the crowd who could name all 14 A10 schools, one guy tried and got 11 before he needed help) ......not getting press in the big markets but you would get a bunch in Omaha World Herald.....even going to NY as a glamourous city with NCAA rules you can't do anything with the team anyway....travel time and cost for other sports.....schools in the corner of the conf geographically cannot dominate the league.....size of the league too big.....St Joe's not here this yr, not next yr and haven't been since we joined the league (this is an incorrect stmnt and to me shows more of his dislike).....CSTV is a minor league deal......geographic proximity to game referees....our time zone vs every other school in the league

I could probably remember a few more if given the time.

He bashed the league at the minimum, imo, and I stand by how I got to my thought of what he thinks

Did he actually say that he was interested in the MVC? that would he a shock to me because he told me about a month ago, while he was complaining about the A10, that he had no interest in the MVC.

[cheeseman]

Cheese, I think if Rick were given the choice right now about MVC vs A10 he takes MVC.

The point is NOT to stir this debate again, we are where we are, but these are his comments.

My reasons for leaping to this based on his comments last night....spoke about attendance in Atl City (4000) vs MVC (sellout)....proximity to other schools in the conf....getting parents to go to games....recruits having familiarity with schools (he asked the crowd who could name all 14 A10 schools, one guy tried and got 11 before he needed help) ......not getting press in the big markets but you would get a bunch in Omaha World Herald.....even going to NY as a glamourous city with NCAA rules you can't do anything with the team anyway....travel time and cost for other sports.....schools in the corner of the conf geographically cannot dominate the league.....size of the league too big.....St Joe's not here this yr, not next yr and haven't been since we joined the league (this is an incorrect stmnt and to me shows more of his dislike).....CSTV is a minor league deal......geographic proximity to game referees....our time zone vs every other school in the league

I could probably remember a few more if given the time.

He bashed the league at the minimum, imo, and I stand by how I got to my thought of what he thinks

I agree I am not meaning to start the A10 vs. MVC up again but the things you posted above still do not say he would leave the A10 for the MVC. He continues to talk about a big time conf. and the MVC does not fit that bill.

[Cowboy]

I agree I am not meaning to start the A10 vs. MVC up again but the things you posted above still do not say he would leave the A10 for the MVC. He continues to talk about a big time conf. and the MVC does not fit that bill.

Did he actually say that he was interested in the MVC? that would he a shock to me because he told me about a month ago, while he was complaining about the A10, that he had no interest in the MVC.

did he say he wanted to move to the mvc? nope, of course not

he made several mentions of the mvc, several, and then mentioned the Omaha World Herald

but he also mentioned the Big East, now and after breakup

i could have leapt to very wrong conclusion, but i combine his staggeringly blunt and direct rips of the A10 and his numerous MVC references

[Majerus Magic]

Did he actually say that he was interested in the MVC? that would he a shock to me because he told me about a month ago, while he was complaining about the A10, that he had no interest in the MVC.

did he say he wanted to move to the mvc? nope, of course not

he made several mentions of the mvc, several, and then mentioned the Omaha World Herald

but he also mentioned the Big East, now and after breakup

i could have leapt to very wrong conclusion, but i combine his staggeringly blunt and direct rips of the A10 and his numerous MVC references

The impression I got was that Majerus likes the MVC strictly for geographical reasons.

[kmbilliken]

the justin love we saw at slu wasnt the justin love that graduated from high school as a pudgy undersized center with marginal ball skills and no consistent outside shot. the experience at juco ball and the sheer hard work made justin love what he turned into the last two years.

am i saying maguire will be justin love after two years? no. i am saying that for anyone to expect a front line guard after playing center in class A ball (only played at edwardsville senior year) for most of his high school career to be ready to step in and be what most seem to have apparently expected.

as to the "we need the bodies" talk, we have more than enough guards to practice without dustin maguire. unless you are telling me he is lining up at power forward in practice. and if you are saying that, are you sure that is a worthy contribution?

[kmbilliken]

For DM to have a Justin Love experience he would have to be a star this year. Justin Love was California JUCO player of the year his second year out of high school. I don't see Macquire doing any beyond being a marginal player at this level. If he wants to play college ball he'd be better off transferring to McKendree where he could have a nice career.

