Sodaburger to Mo State?

[slu72]

Any chance of this happening? He brings an all state guard with him. He's clean. Also, he'd get a yearly shot at his buddy, Fr. Biondi. How much would us Brad Bashers hate losing to him? Seriously though, this would be a good job for UB. He recruits in an area he knows. Kramer would likely excel in the MVC. He's not going to get a BCS job at this stage. Seems to me a good fit. Would MoState take a SLU reject (not meant to sound as harsh as it does)?

[Larry the Legend]

Any chance of this happening? He brings an all state guard with him. He's clean. Also, he'd get a yearly shot at his buddy, Fr. Biondi. How much would us Brad Bashers hate losing to him? Seriously though, this would be a good job for UB. He recruits in an area he knows. Kramer would likely excel in the MVC. He's not going to get a BCS job at this stage. Seems to me a good fit. Would MoState take a SLU reject (not meant to sound as harsh as it does)?

Could be a possibility since Kramer stated that he would love to play for his Dad. This would be a package deal and could be good leverage for Kramer if Hinson were to be fired. However, I still cannot fathom MO St. firing Hinson after one bad year in the last several seasons. Yes, I for one was a Brad basher and would hate losing to him. He does know the area well but as far as his recruiting abilities go, I would not even be scared a bit with him going up against Majerus. Big Rick would destroy Brad in the recruiting battle. In addition, BS was never a good recruiter to begin with.... at least during his time at SLU. Yes, he did land KL and TL but surrounding them with mediocre players did not work out.

[slufanskip]

Any chance of this happening? He brings an all state guard with him. He's clean. Also, he'd get a yearly shot at his buddy, Fr. Biondi. How much would us Brad Bashers hate losing to him? Seriously though, this would be a good job for UB. He recruits in an area he knows. Kramer would likely excel in the MVC. He's not going to get a BCS job at this stage. Seems to me a good fit. Would MoState take a SLU reject (not meant to sound as harsh as it does)?

I'd be shocked if Mo State hires a coach SLU just fired, regardless of whether he could do the job or not ... just my opinion

[NashvilleBilliken]

Any chance of this happening? He brings an all state guard with him. He's clean. Also, he'd get a yearly shot at his buddy, Fr. Biondi. How much would us Brad Bashers hate losing to him? Seriously though, this would be a good job for UB. He recruits in an area he knows. Kramer would likely excel in the MVC. He's not going to get a BCS job at this stage. Seems to me a good fit. Would MoState take a SLU reject (not meant to sound as harsh as it does)?

I can't see it happening. Too close to St. Louis and i'm sure MSU fans are aware of his struggle here. He would be walking into a tough situation. I think he needs to leave the area and start fresh. Other than that, I think Mo State would be a good fit.

[brianstl]

I can't see it happening. Too close to St. Louis and i'm sure MSU fans are aware of his struggle here. He would be walking into a tough situation. I think he needs to leave the area and start fresh. Other than that, I think Mo State would be a good fit.

I hear Bennett is the front runner for the IU job. I think Brad would be smart to follow him there. The money won't be bad as an asst coach at IU. It would give him a reset on his career and later on he might get another shot like Jankovich did at ISU at a decent head coaching job.

[Box and Won]

I'd be shocked if Mo State hires a coach SLU just fired, regardless of whether he could do the job or not ... just my opinion

I'm with you. I can't imagine that the MO State fans would be too thrilled.

[moytoy12]

I'd be shocked if MSU hired Sodie. If SLU didn't want Sodie when they opened a new building why would MSU?

He was a good guy that got maximum effort from most of his players, but couldn't recruit and was generally too stubborn to make in-game adjustments.

If Sodie gets the job, good for him because I think that is above his level of aptitude.

[saluki762]

The opening at MSU scares me as a SIU and SLU fan. We are always competing for the same recruits and getting a good coach in there makes it tougher for both schools. MSU has a lot going for them. Big Money doners, new facilities and even the recent name change all help their program. That said, their AD seems pretty inept so maybe they do boner this hire and get someone who is no better than Barry.

[Pistol]

Any chance of this happening? He brings an all state guard with him. He's clean. Also, he'd get a yearly shot at his buddy, Fr. Biondi. How much would us Brad Bashers hate losing to him? Seriously though, this would be a good job for UB. He recruits in an area he knows. Kramer would likely excel in the MVC. He's not going to get a BCS job at this stage. Seems to me a good fit. Would MoState take a SLU reject (not meant to sound as harsh as it does)?

Dude, I posed this question in the "Hinson Fired" thread- way to steal my thunder.

