Basketbill Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 re-alignment. Does anyone forsee a good outcome?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 No, I agree. Evidently the agreement with Marquette, DePaul, SLU, and Charlotte to stay together was a bunch of BS. What I don't understand is the Big East's non fb schools wanting to stay and mix it up with the FB boys. Am sure it has to do with $$$. If I was Biondi and Woolard, I'd right now be trying to form some alliance with the A-10 that would bring XU, Dayton, Creighton, SLU, and Charlotte into some kind of all BB conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 is this just more nattering from the negative nabob crowd? Don't get me wrong I'm scared Shiiteless (the Sunnis scare me too for the record) about realignment too. I just haven't seen anything in the past couple of days. Got my fingers crossed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 first off, you have to remember that most of what we are reading is coming out of the east. the east coast media doesnt even know where st louis is located. i remember when that burns guy did the long piece for pbs on baseball. i painstakingly taped the whole thing only to find that the series talks about the cardinals in brief passing and stan musial got about a 30 second plug. my gosh, probably the third or 4th most storied baseball team in history gets snubbed and what can arguably be stated one of the 5 greatest hitters of all time only gets a brief mention. i have since used the tapes to retape old bugs bunny cartoons from the cartoon network. I think the key to our fortunes lies in father biondi's level of interest and desires. i think if the good father wants us to be in the top mix, we will be. if he is indifferent, then we will be in the leftover c-usa or something akin to that. i am hoping all this talk of his that he wants the billikens to be a top 25 program was more than just talk. i find it hard to believe that he would be trying to build the taj mahall of college arena's if our future involves an annual home and home with drake and northern iowa. of course you wonder why we dont read more about it locally, and we have discussed our local press involvement with the billikens ad nauseum so that is to be expected. i think if hate and stu had their way we would know and read more, but unfortunately the powers to be at the post would rather write about the pro teams (cards, blues, rams, and missouri) than the true college experience. right now, i am still betting on father biondi calling in his jesuit favors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetorch Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 There have been reports the last couple of days that have the Big East staying intact and adding two football schools and two basketball schools for a 16 team league. L'Ville and Cincy are the football and Marquette and DePaul are for Basketball. Apparently the BBAll schools in the Big East really want to stay with the rest of the league and think that Marquette and Depaul added to it wil give them enough power in the league structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gister Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 I hope you're right. I just don't know what to think. I do sense that much of the recent news is really just old news, rehashed again. I think everyone is being very tight lipped so that there isn't any new information out there. The Post may not be intested, but I don't see much of anything being discussed in other news sources either. Something has to be going on behind the scenes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 BRoy, You and I think a like on this subject. We really don't know anything other than what we have been fed by the Eastern press, and who really knows just how accurate that information really turns out. I'm playing a wait and see attitude on this one, and keeping my fingers crossed that Fr. Biondi is on top of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 if we dont end up in the best of the shakeout, imo it tells us that father biondi didnt really care. if the man can take on the pope and win (see sale of the hospital), he sure as hell can put us in the middle of this if he wants to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidlee Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 I have read many of the same reports the last few days about Marquette and DePaul joining the BB only BE teams. It may sound great but I don't know how practical or financially viable doing something like that really is. The BE BB only schools aren't all that great anymore. If Marquete and DePaul do jump, don't be surprised if a few years down the road they start looking for something closer to home. You have to remember that you have to contend with all the other sports besides men's BB when making this kind of a decision, even though men's BB is the major factor (like $$$.) Also, you have to question how managable a 16 team league would be. Maybe it will work out for them. I don't hold any ill will for them if they do decide to go because they have to do what they think is best for their school. I just wonder about the wisdom in such a decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted August 25, 2003 Author Share Posted August 25, 2003 while I agree the east coast bias is alive and well and living east of the Post Road, Credible info regarding this came from East Carolina University acknowledging the BE asked for info about Cinci, Louisville, Marquette and Depaul, ONLY. As much aa I would like to deny this is bad news it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 Worst case--Cincy, Louisville, Marquette and DePaul go to the BE. Yes, that's bad but it is not the end of the world. B-ball with its egaltarian NCAA tournament is not as skewed in favor of the bigs as football's BCS. If the worst case senario happened, at the very least, I would expect Marquette and DePaul to play us every year (on a home and home contract) as consolation prize for getting shut out of the BE--same thing we did for Dayton when they didn't get into CUSA. Not too many people want to even think about it but going back to an improved Valley with a strong out-of-conference schedule wouldn't be death. Let's say SLU and Butler join the Valley and Drake and another bottom feeder are asked to leave. In addition to yearly out-of-conference b-ball games with DePaul and Marquette, I would expect we could work the same deal with Memphis. Such a conference would be strong in soccer and baseball and be capable of getting 3 teams into the NCAA b-ball tournament each year. But the worst case has not happened yet. Let's wait and see how it all shakes out. As we have seen in the past, what the media reports as being destined to happen (i.e., Boston College and SQuse to the ACC) does not always pan out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 why would the valley ask anyone to leave? i dont see it. if we go to the valley, it would be an additional team (or two) imo. i still think the backup plan would be to replace the departed cincy, louisville and whoever and stay in c-usa. if we pull dayton, xaiver, creighton and someone else, i could live with that. it might explain why some of the leftover southern schools in c-usa are looking westward as the talk of c-usa returning to their basketball roots might be in the works. even if that wasnt the case and