Warmann on RM

[moytoy12]

slu72, it is my opinion that a top program (not counting the likes of duke, north carolina ucla kentucky kansas. they are in a different world)like gonzaga, xavier, butler to degree, that we want to be like, has successfully achieved across the board to get to where they are. they cultivated both media, metropolitan area casual fans, the business commmunity and boosters. this enabled those programs to maximize revenue which gave the program the cash needed to hire the best coaching staff, develop their facilities, enhance their overall athletic department and increase boosters and fans in the seats. that's where loyalty is created. sure winning puts people in the seats, but if everyone isnt tied in and on board long term, the first year that falls off, those pretenders are gone.

Roy, definitely agree that it appears that RM hasn't done all he can to market the program and court support from boosters, fans, etc. But I don't share your dire prediction of what happens when RM leaves. I do believe that 2 very successful seasons (relatively speaking) will do a lot to garner long-term support for the program. If there is a smooth transition to the next coach, which includes a talented roster, then I think the program will continue to gain support regardless of who RM might have alienated. Winning is the ultimate trump card.

Brian, completely agree with you. The time for excuses for/by RM should be over. I've heard too many excuses during the course of his tenure and few of them, if any, have included any responsibility on RM's part.

[moytoy12]

Give me a break. The athletic department and SLU did a piss poor job of selling the team. Once again the School and the AD are responsible for selling the program and they get an F for this year and every year that I can remember since 1973. It is not their priority and doubt that it ever will be. They couldn't even put the right players on the tickets. what a FU.

While this might be technically true, RM, not Chris May, is the face of the program from a non-player point of view. Whether he likes it or not, RM has an inherit responsibility to sell the team and he's done a poor job on that front. RM has also failed to take much, if any, responsibility for the failures of the team/program over the last few years.

[AlumniFan]

Sorry eastsidejoe, but you tell me what job (other than a union or tenured type position) you cannot have unacceptable results for five years and still get paid over a million dollars?

Give the rest of us a break. Most of us have supported Majerus through the past four years, but next year is do or die. He has had challenges which I blatantly acknowledged, but he also has a loyal fan base, a brand new, state of the art facility, and a great school to recruit to. You can say what you want about the fan base, but they built a hell of a nice arena and our attendance is still in the top 25% of D1 basketball.

These are just facts whether you like them or not!

Look, I went onto Warmann's site and posted a reply defending our team so don't throw me under the bus for pointing out facts and a perception that is well-documented in the St. Louis media.

[eastsidejoe]

While this might be technically true, RM, not Chris May, is the face of the program from a non-player point of view. Whether he likes it or not, RM has an inherit responsibility to sell the team and he's done a poor job on that front. RM has also failed to take much, if any, responsibility for the failures of the team/program over the last few years.

I disagree. It is the athletic departments responsibility to sell the team and the product. RM's job is to coach. If he can't produce in building a winning program in the time alloted, then get rid of him. It's too bad they don't hold the School and the Athletic department to the same standards related to them doing THEIR job.

[Westy03]

Give the rest of us a break. Most of us have supported Majerus through the past four years, but next year is do or die.

I agree. I think Rick realizes this too.

[eastsidejoe]

Sorry eastsidejoe, but you tell me what job (other than a union or tenured type position) you cannot have unacceptable results for five years and still get paid over a million dollars?

Give the rest of us a break. Most of us have supported Majerus through the past four years, but next year is do or die. He has had challenges which I blatantly acknowledged, but he also has a loyal fan base, a brand new, state of the art facility, and a great school to recruit to. You can say what you want about the fan base, but they built a hell of a nice arena and our attendance is still in the top 25% of D1 basketball.

These are just facts whether you like them or not!

Look, I went onto Warmann's site and posted a reply defending our team so don't throw me under the bus for pointing out facts and a perception that is well-documented in the St. Louis media.

good for you. i am impressed

[AlumniFan]

good for you. i am impressed

Well, that is a mature and well-thought out response...

[moytoy12]

I disagree. It is the athletic departments responsibility to sell the team and the product. RM's job is to coach. If he can't produce in building a winning program in the time alloted, then get rid of him. It's too bad they don't hold the School and the Athletic department to the same standards related to them doing THEIR job.

Agree to disagree on RM's role, but I completely agree with your last sentence. The Ath. Dept. has done a poor job.

[eastsidejoe]

Well, that is a mature and well-thought out response...

thanks, I appreciate that coming from you.

[JettFlight5]

The only thing SLU can do to change perception is to win, and win big. Nothing short of that will do anymore. No more excuses, no more "next year". It's time to do whatever it takes to win...if that doesn't work, move on.

I think the Athletic Department may be slightly more useless at SLU than an inflatable dartboard.

[BBall Fan]

I agree. I think Rick realizes this too.

+1

[eastsidejoe]

The only thing SLU can do to change perception is to win, and win big. Nothing short of that will do anymore. No more excuses, no more "next year". It's time to do whatever it takes to win...if that doesn't work, move on.

I think the Athletic Department may be slightly more useless at SLU than an inflatable dartboard.