Seriously, though, I agree with you that this makes some sense - he's a pretty good fit on paper and comes loaded with a bonus recruit who would be a great player in the Valley. The only problem is it seems that the decisions at MSU right now are coming from big-money outside pressure and I don't know if they'd settle for a guy we let go. Even if it were another Valley school (except SIUC), this would be a lot more likely. I still don't think it's out of the question and a lot of the names being tossed around for this job so far are reaches (it would take ridiculous bucks to get a "name" coach down to Springfield), so they're going to have to interview the next tier of guys who have some solid D1 experience elsewhere and have either been let go by a bigger program or are looking to jump from a smaller one.

The 'too close to home' factor for the Bears faithful is the only thing that could keep this from being a potentially good situation for both sides. I think Brad would have a lot more success recruiting his type of guys in the Valley and could stay at one of those schools for a long time and build a strong program.

[moytoy12]

I think Brad would have a lot more success recruiting his type of guys in the Valley and could stay at one of those schools for a long time and build a strong program.

why? He wasn't able to recruit while at a school comparable with MVC schools. Didn't he pass up/not pursue a lot of MVC recruits? What makes anyone think that he would have the aptitude to see the ability in the overlooked high school recruit, which is the type of kid that seems to be very successful in the MVC? Brad rarely, if ever, showed this ability at SLU.

[NashvilleBilliken]

Didn't he pass up/not pursue a lot of MVC recruits?

Yep. That was pretty much everybody's problem with him. He was trying to recruit players he didn't have a chance at getting. I agree with Pistol on this one. While it appears he was in over his head at SLU and the A-10, I think he would be on par with a lot of Valley Schools. What kind of players go to the Valley? Top 200-300...That's right in Brad's wheelhouse.

You think SLU is like a Valley School? How so?

[moytoy12]

Yep. That was pretty much everybody's problem with him. He was trying to recruit players he didn't have a chance at getting. I agree with Pistol on this one. While it appears he was in over his head at SLU and the A-10, I think he would be on par with a lot of Valley Schools. What kind of players go to the Valley? Top 200-300...That's right in Brad's wheelhouse.

You think SLU is like a Valley School? How so?

I think SLU is like a Valley School in terms of the quality of basketball players it could recruit under the Sodie regime. For example, SLU was roughly on par with the in terms of competitive advantages and disadvantages with the middle and upper tier MVC schools. Thus, Sodie could have landed the players in the top 200-300 at SLU just as easily as say Bradley. However, he didn't have a nose for these types of players and I don't see how that would change at MSU.

[ACE]

Look at it from their perspective. BS has really done nothing to deserve that job. During his tenure here, several regional and Valley schools became better than us, while we remained stagnant or got worse. Also, BS doesn't exactly create a lot of buzz. I think that's probably what they are going for. As for Kramer, I heard on the radio recently (I forget which station) and they were saying they were surprised how little attention Kramer was attracting from the Valley schools at the moment. The one school where it looked like there was some mutual interest was LaSalle. I'm sure Kramer is a very nice player, but not the kind of player that a good program would consider for a player/head coach "package" deal. Not the player who is a real difference maker. Now if BS had a son like Kevin Love, then it might be a different story and it would help him land a quality head coaching job. I wish BS the best, but he's not going to get a job as good as MSU right now. He'll likely have to go back to being an assistant before getting a crack at a head coaching job again. Perhaps he could still land a head job in a conference like the Ohio Valley or Big South, but I would guess assistant would be most likely now.

[NashvilleBilliken]

I think SLU is like a Valley School in terms of the quality of basketball players it could recruit under the Sodie regime. For example, SLU was roughly on par with the in terms of competitive advantages and disadvantages with the middle and upper tier MVC schools. Thus, Sodie could have landed the players in the top 200-300 at SLU just as easily as say Bradley. However, he didn't have a nose for these types of players and I don't see how that would change at MSU.

I pretty much agree with that (luckily it has all changed). I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he would learn from his mistakes. If he was unable to see why he was fired, then I would agree with you. I think he's a little smarter than that. Plus, Brad's problem generally wasn't signing guards. It was signing big men. And the Valley isn't a league known for it's big guys.

Either way, I still don't think he gets the job.

[moytoy12]

I pretty much agree with that (luckily it has all changed). I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he would learn from his mistakes. If he was unable to see why he was fired, then I would agree with you. I think he's a little smarter than that. Plus, Brad's problem generally wasn't signing guards. It was signing big men. And the Valley isn't a league known for it's big guys.