the conference remains are what we have, i would still believe that the remains of c-usa would be better than the mvc. go check the rpi's top to bottom and you will see that is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLouBlue Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 I don't think the MVC would ask any teams to leave, especially Drake since they were a founding member of the MVC back around 1914 or so and have been in ever since. Drake also has hired Tom Davis, former Iowa coach and seemed to have recommitted themselves to athletics. Also other bottom feeders like Ill St & Ind St are about 3 years removed from being on top of the MVC. I think if the MVC would only be adding teams--would not be dropping any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 is that all the CUSA bottom feeders got to play Cinci, Marquette, Louisville and Memphis while the MVC schools did not. You have always stated you didn't like the RPI because it helps the big-time conferences and hurts the smaller ones. I'd love to see what the RPIs of the bottom CUSA schools would be without those games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 >>why would the valley ask anyone to leave? i dont see it.<< The same reason Temple was asked to leave the Big East in football. It all would depend on the bylaws of the conference as to whether and how a school can get kicked out of the conference. If you kick two bottom feeders out of the Valley and add two top 60 b-ball programs, it would really improve the conference rank. Just an option to expore should doomsday happen. Roy, I know you are a big advocate of staying in CUSA should the worst case happen; however, assuming there is not secondary fallout from the departure of Cincy and Louisville, CUSA is still a hybrid b-ball / football conference and would have to add football teams to help football conference members. Marshall? I just think we are better off in the long run not having our conference make decisions for football reasons and being aligned with like-minded b-ball schools. It might be feasible to cobble together a better conference than a beafed up Valley assuming one could get Dayton and Xavier to leave the A10--which I doubt they would if SLU and Creghton were the headliners. We would need Marquette and DePaul in order to have enough mojo to form a solid new conference with the likes of Xavier and Dayton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 In my books, Fr. Biondi has a track record of doing things first class (the campus for example). I believe he wants SLU to be first class in everything, including being in a first class conference. But, because he wants that.....won't necessarily make it happen. Just like trades in baseball, it takes two or more to make a deal. Academically SLU has a relatively strong standing, athletically most of our teams are competitive to very competitive, but the one thing that may hurt SLU in a BE deal is that we don't have a 2-3 hour scheduling travel partner as compared to Marquette/DePaul and Xavier/Dayton. Hoping for the best! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 Good point about the Media not being infallible. They sure did screw up the initial Bib East teams moving to the ACC. I'm cool with taking thw wait and see attitude as there is not a darn thing that any of us can do but stew about it. Frankly, I just don't see SLU as taking a step back in any conference realignment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 I don't ever recall Doug Woolard or Fr. Biondi stating that there was an agreement of any kind with Marquette, DePaul or Charlotte, but perhaps I missed it. So what was there to believe! It's an everybody for itself atheltic world out there, and always has been; otherwise, SLU fans would have seen a steady diet of fellow Jesuit unversities like Boston College and Georgetown on our home and away schedules. Up until now, its been every Catholic univeersity for itself and I (disapppointedly) don't expect anything to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 i hope you are not saying that drake and northern iowa are actually better teams than houston and tulane. i have had opportunity to watch mvc basketball at their tourney the last few years as well as cusa, and once you get by the likes of creighton and siu, there is no comparison between the rest imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 The problem with dropping to a lesser conference then you are recruiting kids with less talent too. Like I have said before, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that we end up OK when all is said and done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 I am not convinced that Biondi has enormous influence and power outside of the St. Louis area. Biondi didn't take on the Pope, he took on Rigali. Biondi won because Rigali didn't have a leg to stand on. The university, not the church, owned the hospital. The church, through Rigali, attempted to extort a share of the hospital sale profits from the university. Legally, the church was entitled to nothing, so they received nothing. Biondi is an effective business man and, from the perspective of some, bully in the St. Louis region, but the folks on the east coast will hardly be influenced of intimidated by him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 remember the schools that seemed to be driving the "football mentality" the most with cusa was louisville and cincy. i think that the likes of charlotte and st louis could easily "take over" calling the shots. again, the fact that some of the other "football schools" are supposedly looking to head west might speak volumes about actual plans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobo Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 All of the rumors of the behind the scenes wheelin' and dealin' re: conference changes is stressful to us Billiken fans. With a new coach, recruitment optimism and the promise of a state of the art arena is not the time to drop into a lesser conference. Fr. Biondi will do all he can to protect the interest of SLU. The arena is a hugh investment and it must be buget neutral. Therefore, it will need to be filled on game days and that means good opponents and a tough schedule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 One more time! Bottom line - the Valley is not an acceptable option, period. All this talk of a beefed up Valley would not be so bad is like saying - gee whiz I did not get to go to the prom with the girl I wanted to but oh well I will go with my sister's friend so I can at least be there. If the Bills will ever be a consistent big time team, then it must get into a good conference. I worry about Woolard - said this before - I just hope he is doing his job. Not all that being said, I have been out of town the last few days so what has happened that even started this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted August 25, 2003 Share Posted August 25, 2003 To me the funny thing is that IMHO neither Louisville or Cincy have a football program that I would be beating my chest with if I was one of their Alums...at best they are BCS wannabes. Isn't Memphis the CUSA team getting the shaft if the proposed BE reorg does take place? Their football program isn't any worse than either the Cardinals or Bearcats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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