AnkielBreakers Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 hour ago, kwyjibo said: St. Louis may very well support a soccer team and I personally wish the MLS well but that has absolutely nothing to do with public subsidy. To use a word--it is "stupid" to publicly subsidize sports facilities; which is shocking considering all the stupid money St. Louis has thrown at sports (how did the TWA dome work out? hotel?). At least the city had some smart enough people to force a referendum. It is stupid to argue that the potential to give money to millionaires justifies a 'no' vote. That is populist propaganda, not a logical argument on the merits. I have read reports which project the stadium to bring in positive net revenues to the city. Not all sports franchises provide a negative financial result to a city, many provide a major boost to the city's image and revenue. I have also read that it is unlikely that the majority of the extra use tax, which could pay for the stadium, will actually go towards public housing. I would not have voted for the TWA dome, or a football franchise in St. Louis. It failed before, and would fail again. I think you have to make a determination based on the city you live in and the value of that sport to the city. St. Louis has been recognized repeatedly for being a soccer town. SLU dominated soccer for decades, and we have not always been known as a national recruiter. This is a sport where we have a solid base of interest. I think this would be a good investment for the city. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorydays2013 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 As much as people want to say the city won't benefit from an MLS team if they put money into it, they will. City tax from games, the tourists/fans, new players and managers putting their large salary and money into the city economy and taxes etc. Yes its not right away but soccer is a larger season than football (34 games) with significantly more home games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 hour ago, wgstl said: My man crush grew even stronger last night: Christian PulisicVerified account @cpulisic_10 14h14 hours ago More Come on St. Louis, vote yes. #MLS2STL That's cool that he took the time to do that. Does he have any connection anyone knows of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 How realistic would it be to just put a stadium fee on top of every ticket sold. Hell, people pay outrageous ticket master fees for so many events most people wouldn't even notice or care. I will be a season ticket holder from day 1, and I'd pay a couple of extra dollars a ticket to help pay for the stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonwich Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 20 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said: It is stupid to argue that the potential to give money to millionaires justifies a 'no' vote. That is populist propaganda, not a logical argument on the merits. I have read reports which project the stadium to bring in positive net revenues to the city. Not all sports franchises provide a negative financial result to a city, many provide a major boost to the city's image and revenue. Yeah, and Donald Trump read somewhere that Obama had tapped his phones. I'd bet that the "reports" you've read were written by or on behalf of or financed by stadium proponents. There are also reams of studies from people with no dog in the fight that conclude otherwise. For example: Publicly Financed Sports Stadiums Are A Game That Taxpayers Lose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonwich Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 8 minutes ago, slufanskip said: How realistic would it be to just put a stadium fee on top of every ticket sold. Hell, people pay outrageous ticket master fees for so many events most people wouldn't even notice or care. I will be a season ticket holder from day 1, and I'd pay a couple of extra dollars a ticket to help pay for the stadium. Just call it a "handling fee" and everyone who's ever been to a concert won't think twice about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorydays2013 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 8 minutes ago, slufanskip said: That's cool that he took the time to do that. Does he have any connection anyone knows of? parents played for George Mason and thats about as close I can get, I don't even know if they were in the A10 then. He's from Pennsylvania. Only 18 so I assume just has been up to date on everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Since this is a soccer thread and I've been meaning to start an off topic thread discussing the Men's Nat'l Team I'll add it here. I thought we had some outstanding performances. The Pulisic pass to Dempsey and Dempsey's finish was fantastic. Stars - Pulisic, Nagbe, Dempsey, Altidore, and Cameron. I loved watching Pulisic and Nagbe take on defenders and be creative with the ball. Altidore was very good holding and distributing. He did a great job of drawing defenders and then playing the ball to right spot. Dempsey ... even if he can't play 90 minutes on a normal basis how dangerous can he be for 30. Weakness - Bradley besides the goal, just turns the ball over far to often which is really hard to believe considering his first thought almost every touch is to lay off to safety. Central defense just continues to lose their man. It has to change. No time for more, but I'm looking forward to the game tonight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 16 minutes ago, slufanskip said: How realistic would it be to just put a stadium fee on top of every ticket sold. Hell, people pay outrageous ticket master fees for so many events most people wouldn't even notice or care. I will be a season ticket holder from day 1, and I'd pay a couple of extra dollars a ticket to help pay for the stadium. Not necessarily a bad concept - the only question I would have is how do you get the money up front to pay to build the stadium? I am not sure you can float a bond or loan based on future tix sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Just now, cheeseman said: Not necessarily a bad concept - the only question I would have is how do you get the money up front to pay to build the stadium? I am not sure you can float a bond or loan based on future tix sales. I don't for a minute believe the owners can't afford it so would it be reasonable for them to pay it upfront and just use it as a way to recover some of the stadium costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 17 minutes ago, bonwich said: Just call it a "handling fee" and everyone who's ever been to a concert won't think twice about it. That was my point. I went to buy tickets to a concert and two $35 dollar tickets was going to be $94. I just wouldn't do it lol. Had they just told me the tickets were $47, I'd have bought them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 14 minutes ago, slufanskip said: I don't for a minute believe the owners can't afford it so would it be reasonable for them to pay it upfront and just use it as a way to recover some of the stadium costs. I think this is the sort of proposal that no one would have a problem with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 35 minutes ago, Glorydays2013 said: parents played for George Mason and thats about as close I can get, I don't even know if they were in the A10 then. He's from Pennsylvania. Only 18 so I assume just has been up to date on everything. Or you know his teammate Tim Ream asked him, or Taylor Twellman. The president of US soccer was born in STL and is a Billiken.