A10 Attendance

[STLfan]

Since it is the off season and I was bored here are some attendance figures.

Average A10 attendance this year - 5,713

Here is the average attendance of Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 10,163

The A10 average attendance without Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 4,313

1,171,227 people took in A10 games this season

510,885 of those were at Dayton, Saint Louis, and Xavier

44% of all people watching A10 basketball were at those three schools.

Kind of crazy isn't it? And yet for some reason this conference puts the conference tournament as far away as possible from it's three largest fan bases. If a scenario ever came up that offered a better option to Dayton, SLU, and X I wonder how much damage those schools leaving would do to the A10.

[SluSignGuy]

Good figures.

I still think Atlantic City is the best town for the A-10 Tournament unless you want to give Dayton and or Xavier a home court.

Also, if the day comes for conference reshuffling. Let's just hope we are a quality enough program to be attractive to a conference so we don't get left behind.

[GOSLU68]

Since it is the off season and I was bored here are some attendance figures.

Average A10 attendance this year - 5,713

Here is the average attendance of Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 10,163

The A10 average attendance without Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 4,313

1,171,227 people took in A10 games this season

510,885 of those were at Dayton, Saint Louis, and Xavier

44% of all people watching A10 basketball were at those three schools.

Kind of crazy isn't it? And yet for some reason this conference puts the conference tournament as far away as possible from it's three largest fan bases. If a scenario ever came up that offered a better option to Dayton, SLU, and X I wonder how much damage those schools leaving would do to the A10.

thanks, did you get Charlotte, Stl Joe, UMass, Temple? they couldn't be too far behind

[bluecrewfinance]

thanks, did you get Charlotte, Stl Joe, UMass, Temple? they couldn't be too far behind

What about Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, or Cleveland for the tournament? It satisfies neutrality, a bigger city, easier travel, closer to the biggest fan bases. I don't want to touch off a flame war over cities, but doesn't it seem rational to want the tournament (a) in a bigger market and ( closer to the largest drawing programs? A central location is good for something like the Big 10 or Big 12 that travel well and have huge buy-in from program friends, but I don't see that as the best option here.

[thetorch]

What about Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, or Cleveland for the tournament? It satisfies neutrality, a bigger city, easier travel, closer to the biggest fan bases. I don't want to touch off a flame war over cities, but doesn't it seem rational to want the tournament (a) in a bigger market and ( closer to the largest drawing programs? A central location is good for something like the Big 10 or Big 12 that travel well and have huge buy-in from program friends, but I don't see that as the best option here.

It is the Atlantic 10 conference. SLU, Xavier and Dayton could have 90% of the attendance and still the tourney would need to be out there. It is an old east coast league.

How is Indianapolis central, or Chicago? Taking in the number and location of the teams Atlantic City is pretty centralized for the vast majority. The league may stretch to the Mississippi river but 11 teams play 200 miles or less from the atlantic ocean.

I like the cleveland idea. St Bonnies and Duquense would be in favor, only a couple hour drive for them. The only bad thing is it is Cleveland.

[bluecrewfinance]

It is the Atlantic 10 conference. SLU, Xavier and Dayton could have 90% of the attendance and still the tourney would need to be out there. It is an old east coast league.

How is Indianapolis central, or Chicago? Taking in the number and location of the teams Atlantic City is pretty centralized for the vast majority. The league may stretch to the Mississippi river but 11 teams play 200 miles or less from the atlantic ocean.

I like the cleveland idea. St Bonnies and Duquense would be in favor, only a couple hour drive for them. The only bad thing is it is Cleveland.

I agree with your point about "central"...I tried to discount that in my last sentence. Sorry for lack of clarity. I'm not saying that it would ever happen, just that it could make more sense.

And Cleveland is Cleveland, but a long weekend shouldn't kill you, right? RIGHT??? Besides, if we have a problem with the officiating, we could just throw the refs into the Cuyahoga.

[slu72]

I agree with your point about "central"...I tried to discount that in my last sentence. Sorry for lack of clarity. I'm not saying that it would ever happen, just that it could make more sense.

