slufanskip Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Just saw a blurb on ESPN about Maryland ... 3 for their last 36 from 3. Maybe they need Drejaj and Polk to shoot for them and bring their average up. Sorry to bring up Marquette ... but I saw in the USA Today that Travis Deiner is in the leaders in ppg and assts. I hadn't really paid attention but he is having one hell of a year. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Not tonight at Memphis so far...as the Tigers are up by 16 at the half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 they looked pitiful. i think they had 60 something turnovers. seriously, if that is best genius crean can come up with for an offense, is he ever overated. lockerroom before the game: crean: ok, on offense, everyone get out of the way and travis you score. travis: but coach, cant the guys help some? crean: i never planned for that. never in my wildest dreams would i have thought i would watch a calipari coached team and root for them, but last night i found myself pulling for memphis to win. thanks to our buddies from marquette who visited here and our two faced one who ridiculed us on the marquette board, i have apparently become a full fledged marquette hater now. even over a cheating underachieving program like memphis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Wow Roy''. To root for Calipari and his "student athletes",man you must have a lot of hate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 i know. my wife sat there in stunned silence as i was cheering dieners misses and turnovers. she finally said, "i thought you hated that calipari guy?" i turned to her and said, i do, but i hate marquette fans more and nothing makes me happier right now than to see marquette anguish. she got up, left the room to go watch e.r. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taj79 Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Frankly, I've never been impressed with a Deiner anywhere .... our Drew, DePaul's Drake or even Marquette's Travis. I think it comes back to the sum of the parts being greater than the individuals ... Travis was a nice compliment to Wade. But that team ran on Wade much as ours did with Hughes. Jackson was a good compliment and so too were Merritt, Blankston, and all theothes. But take away the lead and the parts all going back to being normal. You don't see Steve Novak doing the same crap he did with Wade there. He becomes a soft 6'10" player shooting a three .... can you say Chris Braun? Travis is a good to above-good player .. I just don't hink he's all that some of the pundits make him out to be. And given my grading system I'd even rank him ahead of JFisher as a true PG. But he's only great when the parts around him are of equal or greater value. And in the college game, I think that is the athletic guy ... the Hughes or the Wade or the Anthony. I am really hoping Liddell is that kind of guy. With that kind of guy, even the coach becomes a "genius" .... because he can put him out there. The real idiots are the ones that, even with that kind of player, still can't win ..... which is spelled C-A-L-I-P-A-R-I. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobile-iken Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Did the Memphis player that assaulted the girl play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 hunt didnt even dress. and the other starting guard, rice, sat out most of the game after marquette broke his nose. memphis didnt win as much as marquette sucked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobile-iken Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 I think you're wrong about Travis...He will be an NBA starting point guard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwyjibo Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Marquette is a good team that probably played too soft a schedule. I won't be rooting against them. Calipari has some talent but . . . well, let's just say even his allies eventually jump ship. http://www.nbcactionnews.com/kshb/sports/a...3464948,00.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 calipari has the most talent in the league. he is a horrible coach. but there is no denying his recruiting "methods" work. crean has diener trying to do too much. imo, deiner is as good of a point guard as there is in the country, but to make him out to be a a score first point guard is a mistake. as taj says, he was the perfect compliment to wade, taking advantage of those double on wade to get open shots and opps, but as the focus guy, he is obviously forcing too much. i would have thought the mason kid, who is extemely athletic, would have stepped up more by now, but either he doesnt get it, or crean just isnt utilizing him right. also, i wasnt all that impressed with the inside big guys that marquette brought in. seems like they are subscribing to the same slow offensive linelike mentality that soderberg is recruiting for the inside. marquette is very beatable imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 he's probably near what luke ridenour is and he starts for the sonics. i think he is as good as the little showboat point guard that is at toronto, rafer alston. the