VTIME Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 Saint Joseph's lost Dwayne Jones to the draft and now returns only two players who averaged more than 4.3 ppg in Chet Stachitas and Dwayne Lee. I mention Saint Joe's because I was expecting Dwayne Jones to be the top returning player in the conference along with Pops Mensah-Bonsu. Both entered the draft and only Pops pulled out. George Washington beat Michigan State, who went on to the final four and a disappointing, but talented Maryland team, but however seem to have trouble knocking off Xavier. George Washington returns a talented cast, only losing TJ Thompson to graduation. Xavier returns a balance scoring attack that overachieved after losing Romain Sato and Lionel Chalmers to the NBA. They return 6 players who averaged at least 6 ppg. Along with SLU, I believe it will be a 4 team race for the A10 crown and the thing that gives SLU a slight edge is their defense, now that they have the offensive talents to compliment the defense. SLU's bigs Voyoukas, , Ikeafor, Johnson, and Newborne matchup well with the other bigs in the conference. Our backcourt though young is as highly touted as any backcourt in the conference as well. I fully expect Liddell to compete for and/or win Newcomer of the Year and Freshman of the Year honors in the conference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLURadioBoy Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I like your enthusiasm, but I think it'll probably be another year until SLU realistically challenges for the A-10 title. I think our guards need one more year under their belts and then we'll really be a force to be reckoned with in the conference. I hope you're right though. I would love for SLU to be in the top 4 next year. "Praises we sing, to you our alma mater, Praise to the white and blue. Our hymn shall ring, in tribute strong to you, We hail Saint Louis U." Official Billikens.com sponsor of Andrew Latimer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTIME Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 Our guards dont necessarily need another year. Experience is overrated, if you can ball, you can ball. Guys are coming in for one year and leaving for the pros the next year. The guys are more ready to play right out of high school than ever before. They can compete right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenmetz Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I've never seen paper win a conference title. We haven't seen a full intrasquad practice or scrimmage so talk is just that. It's good that we're making progress off the court in recruiting, but once we see the product take the floor in October/November, I'm not ready to wave that Conference Champs banner in the B.E. Center just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 A team that will most likely start two frosh, two sophs, a junior? Experience counts for a lot in D1 ball. 18-19 year olds playing against 20-23 year olds have a lot of things to learn about the game that are different from HS and AAU ball like travel, living on the road, studies, weight room time,media exposure, etc. The demands on a D1 athlete are unlike anything these kids have faced before. Not to mention they have to learn the disciplined style that UB coaches....big adjustment V time....big. Also, you left out Charlotte and Dayton from your list of contenders. Don't want to be negative here or dampen your enthusiasm for SLU hoops, but let's be real. If this team goes .500 this year I'll be impressed. Now as for 2006-07, I'm thinking if TL, KL, DP, DB (who many think is the sleeper of this bunch)live up to their hype, IO makes a big leap forward and Obi recovers completely....a dance invite should be expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_arete Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 You can show drastic improvement in a one-year time period. I think we should aim higher than .500 this year. I do think a NIT appearance is a reasonable goal, but I agree that it would be a stretch to consider us legitimate title contenders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTIME Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 Who is the other sophomore you expect to be starting? Also, I saw in 2003 a team that started two freshman, two sophomores and a senior win the national championship. One player can turn a program around. Guys ARE coming in not only ready to play every year, but being a star for that one year and then leaving. Liddell may not be ready to leave after one year, but he certainly could be a highly productive player. I think the Fab 5 showed how far inexperience can get you. You guys saw what Larry Hughes did for SLU, and Tommie Liddell is our best recruit since Larry, he will make us a contender for the A10 right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I look at our roster and I don't see one player as a likely candidate for the 1st or 2nd all-conference teams. Yet you've got teams like Fordham who are not only bringing back a player who was all-conference as a freshman (14.9 ppg 8.6 rpg), but another kid in the same class who averaged 13.5 ppg. Fordham was 8-8 last year. UMass has a returning all-conference player (15.4 ppg 7.8 rp) and a strong recruiting class. They were 9-7. We won 9 games all of last year and we lost our two leading scorers. Expecting an NIT bid is just setting oneself up for disappointment. I think we will be better, but not 8 games better. I think some of us are underestimating the level of talent in the A-10, top to bottom. This isn't the MAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I'm sorry I didn't realize TL was our version of Carmello Anthony....jeez, give these guys a chance V time and read 3 star's post for an intelligent assessment of where we are at this point in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesycow Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 ...there's been one year that a frosh singlehandedly carried a team to the title, and VTIME is not only treating it like the norm, he's already crowned Liddell as the next carmello. yeesh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 Good post 3 star...hope V-time reads it and comes back to earth. I thought the Fordham program was hanging on by it's fingernails? Guess not. Do we play them this year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 it's also not last year's cusa. all i know is that we could have easily won 9-10 games more with a couple of possessions. i would hope lisch and liddell are worth a couple of possessions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_arete Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 by many pundits. This conference is not that much better than the MAC or the MVC in my opinion. This conference only got three bids last year and the inclusion of Charlotte will not boost up their profile that much. This conference should be between 8th-11th next year, no better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTIME Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 It was one year that a freshman lead the team to a crown, but it wasnt the first time a freshman has took a team from mediocre to very, good. Syracuse didnt even have a great regular season that year, but a spectacular postseason. Every year freshman are doing big things like Drew Neitzel, Rajon Rondo, Marvin Williams, Daniel Gibson, LaMarcus Alridge, Jawann McClellan, Malik Hairston, etc. You know longer have to wait on freshman. College teams are lucky it they get the freshman at all with the NBA scouts hanging out in high school gyms. These two freshman make SLU compete for the conference title immediately. .500 would be acceptable, but at the same time disappointing. 