+1

[BBall Fan]

Roy, please reread my post. I was not calling you a fringe fan. I was simply referring to your reference to that group. I am in the same contribution group that you are. I have been back in St. Louis since 2003 and had season tickets from then till now and will continue for as long as SLU plays basketball. I did not even graduate from SLU but still have given 2k per year since 2004. I paid for a family member to go to SLU law school from 2000 to 2002 and do think it is a top level academic institution. I graduated from KU in the mid 90's so I have seen a successful basketball program. I still have my season tickets at Phog Allen. I moved back to the St. Louis area and took to the Billikens. I have not been a lifer but am definately a Billiken Fan.

Call me what you will with regard to my support of RM but I just do not see the benefit of throwing him under the bus for what everyone knew before he was even hired. His reputation definately preceeded him but administration was willing to take the bad with the good to get a new atmosphere in the basketball program. I do not agree with everything that takes place but he has been to 11 NCAA tournaments see a definate change in culture since 2003. I definately agree that next year is a make or break but I also believe that he feels the same way.

[kshoe]

Roy, definitely agree that it appears that RM hasn't done all he can to market the program and court support from boosters, fans, etc. But I don't share your dire prediction of what happens when RM leaves. I do believe that 2 very successful seasons (relatively speaking) will do a lot to garner long-term support for the program. If there is a smooth transition to the next coach, which includes a talented roster, then I think the program will continue to gain support regardless of who RM might have alienated. Winning is the ultimate trump card.

Brian, completely agree with you. The time for excuses for/by RM should be over. I've heard too many excuses during the course of his tenure and few of them, if any, have included any responsibility on RM's part.

Well said Moy. If we have 2 good years and RM rides off into the sunset our future success will almost 100% be determined by the coach the AD brings in and the talent left behind by RM. How RM currently interacts with the media and fans has nothing to do with it.

As Roy poiinted out above, Spoon was a media darling which also coincided with successful teams. Romar and Sodi did their best to be media and fan friendly but simply put they didn't win enough, thus beginning the path to our current situation. No amount of fan friendly behavior can compensate for not winning.

[eastsidejoe]

Well said Moy. If we have 2 good years and RM rides off into the sunset our future success will almost 100% be determined by the coach the AD brings in and the talent left behind by RM. How RM currently interacts with the media and fans has nothing to do with it.

As Roy poiinted out above, Spoon was a media darling which also coincided with successful teams. Romar and Sodi did their best to be media and fan friendly but simply put they didn't win enough, thus beginning the path to our current situation. No amount of fan friendly behavior can compensate for not winning.

+1

[brianstl]

Rome wasn't built in a day. No coach can turn around what Brad Soderberg left behind. I don't care if it was Robert Montgomery Knight coming in. The Soderberg Era set this University back at least a decade.

I wanted to go back to this post and make a point. Brad needed to go, but he didn't set the program back a decade. The old CUSA falling apart set program back a decade. It turned out Brad was not the coach to pick up the pieces after that. He may have been fine if the old CUSA never fell apart. It definitely would have made recruiting easier for him.

[Bobby Metzinger]

I wanted to go back to this post and make a point. Brad needed to go, but he didn't set the program back a decade. The old CUSA falling apart set program back a decade. It turned out Brad was not the coach to pick up the pieces after that. He may have been fine if the old CUSA never fell apart. It definitely would have made recruiting easier for him.

Soderberg and recruiting go together like Michael Moore inviting Karl Rove over for a BBQ.

[GoBills]

Winning is by far what is most important regarding generating interest. Marketing and being media friendly and all of that other stuff is so far down the list of what is really important. No question Majerus is a quirky guy, but I guess I don't get this idea that he is not media friendly. I hear him on with Bernie and Cusumano on a regular basis. Leading up to the season, he was very visible on the local tv circuit. The local media starting taking notice of the Bills last February, why? Because we started stringing some wins together, not because of a bunch of media appearances. I also don't get this idea that we will go to two straight NCAA appearances, coach will leave and then everything will fall apart and it will be his fault?????? Let's say things play out that way, Majerus will leave the next coach with the advantage of recruiting to a program that has been to back-to-back NCAA trips PLUS he will leave a senior roster that includes McCall, Jett, Barnett, Loe and Evans. IF things fall apart after that, the last person you could blame would be Majerus.

[ACE]

After reading that ridiculous commentary, along with a few of the comments in this thread, I'm reminded of something I observed a few months. One of the many things that is so frustrating about the fallout from "the situation" is that it has given the usual collection of SLU haters, Missouri Valley lovers, Mizlosers, and Majerus bashers the opportunity to form a coalition... rallying around the idea that the program is falling apart. Prior to the situation, nobody was ripping on the direction that Majerus appeared to have the program heading. Even many in the local media started taking notice of our top 4 finish in the A-10 and a little run in the CBI with the youngest team in America. With a strong recruiting class coming in, seemingly everybody including some in the national media were encouraged that Majerus had the program on the verge of a breakthrough. So this argument now that the program is in ruins because of Majerus seems disengenuous. Majerus had the program well positioned, the only thing that changed was "the situation."

