What did the bills learn

[jonny karate]

Two bills with 20 + how did we lose

[moytoy12]

That we are a slightly above average team, capable a beating most and capable of losing to most.

[AlumniFan]

Beating ANY team that makes 55% of their shoots is next to impossible. The Bills learned that (and so should we).

If Loe catches that pass under the basket we win. If Kwamain hits that last shot we win. If Hurley gets a T on any of the multiple occasions he should have we win. If the refs didn't give Loe a T when everyone thought Loe was the one being fouled we win. If Cory's missed dunk goes in (or he at least he gets the foul), we win. If Rick was coaching, we absolutely win.

Yes our tournament resume is severely damaged. But let's be realistic about the facts of what happened last night.

If just one of the things outlined above had happened, we'd be talking about the return of Kwamain, about how we protected the home court, about how we beat a team the shot 55%, etc.

The loss of Conklin and Majerus has left this a worse team (maybe a "B" team in Wiz parlance), but the Bills are not a bad team. Unlucky, yes, but not bad.

[AlumniFan]

A couple of more things. I hear people talking about how we cannot score inside. Well, we had 26 points in the paint to RI's 22. I hear people saying we aren't playing defense. Well, we had 11 steals to RI's 5. I hear people talk about how we don't take care of the ball. Well, we had 11 turnovers to RI's 18. I hear people saying we don't get offense rebounds. Well, we had 14 offensive rebounds to RI's 10. We did get killed on the defensive boards, but that is obviously partly due to the 55% shooting - hard to get a rebound when the ball goes through the hoop. And, RI blocked 9 shots. They also shot 86% from the line and 55% from the field. They just had an incredible shooting night. We were able to get in position to take 64 shots, RI only took 49, but when 55% of your shots are going in, you don't need that many to win.

[Tonka]

AlumniFan - how dare you stay positive after this loss! People would much rather stay in the melt down mode.

We cannot lose a home game to RI in this conference, You just can't. RI had career nights in shooting, but we must find a way to slow that down. Look at our average scoring defense and look at how many RI had. That can't happen.

Plenty of games left - now we can't lose ANY more games we're supposed to win and we need to steal one or two. I'm still optimistic after KM's big game, but Crews needs to figure out a way to not lose these type of games.

[bonwich]

Anyone not named KM or CE needs to be taking a long look in the mirror this morning, and anyone named KM or CE needs to be standing right behind them when they look in that mirror, screaming at them like a drill sergeant.

[cheeseman]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

[Tonka]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

I have to think (and pray) that Dr. Chaifetz sees what is going on and has ABSOLUTELY no intention of even considering Crews. We have heard he doesn't, but let's hope that is the case. In some ways, the worse this team plays the more likely Crews won't even be a consideration.

[cheeseman]

A couple of more things. I hear people talking about how we cannot score inside. Well, we had 26 points in the paint to RI's 22. I hear people saying we aren't playing defense. Well, we had 11 steals to RI's 5. I hear people talk about how we don't take care of the ball. Well, we had 11 turnovers to RI's 18. I hear people saying we don't get offense rebounds. Well, we had 14 offensive rebounds to RI's 10. We did get killed on the defensive boards, but that is obviously partly due to the 55% shooting - hard to get a rebound when the ball goes through the hoop. And, RI blocked 9 shots. They also shot 86% from the line and 55% from the field. They just had an incredible shooting night. We were able to get in position to take 64 shots, RI only took 49, but when 55% of your shots are going in, you don't need that many to win.

FYI - there is a difference to playing good defense and playing good help defense - we did not play good help defense last night. You can talk about about how we had fewer turn overs but when your pg is turning it over as many times as he did last night at crucial times that will kill you. You can talk about our steal total but when you can not convert them into points on the offensive side then the steal is some what less a factor. You can talk about offensive and defensive rebounds but the bottom line is we got out rebounded and that is something that can not happen if we expect to win. Finally, the reason RI had such a good night from the floor was because we did not play good defense for the entire 35 seconds - we would be good for 30 and then somebody would lose their man and they would score. Yes they hit some tough shots but I can think of at least a half dozen times that we lost our man who converted an easy lay up or a wide open 3. We did nothing to slow them down - this was an embarrassing loss and unless we go on another run it will be one of those killer losses that keep you out of the dance.

[bonwich]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

I have to think (and pray) that Dr. Chaifetz sees what is going on and has ABSOLUTELY no intention of even considering Crews. We have heard he doesn't, but let's hope that is the case. In some ways, the worse this team plays the more likely Crews won't even be a consideration.

Did anyone notice when Dr. C. got warned by the refs yesterday for trying to look over their shoulders while they watched a replay? I love that man.

[Taj79]

There are turnovers, and there are turnovers. I don't mind a turnover when you fire a perfect bullet pass to an open man under the basket and it sails out of bounds. That's commission and you were trying. But when you dribble it off your knee or it slips out of your hand when you are not guarded .... that I mind, and it amplifies if the guy doing it is not a freshman, which, by the way, we don't have.