key will be getting picked by the right team. he isnt an obvious starter imo. he needs to be in the right place at the right time. if he goes to some team already set at point guard, he could very easily get lost. at this point in time, i wouldnt bet that diener is a first round pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taj79 Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 ...Mac but I don't count being an NBA point guard as being any different than what he was in his glory year with Wade. Deiner can distribute the ball but as broy points out, I don't think he's that good as a scorer. Can he do it? Sure. But he should not be the main man. Frankly, I think he'll get run over as a point in the NBA by the likes of most of the talent up there. But I would have thought the same about Hinrich and he seems to be doing well at Chicago. Same with Ridenour and he's doing okay until hurt. If you follow my rants and raves, you'll know that success in the NBA means nothing to me. Don't watch it, don't support it, don't care. I actually could spend more time watching "The Cheap Seats" and "Most extremem Elimination Challenge" than the NBA. I know I watch PTI every day ..... Hey .. who's our Deiner lover .... didn't I see Drew onthe DePaul bench as an assistant during the UC/DePaul game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 drew is indeed a depaul grad asst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUAvtr Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 And the Oscar goes to!........Ryan Amoroso! Anybody notice last night, after every foul called again Amoroso, he tried to act all innocent and shocked that he was called for a foul, after he blatently went over the back and/or hacked/slashed an opposing player, or him flopping to the ground every 30 seconds to try and force a call. Gee, I can't wait 'til he comes here to play; probably end up like Cincy where the Bills will be called every time this guy decides to put on one of his acts! Sorry to get off the subject where this thread was starting to go, but I just had to point out this guy. Maybe he should be a theatre major instead of whatever he's studying there. "It's a 106 miles to Chicago...we have a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses.....HIT IT!" Blues Brothers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Wow, it was one game for both teams. Some big judegements on just one game. I certainly didn't fly off the handle when Louisville lost to Houston when I saw it, or when DePaul waxed Notre Dame or got waxed at Cinci if I just watched one game. Memphis had been playing poorly, and at some point with their talent was going to put to gether a big game and they did. How about crediting them first? Marquette did play a bad first half, got down big, played a better second half, but got down too much. Memphis has a lot of problems but has the talent to be an NCAA team. Only Arizona from what I have seen has defended Marquette as well. Take away the pick and roll sets with Diener and Novak and force the others to beat you. Not sure why other teams don't defend them this way. I would agree Mason is not a superstar yet and may never be. He is a nice player, a typical improving Soph who will probably be getting better and better next two years, but no he isn't a Dwyane Wade impact player in his first two years,(Wade only played two years, one more than Hughes) has too many lapses. I would disagree with Mac, Diener is 13th in the country in scoring and is a scorer. He can shoot it, from 3 or mid range or on drive, and he is almost a 90% ft shooter, who knows getting to the line is important. I think he just had a bad game. I think he will be a mid to late second round pick. Hinrich? I always thought he would do well in NBA. ever see him up close? he is a big dude who could always score because he can shoot, has size and athleticism. His question was he willing to play point and distribute and handle the ball? Both he and rdnour are much taller than Diener and can throw it down if they have too. Diener would be more appropriately compared to a Steve Nash(obviously I am not literally comparing them on results), ...I think he has a place in the NBA. Comparing Novak to Chris Braun is laughable imo. Watch more games. If you just watched Wade based on his games vs SLU people would say he wasn't that good, and a LOT of people here did. Get a larger sample of the other teams, especially conference teams. For example, Diener has to score this year, if Marquette wants to win, period. They do not have developed big men on their team. So, Marquette runs endless perimeter screens for Diener and Novak, because the three is like a lay up for them. Marquette has a big time recruiting class for next season, but for this year, Diener needs to score for them. I actually am impressed even more by him because not only does he get 20 plus a game, but his turnover ratio and assist ratio are quite good too, tough to do when asked to be "the" guy. The only thing I don't like about Diener's game is his defense, which has gotten better but isn't good. Marquette obviously isn't as good as thier record, but they are an NCAA tourney caliber team this season. As we all know here, tough to win on road in C-USA, like many conferences. If East Carolina gets off to a better start the other night, they give UC a run for their money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted January 14, 2005 Author Share Posted January 14, 2005 Some of you guys kill me ... give respect where it is due. Deiner is having a great year. To say he needs to have good players around him ... that is an obvious statement ... Over the last 10 years ... 