And Cleveland is Cleveland, but a long weekend shouldn't kill you, right? RIGHT??? Besides, if we have a problem with the officiating, we could just throw the refs into the Cuyahoga.

Columbus, OH would be good.

[lefty]

Since it is the off season and I was bored here are some attendance figures.

Average A10 attendance this year - 5,713

Here is the average attendance of Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 10,163

The A10 average attendance without Dayton, SLU, and Xavier - 4,313

1,171,227 people took in A10 games this season

510,885 of those were at Dayton, Saint Louis, and Xavier

44% of all people watching A10 basketball were at those three schools.

Kind of crazy isn't it? And yet for some reason this conference puts the conference tournament as far away as possible from it's three largest fan bases. If a scenario ever came up that offered a better option to Dayton, SLU, and X I wonder how much damage those schools leaving would do to the A10.

What was the average attendance of Dayton, Xavier and SLU individually?

[Pistol]

The cities in the running for 2010 were AC, Dayton, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, and Springfield, Mass. Selfishly, I would have liked to see it in Cincinnati, where it would be held at US Bank Arena downtown (not Cintas on Xavier's campus). SLU has played in conference tournaments there before when we were in C-USA.

If it were in Dayton, I think it would have to be at UD Arena, as Hara Arena is kind of a dump and only seats about 5,500- not enough for when Dayton or Xavier would be playing. Plus, if people are complaining about going to Cleveland, Dayton is way less exciting.

Pittsburgh is about 4 hours from either Dayton or Cincy, so that would not have been bad for us westernmost A10 teams. It's also an easy direct flight from St. Louis, and doesn't require an hour ride or 90 minute train from Philadelphia's airport like AC does.

People are bringing up good points- from an attendance standpoint, the three western teams are pulling more than their share for the whole conference. Xavier, and probably Dayton second, are also pulling the load when it comes to winning outside the conference and gaining national respect. It's time for the conference to throw us a bone and put the tournament within easier driving distance for our fans.

Cleveland is actually a pretty good idea, and to those who are ripping on it, I say give it a chance. I have never had a bad time in Cleveland and there's plenty to do there (and most of it downtown) over a long weekend. Columbus is another good idea, though I personally like Cleveland better.

[STLfan]

Here is the breakdown per school

SCHOOL - AVERAGE ATTENDANCE

Dayton - 12,765

Xavier - 10,079

Saint Louis - 7,627

Charlotte - 6,184

St. Joseph's - 6,154

Temple - 5,933

Rhode Island - 5,300

UMass - 5,033

Richmond - 4,999

St. Bonaventure - 4,136

Duquensne - 2,786

La Salle - 2,544

George Washington - 2,338

Fordham - 2,037

Taken From this Thread

[ARbilliken]

The cities in the running for 2010 were AC, Dayton, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, and Springfield, Mass. Selfishly, I would have liked to see it in Cincinnati, where it would be held at US Bank Arena downtown (not Cintas on Xavier's campus). SLU has played in conference tournaments there before when we were in C-USA.

If it were in Dayton, I think it would have to be at UD Arena, as Hara Arena is kind of a dump and only seats about 5,500- not enough for when Dayton or Xavier would be playing. Plus, if people are complaining about going to Cleveland, Dayton is way less exciting.

Pittsburgh is about 4 hours from either Dayton or Cincy, so that would not have been bad for us westernmost A10 teams. It's also an easy direct flight from St. Louis, and doesn't require an hour ride or 90 minute train from Philadelphia's airport like AC does.

People are bringing up good points- from an attendance standpoint, the three western teams are pulling more than their share for the whole conference. Xavier, and probably Dayton second, are also pulling the load when it comes to winning outside the conference and gaining national respect. It's time for the conference to throw us a bone and put the tournament within easier driving distance for our fans.

Cleveland is actually a pretty good idea, and to those who are ripping on it, I say give it a chance. I have never had a bad time in Cleveland and there's plenty to do there (and most of it downtown) over a long weekend. Columbus is another good idea, though I personally like Cleveland better.

I like Cleveland as a host site--easy flight, pretty central, and plenty to do. I think it would attract some that maybe couldn't shell out a bunch of bucks to stay in AC. The hotels are definitely cheaper, as are the activities.

