OT: Big East / Big 10 matchup

[kappy96]

Saw this in the Sports Business Journal today...nice exposure for the Big East early in the season.

• Big Ten, Big East To Announce Season-Opening Gavitt Tipoff Games

  The Big East and Big Ten conferences today will announce the creation of the Dave Gavitt Tipoff Games, a “four-day, eight-game season-opening challenge” beginning with the ’15-16 season. The games will take place in November “from Tuesday to Friday of the first full week of the season.” ESPN and Big Ten Network will air games played at Big Ten sites, while FS1 will televise games at Big East locations. Each conference “will host four games.” The deal is for eight years (SI.com, 5/4).

[slu72]

That's a big plus for the NBE. The Big 10 will likely kill them next year.

[Clock_Tower]

This is huge for the NBE and not good for SLU/A10. We need our own such agreement ASAP. In the past, we have played the likes of Iowa, Wisconsin, etc. Now, if the Power 5 decide to only play us non-football schools within the confines of such structured events, we will suffer. Personally, I don't believe the Power 5 don't want to play the better non-football schools except on their terms (neutral court, revenue maker, etc.). The NBE is actively playing the Power 5 schools (Big 10) and, with this agreement, is attempting to separate itself from the rest of us non-football schools. No way will the NBE want to play the A10 schools, the Valley, the WCC, etc if they can play the Big 10 and cash in..I sure hope the A10 is planning something as well.

[JettFlight5]

This is huge for the NBE and not good for SLU/A10. We need our own such agreement ASAP. In the past, we have played the likes of Iowa, Wisconsin, etc. Now, if the Power 5 decide to only play us non-football schools within the confines of such structured events, we will suffer. Personally, I don't believe the Power 5 don't want to play the better non-football schools except on their terms (neutral court, revenue maker, etc.). The NBE is actively playing the Power 5 schools (Big 10) and, with this agreement, is attempting to separate itself from the rest of us non-football schools. No way will the NBE want to play the A10 schools, the Valley, the WCC, etc if they can play the Big 10 and cash in..I sure hope the A10 is planning something as well.

The A10 did do the small setup with the ACC, but I don't think you're wrong on the fallout.

Hopefully, A10 leadership realizes what they need to do and do it.

[Cowboy]

-takes two to tango, while a deal with another conf would be great for the A10, what conf is going to agree to that? perhaps I would be surprised but I doubt teams from the A10 pack gyms as the visitor or provide an opponent networks salivate over when negotiating these deals

[slu72]

Our ACC deal is not as big as this NBE v B10 pact. We'll likely get games w/ the ACC's bottom feeders. I don't expect Duke or UNC to show up at the Fetz anytime soon.

[sludevil]

Agree with the above. It would be awesome if the A10 could schedule something similar with the ACC (or, really, any power conference), but I don't see it happening. The A10 just doesn't have the stable of teams (like Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, and even St. John's) that can draw enough fan and media interest so as to make such an arrangement worthwhile to the power conference. It's probably going to remain on SLU's shoulders to schedule tough/power conference opponents to boost RPI and national media exposure.

[Clock_Tower]

Agree. But if we cannot land a Power 5, then we must do something else. There must be a Plan B. Frankly, I think it will only become more and more difficult to schedule an occasional game with a Power 5 team -- even average teams like Iowa which we have played in the past.

And a possible Plan B could be playing a Tournament/Showcase with the WCC. Attempting to pick off a few NBE will probably not work as the NBE don't want to associate themselves at all with us "lesser" name and conference teams.

And as to the Mizzou v. Xavier series, it has less to do with which option will produce extra ticket sales/TV ratings (games with SLU would be more profitable). Instead, it all comes down to Mizzou not being afraid of the ramifications of losing to X but scared to death of losing to SLU. Mizzou, recognizing the need to strengthen their OOC schedule, chose to do so without taking too much risk. Losses can and will occur in college basketball. A loss to SLU would devastate the Mizzou faithful. A loss to X will not. And the reason Mizzou is willing to play X (and risk a loss) has nothing to do with X being a Jesuit school, with its location or with its new conference, the NBE. Instead, it has to do with X having built its own name as a quality team/program and regular NCAA Tourney participant. Hence, losing to a program like X would not be an embarrassment. Likewise, the Big 10 has decided that losing to NBE schools will not only benefit financially but also will not be an embarrassment. Why the NBE and not the A10? Because of prior performance, wins, name recognition. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been good in recent years. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been better than most NBE these past few years. Yes, I like the future of SLU, VCU and others more than I like the future of most "name" NBE schools. Still, a potential loss by a Big 10 team to a NBE program has been deemed to be more lucrative, to strengthen OOC schedules and to not be such an embarrassing loss.