40 teams ... how many final 4 teams did not have more than 1 very good player? ... Not many ... I'm sure most did. I looked up his stats ... 20.6ppg on 45% shooting from the field, 46% from the 3 making over 3 threes a game. 88%ft, 6.5asst's, 2.5t/o's, 4rb's, ... and 1.25 stls. Whether he will be a star or not in the NBA isn't relevant ... The guy is a fantastic college player. I'm not in the least bit a Marquette fan ... I just noticed his name in the ppg and asst leaders in the USA Today ... and thought I would mention it since he is in our conference and we still have to play them ... but give the guy his due ... Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobile-iken Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 I agree Skip...He is one of the top 5 point guards in the nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 He'd be easier to like if he wasn't a flopping, trash-talking, little candya$$. He deserves a Drejaj elbow in his eye, if you ask my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted January 14, 2005 Author Share Posted January 14, 2005 unless he was playing for us ... then he would be a tough gutsy player. I have no problem with any player who flops after contact ... I have a problem with the ref who can't make the proper call ... A little trash talking is good ... I loved it when IV was talking trash to Maxiell (I think) ... after he took the ball back at him and scored after getting his shot blocked ... if we saw more emotion like that from him he would be a better player. 2 of the most famous big time trash talkers in the NBA ... Michael Jordan ... and the grandmaster Larry Bird. He would probably give the elbow to Drejaj back ... if he hadn't already given it first. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 courtside said, "Comparing Novak to Chris Braun is laughable imo." i agree, it is laughable. braun was tougher than novak is (and that aint saying much because chris braun was not). a one dimensional soft (edited by request) 3 point shooter. a player that is 6'10" in college basketball that plays the minutes that novak does should be averaging more than 4 rpg. chris braun averaged more than that as a junior and didnt even start. braun never started. novak reminds me of brad sellers with the chicago bulls teams from the late 80's. all that height that can be stopped with a little attention and afraid to go inside and help where he needs to be. but i will say, dont leave the guy open. courtside, actually, considering how small diener is, (he seems to still be as frail today as he was 4 years ago) i think travis does pretty good on defense. my only b!tch with diener this year is his forcing the action as much as he did last night. there were a number of times last night where he took off to the basket where it seemed he had no plan on what was going to happen at all. he just barreled in hoping they would call a foul or else committed one of his 9 turnovers for the night. i doubt that is his doing. as you said, his a/to numbers are nowhere near what happened last night. but any coach it would seem to me would stop that if it wasnt the plan. the fact he played on tells me that the marquette offense is pretty much travis' marque perry imitation this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 If he was playing for us he'd still be a candya$$. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 i think the focus of most of us in this string was not to say diener was a bad player, just that we really enjoyed seeing him and the marquette team stink it up last night. btw, there is a string today on the marquette message board, started by some memphis fan that apparently sits right behind the visitor bench that detailed quite the ugly exchange last night between crean and a big memphis booster. good reading regardless of whether true or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Good posts Skip. I too don't understand the Marquette envy on this board. Maybe becuase people read a couple of posts negative about SLU at the Marquette board and label the rest of them. I was actually told that is why other better boards started because people hated that board. Maybe it is because of Billiken Law? Maybe it is a new conference sour grapes thing. Maybe a combiniation of a few things. Nothing wrong with trying to develop rivals. But I won't stop being objective. And Roy...I really thought words like pu$$y were beneath you. Wow, disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 actually it is my opinion that if trash talker travis got a drejaj elbow, he would then put on a "i'm hurt" show and win an oscar. i.e. it is all one way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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