I would have to argue that Pitt is not 4 hours from Dayton and Cincy--at least 6-7 hours...I don't think that would be a good place though--probably a lot of big east fans vs. A-10 fans as opposed to a Cleveland State fan would probably like to watch a Xavier v. STJ/SLU/UD game.

I am impressed with the attendance numbers---I'm sure it's X, YouDEE, and SLU in that order. I'd be interested to see how close we are to them though! Hopefully the numbers will be up next year along with a big name non-conference opponent. Maybe RM can get Utah to come in town--they had a good year this past year. That might be a good game--who knows, anything could happen---Isiah Thomas did go to FIU which says a lot!

[GOSLU68]

Here is the breakdown per school

SCHOOL - AVERAGE ATTENDANCE

Dayton - 12,765

Xavier - 10,079

Saint Louis - 7,627

Charlotte - 6,184

St. Joseph's - 6,154

Temple - 5,933

Rhode Island - 5,300

UMass - 5,033

Richmond - 4,999

St. Bonaventure - 4,136

Duquensne - 2,786

La Salle - 2,544

George Washington - 2,338

Fordham - 2,037

Taken From this Thread

So only the bottom 4 really suck in attendance 5,000 for a game especially if you pack them in is not really that bad

What is the MVC attendance without the tournament numbers to add as I don't think we get much at the AC tournament site.

[GOSLU68]

Columbus, OH would be good.

Cleveland beats the hell out of Columbus if you are downtown and know where to go. The flats, Rock and Roll museum,

pro arena for Cavaliers, great shoreline and public works buildings to look at.

Coumbus on the other hand has ???

[Pistol]

I like Cleveland as a host site--easy flight, pretty central, and plenty to do. I think it would attract some that maybe couldn't shell out a bunch of bucks to stay in AC. The hotels are definitely cheaper, as are the activities.

I would have to argue that Pitt is not 4 hours from Dayton and Cincy--at least 6-7 hours...I don't think that would be a good place though--probably a lot of big east fans vs. A-10 fans as opposed to a Cleveland State fan would probably like to watch a Xavier v. STJ/SLU/UD game.

I am impressed with the attendance numbers---I'm sure it's X, YouDEE, and SLU in that order. I'd be interested to see how close we are to them though! Hopefully the numbers will be up next year along with a big name non-conference opponent. Maybe RM can get Utah to come in town--they had a good year this past year. That might be a good game--who knows, anything could happen---Isiah Thomas did go to FIU which says a lot!

Agree with everything you said except the middle paragraph. If it takes you 6-7 hours to get from southwest Ohio to Pittsburgh, you are on a Vespa. It's 288 miles, all interstate. It probably takes closer to 4 1/2 hours, which is less than the trip from St. Louis to Dayton or Cincinnati.

[davidnark]

Based on the below conference map, Atlantic City looks like a pretty reasonable location to me. Unfortunately, the map also highlights which one of these is not like the others.

[GOSLU68]

Based on the below conference map, Atlantic City looks like a pretty reasonable location to me. Unfortunately, the map also highlights which one of these is not like the others.

Rather fly to East Coast or visit Atlantic City than take bus trips-leg cramps are no fun at any

Age

[Taj79]

A) Fact: I like the AC.

Fact: I believe a conference tournament should be as neutral as possible.

C) Fact: Anything west of the Pennsylvania state line is in no way central, Cleveland included.

D) Fact: It depends. What depends? It depends on how or why you are nominating locations for tournaments. If you are nominating based on some location that is closer to the larger fan bases of Dayton, X and us, then the mention of Chicago, Indianapolis and Cleveland make sense. If you are nominating a location based on in-house attendance to turn a buck, only one location makes sense and that is Dayton. If you are intent on NOT giving a home court advantage to a team, without even considering Fact B above, then the correct answer for the attendance/buck question is completely wrong for this answer. You'd never go to Dayton in that case. If you are nominating purely on a central location, central to the overall league, the answer is then Pittsburgh in my book.

