Why I'm against hiring RM

[slufanskip]

1st of all, I don't think it is neccessary to make a big splash. We need a guy who can recruit.

1. I don't like his style of coaching and dealing with players

2. Health issues

3. His past NCAA violations. Which for some reason keep getting brushed under the table. They are worse than just a couple of minor things. It seems obviously clear that RM got a bit too big for his britches and felt the rules didn't apply to him and in turn did as he pleased regardless of the rules. It cost Utah dearly and they were still paying the price through last season.

I can also see there are some advantages. Those are obvious, his record and basketball knowledge are outstanding. It seems he has the ability to force Father B to do things for the program he was previously unwilling to do. I'm not sure many of the things RM will probably get in this contract would be happening if say C. Martin was the new coach. Which imo is a sad statement for Father B. He needs to decide if those things need to be done, if so you do them for whoever the coach is. If not, then you shouldn't be doing them for RM either.

Imo Rick is not SO much better than other options that it is worth putting up with him or risking that he will disregard the rules again. Yes, you can say, "if he does he's gone". but by then it's too late. SLU is on probation and has a rep that we really don't want and may not recover from for quite some time. If the decision was mine, I wouldn't gamble with my integrity and it seems to me, we clearly are.

With all that said ... if RM is hired I will support him as he is the coach at SLU.

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[kingbill]

what's the difference b/n ncaa probation and the state of the program last 5 years? Can't participate in NCAA?? At this point, I'd love to have a club that is NCAA calibre but a rules infraction prevents participation.

against hiring Majerus? come on. in your post you acknowledge Biondi won't make the changes necessary to raise the calibre of the program if a guy like Majerus doesn't make him. so we want Majerus.

MAJERUS IS A DREAM COME TRUE. THIS IS THE MOST INCREDIBLE THING EVER TO HAPPEN TO BILLIKEN BASKETBALL. AT LEAST DURING MY LIFETIME.

$5K donation to SLU is coming out of my pocket if and when Majerus is named headcoach. I guarantee that. Please match me and let's show some real support so we can have a real basketball program.

If we are a top 30 program, how many more student applications do we get a year? Anyone have data or a guess on that? That will help SAT/ACT scores go up, thereby raising the school ranking in US News, thereby leading to even more applications and even higher SAT/ACT scores. Understand the cycle?

THIS IS A DREAM COME TRUE. ANYONE AGAINST HIRING MAJERUS IS A SELF-LOATHING FOOL.

[Schasz]

Skip, your points are well taken, but the probability of SLU becoming big time in college hoops under Majerus (if he is hired and I am still not cetain it will happen) is just too freakin attractive to me...get this done ASAP Fr. Biondi...my heart cannot take too much more of this and I am in a heckuva lot better shape than Rick.

[billiken_roy]

i understand skip's points completely. and to be honest, if slu was in a better position, i would likely agressively defend his points.

that said, i am so tired of starting over and then going through the painstaking slow process of building a program.

majerus brings us national focus immediately.

majerus has been proclaimed by more than one excellent source as one of the best basketball minds in america.

majerus brings someone that can actually force what should have happened 20 years ago. a much bigger investment in the basketball program that might finally be enough to actually approach a top 50 program.

i believe there are few celebrity coaches in america that can bring all those things to table. might not be more than about 10 and guess what. those coaches are coaching at places like north carolina, duke, louisville etc already and would likely come with twice the price tag.

no matter what father biondi thinks about majerus upping the ante. the truth is this is a venture we need to take if we truly want to be an upper echelon program sooner than later.

if that isnt the case, than we shoulda stayed with the soderberg plan of slow build. because the truth is that any one else that might be interested is likely going to start behind where we were 6 weeks ago.

we have to support this. no other options.

[courtside]

> 1st of all, I don't think it is neccessary to make a big

>splash. We need a guy who can recruit.

>

>1. I don't like his style of coaching and dealing with

>players

>2. Health issues

>3. His past NCAA violations. Which for some reason keep

>getting brushed under the table. They are worse than just a

>couple of minor things. It seems obviously clear that RM got

>a bit too big for his britches and felt the rules didn't

>apply to him and in turn did as he pleased regardless of the

>rules. It cost Utah dearly and they were still paying the

>price through last season.