Either way, I still don't think he gets the job.

Good points. I ultimately agree with you; I don't think he gets the job.

[Pistol]

Good points. I ultimately agree with you; I don't think he gets the job.

I also think it's a long shot that they even interview him, but I do think he'd be good there. At SLU, there was pressure to land a higher-caliber kind of player. Not to continue to beat a dead horse, but this is why he'd pass on a kid like Ahearn for a kid like Clarke. Clarke had definite upside and didn't pan out. He showed flashes in high school and practice and even in a couple games (at Georgia Tech, for example) that he had some serious ability. He just never got his mind right, never matured, never fit in, and never worked hard to step up his game.

Ahearn was more of a sure thing, but you knew where his limits where. What he achieved at MSU was about the cap of what he could do- best case scenario. He may not have gotten the free reign he had at MSU had he come to SLU because he was smallish, not particularly tough, and had a ton of work to do on defense (never was a great defender, even as a senior). That may have held him back a lot especially as a freshman because those are Brad's hot buttons. We might not have seen Ahearn develop the same way, who knows. He would have been good, no doubt, but I would guess his numbers would have been different.

Point is, Brad beat himself at recruiting. He wanted the top level of recruits, missed on them, and waited too long or passed on a lot of the reasonable under-the-radar kids or late bloomers that would have accepted a SLU offer. At a school like MSU, he's not in a conference like CUSA where Cincinnati, Memphis, Louisville, and Marquette were getting top-notch talent. There isn't the expectation in the Valley that they'll get better than 3-star talent. They know they have to find the hidden gems and develop programs to surprise the big boys when they get the chance. SLU has constantly been stuck in the in-between place, not able to run with the big dogs yet but not interested in getting stuck in mid-major hell. Brad never found a way to recruit from that spot and build the program out of it.

I think he's a good coach who could find more success recruiting the Valley. I think the small-town kids who wind up at Valley schools would be easier to sell on a system. I think he made some mistakes at SLU but doesn't have too much pride to learn from them. I think he has a very Midwestern personality that would help him fit in well in the cities that make up the Valley. The only problem I see is that he looks like a SLU reject to Valley fans and that just won't do for them.

[moytoy12]

I also think it's a long shot that they even interview him, but I do think he'd be good there. At SLU, there was pressure to land a higher-caliber kind of player. Not to continue to beat a dead horse, but this is why he'd pass on a kid like Ahearn for a kid like Clarke. Clarke had definite upside and didn't pan out. He showed flashes in high school and practice and even in a couple games (at Georgia Tech, for example) that he had some serious ability. He just never got his mind right, never matured, never fit in, and never worked hard to step up his game.

Ahearn was more of a sure thing, but you knew where his limits where. What he achieved at MSU was about the cap of what he could do- best case scenario. He may not have gotten the free reign he had at MSU had he come to SLU because he was smallish, not particularly tough, and had a ton of work to do on defense (never was a great defender, even as a senior). That may have held him back a lot especially as a freshman because those are Brad's hot buttons. We might not have seen Ahearn develop the same way, who knows. He would have been good, no doubt, but I would guess his numbers would have been different.

Point is, Brad beat himself at recruiting. He wanted the top level of recruits, missed on them, and waited too long or passed on a lot of the reasonable under-the-radar kids or late bloomers that would have accepted a SLU offer. At a school like MSU, he's not in a conference like CUSA where Cincinnati, Memphis, Louisville, and Marquette were getting top-notch talent. There isn't the expectation in the Valley that they'll get better than 3-star talent. They know they have to find the hidden gems and develop programs to surprise the big boys when they get the chance. SLU has constantly been stuck in the in-between place, not able to run with the big dogs yet but not interested in getting stuck in mid-major hell. Brad never found a way to recruit from that spot and build the program out of it.

I think he's a good coach who could find more success recruiting the Valley. I think the small-town kids who wind up at Valley schools would be easier to sell on a system. I think he made some mistakes at SLU but doesn't have too much pride to learn from them. I think he has a very Midwestern personality that would help him fit in well in the cities that make up the Valley. The only problem I see is that he looks like a SLU reject to Valley fans and that just won't do for them.

Not having the ability to gauge under-the-radar talent is not a mistake it's a deficiency and I don't know if its so easily corrected as you and Nash suggest.

[Pistol]

Not having the ability to gauge under-the-radar talent is not a mistake it's a deficiency and I don't know if its so easily corrected as you and Nash suggest.