More issues with locations .... Columbus has Ohio State and not one local team involved in the A10. What could you possibly gather in terms of the casual fan coming to the game? Ohio Staters do NOT root for Dayton. Kent. Cincy. Ohio. Or Toledo for that matter. Cleveland has played host to the MAC before. Again, some upstart league comes calling and not a single local connection? I don't think so. Indy and Chicago have both hosted the Big Ten tourney. A10 interest? Nada. Pittsburgh is also an issue in that its a Big East town. The Dukes are way down the list. Playing in the new Penguins center, as stated by Chris May in AC, might sound great, but we know what that's going to look like --- we saw it at Savvis for all those years.

Again, we are just in the wrong conference geographically speaking. We are in the right conference as far as institutional mentality is concerned. Dayton's attendance is, well, what else you gonna do in Dayton on a cold winter's night? What are you going to do in Dayton on a warm summer's night? Go to Cincy for a Reds game or Kings Island, I guess.

[Pistol]

A) Fact: I like the AC.

Fact: I believe a conference tournament should be as neutral as possible.

C) Fact: Anything west of the Pennsylvania state line is in no way central, Cleveland included.

D) Fact: It depends. What depends? It depends on how or why you are nominating locations for tournaments. If you are nominating based on some location that is closer to the larger fan bases of Dayton, X and us, then the mention of Chicago, Indianapolis and Cleveland make sense. If you are nominating a location based on in-house attendance to turn a buck, only one location makes sense and that is Dayton. If you are intent on NOT giving a home court advantage to a team, without even considering Fact B above, then the correct answer for the attendance/buck question is completely wrong for this answer. You'd never go to Dayton in that case. If you are nominating purely on a central location, central to the overall league, the answer is then Pittsburgh in my book.

More issues with locations .... Columbus has Ohio State and not one local team involved in the A10. What could you possibly gather in terms of the casual fan coming to the game? Ohio Staters do NOT root for Dayton. Kent. Cincy. Ohio. Or Toledo for that matter. Cleveland has played host to the MAC before. Again, some upstart league comes calling and not a single local connection? I don't think so. Indy and Chicago have both hosted the Big Ten tourney. A10 interest? Nada. Pittsburgh is also an issue in that its a Big East town. The Dukes are way down the list. Playing in the new Penguins center, as stated by Chris May in AC, might sound great, but we know what that's going to look like --- we saw it at Savvis for all those years.

Again, we are just in the wrong conference geographically speaking. We are in the right conference as far as institutional mentality is concerned. Dayton's attendance is, well, what else you gonna do in Dayton on a cold winter's night? What are you going to do in Dayton on a warm summer's night? Go to Cincy for a Reds game or Kings Island, I guess.

...And here we go again. Geography means surprisingly little as far as conferences are concerned. Taj and Nark, look up the maps for every other conference on Wikipedia, and the A10 looks like one of the most compact, even with that big red Missouri.

As for casual fans coming to the game, how is AC beneficial for that? Do you think people who have visited that place for one obvious reason have any interest in going to a basketball tournament? Most of those people wouldn't leave their chairs if the casinos were on fire. I watch the games. Boardwalk Hall looks empty for the most part.

You think Dayton's in-house attendance is the only one that's enough to turn a buck for the A10 if they held the conference on their home court? What about SLU and Xavier? Charlotte, too.

The whole point of this thread wasn't that we're trying to re-write geography to say that Ohio is somehow central in the context of the whole A10, it's that Xavier, Dayton, and SLU have collectively pulled half the conference's weight in attendance and X and UD have been the two winningest programs. I think what these teams bring to the conference deserves some consideration when the tournament is selected. Do I think the tournament should be in Dayton? No, Dayton sucks. So does Columbus. Cleveland makes more sense but there are some issues, as you point out. Cincinnati is home of the conference's best program by a long shot, and is a major city with a downtown arena and plenty to do.

AC is a really tough trip for people from the conference's three best-drawing markets, beleive me. I couldn't work out the logistics this year without taking off too many days from work, and even with the new format it will be a challenge.