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwyjibo Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 5 minutes ago, JMM28 said: I think this is the sort of proposal that no one would have a problem with. Except the owners. Generally, this kind of tax results in revenue losses for the team as they (generally) lower ticket prices to keep the total cost in line with demand. It is a smart thing to negotiate if you were offering public money. Kudos to Skip though for offering. Also, I love Pulisic and you are right about the other players having played well. I like Bradley a lot more than most but I have not seen him play that well for the U.S. in a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorydays2013 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 13 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said: Or you know his teammate Tim Ream asked him, or Taylor Twellman. The president of US soccer was born in STL and is a Billiken.... Taylor went to SLUH and Maryland... was not on the team the same time as Christian..... The president of US soccer went to Bucknell and Columbia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunil_Gulati https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Twellman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 6 minutes ago, Glorydays2013 said: Taylor went to SLUH and Maryland... was not on the team the same time as Christian..... The president of US soccer went to Bucknell and Columbia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunil_Gulati https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Twellman Taylor Twellman is a commentator that often works US soccer games and has as much contact with the team. Not sure why you're obsessed with the teammate/college angle. Dan Flynn is the CEO, I made a mistake but my point is stil as valid as ever. Nice try buddy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorydays2013 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said: Taylor Twellman is a commentator that often works US soccer games and has as much contact with the team. Not sure why you're obsessed with the teammate/college angle. Dan Flynn is the CEO, I made a mistake but my point is stil as valid as ever. Nice try buddy. No it's not and you're trying too hard to diminish what I say. Those are no real connections. Nice try Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlebill Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 26 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said: Or you know his teammate Tim Ream asked him, or Taylor Twellman. The president of US soccer was born in STL and is a Billiken.... ACTUALLY the kid he tagged in the tweet initially is an STL kid and a youth national team guy. Most likely a connection from the YNT but continue to argue about made up connections and Zimas to think that Twellman would have no connection to Pulisic is ludicrous. But TT wouldn't go as far to ask an 18 yo to do something like this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, Glorydays2013 said: No it's not and you're trying too hard to diminish what I say. Those are no real connections. Nice try What you say is complete nonsense and you say things constantly. You diminish yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 2 minutes ago, Littlebill said: ACTUALLY the kid he tagged in the tweet initially is an STL kid and a youth national team guy. Most likely a connection from the YNT but continue to argue about made up arguments and Zimas to think that Twellman would have no connection to Pulisic is ludicrous. But TT wouldn't go as far to ask an 18 yo to do something like this... Thank you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 minute ago, Littlebill said: ACTUALLY the kid he tagged in the tweet initially is an STL kid and a youth national team guy. Most likely a connection from the YNT but continue to argue about made up connections and Zimas to think that Twellman would have no connection to Pulisic is ludicrous. But TT wouldn't go as far to ask an 18 yo to do something like this... I don't think Twellman would ask the kid to do that, but I am sure the kid knows how important this is to people like Twellman, Ream and Noonan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlebill Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 3 minutes ago, brianstl said: I don't think Twellman would ask the kid to do that, but I am sure the kid knows how important this is to people like Twellman, Ream and Noonan. Exactly my point in the last paragraph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 I think it is surprising that Noonan being on the staff hasn't been mentioned more. I know he want to Indiana, but you would think this would have to help St Louis players getting a fair shake when roster decisions are made for the ever cliquish US National program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilkowsky Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 If I remember correctly the ownership group said the City would benefit to the tune of 77 million dollars over 30 years. That is only about 389000 a year. Considering the 60 million investment - that isn't a great return. For those who want the City to pay for a stadium do you really think an MLS franchise will make a difference in regards to the Coty. Look at St. Charles County who grows at five percent a year. They have never had an NFL franchise. No MLB team. No NHL team. Not putting in a soccer stadium. They have safe neighborhoods and good schools. Unlike St. Louis City. Which is why people don't want to live in the City. An MLS franchise won't change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilkowsky Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 1 hour ago, Glorydays2013 said: As much as people want to say the city won't benefit from an MLS team if they put money into it, they will. City tax from games, the tourists/fans, new players and managers putting their large salary and money into the city economy and taxes etc. Yes its not right away but soccer is a larger season than football (34 games) with significantly more home games. 17 home games times 20,000 fans equals 340,000. For football if you have a franchise that is halfway decent - 8 games times 60000 average equals 480,000 fans. So soccer is a larger season but still attracts fewer fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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