MVC "apologist"

[Bay Area Billiken]

True, winning is the key. But my issue is now that we're winning, why do they still want to throw us in mid-major hell?

Haven't we shown how high our ceiling is? Haven't we shown a commitment to building a bigger program than we've ever been? Why do people want to put a cap on what we can do (and a move to the Valley, the nice conference that it is, would be just that.)?

The answer in some media cases is M-I-Z-Z-O-U. Many Mizzou supporters would love to stick SLU with the mid-major label. In the past, Jeff Gordon has described SLU as a mid-major, which by definition, it is not. More recently, Gordo has been singing SLU's praises (jumping on the bandwagon), which is fine with me.

SLU may not be recruiting many of the same players since Mike Anderson and Rick Majerus installed their systems, although there are some exceptions, but SLU is still competing with Mizzou for media attention in SLU's hometown, and Mizzou continues to duck playing SLU.

SLU is also competing with the Valley teams for media attention, as they continue to mine SLU's own backyard for players, play their conference tournament less than 2 miles from the SLU Campus, and lobby the STL media.

I like and respect the MVC. At the same time, I agree that SLU would put itself into a permanent mid-major dungeon by moving into the MVC, which it appears is not going to happen.

[Pistol]

1) Smoke screen

2) Not familiar with our program

3) Sucking up to Elgin

Nice work.

And Clock, I like your point a lot. The A10 and MVC are playing seriously different levels of basketball at this point. Even the most casual observer could see that.

[cheesycow]

Who cares if he's lying or not? We now have our AD on record saying we're staying in the A10 and the Valley commissioner on record saying they're not interested in SLU. What more could the local sports media want to hear? They need to put this to rest.

What I would like to see the local media do is stir up the pot to get SLU and Mizzou to play each other every year. Enough with the Valley, isn't our program looking like it's rising enough (with staying potential) to talk about it in relation to BCS-level comparisons? They hype up Braggin' Rights every year, and our team is very much playing at the level of an Illinois or Mizzou right now with a much younger roster.

We'll keep playing Missouri State and SIUC for great regional games, but I can't wait for the day our local sports media stops treating us like we belong at the kids' table.

Illinois, maybe

[Bay Area Billiken]

Illinois, maybe

Mizzou too- since Cody Ellis arrived on the scene.

Do you enjoy watching that 40 Minutes of Hades system at work at Old Mizzou?

Do you like getting blown out on your home court by Kansas, playing that "system?"

[Box and Won]

Mizzou too- since Cody Ellis arrived on the scene.

Do you enjoy watching that 40 Minutes of Hades system at work at Old Mizzou?

Do you like getting blown out on your home court by Kansas, playing that "system?"

In fairness, that system works really well a lot more often than it results in blowout losses like the one they experienced on Saturday. Just like the Bills, Mizzou has exceeded most people's expectations this season.

[Bay Area Billiken]

In fairness, that system works really well a lot more often than it results in blowout losses like the one they experienced on Saturday. Just like the Bills, Mizzou has exceeded most people's expectations this season.

I realize where that system once took Arkansas, and that it took Mizzou to the Elite 8 last year.

But overall and generally, I think it can only take you so far.

A good team that can handle that pressure in the backcourt and at midcourt gets a lot of easy baskets.

Also, Mizzou has some issues with its shooting on the offensive end.

[cheesycow]

Mizzou too- since Cody Ellis arrived on the scene.

Do you enjoy watching that 40 Minutes of Hades system at work at Old Mizzou?

Do you like getting blown out on your home court by Kansas, playing that "system?"

Question 1: Yes, yes, and yes. Mizzou has won 53 games over the last 2 years, and is a lock to make the tourney again- the problem with that is?

Question 2: You did get the memo that Kansas is easily the best team in the country, right?

[moytoy12]

Question 1: ...Mizzou has won 53 games over the last 2 years, and is a lock to make the tourney again- the problem with that is?

No kidding, what SLU fan wouldn't like to have that problem?

[Pistol]

Put cheesycow on ignore; he isn't worth acknowledging- a misguided troll from tigerboard.

Not to take anything away from Mizzou, who is having a nice year in a brutally tough conference, but a SLU-Mizzou game could be very interesting. They could very well blow us out by 30 with their crazy system but we could also give them fits. I would call them the better team this year, for sure. However, we are playing at a strong level right now and would not be taken lightly by them.