[Pistol]

What about Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, or Cleveland for the tournament? It satisfies neutrality, a bigger city, easier travel, closer to the biggest fan bases. I don't want to touch off a flame war over cities, but doesn't it seem rational to want the tournament (a) in a bigger market and ( closer to the largest drawing programs? A central location is good for something like the Big 10 or Big 12 that travel well and have huge buy-in from program friends, but I don't see that as the best option here.

Another vote for Cleveland:

[Cowboy]

Fact: I believe a conference tournament should be as neutral as possible.

More issues with locations .... Columbus has Ohio State and not one local team involved in the A10.

-i agree with

-would you consider any team a local team to AC?

[davidnark]

...And here we go again. Geography means surprisingly little as far as conferences are concerned. Taj and Nark, look up the maps for every other conference on Wikipedia, and the A10 looks like one of the most compact, even with that big red Missouri.

I think the A-10 is the right place for SLU to be for a number of reasons that have been discussed at length, but it is eye-popping to see two large states between us and the nearest conference foe.

[Quality Is Job 1]

I think the A-10 is the right place for SLU to be for a number of reasons that have been discussed at length, but it is eye-popping to see two large states between us and the nearest conference foe.

In Major League Baseball, Atlanta used to be in the West while a number of teams further west of Georgia were in the East.

[Pistol]

In Major League Baseball, Atlanta used to be in the West while a number of teams further west of Georgia were in the East.

And the Dallas Cowboys still play in the NFC East after the new divisions were created a few years back. Screw the "rivalry" argument, Dallas gets what they want from the NFL even though the rest of the league was subject to geographic shifts.

[ARbilliken]

Agree with everything you said except the middle paragraph. If it takes you 6-7 hours to get from southwest Ohio to Pittsburgh, you are on a Vespa. It's 288 miles, all interstate. It probably takes closer to 4 1/2 hours, which is less than the trip from St. Louis to Dayton or Cincinnati.

I guess I never really realized how close it was. I grew up in southwest Ohio--off of I-71. I never traveled to Pittsburg so I guess it is closer that I thought. I was thinking about the time to Cleveland, about 3-3.5 hours and to Philadelphia, about 9.5-10 hours. Went through Pitt once on a Greyhound, which I will never do again--they stop too much and take forever. I stand corrected, my apologies.

[Taj79]

To pistol: you missed my point in that I am not limiting things to geography. I am only saying that based on whatever criteria is set for the conference tournament, some things would work. If you wanted to move the thing to support a premise that the better attended schools should be rewarded, you can justify Cleveland, Columbus, Pittsburgh, whatever. Many have argued the Dayton placement due to the place likely selling out for all three or four sessions, depending on whom you listen to. I just can't see anyone getting excited about the A10 coming to any of those three places.

To Cowboy: I would consider the entire south of Jersey local to the Philly schools. Even Gianinni (sp?) who coaches at La Salle had his start at Glassboro State which is now Rowan College in Galssboro, NJ. Southern Jersey has always cottoned (mostly) to the Philly side of things --- the Eagles over the Giants, the Phillies over the Mets and Yankees. WPIC-Channel 6 is based out of Philly and has a Shore Substation in either Ocean City or Atlantic City. The folks I sat with this year were mostly from St. Joe's and in Philly. They came down each night, and even spent a night at their beach house in Ocean City. The goons behind me were Temple idiots one game. Last year, we ended up sitting with the Fordham rowing team (that's about the funniest A10 t-shirt I've ever been privy to!) and they drove down the two hours from NYC for that. So I think AC is local enough for certainly Temple, St. Joes, La Salle (their crowd against us this year was impressive as far as a La Salle crowd goes) and Fordham is close enough. Add in GeeDub (yeah, I know neither of the last two were there this year) and you have a nice collective in the general area. Is it a major reason and lock for the AC then? Absolutely not. But it is central and let's remember this was mostly a Philly dominated league from the outset.

My utmost top priority on my wish list is not only a central states conference, but one that allows for the tourney to be in Indianapolis more times than not. Right now, with the current configuration, that won't fly. I know I also have an internal bias because from here in Baltimore, AC is a breeze. I too wish it were closer to the SLU fan base and really want that to happen. It won't, and while its not the sole outlyer, geography will play a role in it being more times farther away from you all than closer.