[Clock_Tower]

well there is no doubt that making shots in a horse game doesnt translate to live action with a defender of equal or greater size or being able to create your own shot.

but even though i cautioned 3 years ago that maguire as a high school center wasnt going to be a college guard necessarily, i still saw that he can make shots when he has the time. the trick is that you have to make that happen in less time and take out that feeling of fragmentation. remember, dustin has shot it like that for probably 12 years. now we expect him to switch that in one or two summers? not going to happen. what liddell did with his shot last summer is not the norm. it takes time. and like i said, if majerus is convinced that maguire has no future potential, he would be helping him find a school now instead of wasting eligibility. majerus sees something. whether it can be fixed remains to be seen.

Roy. You have now stated DM "was a high school center" twice. Wasn't he a guard or wing on his AAU team? Didn't he transfer so that he wouldn't play center his senior year? I never watched him play in high school. I know you did and therefore respect your opinion. From what I did read, however, I got the feeling that he was tall guard but was forced to play center for the good of his high school team. With that said, guys play as much or more for their AAU team. If he didn't play with his back to the basket during his highschool days for his AAU team, then why do you keep saying he was a high school center. From the little I saw him play last year, the guy doesn't seem to have good form or a good shot.

[Chicago Billiken]

Can anyone give a recap of this event?

Official Billikens.com sponsor of Kevin Shortal

[jimbofive]

Can anyone give a recap of this event?

Official Billikens.com sponsor of Kevin Shortal

There was a room with a guy and bright lights and everyone was SOOOOO noisy and there was food and i got hip-hop-anonymous from a bratwurst and and and...

[NashvilleBilliken]

Can anyone give a recap of this event?

Official Billikens.com sponsor of Kevin Shortal

Are you serious??? Read the first 4 pages, there are 4-5 great recaps.

[bauman]

Rick needs bodies this year. If he told Dustin to transfer we would barely have enough to practice. We cant scrimmage as it is because of the lack of bodies. I know hes not shutting the door on Dustin completely but to say that since he didnt tell him to transfer he will be able to contribute is a big stretch in my opinion. Also, Roy said look at what Justin Love did after two years of JUCO. To compare Maguire to Love is pretty obsurd if you ask me. Justin Love was one of the most athletic guards to ever to play at SLU. If DM has some of his athleticism then I can see the comparison, but its obvious he doesnt.

I agree with you about needing bodies for practice this year. I see the redshirting of DM as a way for him to stay at SLU this year, get a year of coaching under one of the best in the business while at the same time not giving up a year of eligibility, if he transfers to a lower Division school. Kind of a win-win for SLU and Dustin. With the players RM is planning on recruiting next year and thereafter do any of you really think Rick wants to tie up a scholarship for the next three years in a role type player?

[billiken_roy]

ace you seem to forget that i was one of the few that lambasted the maguire signing. i was totally against it and said that i didnt see it because of the fact he was a small high school center with no opportunity to show any guard skills. but once signed, he's a billiken. i will blindly support billikens if they do the right thing (right thing doesnt likely translate into on court either)

the difference between ahearn and maguire is ahearn was never a billiken. once a billiken i am loyal to those players as long as they do their part and represent the school the right way. so yes, i say give the kid a chance. i am totally against running a player off. you play the cards dealt. if MAGUIRE decides life would be better elsewhere, fine. good luck. but not before MAGUIRE decides.

Roy, I am curious why you were so critical of Ahearn and thought Soderberg was correct in not offering him, yet you are urging patience with Maguire... "i still saw that he can make shots when he has the time. the trick is that you have to make that happen in less time and take out that feeling of fragmentation. remember, dustin has shot it like that for probably 12 years. now we expect him to switch that in one or two summers? not going to happen."

Ahearn was an effective shooter right from the get-go as a freshman, but you didn't think we could have used him?; yet we are supposed to wait for a guy who is supposed to be a shooter, but is still looking for his shot entering his sophomore season? I guess I do expect a so-called sharpshooter to be able to shoot right away, because if he can't do that, what does he offer? He's not going to be a great rebounder, shotblocker, playmaker or defensive stopper.

Even if all goes well with Maguire, isn't the best we could hope for is that he would develop into another Ahearn?