Right now, my gut is that we'd beat Illinois. They don't shoot well enough. We beat Dayton twice, largely for the same reason, and Dayton's athletes are every bit as good, if not better, than Illinois'. Call it a hunch, and maybe I'm wrong, but that would be a good game either way.

My original point is that we're playing much more closely to the level of our locally-covered BCS teams than our locally-covered non-BCS conference.

[rhagolf]

There are two things which are like the sun rising in the east in the morning, when one reads this board:

1. Mizzou is the worst program in the history of college basketball, because they won't schedule SLU (among other gripes).

2. The MVC is a collection of hick schools, and is certainly beneath the level of THE SAINT LOUIS UNIVERSITY - since when have you become Buckeye Junior?

I happen to be interested in all three programs, because I happen to like college basketball, overall. And, by the way, the NCAA Regionals are in St. Louis because of The Valley, not anything that might have occurred on Laclede. So, if you happen to appreciate the money that is going to flow into St. Louis because of being the tournament site, you might at least show some appreciation towards Mr. Elgin and his staff. Lord knows, if it weren't for Frank Viverito and the MVC, the Dome would be dark, once more.

[Box and Won]

There are two things which are like the sun rising in the east in the morning, when one reads this board:

1. Mizzou is the worst program in the history of college basketball, because they won't schedule SLU (among other gripes).

2. The MVC is a collection of hick schools, and is certainly beneath the level of THE SAINT LOUIS UNIVERSITY - since when have you become Buckeye Junior?

I happen to be interested in all three programs, because I happen to like college basketball, overall. And, by the way, the NCAA Regionals are in St. Louis because of The Valley, not anything that might have occurred on Laclede. So, if you happen to appreciate the money that is going to flow into St. Louis because of being the tournament site, you might at least show some appreciation towards Mr. Elgin and his staff. Lord knows, if it weren't for Frank Viverito and the MVC, the Dome would be dark, once more.

I appreciate having the MVC based in St. Louis, and I think 99% of the people here feel the same way. I just don't want SLU to be a member of it.

[cheesycow]

Put cheesycow on ignore; he isn't worth acknowledging- a misguided troll from tigerboard.

Not to take anything away from Mizzou, who is having a nice year in a brutally tough conference, but a SLU-Mizzou game could be very interesting. They could very well blow us out by 30 with their crazy system but we could also give them fits. I would call them the better team this year, for sure. However, we are playing at a strong level right now and would not be taken lightly by them.

Right now, my gut is that we'd beat Illinois. They don't shoot well enough. We beat Dayton twice, largely for the same reason, and Dayton's athletes are every bit as good, if not better, than Illinois'. Call it a hunch, and maybe I'm wrong, but that would be a good game either way.

My original point is that we're playing much more closely to the level of our locally-covered BCS teams than our locally-covered non-BCS conference.

Don't be so harsh! I never post on tigerboard. Not in years, at least.

I was just making a joke earlier. I think this year Mizzou probably is the better team, but lord knows anything can happen at any time and I certainly wouldn't count SLU out.

The reason Bragging Rights gets all the press is because of the history of the game, not because both teams are always awesome (as Illinois this year and Mizzou from 2004-2008 can attest).

[moytoy12]

Put cheesycow on ignore; he isn't worth acknowledging- a misguided troll from tigerboard.

Postcard was for sure, but I think cheesy is a very fair poster.

[MB73]

Despite the comments previously made about SLU and the Valley, I truly wish the Valley the best of success. I always pull for the little guy and agains the the BCS schools. Playing here in St. Louis has also been nice - a local flavor.

The other night, put the kids to bed, turned on the TV, saw another Valley game was being played and got a little interested. Then, I see the game is Illinois State v. Indiana State. Since this is not 1979 anymore, I turned the channel and was yet again reminded of how little interest I would have watching our Bills play 18 conference games plus a conference Tourney with these teams.

No thanks.

You gonna watch the A-10 thrilla between Duquesne and St. Bonaventure, then?

[Bay Area Billiken]

There are two things which are like the sun rising in the east in the morning, when one reads this board:

1. Mizzou is the worst program in the history of college basketball, because they won't schedule SLU (among other gripes).

2. The MVC is a collection of hick schools, and is certainly beneath the level of THE SAINT LOUIS UNIVERSITY - since when have you become Buckeye Junior?

I happen to be interested in all three programs, because I happen to like college basketball, overall. And, by the way, the NCAA Regionals are in St. Louis because of The Valley, not anything that might have occurred on Laclede. So, if you happen to appreciate the money that is going to flow into St. Louis because of being the tournament site, you might at least show some appreciation towards Mr. Elgin and his staff. Lord knows, if it weren't for Frank Viverito and the MVC, the Dome would be dark, once more.