18-20 wins is realistic in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I'm not willing to go as far as Vtime ... but I think we will be better than many of you expect. Liddell is not a normal fresh with a year of prep. He is more like a soph. Ian with a year under his belt will be a force in the A-10. We also have a talented bunch of Soph's to go along with Tommie and Ian. IMO they key will be our 4. Can VN make the improvement we have seen other JC's make betwwen their jr and sr years? Will JJ finally step up? Will Obi help at all. I lean towards thinking VN his going to have a good year. I'm not that worried about our freshman. I hope to see TL, KL, and Dwayne starting as guards along with VN and IV inside. If one of our freshman don't come through or progresses slower than we hoped we still have DB and LM. I think we just have to many options not to have good guard play. You can't look at DB, LM and DP 's performance from the beginning of last year you have to look at the way they were playing at the end and figure they will all be even a little more improved. Look at the guard combinations we can have on the floor. DP, KL, TL DP, TL, DB TL, KL, LM ... you get my point. Again I see the 4 as the key. If one of our options step up then I think we will be pretty good ... if not ... who knows. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 the A-10 had 4 NCAA bids and two teams made the Elite 8. the league is not overated and historically has proven to be considerably better than the MVC or MAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 "This conference is not that much better than the MAC or the MVC in my opinion." There aren't any Curtis Withers, Bryant Dunstons or Rashaun Freemans in the MAC. There are good guards in all the mid-major conferences. What makes the A-10 a cut above in most years is the presence of 6'8/6'9 athletic power players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p diddy Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 collectively, our perimeter game has a chance to be the best in a decade when we had scott, claggs, H and carl turner. with the corps of tommie, kevin, dwayne, danny, luke, AD (to be replaced by dustin), we can compete for an a-10 title with that group. the key is the continued development of ian and hopeful development of obi. i saw enough of ian during the second half of his sophomore year to think that he can be an all-conference caliber player for the next two years. if he takes the next step with the guards we have, look out. it's tough to judge obi because we haven't see him yet and he's coming off an injury and year layoff. but i like the idea of having a 6'8" 245-pound power forward with a lot of skills playing alongside ian if he's ready to do that. having him for four years is huge. you still have bryce for three and jj for two more. what a like about this whole scenario is that the pieces are finally being put in place for success over the long haul and not just a one-year wonder type of deal. we've got a lot of talented kids who are going to be together for two and three years with good young players coming in behind them (maguire, hopefully leon powell, little sodes etc...). a good nucleus of players is being put together, staring with solid local talent. brad just cannot repeat the mistakes that he made during his first few years of the job. he is now starting to put himself in a position where he does not have to take "risks" out of desparation. what made illinois so tough was that they had basically the same starting five for two years and three of those five started together for a third year when cook was a senior. that is how you win when you don't have the blue-chip assembly line going. bad boyz for life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 If VN does anything this year I will be happy. If he is as mediocre as last year he needs to take a seat for JJ and Obi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 As a longtime follower of the A10, the league is generally better than it's preseason Out of Conference record and OOC RPI, as its teams have historically played, year in and year out, the toughest non-conference schedule of any league. I believe the league decided to revisit that philosphy at it's recent annual meeting in Florida. Size wise there are some good big men, though not as many as in the Big East, but Temple is as big as any team in the country. They go 7'2", 6'11", 6'10" up front. 6'9" Rashawn Freeman of UMass is a stud and Fordham has some young topflight talent with size returning. GW has a very balanced and veteran front line and is also being bolstered by 6'9" LSU transfer Regis Kounja who become elegible at end of December. Xavier probably has the deepest front court talent. The top teams will be GW, Xavier, Temple, Charlotte and Fordham. St. Joes will be good if 6'11" Dwayne Jones decides not to sign if drafted by the NBA and return for his final year, though the graduation of Pat Carrol is a huge loss to them. UMass is a wildcard but with Freeman and some of their other returning players plus a new coach, they could be tough. Dayton will be pretty good but not great as the loss of Treant Meachan who transferred to Illinois really hurts. Don't expect much from Duquense or St. Bona. With Steve Smith pulling out of the NBA draft coupled with an excellent caoch at LaSalle, they are a tough out for a lot teams when playing in Philadelphia but not so hard to beat at home. Smith is the best all around front line player in the league and can single handidly lead them to victory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLURadioBoy Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 The deadline for withdrawing from the NBA draft expired last Tuesday. Players have no choice, but to stay in now and see what happens. Jones is no longer eligible to play at St. Joe's if he remained in the draft. In baseball, you're allowed to not sign if you get drafted and go back to school. In basketball, you are not. Thanks for the A-10 info though! "Praises we sing, to you our alma mater, Praise to the white and blue. Our hymn shall ring, in tribute strong to you, We hail Saint Louis U." Official Billikens.com sponsor of Andrew Latimer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenmetz Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 A comparison of Liddell to either Webber, Rose, Howard, King or Jackson is rediculous. We'll never see a starting 5 like that again in collegiate basketball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 actually, i think liddell resembles jalen rose quite a bit. maybe better as a freshman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VTIME Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 didnt compare them, just said its happened before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 To add to my summary of the legaue's big men I want to also mention Rashawn Freeman's back-up at UMass, 6'11" 350 pound (at least) Jake "Big Deli" Salovski. He is huge, can't be moved once he establishes position and though he doesn't run very fast he has soft hands and a nice touch around the absket. He'll be a sophomore and he's the biggest player in the league since Temple's 6'11" 400 pound Ron Rollerson played about 3 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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