What the Bills have learned once again is that our talent level is such that we cannot take any night off. We will never win when three of our six main guys contribute 4 points per guy per game. Our interior guys couldn't slam down a dunk last night when challenged by slugs from Rhode Island. This is a team, like last year, that is going to win by out-executing and out-defensing the other. Sure, they shot well, and they even challenged us physically in our house, and won. Hurley outcoached our slug and their bench reacted as if this was their Super Bowl, as I said every other A10 dog team would against us this year.

I haven't seen the P-D story yet, but the first guy who says "we weren't ready to play" can kiss my ass for the upteenth time. The more they hung around, the more you could see their confidence growing and we looked shellshocked. Every time we took a lead in the OT, they answered.

There, we also learned that we can't just outscore even a mediocre team in a game, let alone the bottom dwellers of the league and the nation and in our house to boot.

[willie]

Beating ANY team that makes 55% of their shoots is next to impossible. The Bills learned that (and so should we).

If Loe catches that pass under the basket we win. If Kwamain hits that last shot we win. If Hurley gets a T on any of the multiple occasions he should have we win. If the refs didn't give Loe a T when everyone thought Loe was the one being fouled we win. If Cory's missed dunk goes in (or he at least he gets the foul), we win. If Rick was coaching, we absolutely win.

Yes our tournament resume is severely damaged. But let's be realistic about the facts of what happened last night.

If just one of the things outlined above had happened, we'd be talking about the return of Kwamain, about how we protected the home court, about how we beat a team the shot 55%, etc.

The loss of Conklin and Majerus has left this a worse team (maybe a "B" team in Wiz parlance), but the Bills are not a bad team. Unlucky, yes, but not bad.

Just for clarifation Loe did not get a T he was called for a flagrant foul. New rule any time you make contact with your elbow over the opposing players shoulder it's an automatic flagrant foul. Two throws and the ball. That's why they went to the monitor.

[slufan13]

Beating ANY team that makes 55% of their shoots is next to impossible. The Bills learned that (and so should we).

If Loe catches that pass under the basket we win. If Kwamain hits that last shot we win. If Hurley gets a T on any of the multiple occasions he should have we win. If the refs didn't give Loe a T when everyone thought Loe was the one being fouled we win. If Cory's missed dunk goes in (or he at least he gets the foul), we win. If Rick was coaching, we absolutely win.

Yes our tournament resume is severely damaged. But let's be realistic about the facts of what happened last night.

If just one of the things outlined above had happened, we'd be talking about the return of Kwamain, about how we protected the home court, about how we beat a team the shot 55%, etc.

The loss of Conklin and Majerus has left this a worse team (maybe a "B" team in Wiz parlance), but the Bills are not a bad team. Unlucky, yes, but not bad.

With the the way that game was going, if Kwamain would've hit that shot, I would've fully expected Rhode Island to jack up an 80 foot that that would have been nothing but net for the win.

[AlumniFan]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="willie" data-cid="336935" data-time="1358697832"><p>

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="AlumniFan" data-cid="336919" data-time="1358689788"><p>Beating ANY team that makes 55% of their shoots is next to impossible. The Bills learned that (and so should we). <br />

If Loe catches that pass under the basket we win. If Kwamain hits that last shot we win. If Hurley gets a T on any of the multiple occasions he should have we win. If the refs didn't give Loe a T when everyone thought Loe was the one being fouled we win. If Cory's missed dunk goes in (or he at least he gets the foul), we win. If Rick was coaching, we absolutely win. <br />

Yes our tournament resume is severely damaged. But let's be realistic about the facts of what happened last night. <br />

If just one of the things outlined above had happened, we'd be talking about the return of Kwamain, about how we protected the home court, about how we beat a team the shot 55%, etc. <br />

The loss of Conklin and Majerus has left this a worse team (maybe a "B" team in Wiz parlance), but the Bills are not a bad team. Unlucky, yes, but not bad.</p></blockquote>Just for clarifation Loe did not get a T he was called for a flagrant foul. New rule any time you make contact with your elbow over the opposing players shoulder it's an automatic flagrant foul. Two throws and the ball. That's why they went to the monitor.</p></blockquote>

------------

You are absolutely correct. I noticed that in reviewing the stat sheet after my post. Of course I've seen people convicted of rape for doing less than what the Rhody player did to Loe but they didn't have Hurley as their attorney.

[TheOldie]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="bonwich" data-cid="336931" data-time="1358696880"><p>

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="Tonka" data-cid="336926" data-time="1358694292"><p><blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="cheeseman" data-cid="336925" data-time="1358693995"><p>What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. <strong class='bbc'>Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.</strong></p></blockquote>

I have to think (and pray) that Dr. Chaifetz sees what is going on and has ABSOLUTELY no intention of even considering Crews. We have heard he doesn't, but let's hope that is the case. In some ways, the worse this team plays the more likely Crews won't even be a consideration.</p></blockquote>

Did anyone notice when Dr. C. got warned by the refs yesterday for trying to look over their shoulders while they watched a replay? I love that man.</p></blockquote>

Did u see him in the late stage of the second half get up from his seat and walk over to the end of the floor? He watch the game from that location, shrugged his head and walk back to his mid court seat. U can tell that he is frustrated with this program.