Mizzou and the MVC are fine.

But the STL Hometown Media should give St. Louis U., the real hometown team, its just due.

This Billiken team has really come on strong, and I'd take my chances with SLU v. any Valley team, even Northern Iowa, as well as Mighty Mizzou itself at this point in the season.

I'd rather watch SLU's offense in action than Mizzou's "system" of basketball. I could be more descriptive re the latter, but what is the point? SLU's offense at times looked like poetry in motion Saturday night at Dayton, which ranks among the most difficult venues in college basketball.

Why won't Mizzou play SLU? We all know that answer, don't we?

Read somewhere above re Doug Elgin's comments when asked about SLU. Irrespective of what Elgin said, face saving IMO, everyone knows that the Valley would love to have SLU, a nationally ranked university, in it. Immediately, SLU would be the #1 academic school in that league, and the Valley would be getting a Top 1-2 Tier School per US News & World Report. SLU would also bring with it, at least in theory, by far the largest media market, much larger than any other MVC school.

So hey, let Mizzou and the MVC have some kudos. But don't forget SLU, which should be getting the most local attention of all.

[cheesycow]

Mizzou and the MVC are fine.

But the STL Hometown Media should give St. Louis U., the real hometown team, its just due.

This Billiken team has really come on strong, and I'd take my chances with SLU v. any Valley team, even Northern Iowa, as well as Mighty Mizzou itself at this point in the season.

I'd rather watch SLU's offense in action than Mizzou's "system" of basketball. I could be more descriptive re the latter, but what is the point? SLU's offense at times looked like poetry in motion Saturday night at Dayton, which ranks among the most difficult venues in college basketball.

Why won't Mizzou play SLU? We all know that answer, don't we?

Read somewhere above re Doug Elgin's comments when asked about SLU. Irrespective of what Elgin said, face saving IMO, everyone knows that the Valley would love to have SLU, a nationally ranked university, in it. Immediately, SLU would be the #1 academic school in that league, and the Valley would be getting a Top 1-2 Tier School per US News & World Report. SLU would also bring with it, at least in theory, by far the largest media market, much larger than any other MVC school.

So hey, let Mizzou and the MVC have some kudos. But don't forget SLU, which should be getting the most local attention of all.

Patience, friend, it takes time to build up the biggest profile in St. Louis. Even though Mizzou and Illinois aren't located in St. Louis, they're still very much considered St. Louis schools in terms of fandom. If SLU can build on this year and string together some tourney appearances and even some deeper runs in the tourney, they'll get more attention in town. Mizzou and Illinois have just been more relevant for a longer period of time. If SLU had the basketball resume of schools like Gonzaga, they'd get a lot more media attention. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed that the attention started to show up as SLU started putting it together as the season wore along.

[Bay Area Billiken]

Patience, friend, it takes time to build up the biggest profile in St. Louis. Even though Mizzou and Illinois aren't located in St. Louis, they're still very much considered St. Louis schools in terms of fandom. If SLU can build on this year and string together some tourney appearances and even some deeper runs in the tourney, they'll get more attention in town. Mizzou and Illinois have just been more relevant for a longer period of time. If SLU had the basketball resume of schools like Gonzaga, they'd get a lot more media attention. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed that the attention started to show up as SLU started putting it together as the season wore along.

Thanks and good.

As to the above Valley support from another poster, remember that the infamous Juan Bid made his unwelcome appearance at Scottrade Center yesterday.

It is doubtful that Juan Bid was lobbied by the Missouri Valley Conference, nor the St. Louis Convention and Visitors Commission.

[rhagolf]

Even though I am a fan of the MVC, I would NOT like SLU to enter the conference, for one, overriding reason -

St. Louis would probably lose Arch Madness, because of not being a "neutral site." And, this would be a major economic blow to the region. I am sure that you could realize the money that flowed into the hotels and restaurants this past weekend, from the fans of Wichita and Northern Iowa. While the long distance may have affected the turnstile count, the impact to the community was greater than if the SIU fans had commuted to-and-from St. Louis - in greater numbers.

The tournament is up for bid in the near future, with the competition being Kansas City, Chicago, and Indianapolis. If you care at all about attracting visitors to St. Louis, you might want to hope that Arch Madness remains here for at least 20 more years! It's not like the Convention and Visitors' Bureau is having to allocate space in the hotels, is it?