[JettFlight5]

Agree. But if we cannot land a Power 5, then we must do something else. There must be a Plan B. Frankly, I think it will only become more and more difficult to schedule an occasional game with a Power 5 team -- even average teams like Iowa which we have played in the past.

And a possible Plan B could be playing a Tournament/Showcase with the WCC. Attempting to pick off a few NBE will probably not work as the NBE don't want to associate themselves at all with us "lesser" name and conference teams.

And as to the Mizzou v. Xavier series, it has less to do with which option will produce extra ticket sales/TV ratings (games with SLU would be more profitable). Instead, it all comes down to Mizzou not being afraid of the ramifications of losing to X but scared to death of losing to SLU. Mizzou, recognizing the need to strengthen their OOC schedule, chose to do so without taking too much risk. Losses can and will occur in college basketball. A loss to SLU would devastate the Mizzou faithful. A loss to X will not. And the reason Mizzou is willing to play X (and risk a loss) has nothing to do with X being a Jesuit school, with its location or with its new conference, the NBE. Instead, it has to do with X having built its own name as a quality team/program and regular NCAA Tourney participant. Hence, losing to a program like X would not be an embarrassment. Likewise, the Big 10 has decided that losing to NBE schools will not only benefit financially but also will not be an embarrassment. Why the NBE and not the A10? Because of prior performance, wins, name recognition. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been good in recent years. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been better than most NBE these past few years. Yes, I like the future of SLU, VCU and others more than I like the future of most "name" NBE schools. Still, a potential loss by a Big 10 team to a NBE program has been deemed to be more lucrative, to strengthen OOC schedules and to not be such an embarrassing loss.

The "embarrassing loss" part is very appropriate here.

If a P5 school loses to any A10 school (yes, I'm counting SLU and VCU in this), it's an embarrassment. This shows that for the moment, the NBE is not seen as such. The extremes make it almost a dark comedy:

If Auburn loses to Seton Hall, is that a "better loss" than losing to Saint Louis or VCU?

[Old guy]

I tend to think that Big 10 "chose" Big East because the Big East just came in and asked them to do so and no one else had done it. Had A10 asked first and been turned down followed by their acceptance of Big East's similar offer as a tournament partner ti would be a different situation. I just do not think the A10 league has the initiative level that Big East has.

[Dwayne's_World]

Agree. But if we cannot land a Power 5, then we must do something else. There must be a Plan B. Frankly, I think it will only become more and more difficult to schedule an occasional game with a Power 5 team -- even average teams like Iowa which we have played in the past.

And a possible Plan B could be playing a Tournament/Showcase with the WCC. Attempting to pick off a few NBE will probably not work as the NBE don't want to associate themselves at all with us "lesser" name and conference teams.

And as to the Mizzou v. Xavier series, it has less to do with which option will produce extra ticket sales/TV ratings (games with SLU would be more profitable). Instead, it all comes down to Mizzou not being afraid of the ramifications of losing to X but scared to death of losing to SLU. Mizzou, recognizing the need to strengthen their OOC schedule, chose to do so without taking too much risk. Losses can and will occur in college basketball. A loss to SLU would devastate the Mizzou faithful. A loss to X will not. And the reason Mizzou is willing to play X (and risk a loss) has nothing to do with X being a Jesuit school, with its location or with its new conference, the NBE. Instead, it has to do with X having built its own name as a quality team/program and regular NCAA Tourney participant. Hence, losing to a program like X would not be an embarrassment. Likewise, the Big 10 has decided that losing to NBE schools will not only benefit financially but also will not be an embarrassment. Why the NBE and not the A10? Because of prior performance, wins, name recognition. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been good in recent years. Yes, SLU, VCU and others have been better than most NBE these past few years. Yes, I like the future of SLU, VCU and others more than I like the future of most "name" NBE schools. Still, a potential loss by a Big 10 team to a NBE program has been deemed to be more lucrative, to strengthen OOC schedules and to not be such an embarrassing loss.

Do you think that Mizzou might also be afraid that if they lost to SLU, they would begin to lose a casual fan base in the STL area? I think they still hold this misconception that they are the dominant basketball program in the state of Missouri (which everyone knows is no longer even remotely the case). Playing SLU and getting their a$$es handed to them would only confirm this. The post dispatch would be all over that, and Mizzery will have lost at least some of the casual college basketball fans in STL...

[kshoe]

I tend to think that Big 10 "chose" Big East because the Big East just came in and asked them to do so and no one else had done it. Had A10 asked first and been turned down followed by their acceptance of Big East's similar offer as a tournament partner ti would be a different situation. I just do not think the A10 league has the initiative level that Big East has.