I don't think his problem was in detection; I think it was in his hesitation. He knew who the players were and what they could do. He took too long and missed his chances. This is something he's had a lot of time to reflect on now and it is an easy fix compared to just not being able to assess talent.

[Pistol]

I don't think his problem was in detection; I think it was in his hesitation. He knew who the players were and what they could do. He took too long and missed his chances. This is something he's had a lot of time to reflect on now and it is an easy fix compared to just not being able to assess talent.

There are a few exceptions to this, notably Justin Johnson, Horace Dixon, and Dustin Maguire. I don't think any of them have the level of talent needed to succeed in CUSA or the A10. They were primarily back-up plans anyway, though (back to my previous post).

You could make the argument for Obi as well, but he was getting some high major interest before he blew out his knee. Brad saw him as an injury risk with a potential big upside if he could return to form. Had he not been hurt, he might have wound up with some Big 12 offers. The knee injury was killer and he never worked his way out of it; work ethic became his problem after that (vanishing from campus, skipping class, skipping rehab).

[3star_recruit]

The major recruiting problem with Brad with not talent detection, IMO, it was the inability to sign enough players. Half of the players at virtually any program you can name fail to live up to the hype, whether it's because of grades, Chuck Knoblauch disease, injury, etc. But when you go to season after season with only 11 guys and half of them don't live up to the hype, you get stuck with these 6 man rotations.

[Clock_Tower]

I pretty much agree with that (luckily it has all changed). I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he would learn from his mistakes. If he was unable to see why he was fired, then I would agree with you. I think he's a little smarter than that. Plus, Brad's problem generally wasn't signing guards. It was signing big men. And the Valley isn't a league known for it's big guys.

Either way, I still don't think he gets the job.

Don't give Brad too much credit for guards such as Dwayne Polk, Dustin McGuire, Danny Brown, Darren Clarke, Anthony Drejaj. These have hardly been that good of guards to go along with TL and KL.

[jjray]

The major recruiting problem with Brad with not talent detection, IMO, it was the inability to sign enough players.

Are not those two problem related? He passed on a long list of players when we had open scholarships available who went on to contribute elsewhere. For example, why Soderberg passed on Josh Harrellson with all the open scholarships and thin front court is beyond me. That's poor talent evaluation. That's why he was fired.

[slufanskip]

The major recruiting problem with Brad with not talent detection, IMO, it was the inability to sign enough players. Half of the players at virtually any program you can name fail to live up to the hype, whether it's because of grades, Chuck Knoblauch disease, injury, etc. But when you go to season after season with only 11 guys and half of them don't live up to the hype, you get stuck with these 6 man rotations.

I don't get it, even the people that say he would be a good fit, don't see him getting the type players that would take Mo State to another level. They see him getting good "valley type" players. If that's what they wanted, they wouldn't be making a change. Hinson has had them consistently in the top half of the valley ... It seems obvious to me, they want a guy that can take them to the next level. I like Brad, and hope he finds his place and get's another shot at a good school, but at this point what would make anyone think he can do better than what Hinson is getting fired for doing .... If in fact he gets fired.

[NashvilleBilliken]

Don't give Brad too much credit for guards such as Dwayne Polk, Dustin McGuire, Danny Brown, Darren Clarke, Anthony Drejaj. These have hardly been that good of guards to go along with TL and KL.

Anothony Drejaj is playing professionally. Danny Brown is the third best guard on this team behind 2 all conference performers. Not bad.

[Pistol]

I don't get it, even the people that say he would be a good fit, don't see him getting the type players that would take Mo State to another level. They see him getting good "valley type" players. If that's what they wanted, they wouldn't be making a change. Hinson has had them consistently in the top half of the valley ... It seems obvious to me, they want a guy that can take them to the next level. I like Brad, and hope he finds his place and get's another shot at a good school, but at this point what would make anyone think he can do better than what Hinson is getting fired for doing .... If in fact he gets fired.

Who is going to be able to get the players that would take MSU to the next level? Even if Knight were there, he wouldn't suddenly be getting 4- and 5-star recruits to go to Springfield. Same with the Spoons. It would take one of the biggest name coaches in the country to get those kids to go there over major programs. And even then, I would suspect it would take less-than-legal recruiting to get that caliber of player. The most successful teams in the Valley (SIUC, Creighton) have done it with Valley-type players.

Even the Valley's NBA talent- Kyle Korver is a gym rat from Pella, Iowa and Patrick O'Bryant, a very late bloomer out of Blaine High School in Oskaloosa, Iowa- would be considered Valley-type players as recruits; the Valley programs don't compete with high major programs for talent.