[Bay Area Billiken]

Even though I am a fan of the MVC, I would NOT like SLU to enter the conference, for one, overriding reason -

St. Louis would probably lose Arch Madness, because of not being a "neutral site." And, this would be a major economic blow to the region. I am sure that you could realize the money that flowed into the hotels and restaurants this past weekend, from the fans of Wichita and Northern Iowa. While the long distance may have affected the turnstile count, the impact to the community was greater than if the SIU fans had commuted to-and-from St. Louis - in greater numbers.

The tournament is up for bid in the near future, with the competition being Kansas City, Chicago, and Indianapolis. If you care at all about attracting visitors to St. Louis, you might want to hope that Arch Madness remains here for at least 20 more years! It's not like the Convention and Visitors' Bureau is having to allocate space in the hotels, is it?

Your point if very much understood.

I grew up in Quincy, IL, and have good friends from MVC schools, as well as friends and family who are Mizzou alumni. I'm not against any of those schools, and have 2 Degrees from SLU.

I want the MVC Tournament to stay in St. Louis too.

There must be a way for all of us to peacefully coexist.

But when SLU gets slighted in its own hometown, a response is in order.

Maybe the better question is why was the Channel 4 sports guy even asking Doug Elgin the question. It's bound to lead to controversy. There really is no point in beating another dead horse.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Maybe the better question is why was the Channel 4 sports guy even asking Doug Elgin the question. It's bound to lead to controversy. There really is no point in beating another dead horse.

And that brings us back to the question of the amount of knowledge about college basketball.

Baseball & Cardinals: yes.

College hoops: not so much.

[Schasz]

Question 1: Yes, yes, and yes. Mizzou has won 53 games over the last 2 years, and is a lock to make the tourney again- the problem with that is?

Question 2: You did get the memo that Kansas is easily the best team in the country, right?

I watched that fiasco here in S. Florida and even the most ardent Mizzou could not be happy with that arse kicking on their home court on Sr. Day.

From what I saw your team better hope for a good draw or else it will be one and done Moo Cow!

[cheesycow]

I watched that fiasco here in S. Florida and even the most ardent Mizzou could not be happy with that arse kicking on their home court on Sr. Day.

From what I saw your team better hope for a good draw or else it will be one and done Moo Cow!

Certainly not happy about it (who likes it when their team gets spanked?!), but do you really believe that SLU would have fared any better against them at home on Senior Day (pretend it's senior day in two years i guess )? I mean I hate Kansas as much as anyone but they're friggin' good and there's no shame in losing to them no matter what the circumstances (as all but 2 teams did this year)

[dlarry]

I watched that fiasco here in S. Florida and even the most ardent Mizzou could not be happy with that arse kicking on their home court on Sr. Day.

From what I saw your team better hope for a good draw or else it will be one and done Moo Cow!

One and done is still a lot better than what was predicted for Mizzou this year.

Much like SLU this was a complete rebulding year. They lost the three top scorers from last year and were not expected to be Tourney bound this year.

When it comes to Mizzou the defense is fun to watch but that "offense" they run is terrible.

Ive never seen such unorganized slop. I know they want to play fast but if they could run some type of offense they would be tough to stop.

[JamminJamalJohnson]

I don't think this is true.

SLU only has to do one thing to get all of the respect fans want the Billikens to get: win.

That's it. Very simple. The Billikens keep winning games, they will get plenty of respect.

I heard the same complaints about Missouri football years ago, about how the Tigers got no respect and couldn't get on TV and St. Louis kids wouldn't consider the school because of those factors. When Missouri started winning more games, the program got more and more respect.

It's all about winning games. You win games and you get more attention.

Bingo

[Clock_Tower]

You gonna watch the A-10 thrilla between Duquesne and St. Bonaventure, then?

Valley game was #3 seed v. #6 - Illinois State v. Indiana State. Ken Pom RPI 91 v. Ken Pom RPI 141

A10 #3 seed is Richmond (Ken Pom RPI 46) and #6 seed is Charlotte (Ken Pom RPI 97). Big difference.

Duquesne v. St. Bonaventure would be our (A10) seeds #8 v. #9. That game is not going to happen, but if it did, Duquesne is RPI 137 and St. Bona is RPI 139 - both of which are HIGHER than the Valley's #6 seed - Indiana State at RPI 141!!

What's your point again MB? Too bad the facts don't back you up!!