[jbizzle09]

I was pretty much in full meltdown mode last night and the wife had to talk me off the ledge. Considering that I am still pretty peeved about last night's game, I figure it is best to stay away from rant mode on the board and let it sink in for another day or two before commenting in full.

At the very least, it was nice to see Kwamain in full beast mode last night. Would've been nice if it wasn't wasted in a loss like that.

[kmbilliken]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

I have to think (and pray) that Dr. Chaifetz sees what is going on and has ABSOLUTELY no intention of even considering Crews. We have heard he doesn't, but let's hope that is the case. In some ways, the worse this team plays the more likely Crews won't even be a consideration.

Did anyone notice when Dr. C. got warned by the refs yesterday for trying to look over their shoulders while they watched a replay? I love that man.

Yes, I was hoping he would tell them " I built this place, I'll stand anywhere I want."

[AlumniFan]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

2nd Chance Points

URI - 10

SLU - 14

[Bizziken]

I'm as furious as the next fan with this loss, and I think we played like dick, and I think we severely (but not fatally) damaged our Tournament chances, BUT

St. Bonaventure beat Temple @ Temple

George Washington beat UMass @ UMass

We aren't alone in deplorable losses

[cheeseman]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

2nd Chance Points

URI - 10

SLU - 14

First of all my comment was in regards to to the overall trend. Second, we would have won the game if we had scored one more second chance basket or they scored one less - two can play the what if game. Now, how we give up that many points by not rebounding to a 5-10 team on our home floor is not acceptable - I would think you would agree.

[AlumniFan]

What we saw last night was a trend that started about 4 games ago - we have been getting out rebounded giving up a bunch of second chance scores, getting beat to the ball, not playing good help defense, and letting our opponent out shoot us % wise. This game was inevitable - a shame but clearly the end result of our poor play lately. Evans is killing us - not rebounding, not scoring, and sitting for long periods. MM has been inconsistent and Jett has turned into a turn over machine again. What we are seeing is a a team that needs an attitude adjustment and apparently there is nobody around who can do it. Last night was a clear example of why Crews will not/ and can not be our next head coach - he has no meaningful control of the situation.

2nd Chance Points

URI - 10

SLU - 14

First of all my comment was in regards to to the overall trend. Second, we would have won the game if we had scored one more second chance basket or they scored one less - two can play the what if game. Now, how we give up that many points by not rebounding to a 5-10 team on our home floor is not acceptable - I would think you would agree.

That's fine. Last night SLU reversed the trend.

My point is that when a person takes the time to look at the statistics and delve into them a little, what they find, at least for this game, is that it is remarkable that we almost beat a team that shot 55% from the floor and 86% from the line. URI was very fortunate to have 6 more foul shots than the Bills as that, mathematically, was the difference in the game. Why? Because we hit 28 shots to their 27 from the field. IF they have a very good night shooting (45% from the field) and this isn't even that close of a game; but what they had was a statistical outlier in their shooting that is unlikely to occur again this year for them. They were stupendous from the field. Last night's game was an aberration in that regard.

Sure, we could have done some things better, but several people have suggested that we played terribly - that is not true. I hate that we lost and very good teams have to find a way to protect the home court - we failed to do that. So maybe we are only a good team and not a very good team. Everyone was pissed last night.

For fans who care, now is a good time to really look at the numbers and try to understand what happened. In most categories, we outplayed them. The meaningful place that they beat us was in A) getting to the line more and B. making a higher percentage of their shots both from the line and from the field. I just wonder, given how aggressive they were and how unaggresive we were, how they got to the line so much more than we did.

[MB73]

A couple of more things. I hear people talking about how we cannot score inside. Well, we had 26 points in the paint to RI's 22. I hear people saying we aren't playing defense. Well, we had 11 steals to RI's 5. I hear people talk about how we don't take care of the ball. Well, we had 11 turnovers to RI's 18. I hear people saying we don't get offense rebounds. Well, we had 14 offensive rebounds to RI's 10. We did get killed on the defensive boards, but that is obviously partly due to the 55% shooting - hard to get a rebound when the ball goes through the hoop. And, RI blocked 9 shots. They also shot 86% from the line and 55% from the field. They just had an incredible shooting night. We were able to get in position to take 64 shots, RI only took 49, but when 55% of your shots are going in, you don't need that many to win.

Did we have anyone posting up or playing close to the hoop, getting a pass from our guards and making moves, shots? That presents a threat, inside / outside, hard to defend, frees up other shooters. BC did that for us last yr. WR yrs ago. Consistent.

I was not there last night... so my question is, we got our 26 points in the paint, "how"?

If we do some slashing from 4-5 different guys, I would say that is quite different from what I am suggesting. Please clarify.