As we head into next year, let's let at least see what Majerus does with this team. We've all now seen what the freshmen have to offer and it looks very good. We know KM and JB will be onboard, so the only uncertainty remains WR. If things don't go well next year, then the RM bashers can have at it. Until then, the opportunists have very little credibility.

[GOSLU68]

KM and WR gave us a "20" game season

and a very small tournament opportunity

Add back KM, CE, JB, and we will be a better

team: if that minor miracle happens and WR

or another Quality five can play for us in

2011-2012 I will be pleased; I think RM wil take

it a year at a time in two years or more and I

Think RM is the glue not any one player

[Cbilkn1]

What a moron!!!

[rhagolf]

Message to all the "holier than thou's" on this site:

The only solution is to evict the Missouri Valley Conference HQ from St. Louis, and make sure that they take their "hayseed attitudes" and conference tournament with them to Kansas City. As we all know, there is an overabundance of corporate headquarters in St. Louis. And, scheduling things in March at ScottTrade will be so much easier (tractor pulls and WWE extravaganzas). Fr. Biondi will soon be moving the SLU campus to somewhere in Pennsylvania (or, anywhere else in his beloved Eastern Time Zone); this will make it easier to recruit the best and brightest (only those living in the East), and reduce travel expenses to other A-10 cities.

Attitudes like yours are what gave Martin Luther a reason to live. Then again, we know that this is the "only true religion." Just ask Cardinal Rigali how well it's going for him in Philly, now.

One thing is for sure - there is an equal hate here for anything about the local media's treatment of SLU, and the MVC.

[Bizziken]

Message to all the "holier than thou's" on this site:

The only solution is to evict the Missouri Valley Conference HQ from St. Louis, and make sure that they take their "hayseed attitudes" and conference tournament with them to Kansas City. As we all know, there is an overabundance of corporate headquarters in St. Louis. And, scheduling things in March at ScottTrade will be so much easier (tractor pulls and WWE extravaganzas). Fr. Biondi will soon be moving the SLU campus to somewhere in Pennsylvania (or, anywhere else in his beloved Eastern Time Zone); this will make it easier to recruit the best and brightest (only those living in the East), and reduce travel expenses to other A-10 cities.

Attitudes like yours are what gave Martin Luther a reason to live. Then again, we know that this is the "only true religion." Just ask Cardinal Rigali how well it's going for him in Philly, now.

One thing is for sure - there is an equal hate here for anything about the local media's treatment of SLU, and the MVC.

Dennis Miller, is that you?

[dlarry]

slu72, it is my opinion that a top program (not counting the likes of duke, north carolina ucla kentucky kansas. they are in a different world)like gonzaga, xavier, butler to degree, that we want to be like, has successfully achieved across the board to get to where they are. they cultivated both media, metropolitan area casual fans, the business commmunity and boosters. this enabled those programs to maximize revenue which gave the program the cash needed to hire the best coaching staff, develop their facilities, enhance their overall athletic department and increase boosters and fans in the seats. that's where loyalty is created. sure winning puts people in the seats, but if everyone isnt tied in and on board long term, the first year that falls off, those pretenders are gone.

I heard a reporter from cincinnati on Cussamano and kilcoyne yesterday talking about the MU vs Cincy game.

Cussamano started asking questions about Xavier and how they compare with Cincy for local media attention. I forget the guys name but he talked about how he was a graduate of Xaiver and is upset with the lack of attention Xavier gets from local media. He said that every Xavier game is a sell out but besides those 10,000 that go to the game nobody cares about Xavier basketbll.

He talked about how Bearcats basketball would be on pages 1-4 and Xavier would have a small article on page 8.

The guy was saying that Xavier has a good number of die hard fans but has trouble getting the casual fan.

I was really suprised to hear some of the things he was saying.

I agree with you that all those things are important but if what this guy was saying was true I think it goes to show you that putting a winner on the floor for 4 or 5 years is more important than anything else.

[ACE]

I heard a reporter from cincinnati on Cussamano and kilcoyne yesterday talking about the MU vs Cincy game.

Cussamano started asking questions about Xavier and how they compare with Cincy for local media attention. I forget the guys name but he talked about how he was a graduate of Xaiver and is upset with the lack of attention Xavier gets from local media. He said that every Xavier game is a sell out but besides those 10,000 that go to the game nobody cares about Xavier basketbll.

He talked about how Bearcats basketball would be on pages 1-4 and Xavier would have a small article on page 8.

The guy was saying that Xavier has a good number of die hard fans but has trouble getting the casual fan.

I was really suprised to hear some of the things he was saying.

I agree with you that all those things are important but if what this guy was saying was true I think it goes to show you that putting a winner on the floor for 4 or 5 years is more important than anything else.

I don't know what evidence roy has regarding what Gonzaga, Xavier and Butler have done to cultivate the media, casual fans, etc. What I do know is that those programs have consistently done a lot of winning on the court recently. Everybody likes associating with a winner including the media, boosters and casual fans.

Regarding UC getting more media attention, I am not surprised. UC is a much bigget school than Xavier and they play in a more high profile conference. Plus I would guess that more people in that town could identify with a big public university which has the name of the town in its name than a small private Catholic school.