This post is pretty clueless.

[thetorch]

Do you think that Mizzou might also be afraid that if they lost to SLU, they would begin to lose a casual fan base in the STL area? I think they still hold this misconception that they are the dominant basketball program in the state of Missouri (which everyone knows is no longer even remotely the case). Playing SLU and getting their a$$es handed to them would only confirm this. The post dispatch would be all over that, and Mizzery will have lost at least some of the casual college basketball fans in STL...

If Missouri won't play us when we lose 5 starters and 90% of our scoring, they never will. Regardless of the reasons its time to drop this topic.

[Clock_Tower]

Do you think that Mizzou might also be afraid that if they lost to SLU, they would begin to lose a casual fan base in the STL area? I think they still hold this misconception that they are the dominant basketball program in the state of Missouri (which everyone knows is no longer even remotely the case). Playing SLU and getting their a$$es handed to them would only confirm this. The post dispatch would be all over that, and Mizzery will have lost at least some of the casual college basketball fans in STL...

Not sure Mizzou will ever lose casual fans simply by playing a few games against SLU. Instead, Mizzou knows that they risk the appearance of superiority simply by playing us. Just like with a Presidential campaign, when the many challengers in the primary (non-Power 5 schools) take the stage against each other, they look "small." but when the primary is over and a candidate is selected, and when this candidate takes the stage with the incumbent President (Power 5 school), the superiority gap closes. Now, if the challenger is unprepared, mis-speaks and/or looks foolish (the non-Power 5 school loses by 20+ points), superiority is confirmed. Otherwise, if an equal performance, then the superiority argument vanishes.

For years, Mizzou loyalists have said: "We're better b/c we are in the Big 8/12, we play/beat KU each year... Now, they play in the SEC and lose to Florida and Kentucky each year... and to Vandy, and to Old Miss and to Arkansas and to...),

[cheesycow]

Not sure Mizzou will ever lose casual fans simply by playing a few games against SLU. Instead, Mizzou knows that they risk the appearance of superiority simply by playing us. Just like with a Presidential campaign, when the many challengers in the primary (non-Power 5 schools) take the stage against each other, they look "small." but when the primary is over and a candidate is selected, and when this candidate takes the stage with the incumbent President (Power 5 school), the superiority gap closes. Now, if the challenger is unprepared, mis-speaks and/or looks foolish (the non-Power 5 school loses by 20+ points), superiority is confirmed. Otherwise, if an equal performance, then the superiority argument vanishes.

For years, Mizzou loyalists have said: "We're better b/c we are in the Big 8/12, we play/beat KU each year... Now, they play in the SEC and lose to Florida and Kentucky each year... and to Vandy, and to Old Miss and to Arkansas and to...),

Yeah the Mizzou faithful have never really recovered from that loss to SLU ~15 years ago.

[kshoe]

Yeah the Mizzou faithful have never really recovered from that loss to SLU ~15 years ago.

Serious question. When you come to this board, do you just type in keywords like Mizzou, Missouri, SPUMAC, etc. into the search function in the upper right? If there are any new mentions, you post a response back. If there aren't any mentions you go on with your day.

I dare say your reply rate on the few times people talk Mizzou on this board is about 90%. Your reply rate on anything that deals purely with SLU is about 0.02%.

[cheesycow]

Serious question. When you come to this board, do you just type in keywords like Mizzou, Missouri, SPUMAC, etc. into the search function in the upper right? If there are any new mentions, you post a response back. If there aren't any mentions you go on with your day.

I dare say your reply rate on the few times people talk Mizzou on this board is about 90%. Your reply rate on anything that deals purely with SLU is about 0.02%.

I read almost everything but I know way less than most posters about specific SLU stuff so I typically comment on more national stuff or Mizzou stuff because I feel knowledgeable enough to comment.

[ACE]

Serious question. When you come to this board, do you just type in keywords like Mizzou, Missouri, SPUMAC, etc. into the search function in the upper right? If there are any new mentions, you post a response back. If there aren't any mentions you go on with your day.

I dare say your reply rate on the few times people talk Mizzou on this board is about 90%. Your reply rate on anything that deals purely with SLU is about 0.02%.

He appears to have an insatiable need to receive approval from SLU fans and he gets frustrated when we don't give his beloved SPUMAC the respect he thinks it deserves.

[cheesycow]

He appears to have an insatiable need to receive approval from SLU fans and he gets frustrated when we don't give his beloved SPUMAC the respect he thinks it deserves.

Yeah my whole life has been about getting Steve to actually like me.