DoctorB Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 here it is: (I knew that subject line would work!): Some of the most inane comments on this topic have been casting aspersions on 2 very nice recruiting classes: our juniors and freshmen this year. These are nice classes, and these guys are here to stay, meaning we ought to shut up and see how they do in their 3rd and 4th years (which none of them have had yet). I get really irritated by comments that are sharply critical of these guys. The players on our team are good guys and have excellent talent. Further, a few posters whose names I will omit are just obsessed with player rankings, most of which are just hogwash. An overreliance on so-called "ratings" services is pitiable if not completely ignorant. Why not go back and see how many "blue chip" recruits were on those recent teams at George Mason, Bradley, Butler, or Valparaiso, who made serious noise in the NCAAs? Mid-major teams that have success are hardly made up of stud athletes, and frankly, our core guys probably have more potential than most of the players on George Mason last year-- so there. My point is: though nobody has put it quite this way: I am very happy with our excellent junior and freshmen classes and I expect them to grow and mature a lot over the next few years. These are great recruits who should all stay 4-5 years and contribute. Take our 4 freshmen (including Obi, who redshirted). This is a solid bunch and I am sorry if they were not in anyone's "top 100" or whatever. Frankly, Dustin and Adam are much more highly visible recruits than Ian ever was. It's called coaching, maturity, and development. Think about that. And lay off these guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 I do agree that player development is huge when you don't get big time recruits. That's one reason I am a big believer that we should eventually try to use all of our scholarships, use a few red-shirts and transfers to develop an experienced, mature roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Well said Doc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardball Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 Ace I agree with you totally and have said so in the past. The statement "use all of our scholarships, use a few red-shirts and transfers to develop an experienced, mature roster" is a great way of putting a program together. Not to bring up a bad subject but thats how SIU has done it. They have quality redshirts almost every year that come off red shirt status and help out. Harriston and Brooks were both 5 year players. Weber brought this philosophy with him from Purdue and Lowery continues to use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiphan Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 >Well said Doc. To paraphrase Doc: Drink the Kool-Aid. Don't dare be critical. This board is for positive messages only. Those freshmen and junior classes are the best ever and anyone who thinks otherwise is wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted September 27, 2006 Share Posted September 27, 2006 How about don't be hyper critical of players you've never seen and expect some improvement from those already here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 so why won't you let the guys become experienced and mature before you decide they aren't any good. You have stated that UB can't recruit over and over, don't you think we should let the freshman play a couple of years before we declare them a flop Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 So if Dr. B says those two classes were very good recruiting groups then it has to be true? Is that what I really heard? I am sorry but our juniors are not that good. I am not saying they are duds but none are locked in starters and they should be the heart of our team. The freshmen class - time will tell and I anxiously await seeing them play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 > I am >not saying they are duds but none are locked in starters and >they should be the heart of our team. You could have said the same thing about Fisher and Sloan before the start of their junior season. Maybe all that hard work they put in over the summer will pay off like it did for those guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 3Star - I don't disagree but lets wait until the season is played before we annoint the juniors as good as Sloan and Fisher turned out that is the only point I am trying to make. I agree that kids do mature and can develop into good players as juniors and hope this is what happens for ours. Even if that group turns out to be as good as Sloan and Fisher, you can not say that they are very good recruiting class today maybe in the future but not today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 thats right wait until we see them play to decide if they are good, but yet so many can decide our freshman class id bad before seeing them play even one game. This board confuses me Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 better yet skipper....some posters are willing to judge the 2006-2007 recruiting class at the conclusion of the mid-November 2006 signing period! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 there is some funny stuff that goes on here. Some people contradict themselves so often it's comical. The funniest of all though is how many "insiders" we have posting here. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 of the 12 scholarship players on the current SLU roster....6 (50%) have either redshirted at SLU or attended a 5th-year prep school: Brown > Air Force Academy Prep School Dixon > Fort Union Prep School Liddell > Hargrave Military Prep School Ikeakor > SLU freshman redshirt JJohnson > SLU freshman redshirt Hysak > SLU freshman redshirt On day one, Coach Soderberg stated you win with mature juniors and seniors, particularly redshirted juniors and seniors. ACE, sounds like you and Soderberg are on the same track regarding a mature roster! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 skip....if there was an "insider" he/she wouldn't claim to be an insider! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 Agreed, DOC, a team that stays together for 4 years at a time and feeds in legit D1 players every year, not top 100's, can succeed over time. The key is player development. his year we have to see leaps forward by DP (shot), DB (court sense), and LM (3 pt shot) to reach the goal of the NCAA's. Our big three can't be expected to carry the whole load. Never expect much from frosh, as they will have an adjustment periord. Of course, anything over and above little or nothing is a pleasant surprise. Read KL and TL last year. This year is really more of a test of UB's coaching skills than that of a recruiter. With 3 all conference types this team should be dancing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 Also remember for most college players the jump in thier level of play from soph. to jr. year is huge. Just look at Ian last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 If DP, LM, and DB make an IV type leap from so to jr seasons, we'll be in the sweet 16....guaranteed. That'll will give us 6 all conference players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoctorB Posted September 28, 2006 Author Share Posted September 28, 2006 as always, it is great fun to post a mildly controversil message and then read the responses 24 hours later. HA! It actually brings a smile to tired face--sometimes. Most people are sympathetic to my views, and I appreciate the support. Not surprisingly several are not, and take great pleasure in misreading what is said, or exaggerating it beyond belief. Either reading skills are very poor, or else you have been watching to much bill O'Reilly or other media clowns whose only arguments are based on fabrications. I assume these bashers are uniformly fairly young, feisty, largely disaffected and dissatisfied, and thus bashers of many other things in their lives besides basketball teams, but maybe not. I also love it when some say we should just "ignore" certain posters-- and then go right ahead and engage them. HAHA! General point; I like our recruits, and I like our coaching. I like our general position in the basketball universe and I have a pretty good and sober realization of what it is, unlike some posters. I truly hope we keep progressing but inch by inch it is all a cinch. and, unlike some program slammers, I actually have a full and rich life beyond this board and way beyond Billikens basketball. that means that even though I am a diehard fan, when I am on my deathbed i will not be looking back and feeling cheated that we did not recruit Charlie villanueva or Luke Stemler. Thank God! and I don't like Kool-Aid either-- just ask my students. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 72 - IV is a senior not a junior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Majerus Posted September 29, 2006 Share Posted September 29, 2006 Thanks to Nark for the use of the Billiken Right, but what a move up he made from soph to jr, and we're hoping for similar improvement from this year's jr class. LM is my fav to make that jump, but I'm open for all of them to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRaginCajun Posted September 29, 2006 Share Posted September 29, 2006 Skip, I think you raise a good point. The only thing is waiting to see how guys develop before praising or bashing them does not make for good discussion/argument on a message board. I enjoy drawing out arguments from the very pro SLU fans. I think Danny, Luke, and Dwayne all have the ability to contribute at this level. I am sorry but I have seen nothing in Bryce that makes me expect anything from him in his career. Nobody has seen the likes of Obi, Horace, Adam, or Dustin in an actual college game so it is unfair to really be critical of them. The thing with this board is that we have so many posters who are on extremes and not enough who remain objective. Too many posters sit in the love Brad camp or the hate Brad camp and not enough posters are in that middle ground. People who are overly critical of the program or overly high on the program constantly get bashed and it doesn't make for productive arguments and discussions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRaginCajun Posted September 29, 2006 Share Posted September 29, 2006 UNCA, I am in 100% agreement. I think he was really hampered by his injury prior to last season and I see him as a kid who could really surprise some people. He has shown the willingness to accept a role and he has the ability to be a consistent offensive threat. I am not expecting him to light up the scoreboard, but he should be able to give us someone who is going to knock down some open shots, get to the rack at times, and battles for some put backs. He is a very underrated athlete and he is a fairly quality player all around. I just wish he could speed up his shot a little bit. They always talk about the sophomore slump. If that is indeed the case with our squad, look out. (I guess one could say this could be a bad thing since Tommie and Kevin are going to be sophs, but they play well beyond their years in my opinion). Three juniors to go along with three all-conference quality players. I really like this team because when you look at the competition for minutes a large chunk of that is going to be divided amongst three juniors who have had a chance to play some significant minutes the past two seasons. Lets just hope Adam, Horace, and Obi can give us enough from the power forward position. Who is ready for the season to start? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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