>

> I can also see there are some advantages. Those are

>obvious, his record and basketball knowledge are

>outstanding. It seems he has the ability to force Father B

>to do things for the program he was previously unwilling to

>do. I'm not sure many of the things RM will probably get in

>this contract would be happening if say C. Martin was the

>new coach. Which imo is a sad statement for Father B. He

>needs to decide if those things need to be done, if so you

>do them for whoever the coach is. If not, then you shouldn't

>be doing them for RM either.

>

>Imo Rick is not SO much better than other options that it is

>worth putting up with him or risking that he will disregard

>the rules again. Yes, you can say, "if he does he's gone".

>but by then it's too late. SLU is on probation and has a rep

>that we really don't want and may not recover from for quite

>some time. If the decision was mine, I wouldn't gamble with

>my integrity and it seems to me, we clearly are.

>

> With all that said ... if RM is hired I will support him as

>he is the coach at SLU.

>

>

> Official Billikens.com sponsor of H

>Waldman

>

>Official Sponser of the Stemmler and Ahearn could and would

>have helped club.

I don't agree that SLU would be gambling with its integrity hiring Majerus.

As for your issues with Biondi, well makes sense and that is on Fr. Biondi. Doesn't have anything to do with Majerus. Biondi has had the opportunity to say no. Biondi has many detractors and supporters here and Biondi is a mixed bag. There will always be some people who blindly support anything Biondi because of where SLU was and is now. However these people don't spend time at other schools where things are done very well all the way around.

I don't have concerns with how he deals with players. He is fair with players. Tougher on his star players than role players or walk-ons. He is not there to be the players' friend. He is there coach. He recruits, develops talent, makes sure they take care of schoolwork and supports them during college and well after. He is not going to be their buddy.

Health issues are fair enough. We'll see who else he brings in?....Jeff Strohm, etc....with him.

How many other coaches could SLU hire that would be able to negotiate all of the things Majerus can for the program and athletic department and still want to come to SLU? That list is not very long. SLU would be very fortunate to have Rick, short or long-term.

[Schasz]

Good points, if we get him signed then SLU is lucky that Rick was available and interested. As stated above we are not in the best of bargaining positions because of our recent history and the way the Soderberg firing was handled.

[courtside]

>Good points, if we get him signed then SLU is lucky that

>Rick was available and interested. As stated above we are

>not in the best of bargaining positions because of our

>recent history and the way the Soderberg firing was handled.

Schasz...not Skip perhaps....but there are some people here who live in some sort of reality that Biondi would wake up one day and make the necessary commitments to succeed in men's basketball all on his own. And, there are some people who also think that there is this pool of candidates out there who would be interested in the SLU job that can negotiate all the things for SLU's program that Majerus can. Now, you and I live in a different reality.

[SLUDrew]

I was actually talking to a friend of mine about this yesterday. Some out there (and I grant you it is a small number of people) would rather SLU play it "safe" and hire a Kim Anderson or Jay Spoonhour. These guys would be non-controversial, be company men, and put a pleasant face on SLU basketball. In other words, a continuance of what we have always had; a mediocre, bland, vanilla program that no one under the age of 65 who lives outside of a 25 mile radius of campus, gives a ##### about. I think these are the same guys who think Rex Hudler, Joe McEwing and David Eckstein are the greatest Cardinals of all-time. I think some actually desire that SLU remains the little program that could as opposed to try and be a major player becuase its fun to root for the underdog that works real hard.

Personally, I find this mindset pathetic. I want SLU to be everything it can be and at a school like SLU you only get a chance to hire a Coach of Majerus's status once is a lifetime. I think Biondi realizes the opportunity before him and is doing everything in his power to get this done.

[sp_billiken]

I've done a complete flip due to the timing of this whole thing. It sure didn't take Kentucky very long to come to terms that were a lot higher stakes in terms of total package than this.

If RM REALLY wanted to be here, I think it would be announced by now.

Since it's not, I'm leaning much more toward hiring a lesser-named coach who really wants to be here.

[Schasz]

Courtside,

I might be wrong about this, but surely the hole in the ground and subsequent building going on down at Frost campus had to be part of the reason that Fr. Biondi got religion as far as the hoops program is concerned. I don't live close enough to the situation to know what effect the boosters have had in his recent finding of the Holy Grail.

[kshoe]

"It cost Utah dearly and they were still paying the price through last season."

What exactly did it cost Utah so dearly? Didn't they lose one scholly a year? Was there anything else?

If thats it, I may have to ask if SLU was really on double secret probation these past five years as we NEVER used all 13 of our schollys under Brad.

[courtside]

>"It cost Utah dearly and they were still paying the price

>through last season."

>

>What exactly did it cost Utah so dearly? Didn't they lose

>one scholly a year? Was there anything else?

>

>If thats it, I may have to ask if SLU was really on double

>secret probation these past five years as we NEVER used all

>13 of our schollys under Brad.

Now that is actually funny and something I understand.

(Utah lost one per season for three seasons. )

[davidnark]

nm = no message

[slufanskip]

If you think it's ok to cheat as long as you win, I think you have the wrong fool.

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[slufanskip]

I never thought we should consider Spoonhour or Kim Anderson. I just find it hard to believe that there isn't a coach who can lead us to be successful without NCAA probation hanging over his head. It seems absolutely clear that RM blatantly and knowingly broke the rules.

It looks like it doesn't matter though as RM is almost certain to be our coach. With that decision made, I will support him.

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[slufanskip]

I knew that was coning, and I figured it would be from you. Yes being put on probation hurts a program and imo alot. I'm clearly in the minority though. I hope I'm wrong about RM.

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[NashvilleBilliken]

I agree with some of your points in regard to RM. Although KShoe has a "win at any cost" mentality, I think the majority of fans still want this to be a clean program and expect as much. I'm behind this (potential) hire because I have to think SLU and Biondi made it very clear that we run clean programs. I would imagine one of those bullet points is that cheating won't be tolerated. And I highly doubt RM wants to go out like that. If he's coming back, it's to secure his legacy.

[Billikan]

As you know, I was a big supporter of Brad and I was really opposed to his firing at this time. One of the reasons was that I was sure that we would not get a coach who was any better but it would just be a repeat of Romar--a supposed great recruiter who would be starting over in this area.

For me, the only reason to fire Brad was if we could replace him with a nationally known outstanding coach who would bring significant local and national publicity to SLU while at the same time increasing the interest in sales of tickets--with hefty donations attached--in the new arena. I just did not believe that the University had the money to attract such a coach so I felt like we blew it in firing Brad.

I have seen and heard Majerus on a number of occasions and I think he is-- BY FAR --the best coach currently available in the United States. He is a true genius when it comes to the Xs and Os and his gig with ESPN has increased his national recoginition so we now have the "wow" factor in place to help sell tickets.

For sure, there are some possible negatives, but to me the only real negative is his health. The other things are not significant enough for me to back away. If his health is ok then I think we could be a very good team, even next year. The players are used to Brad when he blows a gasket so I doubt that Rick's tough style and demanding personality will be that big of an issue.

I see this as a complete change of direction for the SLU basketball program. We may fail, but no one--even Roy--can say that we have not invested huge resources in the new arena and the new coaching staff, etc. It is now on the players and the coaches to make it happen. No one can blame the administration any more. For that reason alone, I am glad to see this hire. We will now truly know if we can compete! It should be a fun ride!

[moytoy12]

And this just in, RM hasn't cheated at SLU.

[Westy03]

Very well said

[slufanskip]

should we hire Jim Harrick. He actually won a championship and hasn't cheated at SLU either.

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[moytoy12]

Are you equating Harrick to RM?

RM messed up in the past and a school was penalized for it. I hope that he has learned his lesson and it won't be carried over to SLU. If it happens, the appropriate measures should be carried out, but I say we let him break a rule at SLU before we penalize him.

He wasn't paying for hookers to entertain recruits. He didn't shave points. To my knowledge he didn't have other students doing his players' school work. There are much bigger infractions.

[kshoe]

"Although KShoe has a "win at any cost" mentality"

What are you talking about? Mentioning the fact that the only punishment Utah got was one loss of scholarship = a win at all cost mentality?

With that being said, I don't believe what Majerus did at Utah was all that bad. Buying a kid a hamburger when his dad died, are you kidding me?

No matter what anyone feels, there ARE differences in levels of "cheating". There is the type like Juco kids getting 24 credit hours in one semester, or giving tests like the one Georgia offered which asked how many quarters are in a game. Those are significant problems and shouldn't be ignored. But when you host a barbeque for your players or buy a kid a lunch you shouldn't be lumped in with the real cheaters. There are plenty of holier than now posters on this board that don't see the difference but in a lot of ways its no different than comparing a thief with a speeder. Both are against the law but common sense tells us they aren't the same.

Some times common sense isn't so common when it relates to Billikens.com.

[moytoy12]

So you don't have a win at all cost mentality? And i thought you were a real fan.

[Mobile-iken]

I second that. Billikan you should have started a new thread with that, what do you think Mods?